filthymcnasty08 Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 I'll get it started: http://chicago.barst...01/KAW6hk21.jpg Both have ridiculous talent around them Both have good-to-great coaches Both have elite Defenses Both were passed on by Buddy Nix knowing our #1 need was QB Who ya got??? Still kills me that Wilson is not a Bill. Brains, athletic ability, leadership, maturity, cool in the pocket, doesn't make the big mistake. Kaep is a stud but Wilson has the heart of a Champion and I think he will have more success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Cain Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 russell wilson is suspect as a QB can be. 108 yards last week, and was saved by a miracle reception. count me as unimpressed. don't get me started on colin "daddy long-legs" kaepernick. one blow to his boney knees would shatter the 49ers world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 russell wilson is suspect as a QB can be. 108 yards last week, and was saved by a miracle reception. count me as unimpressed. don't get me started on colin "daddy long-legs" kaepernick. one blow to his boney knees would shatter the 49ers world. I agree... I think this a mirage too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 I agree it's a great rivalry as they play each other twice a season. Factoring in the first three items you mention you have two very evenly skilled QB's going up against eachother. The more I see of both of them I'd call it the battle of mediocrity Buffalo doesn't have any of those first three items, I think if we had drafted RW, likely this board would be covered with posts talking about what a bust he is and we need to get a new QB this year in the draft. Kind of like this board is now, but times ten! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthymcnasty08 Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) yet both are in the conference championship in consecutive years..yes great defense. ..yes great ol/rb.....and No....EJ couldn't QB either team this far....Both guys are going to win a lot of games. Brees had 30 yards passing in the first half. ...The elements had a lot to do with Wilson's low total. Not a great stat to pull if you're going to knock him. Edited January 15, 2014 by filthymcnasty08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 yet both are in the conference championship in consecutive years..yes great defense. ..yes great ol/rb.....and No....EJ couldn't QB either team this far....Both guys are going to win a lot of games. Brees had 30 yards passing in the first half. ...The elements had a lot to do with Wilson's low total. Not a great stat to pull if you're going to knock him. I don't think they will go the way of mark Sanchez (started with two straight conference championship games) but once they get 20m deals I'd guess we see them closer to rivers romo or a variety of other good but not manning-Brady qbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zevo Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Russell Wilson is extremely overrated...the team rolls with lynch.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Kaepernick has a cannon arm and he's not as small and injury prone as RGIII. I think Wilson has shown more pocket passing ability, but Kaepernick is getting better. Like both of them a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFunPolice Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) doesn't part of you wonder how much being successful early has helped both of them? They might not be elite passers, but they have won so much that they are "budding stars" now, so they will keep doing at least very well if not great. Now had either of them been drafted here and gotten beat up on a bad 6-10 team for 2 years they could be about finished in the league. Makes you wonder. So much of success is mental belief in oneself and circumstance Edited January 15, 2014 by TheFunPolice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthymcnasty08 Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 Russell Wilson is extremely overrated...the team rolls with lynch.... We take for granted how cool he appears to be back there….and since Day 1. For a 3rd Rounder - his rookie season eats our first rounder's lunch (so far). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 We take for granted how cool he appears to be back there….and since Day 1. For a 3rd Rounder - his rookie season eats our first rounder's lunch (so far). Not really. http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/gamelog/_/id/14881/year/2012/russell-wilson http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/gamelog/_/id/15803/ej-manuel I think Kaepernick and Wilson have great futures. But they have had their share of struggles as well. Struggles that some irrational posters here would suggest that the team needed a new QB. Wilson completed 9 passes for 105 yards in a playoff win. No matter how folks try to change it, football is the ultimate TEAM game. Seattle vs. SF is the great rivalry. These QBs have a ton of talent but they have better overall teams around them that can overcome a bad game. Could EJ not have done what Wilson did against NO? EJ helped the offense score 31 points in a loss to Atlanta, that featured he leading the team down the field for 2 potential GW drives. Do you think Seattle's or SF's defense is losing a game where they score 31 points? If anything, these QBs should encourage us more about EJ. Unfortunately, our overall team is not as good as theirs so EJ's mistakes stand out more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Nix and Levy set this team back about 10 years. It kills me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 So its funny to me. Both of them come out in to the league and set soar. They fly. Both of them performing at the top of their position. By all means they won't get any better. If anything they will regress. Wilson probably has more longevity career wise due to his team and Lynch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mopreme Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 What are you taking about? Geno Smith and Ej Manuel is the next best rivalry in the NFL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffOrange Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 I don't think they will go the way of mark Sanchez (started with two straight conference championship games) but once they get 20m deals I'd guess we see them closer to rivers romo or a variety of other good but not manning-Brady qbs. I agree with this. Both guys are huge bargains right now because they're good and getting paid peanuts. They will probably be good for a while. But when they sign that mega-contract (and the talent level on their defense deteriorates as a result) - I don't know, I don't think they'll be squaring off in the title game 10yrs from now the way Manning & Brady still are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 So its funny to me. Both of them come out in to the league and set soar. They fly. Both of them performing at the top of their position. By all means they won't get any better. If anything they will regress. Wilson probably has more longevity career wise due to his team and Lynch. I don't understand all this talk about how the Seahawks are the better team. Their defense is slightly better, sure, but the Niners have the better O-Line, better receivers and a deeper backfield. Kaep is better protected and he has more opportunities to make plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffOrange Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 I don't understand all this talk about how the Seahawks are the better team. Their defense is slightly better, sure, but the Niners have the better O-Line, better receivers and a deeper backfield. Kaep is better protected and he has more opportunities to make plays. All true, it's not really close offensively. Golden Tate, Doug Baldwin & Zach Miller? Yikes. Even when Crabtree & Davis were hurt Kaep probably had more to work with just by having a superior OL & Boldin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 All true, it's not really close offensively. Golden Tate, Doug Baldwin & Zach Miller? Yikes. Even when Crabtree & Davis were hurt Kaep probably had more to work with just by having a superior OL & Boldin. percy, and marshawn would both be welcome additions to the 9ers roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffOrange Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Yes Harvin is awesome but hasn't finished a game yet. Lynch is a RB so whatever. Upgrading from Gore to him might be worth .1 wins/year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 russell wilson is suspect as a QB can be. 108 yards last week, and was saved by a miracle reception. count me as unimpressed. don't get me started on colin "daddy long-legs" kaepernick. one blow to his boney knees would shatter the 49ers world. I like RW a lot but he has not looked good in the passing game for about a month. I would worry about this game if I am a Seahawks fan. doesn't part of you wonder how much being successful early has helped both of them? They might not be elite passers, but they have won so much that they are "budding stars" now, so they will keep doing at least very well if not great. Now had either of them been drafted here and gotten beat up on a bad 6-10 team for 2 years they could be about finished in the league. Makes you wonder. So much of success is mental belief in oneself and circumstance They were both drafted without the pressure of starting right away. They were both drafted to playoff-ready teams. They both won the QB job away from the starter. They already had stability at HC. They would not be winning playoff games in Cleveland or Jacksonville. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah John Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Wilson and Kaepernick are both very good players who play at the level of the rest of their teams. They don't put their teams on their backs and get them through a tough game like Brady and P Manning do. I think for a few more years the more interesting QB rivalries will be Foles v RGIII, and Brees v Newton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 I don't understand all this talk about how the Seahawks are the better team. Their defense is slightly better, sure, but the Niners have the better O-Line, better receivers and a deeper backfield. Kaep is better protected and he has more opportunities to make plays. Seattle has better talent and better players but San Fran is a better team with talent farther across the board then Seattle. This showed a lot against Carolina. San Fran shut down Carolinas few play makers and keyed in on their weakest parts on defense.Seattle has more playmakers then Carolina and if they get a chance they will be able to win with that alone. Otherwise I can see San Fran coming back for another Super Bowl appearance. New England beats SF in the Supr Bowl. SF beats Denver. Denver would beat Seattle. I say this because Manning is smart enough to put the ball where it needs to be and they have a good enough defense to make Seattle 1 dimensional. SF beats Denver because of clock management and harder hitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Russell Wilson is extremely overrated...the team rolls with lynch.... Sure, he is overrated; only 24-8 in his first two seasons. Who would want a QB who wins 75% of games in his first two years and is durable? Not the Bills, they played it smart and took Graham ahead of Wilson in the third round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clippers of Nfl Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Seattle has better talent and better players but San Fran is a better team with talent farther across the board then Seattle. This showed a lot against Carolina. San Fran shut down Carolinas few play makers and keyed in on their weakest parts on defense. Seattle has more playmakers then Carolina and if they get a chance they will be able to win with that alone. Otherwise I can see San Fran coming back for another Super Bowl appearance. New England beats SF in the Supr Bowl. SF beats Denver. Denver would beat Seattle. I say this because Manning is smart enough to put the ball where it needs to be and they have a good enough defense to make Seattle 1 dimensional. SF beats Denver because of clock management and harder hitting. Seattle has #1 defense. They can stop the run. They can get at the qb. They have the players to stop the mediocre pass attack that's left from Ne. Seattle vs Ne is a Seattle blow out in my mind. Or if not a blow out, at least a convincing victory. Sf almost for the same reasons as above only that they stop the run even better. Sf over Ne. Nfc superbowl this year if new england represents afc. If Denver represents afc, ugggghh Im still not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prissythecat Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Sure, he is overrated; only 24-8 in his first two seasons. Who would want a QB who wins 75% of games in his first two years and is durable? Not the Bills, they played it smart and took Graham ahead of Wilson in the third round. If you put Wilson on our team, you think he would still have a 75% win percentage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Sure, he is overrated; only 24-8 in his first two seasons. Who would want a QB who wins 75% of games in his first two years and is durable? Not the Bills, they played it smart and took Graham ahead of Wilson in the third round. Obviously, Graham over Wilson is terrible. But people have to stop with the whole QB record thing. Seattle's D has finished #1 and #4 the last 2 years. They are the MVPs of that team. And as much as people try to twist it, Wilson started his career very similar to EJ's (minus the injuries). A dominant D helped him grow into the position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clippers of Nfl Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Russell Wilson is extremely overrated...the team rolls with lynch.... Do you watch their games? I watch almost all their games. He single handily has one games for them. Extending plays on his feet. Very accurate passer. Throws while runners are in stride. This guy is the real deal. High football iq. You're right about beast mode. They rely on him too. But wilson is the man too. Get him some wrs, not glass joe percy harvin, and his numbers will only get better. Now percy Harvin is overrated. Since he is not durable, I wouldnt want him on the squad. Too too too too too injury prone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Do you watch their games? I watch almost all their games. He single handily has one games for them. Extending plays on his feet. Very accurate passer. Throws while runners are in stride. This guy is the real deal. High football iq. You're right about beast mode. They rely on him too. But wilson is the man too. Get him some wrs, not glass joe percy harvin, and his numbers will only get better. Now percy Harvin is overrated. Since he is not durable, I wouldnt want him on the squad. Too too too too too injury prone. I think Wilson is a top 10 qb. He can be great at times. He has pretty crappy wrs. But it's a lot easier to win games with the #1 D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 I put them both in the Top 10-15 range......neither is elite.....YET. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 If you put Wilson on our team, you think he would still have a 75% win percentage? No, because he wouldn't have had a coach who recognized his skills and knew how to use them, and the Bills are not as good as the Seahawks. Nevertheless, Wilson has been outstanding in his first two years. Everyone thought Carroll was crazy when he announced Wilson as the starter at the start of the 2012 season, but he know what he was doing. Obviously, Graham over Wilson is terrible. But people have to stop with the whole QB record thing. Seattle's D has finished #1 and #4 the last 2 years. They are the MVPs of that team. And as much as people try to twist it, Wilson started his career very similar to EJ's (minus the injuries). A dominant D helped him grow into the position. In 2012, Wilson was one of only 4 QB's to have a rating of 100 or better (Rodgers, P. Manning and RG III) and one of 7 to have a rating of 100 or better this year. His winning % last year was .69. EJ's ratng this year was 77.7, winning % .40. I don't see the similarity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zevo Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 No, because he wouldn't have had a coach who recognized his skills and knew how to use them, and the Bills are not as good as the Seahawks. Nevertheless, Wilson has been outstanding in his first two years. Everyone thought Carroll was crazy when he announced Wilson as the starter at the start of the 2012 season, but he know what he was doing. In 2012, Wilson was one of only 4 QB's to have a rating of 100 or better (Rodgers, P. Manning and RG III) and one of 7 to have a rating of 100 or better this year. His winning % last year was .69. EJ's ratng this year was 77.7, winning % .40. I don't see the similarity. Game manager....I'd take Kap any day... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clippers of Nfl Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Game manager....I'd take Kap any day... From what I'v seen, they are michael vicking kap too much. 9ers are just asking for an injury. Wilson is mostly forced to run out of the pocket. (of course they have designed run plays for wilson) So I'll take Wilson for the long run. I have not seen that many 9ers games. So my info could be off. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 From what I'v seen, they are michael vicking kap too much. 9ers are just asking for an injury. Wilson is mostly forced to run out of the pocket. (of course they have designed run plays for wilson) So I'll take Wilson for the long run. I have not seen that many 9ers games. So my info could be off. Sorry. I think they are asking him to run less than last year and Kap is pretty good about getting down or out of bounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 Game manager....I'd take Kap any day... I'd take Kap too wlith his size, but game managers don't keep drives alive with their running and ability to turn busted plays into gains, and don't usually have QB ratings above 100.0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 No, because he wouldn't have had a coach who recognized his skills and knew how to use them, and the Bills are not as good as the Seahawks. Nevertheless, Wilson has been outstanding in his first two years. Everyone thought Carroll was crazy when he announced Wilson as the starter at the start of the 2012 season, but he know what he was doing. In 2012, Wilson was one of only 4 QB's to have a rating of 100 or better (Rodgers, P. Manning and RG III) and one of 7 to have a rating of 100 or better this year. His winning % last year was .69. EJ's ratng this year was 77.7, winning % .40. I don't see the similarity. I definitely put Wilson in the top 10. But I dispute the idea who is solely winning games for him. as a rookie, he threw 393 times (24.6 per game) which tied for 25th in the league. Manuel threw 306 times in 10 games (30.6 per game). When you have a top 5 defense and a good running game, you don't have to win games by yourself. The way the Seahwaks brought Wilson along last year was pretty much the same way the Bills brought EJ along. Except EJ struggled with injuries and didn't have as good of a defense. At this point, the pressure isn't all on Wilson like it is which some QBs. I think he will be very good but he is a part of a very well balanced machine. And to answer the question, I'd go with Wilson over Kaepernick. Very similar and very similar situations. Difference is I think Wilson is a better pure passer and never takes a big hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) And to answer the question, I'd go with Wilson over Kaepernick. Very similar and very similar situations. Difference is I think Wilson is a better pure passer and never takes a big hit. passing ability and health are definitely higher on the list than this but.... additionally, i think wilson has a better head on his shoulders. I think the humble, professional, leadership that he displays does better long term over CK telling the haters to be quiet when he wore a dolphins hat and mocking cam in the endzone. while its not always true, its definitely my preference all things equal - especially at quarterback Edited January 15, 2014 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 passing ability and health are definitely higher on the list than this but.... additionally, i think wilson has a better head on his shoulders. I think the humble, professional, leadership that he displays does better long term over CK telling the haters to be quiet when he wore a dolphins hat and mocking cam in the endzone. while its not always true, its definitely my preference all things equal - especially at quarterback Agreed. I never thought Wilson was going to be a bust but I didn't get the hype. But everything people said about him being a special guy seems very true. IMO, EJ has a lot of the same characteristics as a human being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 I agree that Wilson's professionalism and humility are admirable and make him a great leader. Kaepernick is a competitor and a hard-worker, but his off the field behaviors should be corrected. Mocking Cam's celebration is one thing - as LT was saying on NFLN, during the game, besides being in the heat of the moment so to speak, you give the other guys a chance to get back at you. The thing he did after the game on Twitter where he was like "I used to be called Kryptonite" was a bit much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerry Posted January 15, 2014 Share Posted January 15, 2014 I definitely put Wilson in the top 10. But I dispute the idea who is solely winning games for him. as a rookie, he threw 393 times (24.6 per game) which tied for 25th in the league. Manuel threw 306 times in 10 games (30.6 per game). When you have a top 5 defense and a good running game, you don't have to win games by yourself. The way the Seahwaks brought Wilson along last year was pretty much the same way the Bills brought EJ along. Except EJ struggled with injuries and didn't have as good of a defense. At this point, the pressure isn't all on Wilson like it is which some QBs. I think he will be very good but he is a part of a very well balanced machine. And to answer the question, I'd go with Wilson over Kaepernick. Very similar and very similar situations. Difference is I think Wilson is a better pure passer and never takes a big hit. One thing that is rarely discussed is the coaching that rookie QB's get; this can make or break their development. Carroll has a ton of experience as a HC at the major college and pro level, and Harbaugh was a pro QB with major college HC experience. All QB coaching is not equal, and I have concerns about whether Marrone and Hackett will be able to develop and maximize EJ's talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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