gumby Posted January 1, 2016 Share Posted January 1, 2016 Defense sucks because we have terrible LB's and a D-Line full of highly paid players that are dropping into coverage Spot on. Our LBs are no where near the talent you need to be an elite defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted January 1, 2016 Share Posted January 1, 2016 Does anyone else think that Rex will go all in with his brother as his defensive coordinator next year? He knows that 2016 is his "do or die" season as Bills' HC and he'll want to go down fighting arm and arm with his brother? He seems like someone who wouldn't care one bit about the criticisms and barbs of this move by the fans and media. It would last a week and the NFL would move onto another story. As for the original question...I have no idea until all the chips have fallen, like seeing who stays and who goes, and what they get through the draft and free agency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan_in_raleigh Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 After reading this I am more depressed about the upcoming offseason. I can't believe we can rebuild the defense and OL all at same time. So we will see a regressed D, a struggling OL and more years without sniffing playoffs. Exciting times for Bills fans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gray Beard Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 this defense will not work. this defense we are seeing is what happens when you run a hybrid defense that mutates in to this mess. . the defense needs to be retooled to run what rex is capable running - since he is staying. without reading all of the responses or getting in to depth, my analysis as knowing a little bit about defense: Need: Nose Tackle/34DT. Talking the 300 lbs. Pat Williams/Ted Washington/Vince Wilfork. Al Woods - Titans. Should not cost too much. He's stout, not a big name. He is big and can play all 3 spots on the line in a 34D BJ Raji - Packers. Might cost a little more, might not want to leave Green Bay. They would like to keep him, from what I see. Mike 34 - Brandon Spikes might be considered since we will run a hybrid 34 occasionally. Otherwise, we need a Mike that's half Mike half Jack. A Tranny Mike? I am going all draft here, if possible. 1st round should leave us the ability to get one. If it doesn't pan out well a June 1st cut is well worth it. Rolando McClain - Cowboys - expensive patch but an upgrade to Spikes Demario Davis - Jets - One of Rex's boys. Will/SS - I really wanted Sean Lee of the Cowboys last year, he'd have done very well with Rex. Mark Barron - Rams - THIS IS THE GUY I WANT. A SAFETY/LINEBACKER FOR JACK. If anyone is going to get something from this guy it is going to be Rex. Mark Barron is my number 1 target this offseason from outside FA's. I have been looking at this all day, unamused by the college play. I have seen several posts that are consistent with this summary. I believe off-season moves will help to make this a reality. My problem with this has to do with injuries. When the newly acquired space eaters and run stuffers get hurt, there won't be adequate depth to replace them with players that have comparable physiques and abilities. It will then be up to the coaching staff to change the scheme to accommodate the players that are available... Oh wait,,, This coaching staff has already demonstrated that they can't do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthymcnasty08 Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 Does anyone else think that Rex will go all in with his brother as his defensive coordinator next year? He knows that 2016 is his "do or die" season as Bills' HC and he'll want to go down fighting arm and arm with his brother? He seems like someone who wouldn't care one bit about the criticisms and barbs of this move by the fans and media. It would last a week and the NFL would move onto another story. As for the original question...I have no idea until all the chips have fallen, like seeing who stays and who goes, and what they get through the draft and free agency. Two wrongs still will not make a right. The Saints defense was a bigger dung pile than ours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 Rex could spend several years trying to rebuild the defense to his type 3-4. Draft picks take time to develop. If it does not work especially against the hurry up offense, then the next coach rebuilds a 4-3 again. This is high risk starting over once again, it demoralizes the players and fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 Rex showed no middle ground this season as his defense piled up mediocre performances. How will there be middle ground next season when the Bills start cutting all pro players? This will turn out being a full-on rebuild. Problem is that Rex is rebuilding the unit into a scheme with little chance for success. Perry- I think your right in his scheme was predicated on offenses using predominantly 5 to 7 step drops. These faster offenses releasing in 2 seconds is not enough time for his defense to work. I disagree that Rex tried to blend what they did last year to his scheme but as another post stated, that's a mistake. Pick your defense and run it. I have so little hope for this team turning around in one year. I hope Boyst62 is right, and know Barron very well from Tampa. He is a banger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simpleman Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 (edited) This team's defense was built and was primed to "Win Now" this year. Whaley even added in a big boost in the surprising rookie, Darby. Rex came in and castrated the D with his EGO. He felt his scheme was better, even though the team was at it's prime and functioning at the highest levels with a scheme that perfectly matched the talents and ability of it's members. Rex cares more about his ego and proving he is right than he does about winning the game and taking this team that was built and primed to "win now" to the post season. After having a year to mentally castrate the D players and force them to do it his way, even if it isn't better for the chances of the team to "win now", or for the players to do what they do best, he is now ready to really get down to business. He now has been given a free license by the ownership to physically castrate the "D" by reshaping the team to fit his scheme, cutting players and adding new ones. We are officially in rebuild mode and the D will take years to recover and reshape to fit his scheme. So much for a "Win Now" D for the next few years. Edited January 3, 2016 by simpleman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjjr Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 It is recoverable and will be better next season no doubt. It's just unfortunate that Rex didn't let the players dictate the style rather than his personality. Have to build around Gilmore, Dareus, Hughes, Darby and hopefully A. Williams. Vets like K.Williams, C.Graham and M.Lawson hopefully can be solid for another season or two too while young guys develop. Have to get better at LB and develop young guys at S and DL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 I'm unhappy with Rex's philosophy. Much has been said about it already so I don't mean to repeat - but when you have 4 great defensive linemen, spread them out and let them force less athletic offensive linemen to move around. We'll win those one-on-one battles many times per game, which leads to sacks and turnovers. And if you have a thumper like Spikes to clean up the mess caused by any holes created by all of the movement, you can prevent the big running plays. By contrast, Rex's philosophy is to keep the defensive linemen mostly bunched and static to disguise where the pressure is coming from. That's all well and good if you have great linebackers and safeties who are fluent in the pressure concepts. 'Cept we don't have those. We in fact have no linebackers or safeties. And Rex has refused to adjust. So yes, the defense is fixable if Rex gets 4 new linebackers and two new safeties. Or, we could just get rid of Rex... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 (edited) I posted elsewhere that in the Bills' first ten games, they faced 8 of the top-ten offenses in terms of pace (and 4 of the top 5). That's a little bit of a fluke, but at the same time the pace is increasing across the league. That's a long term problem for the scheme, I think, although I think that if they get the right players who can process information quickly and who gain enough experience in the system, it can succeed. I think they need to reshuffle or replace some of the defensive assistants, however. Thurman does not inspire confidence. I know he's basically a figurehead, but he has responsibilities that affect the pace of substitution. I also think they need a LDE that tries; that'll go a long way. Watching what the Bills have now at that position compared with what the Ravens had then (Trevor Pryce; Suggs [who flipped to ROLB/DE after Ryan left]) and what the Jets have had the last few years (Shaun Ellis; Wilkerson) is eye opening. All of those guys were playmakers. Pryce had 13 sacks from that spot in 2006 and was great in that system. Getting a guy like that who a) can play the position well; b) buys in; and c) (not least) tries will make a big difference. At present, we have a complete stiff at the position, and it affects the defense's overall production significantly. Edited January 3, 2016 by dave mcbride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 Thinking about it, this may have been a rather unique situation Buffalo had. How often is a new coach brought into a team that was a league leader one one side of the ball. Usually they are teams bad on one side and maybe just OK on the other side, so in that situation easy for a coach to come in and say this is the system we're going to use and get the players to buy into it as what they were doing wasn't working very well already. Usually when the new coach is brought in, the team will hire the new guy who's strength is on whatever side was weaker to begin with. In the case of the Bill's you'd normally hire a guy who's strength is offensively. The other thing you'll often see teams do if they need to replace the HC is promote the coordinator from whichever side of the ball was doing well so you can keep continuity there. The Bill's did interview Schwartz, but the problem was his prior HC resume was rather sketchy at best. There probably would have been a better chance of the Bill's hiring Schwartz as the HC if he had never coached before as then no bad record to think about. On top of that then Rex pops into the picture, guy who's labeled a defensive genius, can only imagine what he can do to improve this group. Players love the guy, had some success in NY and much of his failure was blamed on a bad situation with the relationship with the GM and not getting very good players than him. So Rex is hired, everyone from the players, coaches, front office expected all the players to get on board with this and things will go great. Have to wonder did Mario create the mutiny once he saw things weren't going well or did he create issues right from the first day of mini-camp, planting seeds with others, once things started to go south was easy for him to get a full scale mutiny going. And Rex to a fault being a players coach was against his principles to stop it. It was the Perfect Storm created! On a related topic, when was the "Vic" article about the Bickering Bills? Curious as I must have missed reading it. This is the heart of the fury people have towards Rex. I mean, why would you take a defense that was generally working very well with the ability f the players you had and which the players were well-schooled in, a replace it with what is an apparently super complicated one that can fall apart completely if a single player fails in the slightest? And then to continue to stubbornly insist on that system when it is clearly not working is insane. I get that. I really do. But when the whole coaching staff comes over with a program , it might just be more difficult to shift. He guessed wrong. He assumed that the players would take to the program quickly. Rex made a big mistake. But there are many things wrong here besides scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardinalScotts Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 scheme adjusting combined with injuries- you can stop there. They will have a good defense in 2016 I'll take a guys 16 year nfl track record over hey remember that year we had a lot of sacks? Still didnt make playoffs.....were are -34 sacks and have one less win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 complete teardowns & rebuilds take years. Rex is a very good 3-4 coach. Rex is/was a very BAD fit for the 2014 bills 4-3 defense. the bills making the playoffs in 2016 is NOT happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlayoffsPlease Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 The defense will be starting from Scratch in 2016. Mario will be gone. The only three certain pieces of the puzzle are Darby, Dareus and Jerry "Bonehead Hughes". Its a mere shadow of what was there in 2014. Rex may very well be able to "build a bully" with new players, but the 2014 defense now belongs to history, so it won't be "recovered" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockinon Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 Full scale mutiny? Seriously? Yes the defense laid an egg this year, but this is utter speculation and likely way off base. New coach and scheme and they are supposed to just miraculously be top 10? The players have obviously been struggling but mutiny is a huge leap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 While I think Rex screwed up this year, he does have a tremendous record building strong defenses. He's had an entire year to reassess the roster and his strategy. Even without Mario, I think the D gets better next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 (edited) The defense will be starting from Scratch in 2016. Mario will be gone. The only three certain pieces of the puzzle are Darby, Dareus and Jerry "Bonehead Hughes". Its a mere shadow of what was there in 2014. Rex may very well be able to "build a bully" with new players, but the 2014 defense now belongs to history, so it won't be "recovered" I hope they pick up the option /extend Gilmore also. He's a good player. I'd still shop Dareus as he's a prototypical all pro 3-technique penetrating 4-3 DT. He will continue to be marginalized in this scheme as he's not a great fit at NT or DE and certainly will never live up to his contract in this scheme. The only reason to keep him around is if his deal is long enough to outlive the wrecks regime and they next guys schemes to the talent. Edited January 3, 2016 by over 20 years of fanhood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 While I think Rex screwed up this year, he does have a tremendous record building strong defenses. He's had an entire year to reassess the roster and his strategy. Even without Mario, I think the D gets better next season. Agreed. Leave the Offense to Roman and let Rex figure out what went wrong on D and correct it. Ed formerly of Roch, I think you are onto something about "perfect storm" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 I get that. I really do. But when the whole coaching staff comes over with a program , it might just be more difficult to shift. He guessed wrong. He assumed that the players would take to the program quickly. Rex made a big mistake. But there are many things wrong here besides scheme. Yup, Rex and thurmond. Spot on. Our LBs are no where near the talent you need to be an elite defense. These same lbs were pretty good last yr. But you're right, they aren't meant for Rex's scheme. Nor our DL. Wow Rex, just wow! Does anyone else think that Rex will go all in with his brother as his defensive coordinator next year? He knows that 2016 is his "do or die" season as Bills' HC and he'll want to go down fighting arm and arm with his brother? He seems like someone who wouldn't care one bit about the criticisms and barbs of this move by the fans and media. It would last a week and the NFL would move onto another story. As for the original question...I have no idea until all the chips have fallen, like seeing who stays and who goes, and what they get through the draft and free agency. Rob?! 1 clown isn't enough!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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