machine gun kelly Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 Bloke- good point. He has done a tremendous job of turning that team around. It's unfortunate for us, but I see Jacksonville and Oakland really on the ascent. They've made a lot of good moves. If they both have excellent drafts, we won't be able to assume 4-12 any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokestradamus Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 Bloke- good point. He has done a tremendous job of turning that team around. It's unfortunate for us, but I see Jacksonville and Oakland really on the ascent. They've made a lot of good moves. If they both have excellent drafts, we won't be able to assume 4-12 any more. I'm very seriously thinking that Oakland will win the AFC West this year. That division is wide open now with Denver's offseason losses. I love the idea of a hyper-competitive AFC in 2016. Unpredictable is good, makes every game more valuable. Outside of Cleveland, I don't think there's a massively awful team in the conference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 Got to admit, I think Reggie McKenzie should be higher. I know that with the Raiders (much like Whaley and the Bills), it has to bear fruit soon but the moves that Reggie has made recently have put them in a position for sustainable success for a long time. I think people forget just how terrible that roster was when he took over.Totally agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 Completely agree on both points! And lets not forget often the reason he's letting go of players early was because the GM for NE signed a player to a contract worth much more than their abilities showed. BB covers up alot of the weaknesses of the GM up there. Who is there GM there anyway?? I give BB credit for letting go of players early and having no soul. That is what is needed in a salary cap world. For that he deserves much credit. But his FA and draft skills are no better than middle of the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAST MODE BABY! Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 (edited) Got to admit, I think Reggie McKenzie should be higher. I know that with the Raiders (much like Whaley and the Bills), it has to bear fruit soon but the moves that Reggie has made recently have put them in a position for sustainable success for a long time. I think people forget just how terrible that roster was when he took over. I don't, at least not higher than Whaley. Whaley hasn't had any terrible drafts, and McKenzie had two really bad ones in a row. Whaley has found talent in every draft he's been here, and Nix too. I'm not saying Whaley is a god, but man, the Bills FO has brought a ton of talent here since Nix/Whaley showed up. McKenzie did find a QB in round 2, so that is making his whole team better. Amari Cooper and the LB from Buffalo were two of the biggest "can't miss" picks at their position in recent memory IMO Edited April 17, 2016 by BEAST MODE BABY! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted April 17, 2016 Author Share Posted April 17, 2016 Got to admit, I think Reggie McKenzie should be higher. I know that with the Raiders (much like Whaley and the Bills), it has to bear fruit soon but the moves that Reggie has made recently have put them in a position for sustainable success for a long time. I think people forget just how terrible that roster was when he took over. Good post -- agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Well, by what's said on here, I thought Whaley would have been #1 or #32. Middle of the pack seems about right. So on average.... Nailed it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Whaley can't be ranked higher until the Bills go to the playoffs. It's really that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 I actually think a better list would be to rank the GM - HC combos because actually you can be a really good GM but with the rules all geared towards ensuring parity the difference often comes down to coaching. Whaley might be an example of a guy who has done a good job with little help from his coaches. On the flip side, someone like the Giants GM has done such a bad job in recent years that it has made coaching that team near on impossible even for a likely future HoF Head Coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 I actually think a better list would be to rank the GM - HC combos because actually you can be a really good GM but with the rules all geared towards ensuring parity the difference often comes down to coaching. Whaley might be an example of a guy who has done a good job with little help from his coaches. On the flip side, someone like the Giants GM has done such a bad job in recent years that it has made coaching that team near on impossible even for a likely future HoF Head Coach. 100% agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Our GM has, more or less, filled the 53 positions and head coaching spot. Of those 54 decisions I think he's about as high as you can get with success, percentage wise, but the 2 biggest question marks remain the HC and qb which are the two most important choices. Hopefully Rex steps up and tyrod continues pushing forward in his development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 This is a make or break draft for Whaley. He really needs to hit big on at least two picks with a solid role player to boot if this team is to step forward this year. The Bills do not have glaring ho,Es in the roster this year, as they have in years past. However, the D front 7 is hardly what it was supposed to be given the money invested. Agreed. It's hard for any GM to remain in the position without results, i.e. playoffs. I'm pretty sure TPegs expects a winner in 2016 and if not, perhaps they'll make significant changes. But we're a long way from there right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonCents Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Agreed. It's hard for any GM to remain in the position without results, i.e. playoffs. I'm pretty sure TPegs expects a winner in 2016 and if not, perhaps they'll make significant changes. But we're a long way from there right now. The Pegula's shouldn't just automatically clean house if we miss the playoffs again. The 2016 season could go any number of ways, some of them could show traits of sustainable success without leading to a playoff birth. If Whaley does a good job in the draft and Rex gets the players and coaches on the same page on defense we could see major improvements. Those same improvements could be coupled with a season of regression from a young inexperienced QB like TT. That most likely won't equate to playoffs. For point of the arguement let's say they draft a mid-late round QB and he is showing promise in camp and preseason etc...it's conceivable that we could be closer to building a winning team with long term potential than we have in almost two decades. It would be a shame to tear it all down because you missed your 2016 "ultimatum" as an owner. Whaley is a middle of the pack GM who really has a chance to prove himself this year. The talent mixture and depth really projects well at our biggest positions of need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 The way I look at it is the Bills talent is pretty high and their coaching would rank pretty low. I'd have the personnel department near the top 10 and the coaching bottom 5. You put those together and you have middle of the road team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 The way I look at it is the Bills talent is pretty high and their coaching would rank pretty low. I'd have the personnel department near the top 10 and the coaching bottom 5. You put those together and you have middle of the road team. I do not agree with the coaching being bottom five overall. And i am surprised you say that Kirby. Wonder what outsiders think. Rex is polarizing for sure but beyond that i think Bills have a lot of experienced and knowledgeable folks in the building. But that is my amateur opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 I do not agree with the coaching being bottom five overall. And i am surprised you say that Kirby. Wonder what outsiders think. Rex is polarizing for sure but beyond that i think Bills have a lot of experienced and knowledgeable folks in the building. But that is my amateur opinion I like Roman so he gives them a boost. Kromer is a good coach too. I think that Rob Ryan is the worst coach in the NFL. I think that Rex and Thurman got the least out of their talent. The design of the defense was atrocious. It would have been hard to get less production out of that defensive talent. Also, I think that Crossman is in Rob Ryan's league. The Bills have some terrible coaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 I like Roman so he gives them a boost. Kromer is a good coach too. I think that Rob Ryan is the worst coach in the NFL. I think that Rex and Thurman got the least out of their talent. The design of the defense was atrocious. It would have been hard to get less production out of that defensive talent. Also, I think that Crossman is in Rob Ryan's league. The Bills have some terrible coaches. Well i was going to say they have some fine coaching on the offense. defense may have some kinks to work through Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 Yeah, I think that I would have him closer to 12ish but the results have varied. They acted as if McCoy and Watkins weren't good moves. It was a little weird in the explanation. McCoy, at that price, was an awful move. Whaley re-worked his contract. Are you thinking that this was OK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 The way I look at it is the Bills talent is pretty high and their coaching would rank pretty low. I'd have the personnel department near the top 10 and the coaching bottom 5. You put those together and you have middle of the road team. Agreed. I think Whaley is one of the best talent evaluators in the NFL. There are some crazy people who think GMs should hit on 100% of their picks. Whaley's biggest failings is the coaches. I think Marrone and his offensive staff was terrible. I really liked the Rex hire but you have to be the biggest homer ever to think last year wasn't a failure. My question is how much say Whaley got in hiring the coaches. Ultimately, he is the GM so he gets the credit and blame. But I don't think he got the final say in either hiring this I think he has a bigger leash than some fans think. McCoy, at that price, was an awful move. Whaley re-worked his contract. Are you thinking that this was OK? You're right. We should have kept Kiko. That dude is a monster. I'm not the biggest fan of McCoy as a person but he is such a far better player than Alonso. The Bills crushed that trade even if they probably gave McCoy too much money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardcore Bills Fan Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 I like Whaley. He makes Donahoe moves but way, way better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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