l< j Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 "Lying Eyes" by The Eagles. "Your Cheatin' Heart" by Hank Williams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewin Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Interesting - another take being discussed on Rome is the Bellichick denial and deflection to Brady has been purposely orchestrated in a way to make it appear to be a single player issue, and not a systemic/organizational thing (which would be the implication if Bellcheat was held responsible) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 "Your Cheatin' Heart" by Hank Williams. Katy Perry should do a rendition of My Cheating Heart at halftime thats where it started only I flubbed the title Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 I know a lot more about playing hockey than football, but this is like the head coach of a hockey team suggesting he didn't know every hockey player likes his own particular stick in terms of curve, treatment of the stick, tape, length, knob size (or no knob at all) type of tape applied, etc. Anyone who has ever been involved in hockey at any level knows how this works. A head coach of an NHL team suggesting "What? Guys are particular about their sticks and play around with them constantly? I didn't know!" is absurd. Belicheat's comments are identical. He strikes me as the kind of guy who sits around thinking about every last aspect of the game (to his credit) and then tries to find any possible competitive advantage he can get (also to his credit). Where he becomes a scumbag is in his willingness to cross over into illegal crap to get an edge. I'd be surprised if he didn't lead an internal investigation into PSI levels in footballs and how they can translate into success! LOL from MMQB: "Probably the most curious feedback came from three coaches who have spent most of their careers dealing with quarterbacks. Their responses were almost identical. Echoing Belichick’s sentiment, these coaches told me they had never really heard any discussion about the pressure in a game ball. Getting one worked in and scuffed up? Sure, every quarterback has a personal preference as to the feel of the football. When the balls come out of the box, they’re slippery because of wax on the ball. But the amount of air? Never part of the interaction with their quarterbacks" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Anyone else get the feeling that Belicheat will retire when Brady does? CBF I get the feeling that Robert Kraft will cut ties with Belichick after this Superbowl. This new scandal coming up during Superbowl week will have done way too much PR damage for the Patriots to continue with him. The Brady/Belichick era is drawing to a close so why prolong the inevitable for Kraft. There comes a point where your talents as a head coach no longer exceed the damage you are doing to the franchise's credibility. What's the fun of winning if no one thinks you did it fairly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 from MMQB: "Probably the most curious feedback came from three coaches who have spent most of their careers dealing with quarterbacks. Their responses were almost identical. Echoing Belichick’s sentiment, these coaches told me they had never really heard any discussion about the pressure in a game ball. Getting one worked in and scuffed up? Sure, every quarterback has a personal preference as to the feel of the football. When the balls come out of the box, they’re slippery because of wax on the ball. But the amount of air? Never part of the interaction with their quarterbacks" oh BS. Then who is responsible for inflating the game balls to the NFL's regulation limits? Bellycheat knows all the rules down to an ineligible eligible receiver yet know nothing about how to treat a game ball? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 When did Bellicheat say that though? In his PC you mean? He said: "In my entire coaching career I have never talked to any player, staff member about football air pressure." He went on to say that since this all went down, he has learned a lot about the whole football prep process...and suggested if their balls were inflated to 12.5, any deflation (from weather is what he meant) would take us under the accepted range. I don't think he said anything which can be construed to be "We as an organization deliberately set our ball pressure to 12.5 PSI before every game." In fact, he said he didn't even know of this until after the fact. Doesn't matter and the important part is what you wrote, namely, the entire thing is just unbelievable. None of this passes the sophisticated "bad smell" legal test! LOL Guys who are in the know all across America right now are laughing at this stuff. I'm talking about football coaches at high levels, QBs, equipment guys, etc. Insiders who would know about this type of thing. They ALL know how this sort of thing is done and the "culture" of this. And they all know EVERYONE in NE knew about this...and that they all had to deliberately cheat in order to get all the balls "low" by 2 or 3 PSI. He said their balls were inflated to the lowest. That's how I read it. And that was all he knew. I’ve learned about the inflation range situation, obviously, with our footballs being inflated to the twelve and a half pound range, any deflation would then take us under that specification limit. Knowing that now, in the future we will certainly inflate the footballs above that low level to account for any possible change during the game. So as an example, if a ball deflated from 13.2 to 12.9, it wouldn’t matter, but if it deflated from 12.5 to 12.3, it would — as an example. So we will take steps in the future to make sure that we don’t put ourselves in that type of potential situation again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 from MMQB: "Probably the most curious feedback came from three coaches who have spent most of their careers dealing with quarterbacks. Their responses were almost identical. Echoing Belichick’s sentiment, these coaches told me they had never really heard any discussion about the pressure in a game ball. Getting one worked in and scuffed up? Sure, every quarterback has a personal preference as to the feel of the football. When the balls come out of the box, they’re slippery because of wax on the ball. But the amount of air? Never part of the interaction with their quarterbacks" Yeah, except that - objectively speaking - Belichick's cultivated reputation as someone in complete control who knows and relies on every nuance of the game to gain an edge is kind-of at odds with that observation. Subjectively speaking, I have an easier time imagining "Hey, let's deflate the balls a little, that'll give us an advantage in poor weather" being brought up in a staff meeting, and Belichick saying "Yeah, look into that," than I do imagining him not knowing what his own QB and staff are doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 my 2 year old has it figured out that the amount of air inside balls is a major variable. I would be willing to bet the "greatest football mind of this era' is at least mildly aware of that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 (edited) here you go Brady's got flat balls sung to AC/DC's big balls the song is on the web page no direct link http://www.sportsradiokjr.com/onair/sports-radio-kjr-55035/toms-big-balls-13172153/ If they say there was some tampering, and the Patriots conspired, everyone will say they suck and Belicheck's a liar Edited January 22, 2015 by ddaryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fadingpain Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 He said their balls were inflated to the lowest. That's how I read it. And that was all he knew. I can see where you interpret it the way you did. I interpreted that exact line you highlighted as meaning "Now that I understand how this all works, we have to keep an eye on this and go a bit high with PSI levels. If we were to inflate to the lowest level...and then had a PSI drop in cold weather....we would be illegal. So we will go a bit higher than that from now on." I just can't imagine every coach in the league, lots of players, and every equipment manager who ever worked in the NFL doesn't know about all this stuff! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 (edited) He said their balls were inflated to the lowest. That's how I read it. And that was all he knew. so he didn't read the rule book? my 2 year old has it figured out that the amount of air inside balls is a major variable. I would be willing to bet the "greatest football mind of this era' is at least mildly aware of that? ever fill up a basket ball? 1 or 2 extra pumps and you can tell a big difference in the way the ball bounces. similar aspect have to apply to a football. I know that and I'm an idiot!!! I can see where you interpret it the way you did. I interpreted that exact line you highlighted as meaning "Now that I understand how this all works, we have to keep an eye on this and go a bit high with PSI levels. If we were to inflate to the lowest level...and then had a PSI drop in cold weather....we would be illegal. So we will go a bit higher than that from now on." I just can't imagine every coach in the league, lots of players, and every equipment manager who ever worked in the NFL doesn't know about all this stuff! 11 of 12 balls all deflate? the odds are to high that they majority do it. Edited January 22, 2015 by BillsFan-4-Ever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 I can see where you interpret it the way you did. I interpreted that exact line you highlighted as meaning "Now that I understand how this all works, we have to keep an eye on this and go a bit high with PSI levels. If we were to inflate to the lowest level...and then had a PSI drop in cold weather....we would be illegal. Or not. Technically, if the league's measuring the pressure in indoor conditions, and the balls are compliant with the minimum, the team's still compliant even if the outdoor temperature drops the pressure during the game. That's a flaw (a fairly significant one, but not critical) in the league's controls. Once again, beyond the cheating aspect, we have another example of the arbitrary, incomplete, and ass-headed nature of league rules and policies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Interesting - another take being discussed on Rome is the Bellichick denial and deflection to Brady has been purposely orchestrated in a way to make it appear to be a single player issue, and not a systemic/organizational thing (which would be the implication if Bellcheat was held responsible)so Brady will be fined 50k, he will pay in cash, the team will be given a stern warning to comply or else next time they will be penalized as an org, and they march on. Teflon Tom will cry at some point about how he regrets putting his team in a negative light and he really didn't think he did anything outside the rules considering they were legally low until they were outside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fadingpain Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 ever fill up a basket ball? 1 or 2 extra pumps and you can tell a big difference in the way the ball bounces. similar aspect have to apply to a football. I know that and I'm an idiot!!! This is good point; not just about initial grip on the ball to throw it better or hold onto it better to avoid a fumble. You also have to imagine the ball being thrown fast and hard...and it being easier to catch b/c it doesn't have that initial "bounce" factor off your hands or whatever. As I think Kelly the Dog said like 35 pages ago (LOL)....if we are finding all these great uses for like a 10 PSI ball, WHY THE HELL AREN'T THE BALLS ALLOWED TO BE 10 PSI ??? B/C we want to make it even harder for the middling QB talent in the league? Hell, how about an entire football design and construction re-think, designed to make it even easier to throw. We have that already in the NFL game as I understand it; the balls is smaller, more pointy than NCAA football, precisely so it can be thrown better. Why stop here? Come out with a new generation football. Why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 so he didn't read the rule book? ever fill up a basket ball? 1 or 2 extra pumps and you can tell a big difference in the way the ball bounces. similar aspect have to apply to a football. I know that and I'm an idiot!!! Except you don't dribble a football. And my recollection from basketball is that those extra 1-2 pumps, while they're evident in dribbling, aren't discernible in passing or shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 ^^^ exactly what everyone is angling for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fadingpain Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Or not. Technically, if the league's measuring the pressure in indoor conditions, and the balls are compliant with the minimum, the team's still compliant even if the outdoor temperature drops the pressure during the game. That's a flaw (a fairly significant one, but not critical) in the league's controls. Once again, beyond the cheating aspect, we have another example of the arbitrary, incomplete, and ass-headed nature of league rules and policies. Well yes, but as I understand it, the balls were checked outside during the game after suspicion was raised, at lower temp and pressure levels despite having been checking for "initial legality" pre-game under different ambient conditions indoors. I am guessing none of this has been well thought out by the NFL but it will be now. Presumably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Except you don't dribble a football. Tell that to Lonnie Johnson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted January 22, 2015 Share Posted January 22, 2015 Except you don't dribble a football. And my recollection from basketball is that those extra 1-2 pumps, while they're evident in dribbling, aren't discernible in passing or shooting. WRT to football its the bounce factor off hands BB to much bounce (if they still do it) kills back board shots Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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