Omar Little Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 The latest piece from Rodak is a real gem. Man, why even write this article? http://espn.go.com/blog/buffalo-bills/post/_/id/16852/jameis-winston-a-pipe-dream-for-qb-needy-bills That's the question that comes to mind every time I read something of his. He's beyond awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000455062/article/report-bills-gm-wants-next-coach-to-revive-ej-manuel I honestly think we might lose out a good HC now. I don't like how DW is doing this. If i was a HC and they want me to develop EJ and i want my own QB then i wouldn't take the bills job. First of all, we have no idea how DW is doing this. We have some anonymous "NFL source" telling Vic Carruci "during interviews Whaley not only has spoken in glowing terms about Manuel, he also has made it clear he wants the new coach to make the progress in developing Manuel that Marrone and his staff failed to make." NFL.com then "spins" this as "Bills general manager Doug Whaley wants his next coach to resuscitate the young career of EJ Manuel.....Whaley thinks Manuel's issues are a product of Marrone's ignorance more than anything, apparently." with the headline "Bills GM wants Next Coach to Revive EJ Manuel" This "spin" casts Manuel as a QB who needs to be "resuscitated" or "revived" rather than as a rookie who was a known project when drafted, who started due to injury of the signed Vet and who struggled, and who was playing behind a struggling line with no run game, all things known to hurt a young QB regardless of coach. Then, the "spin" sounds as though Whaley is really throwing Marrone under the bus by bringing up "Marrone's ignorance" (when the "apparently" makes it clear it's the writer's conjecture). NFL history is full of QB who took a couple years to "get it", especially when they start out with a coach and/or system that doesn't favor their development or are rushed into the lineup prematurely then yanked out of it. That's not exactly news, but of course the word choice and the implications of "throwing Marrone under the bus" make it more exciting After this created "drama, the NFL writer then ends his article on a realistic note, pointing out "Does Manuel actually need saving? He finished his rookie season with a 58.8 percent completion rate and a positive touchdown to interception ratio, which is more than Peyton Manning can say (we're not comparing the two, relax). His progression includes the trademark struggles of any rookie, and not necessarily a project pick who needs to be abandoned. While quality offensive coaching is in short supply, we wouldn't be surprised to see a coach jumping at this opportunity; not only to coach the Bills but to build on a foundation with Manuel that could already be stronger than anticipated." To the second part of your concern: it's really not the HC's job to decide whether he wants to "pick his own" QB or work with the QB the team has in place, unless he's one of the rare coaches who gets to make all his own roster and personnel decisions. Even then: quarterbacks are in high demand, and upgrades aren't just ask-and-have. The Bills have EJ. They may plan to draft a QB, and they may plan to pick up a FA, but if the team's roster development plan is to find a coach who will commit to getting the most he can get out of EJ, don't you think they need to let guys know that up front? There really isn't any other way that makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 There's nothing to revive. He's not a 29 year old vet. Maybe the system and the coaches just weren't a good fit for him. He may never make it. But with the right coaching, confidence...maybe. And for me, Whaley has had more hits then misses. So if he thinks this is the case then why not? But that oline has got to be better. We need a plan at running back bc right now it does not look good. What Bevell has done with Wilson, what Kyle Shanahan did with RGIII and Hoyer...I think that's the approach we want. Having said that, we still need to bring in 2 more QBS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 How should he conduct the interview instead? Honestly, it depends on how Manuel is perceived league wide. I don't pretend to know that. However, if the main view is that he's a bust, then Whaley pushing him interviews will come across as a charlatan selling a bill of goods. Honesty is always the best policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formerly Allan in MD Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 You revive something that was once viable. It sure wasn't EJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 Honestly, it depends on how Manuel is perceived league wide. I don't pretend to know that. However, if the main view is that he's a bust, then Whaley pushing him interviews will come across as a charlatan selling a bill of goods. Honesty is always the best policy.If Whaley doesn't think he's a bust, why should he offer that opinion to anyone? He has confidence and ego just like any coach. You may not agree with it, but this guy did unearth Jerry Hughes from bust status, too. I'd rather bring in a coach with an open mind who will try to use our only QB's skill set - while we keep trying to improve the position. I see zero benefit to bringing in a coach who thinks we need to go shopping for 3 QBs. You revive something that was once viable. It sure wasn't EJ.that's funny because his rookie season sure wasn't any worse than those of a lot of better NFL QBs. I know it's fashion around here to act like he's behind Craig Nall and Billy Joe Hobert in the pantheon of Bills QBs. But he's not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 you poor EJ haters have to suffer your distaste for a long time.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billusional Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 Everyone keeps talking about how bad the qb situation is when the biggest problem with our offense was the lack of quality line play. Im not sure many qbs would have fared much better behind that line. EJ hasnt been given a fair chance to develop any kind of consistency in his game due to that and the knee jerk reaction to bench him after 4 games in which he was 2-2, and very well could have been 3-1 had it not been for a pick six by the Defensive Player of the Year. So, to all you haters out there, suck it up. EJ, as of right now anyway, is our starting qb. And unless we can aquire a Cam Newton or the like in free agency, then hes as good an option as we have. NO MORE RETREADS PLEASE!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 (edited) You revive something that was once viable. It sure wasn't EJ.EJ has had his rough patches, but he's won 6 nfl games. He has been viable. Edited January 9, 2015 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 There is no chance that the Bills send EJ out there unchallenged as the starter. The problem that they are running into now is that worthy HC candidates appear to be shying away from the job b/c of the QB situation. They can't acquire another QB until FA starts so they have to do their best to sell the QB situation on these guys interviewing. You can't win in this league without coaching and a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 There is no chance that the Bills send EJ out there unchallenged as the starter. The problem that they are running into now is that worthy HC candidates appear to be shying away from the job b/c of the QB situation. They can't acquire another QB until FA starts so they have to do their best to sell the QB situation on these guys interviewing. You can't win in this league without coaching and a QB. I agree. However, I also think that the only chance they don't send him into camp with a chance to compete for the job is if they decide to try and trade for Cutler. With any of the other names mentioned, Sanchez, Hoyer, even Bradford I think EJ goes into camp with a chance to compete for the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 If HC's are wary of Manuel, then fans should be as well. Some will say he's raw, but after 2 years with an NFL organization that shouldn't be the case anymore. I get that some people refuse to believe EJ's not starting material, but after throwing more than 400 passes, he's about a 58% completion guy combined with a low yards per attempt (6.4 yards). Given these metrics, I don't think it's only a coaching thing with EJ. Coaching can only get him so far and these prospective HC's know this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garranimal Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 (edited) You may not agree with it, but this guy did unearth Jerry Hughes from bust status, too. Uh, Jerruh unearthed Rolando McClain and it looks like a stroke of genius.....that doesn't make him a guru. Something about the sun and dog's posterior........ Edited January 9, 2015 by Garranimal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 If HC's are wary of Manuel, then fans should be as well. Some will say he's raw, but after 2 years with an NFL organization that shouldn't be the case anymore. I get that some people refuse to believe EJ's not starting material, but after throwing more than 400 passes, he's about a 58% completion guy combined with a low yards per attempt (6.4 yards). Given these metrics, I don't think it's only a coaching thing with EJ. Coaching can only get him so far and these prospective HC's know this. With all due respect, there's no way for you to know this. Coaching issues are huge for young QBs, and there is some evidence out there that EJ performed better when he was in a less structured environment (i.e., two minute drill, etc.). It's simply too soon to draw any rock solid conclusions about his viability as a starter. There's evidence that suggests he'll be mediocre, but EJ's raw talent and work ethic should be enough that any coach who believes he's a QB developer would want to work with him. There is no chance that the Bills send EJ out there unchallenged as the starter. The problem that they are running into now is that worthy HC candidates appear to be shying away from the job b/c of the QB situation. They can't acquire another QB until FA starts so they have to do their best to sell the QB situation on these guys interviewing. You can't win in this league without coaching and a QB. Is there any specific confirmation of this, beyond the "Rex is wary" article? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 If HC's are wary of Manuel, then fans should be as well. Some will say he's raw, but after 2 years with an NFL organization that shouldn't be the case anymore. I get that some people refuse to believe EJ's not starting material, but after throwing more than 400 passes, he's about a 58% completion guy combined with a low yards per attempt (6.4 yards). Given these metrics, I don't think it's only a coaching thing with EJ. Coaching can only get him so far and these prospective HC's know this. So by that metric Derek Carr must be pretty bad too and probably worse. He's thrown 600 passes completed 58% and has an even lower YPA at 5.4 and yet people are excited about him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 So by that metric Derek Carr must be pretty bad too and probably worse. He's thrown 600 passes completed 58% and has an even lower YPA at 5.4 and yet people are excited about him. It was the clear progress Carr showed over the course of the season. He got better, basically, and he throws a nice ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 It was the clear progress Carr showed over the course of the season. He got better, basically, and he throws a nice ball. So the eye test... As far as getting better as the season went along. his 3 worst games happened in the last 5 games. He was very bad against St. Louis week 13, very very bad against KC week 15 and just plain bad against Denver week 17. You can point to "what you saw" but I saw a very bad Derek Carr in those weeks. Does he show promise? Sure, add some more weapons and see what happens. I'm no EJ fan, was merely arguing the terms in which the poster described why EJ wasn't very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 (edited) EJ has had his rough patches, but he's won 6 nfl games. He has been viable. the haters got to hate and we get to laugh at the ignorance I don't know if EJ will be good or not. I would prefer to know than not, and let him go elsewhere and succeed. If HC's are wary of Manuel, then fans should be as well. Some will say he's raw, but after 2 years with an NFL organization that shouldn't be the case anymore. I get that some people refuse to believe EJ's not starting material, but after throwing more than 400 passes, he's about a 58% completion guy combined with a low yards per attempt (6.4 yards). Given these metrics, I don't think it's only a coaching thing with EJ. Coaching can only get him so far and these prospective HC's know this. and how do we really know what Marone did (keeping EJ on the bench) wasn't out of spite for the Watkins signing? Edited January 9, 2015 by BillsFan-4-Ever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 Why does this subject always have to go an either/or binary subject? It is always EJ hate/ EJ defenders or this guy or that guy. The fact is there is a fair amount of uncertainty. The Bills would be wise to consider mutilple options including developing EJ, bringing in a good FA or 2, and using the second pick or moving up in the draft. Anyone who thinks it is a waste of time to work with EJ because he has not shown he is viable is being foolish. Anyone who thinks just because EJ is a first round pick, and wants to put all their eggs in his basket, is also being foolish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 EJ is the best QB on the roster right now and Whaley is up-talking him. Why is this either surprising or controversial? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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