God's Team: Ray Lewis vs Tim Tebow - same or different?

[BillsCelticsAngelsBama]

Ray Lewis is a creep.

Wonderful insight. May I quote you ? Edited January 22, 2013 by MOVALLEYRANDY

[metzelaars_lives]

so because I made a mistake in one area means everything else is wrong, that's not logical.

 

Every idea is stands own its own merits, not whether or not you like some one, or disagree with them on something else.

 

You made a mistake about football players, but you are certain as to how the Earth was created and to what extent God played a role?

 

Let me make something abundantly clear: if you believe that there is a 100% chance that God exists, much the same way you are certain Wegmans exists, YOU ARE INSANE. If you believe that there is between a 1 and 99% chance that God exists but what would like to believe he exists because it helps you sleep at night, then that is a rational thought. Either way, you, me, Ray Lewis, Tim Tebow, priests, rabbis- none of us know anything more about anything related to this subject than any man that has ever walked the face of the earth. There is only one logical answer when asked about this subject and that is: I DON'T KNOW.

 

But I do know that trading Mario Williams for John Skelton would have proved to be an enormous blunder.

[Prickly Pete]

Wonderful insight. May I quote you ?

Sure.

 

There is no other insight needed.

[BBeck/cuba]

Tebow = great person, good football player, Bad QB

Ray Ray = Great football palyer, good man, bad young man

I am a Christian and my faith is very important to me. I dont like Tebow but its more because of how the media overhyped him. There are a lot of NFL players who are strong in their faith and do amazing charity work and have accomplished much more on the field. I dont see those guys getting this kinda play.

As far as the Bible goes, it is a redemtion story. Ray's sins of the past are forgiven by the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. The one lost sheep is of more worth than the 99 who never strayed. I belive Ray Lewis' life has spoken for itself since he got in trouble. Also Tebow's year in exile on the bench in New Jersey will do him well.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

You made a mistake about football players, but you are certain as to how the Earth was created and to what extent God played a role?

 

Let me make something abundantly clear: if you believe that there is a 100% chance that God exists, much the same way you are certain Wegmans exists, YOU ARE INSANE. If you believe that there is between a 1 and 99% chance that God exists but what would like to believe he exists because it helps you sleep at night, then that is a rational thought. Either way, you, me, Ray Lewis, Tim Tebow, priests, rabbis- none of us know anything more about anything related to this subject than any man that has ever walked the face of the earth. There is only one logical answer when asked about this subject and that is: I DON'T KNOW.

 

But I do know that trading Mario Williams for John Skelton would have proved to be an enormous blunder.

 

Again my views of Skelton are irrelevant as to whether or not God exists.

 

All I can say is look at the links I provided (and the one below) and see for yourself if I'm insane or not.

 

You having nothing to lose as learning this information will either strengthen your views against it or at least you will have learned something new.

 

 

http://www.proofthatgodexists.org/welcome.php

[dwight in philly]

One is a murderer, the other does charity.

 

Guess who the media portrays in a better perspective

[BobChalmers]

Ray Lewis does it, Ok

 

Tebow does it, Bad

 

You mocking the media or being serious?

 

Lewis' words on the field seemed to go way beyond what I'd heard Tebow say/do. Tebow seems pretty focused on his own thankfulness for his own opportunities win or lose. Lewis was implying God was on the side of the Ravens winning the game.

 

I'm not terribly offended by any of it, but Lewis' seemed pretty clear that God was helping his team win ball games and I find that presumptious at best. I suspect there are plenty of good prayers being said in most locker rooms - and most post-game kneel-downs prove that out. To take the attitude that your team is more favored is kind of obnoxious.

[major]

I don't mind Ray Lewis or Tim Tebow being bold about their faith. I'm a firm believer that if you're passionate about something, you'll talk about it. People see a good movie and tell their friends about it; therefore, I don't mind either athlete talking about their love for God. Good for them.

[BillsBytheBay]

One is a murderer, the other does charity.

 

Guess who the media portrays in a better perspective

wait, Tebow committed murder, or ray-ray doesn't do charity work? Witch is it? I know ray went to jail for not talking... And he does charity work... So ....Tebow killed a guy? This is more of that Christian forgiveness, and don't judge others judging.

Both men, I'm sure, are very serious with there relationships with god. I I would never pick who pulls it off better. That's so stupid. Crap, I just realized this is a thread about how we perceive others during emotional religious moments.... And we have to pick one?

Edited January 22, 2013 by JaxBills

[BillsBytheBay]

New question, who are we the most okay with praying on a football field?

[Mr. WEO]

You made a mistake about football players, but you are certain as to how the Earth was created and to what extent God played a role?

 

Let me make something abundantly clear: if you believe that there is a 100% chance that God exists, much the same way you are certain Wegmans exists, YOU ARE INSANE. If you believe that there is between a 1 and 99% chance that God exists but what would like to believe he exists because it helps you sleep at night, then that is a rational thought. Either way, you, me, Ray Lewis, Tim Tebow, priests, rabbis- none of us know anything more about anything related to this subject than any man that has ever walked the face of the earth. There is only one logical answer when asked about this subject and that is: I DON'T KNOW.

 

But I do know that trading Mario Williams for John Skelton would have proved to be an enormous blunder.

 

Oh my! Ba--BOOM!

 

But the difference between the two is that Tebow has devoted nearly his entire adult life to this point to living the life he describes, through missions, etc. I really believe his faith is natural and authentic.

 

Lewis, since he was busted in connection with a fight in which 2 men were murdered by his friends (and which he attempted at first to cover up), has been in totally over the top and in everyone's face with his "found" religion--as if to convince everyone he's not the a**hole por athlete he seemed to be back then. Maybe he's lobbying St. Peter.........

[Gugny]

These are just my feelings. I have no evidence of anything being factual. They're feelings and I'm not implying that I'm right or wrong:

 

I think Ray Lewis is a murderer.

I think Ray Lewis' faith is genuine and sincere.

I think Ray Lewis' display at the end of the game was real and unplanned.

I think Ray Lewis is the posterboy (boy is not being used as a racial slur, so relax) for "teammate."

I think Tim Tebow is a fake.

I think Tim Tebow uses the camera to spread his gospel the same way a televangalist does .. just with less words.

I don't think Tim Tebow cares about anyone or anything but himself, his family and his personal achievements.

I don't think Tim Tebow cares about winning football games.

I think every single thing Tim Tebow does when the camera is on him is planned and he waits to do nearly everything until he knows the camera is on him.

 

Those are just my thoughts. And I'm glad neither is a Bill and I pray to MY God that neither ever is.

[apuszczalowski]

Tebow = great person, good football player, Bad QB

Ray Ray = Great football palyer, good man, bad young man

I am a Christian and my faith is very important to me. I dont like Tebow but its more because of how the media overhyped him. There are a lot of NFL players who are strong in their faith and do amazing charity work and have accomplished much more on the field. I dont see those guys getting this kinda play.

As far as the Bible goes, it is a redemtion story. Ray's sins of the past are forgiven by the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. The one lost sheep is of more worth than the 99 who never strayed. I belive Ray Lewis' life has spoken for itself since he got in trouble. Also Tebow's year in exile on the bench in New Jersey will do him well.

there is something to be learned from all of this.

 

Be a great athlete and play your game at a high level and all is forgiven

Don't play your game to the crazy potential the media and fans put on you and you will be cricified in the media for your actions/beliefs

[Buftex]

I am not taking sides on this issue, and I am no holy-roller...but honeslty, other than sucking, and having way too much coverage from ESPN, what has Tim Tebow done to make people hate him so much?

 

He is hardly the first athlete to be "super-christy",and honeslty, other than media people railing on and on about it, I have seen/heard little from him on the subject, unless asked. I mean, most people loved Kurt Warner, right? He was far more verbally "super-christy" than Tebow, from what I have seen. Believe me, I am sure as **** glad the Bills never got involved in the Tim Tebow circus, but I have a real hard time dis-liking the guy. Even this season, when he was treated like absolute crap by his coaching staff, he kept a stiff upper-lip and never complained in public...in this day and age, that is to be commended...look at that punk Dwight Howard in LA.

 

****, I just read Figs' comments... I got nothing against Ray Lewis either (as far as the religious stuff goes), but do you really think his displays are any less contrived than Tebows'? I thought he was rediculous this past Sunday..he did a lot of crying, but I didn't see any tears. But that doesn't make me root against him.

Edited January 22, 2013 by Buftex

[BillsBackersChicago]

 

 

Again my views of Skelton are irrelevant as to whether or not God exists.

 

All I can say is look at the links I provided (and the one below) and see for yourself if I'm insane or not.

 

You having nothing to lose as learning this information will either strengthen your views against it or at least you will have learned something new.

 

 

http://www.proofthatgodexists.org/welcome.php

 

That website is arguably the dumbest thing i've ever seen. I wasted my time going through all the links only to be brought to a page which predicated the entire argument on the following completely and unsubstantiated statement.

 

"Universal, immaterial, unchanging laws cannot be accounted for if the universe was random or only material in nature."

 

Now i know that I was the idiot that took the bait and decided to click through that nonsense (it was that or going back to work), but come on!!

 

Dammit man, if ur gonna try and argue ur point, find some better substantiating resources!!

 

[Gugny]

I am not taking sides on this issue, and I am no holy-roller...but honeslty, other than sucking, and having way too much coverage from ESPN, what has Tim Tebow done to make people hate him so much?

 

He is hardly the first athlete to be "super-christy",and honeslty, other than media people railing on and on about it, I have seen/heard little from him on the subject, unless asked. I mean, most people loved Kurt Warner, right? He was far more verbally "super-christy" than Tebow, from what I have seen. Believe me, I am sure as **** glad the Bills never got involved in the Tim Tebow circus, but I have a real hard time dis-liking the guy. Even this season, when he was treated like absolute crap by his coaching staff, he kept a stiff upper-lip and never complained in public...in this day and age, that is to be commended...look at that punk Dwight Howard in LA.

 

****, I just read Figs' comments... I got nothing against Ray Lewis either (as far as the religious stuff goes), but do you really think his displays are any less contrived than Tebows'? I thought he was rediculous this past Sunday..he did a lot of crying, but I didn't see any tears. But that doesn't make me root against him.

I think Lewis' passion is sincere. I think the only contrived Ray Lewis actions are that idiotic dance thing he does at the beginning of games.

 

And I don't hate Tim Tebow. I just don't buy his schtick. It's why I prefaced my opinions with what I did. It's just my personal belief that Tebow is a huge phony.

[HamSandwhich]

That website is arguably the dumbest thing i've ever seen. I wasted my time going through all the links only to be brought to a page which predicated the entire argument on the following completely and unsubstantiated statement.

 

"Universal, immaterial, unchanging laws cannot be accounted for if the universe was random or only material in nature."

 

Now i know that I was the idiot that took the bait and decided to click through that nonsense (it was that or going back to work), but come on!!

 

Dammit man, if ur gonna try and argue ur point, find some better substantiating resources!!

 

No you're not the only one, and I'd like that 5 mins of my time back.

[Buftex]

I think Lewis' passion is sincere. I think the only contrived Ray Lewis actions are that idiotic dance thing he does at the beginning of games.

 

And I don't hate Tim Tebow. I just don't buy his schtick. It's why I prefaced my opinions with what I did. It's just my personal belief that Tebow is a huge phony.

 

Maybe you are right...maybe I just tune out the Tebow thing, cuz I get so sick of hearing the name...I didn't really see a lot of him in college...but in the pros, I don't really think I ever heard him utter a christy word...maybe that Super Bowl commercial he did prior to the draft. It just seems like people dig for reasons to dislike him.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

That website is arguably the dumbest thing i've ever seen. I wasted my time going through all the links only to be brought to a page which predicated the entire argument on the following completely and unsubstantiated statement.

 

"Universal, immaterial, unchanging laws cannot be accounted for if the universe was random or only material in nature."

 

Now i know that I was the idiot that took the bait and decided to click through that nonsense (it was that or going back to work), but come on!!

 

Dammit man, if ur gonna try and argue ur point, find some better substantiating resources!!

 

I thought it might apply to his logical mindset but this one is the more strait forward.

 

http://www.eaec.org/bookstore/books/answers_evolution_friends.htm

[Gene Frenkle]

I thought it might apply to his logical mindset but this one is the more strait forward.

 

http://www.eaec.org/...ion_friends.htm

So now, in addition to claiming that Abiogenesis is not possible, you're denying Evolution too?

 

Sweet.

[buckeyemike]

As a man who believes that Jesus is the Son of God, came in the flesh, and died and rose again for all humanity I agree. I am open to those I come in contact with on a daily basis by my lifestyle that I love all that He has done for me. I am happy he is happy and thanking God. I dont know the mans heart and cant judge him personally. The problem I have is with the grandstanders in public and behind the pulpit that live contrary to what they preach . live it or shut up is my feeling.

 

^^^This^^^

[Hater]

I am an Atheist, so I am not taking sides on this issue

 

I just find it funny that God who suppose to love all would give one Player or Team the edge to win a game, does he pick the player that prays harder

 

I am not being mean I just like to know how a player can justify saying God gave me the ability to Win, that like saying I am a better Christian then the the guy

[BillsBackersChicago]

In two days, I have had to look up two words written on this godforsaken (like how I incorporated the subject material) board that I did not know the meaning of: proselytizing and now abiogenesis. I am thinking that either you guys are getting too damn smart, or I am getting decidedly dumber. It might be from reading some of the posts on here, but wow, you guys and your fancy words.

[Dibs]

I have no problem with sports people thanking God for having been blessed with skills and abilities well above the norm.

I also have no problem with them thanking God for being in a situation where there personal dreams can be fulfilled(irrelevant to how self serving those dreams are).

Both of these to me are similar to thanking God for the food on ones table or the roof over ones head.

 

I do however have a problem with sports people thanking God in such a manner that implies that He has taken a specific interest in the outcome of the sporting event or athlete's success.

The mildest view I can take on those athletes is that they are unwise.

Less mild views would contain the words "hubris", "attention seeking", "self absorbed" and "misguided".

[Prickly Pete]

Ray Lewis implies that God is endorsing him. That implies that he is worthy of God's good will, which implies that Ray Lewis must be a good guy. That is why he grandstands, to say "how can I be a bad guy if God is having all these great things happen to me?". It's a total ego trip, and the more he insists it is "God's work" the more I think he is compensating.

 

Lot's of bad guys have won Super Bowls, and lots of bad guys have been ministers, priest's, and ayatollah's.

 

I also question his constant proclamations about "being a man", and his manhood, etc. Draw your own conclusions about that.

Edited January 23, 2013 by Manti'sMicro

[Dibs]

(no capital needed)

According to the English language, technically a capitol is needed.

[Prickly Pete]

According to the English language, technically a capitol is needed.

 

Do you mean "capital" (because we are being "technical" here)?

[Dibs]

Do you mean "capital" (because we are being "technical" here)?

lol

[Prickly Pete]

lol

 

[CSBill]

I think Lewis' passion is sincere. I think the only contrived Ray Lewis actions are that idiotic dance thing he does at the beginning of games.

 

And I don't hate Tim Tebow. I just don't buy his schtick. It's why I prefaced my opinions with what I did. It's just my personal belief that Tebow is a huge phony.

 

Wow, pretty strong judgement against someone you don't know, I really don't get the angst.

[BillsBiker]

Watching Ray Lewis at the end of the game last night, kneeling on the field - butt crack showing and dozens of photographers surrounding him in a circle - and then listening to him talk about God....well, it seemed a bit "over the top" to me.

 

But then I started thinking maybe it's not all that different than what Tebow does, in terms of how Tim presents his faith in God on the field and in interviews.

 

To me, my faith and my relationship with God are intensely personal and intimate, but I understand not everyone feels that way.

 

So, I'm interested in people's opinions about their reaction to Ray Lewis' post-game actions/words on his faith, and how that compares to people's perceptions about Tim Tebow's actions/words on his faith.

 

This is strictly related to how they present this to the public as part of their football (professional) personas.

 

Most people like Tim and Ray are proud of the relationship they have God.. Ur's is intimate? What do you wanna give Jesus as Bee-Jay? Ur sick..

[brenty]

honestly does it matter? I am a Christian and who cares how someone does it. I can give you great examples of pastors that might be faking it also. As I always was told. Know one knows what is really inside your heart but God. I just think it gets rediculus when people mock someone for having their faith, like everyone did with tebow. And tebow has been doing that since he was in highschool so I don't think he is doing it for the spot light. He is a real guy who I got to meet when no cameras were on him.

[Prickly Pete]

honestly does it matter? I am a Christian and who cares how someone does it. I can give you great examples of pastors that might be faking it also. As I always was told. Know one knows what is really inside your heart but God. I just think it gets rediculus when people mock someone for having their faith, like everyone did with tebow. And tebow has been doing that since he was in highschool so I don't think he is doing it for the spot light. He is a real guy who I got to meet when no cameras were on him.

 

It mainly matters to the people that want to watch the Super Bowl without having Ray Lewis's story, face, and antics thrown in our face all game long (at the very least).

[Gugny]

honestly does it matter? I am a Christian and who cares how someone does it. I can give you great examples of pastors that might be faking it also. As I always was told. Know one knows what is really inside your heart but God. I just think it gets rediculus when people mock someone for having their faith, like everyone did with tebow. And tebow has been doing that since he was in highschool so I don't think he is doing it for the spot light. He is a real guy who I got to meet when no cameras were on him.

I'm not saying his prayers aren't real. I'm just saying he's putting on a show while doing it. And I'm also saying it is my belief that he's only praying for his own good fortune. I'm Christian, too, and no one knows when I'm praying. Even if they're right next to me. You know why? Because it's personal. It's not for everyone in the world to see, or to know about. He's a fake.

[Cugalabanza]

Everybody's spewing off their opinions, so I'll give mine too. I reject religion. It's not thinking. It's not inquiry. It's not dialectic or reason or exploration or discovery or tolerance or respect for the mystery of the world. It's the cessation of spiritual thought. It's words in a book and listen to the man in the robe. The more organized and established the religion, the more stultifying. I think some people are helped by religion, but only as a result of lucky side effects like social contact, structure, accountability--it has nothing to do with the questions that the institution purports to address.

[boyst]

If anyone thinks that God hand picked them to do his work I have a problem with them. If a meat headed knuckle dragger on a football field believes God chose him to show the world how great He is then he is incredibly flawed.

 

I am an atheist. I could give a crap what anyone thinks of religion. If you want to worship a toaster and it makes you a better person then good. I try my best not to pick on religious people but they Its ask for it and taunt atheists all the time.

 

The whole debate is not who God likes more. It is who best represents what God is supposed to be. Tebow does it best, ironically, though he comes off as a huge phony. Lewis just comes off as an egomaniac narcissistic douche nozzle. Tebow, for the record is just a douche nozzle. But both are better then that little btch Tom Brady.

Edited January 23, 2013 by jboyst62

[apuszczalowski]

I have no problem with sports people thanking God for having been blessed with skills and abilities well above the norm.

I also have no problem with them thanking God for being in a situation where there personal dreams can be fulfilled(irrelevant to how self serving those dreams are).

Both of these to me are similar to thanking God for the food on ones table or the roof over ones head.

 

I do however have a problem with sports people thanking God in such a manner that implies that He has taken a specific interest in the outcome of the sporting event or athlete's success.

The mildest view I can take on those athletes is that they are unwise.

Less mild views would contain the words "hubris", "attention seeking", "self absorbed" and "misguided".

How do you know that God doesn't sit in his recleiner in the living room every sunday in his Brady jersey cheering on his favorite team to win and affecting the outcome of the game while eating nachos and having a beer?

 

If its not god affecting the outcome of the games, then who is it? My guess is Goodell or the networks. Is it just a coincidence that the Ravens came close to not making the playoffs, then go out and beat the Colts, the Broncos, and the Pats to get to the Superbowl in Lewis' last season for a matchup of Brother against brother HC's? There was no better scenario this season for the networks............

[T master]

First off being a christian especially in todays world means you will be persecuted in some way & i believe that is part of the fascination with Teabow, is to follow him & see if the bright lights of the NFL will take him down or expose him as a phony christian.

 

Along with the guy being used incorrectly & not given a true chance to prove that he can be a good player for some one i think has really tested his metal ! But as the person he is he always comes out on top b/c god has his back !!

 

I believe that Ray has real conviction but b/c of his announcement the media will grab any chance to sensationalize any little tid bit of that story, if it was any one else i don't think they huddle around him like that. Maybe 1 or 2 would pick up on it but b/c of his situation they will be all over any little thing he does.

 

I just hope one day Teabow gets to prove all these haters wrong & he doesn't have to prove that he is Montannaesk but just shows them all he can be & is a good NFL QB !!

[Keukasmallies]

I wonder if there is a religious forum that gets tangled up in football stuff....?

[Gene Frenkle]

If anyone thinks that God hand picked them to do his work I have a problem with them. If a meat headed knuckle dragger on a football field believes God chose him to show the world how great He is then he is incredibly flawed.

 

I am an atheist. I could give a crap what anyone thinks of religion. If you want to worship a toaster and it makes you a better person then good. I try my best not to pick on religious people but they Its ask for it and taunt atheists all the time.

 

The whole debate is not who God likes more. It is who best represents what God is supposed to be. Tebow does it best, ironically, though he comes off as a huge phony. Lewis just comes off as an egomaniac narcissistic douche nozzle. Tebow, for the record is just a douche nozzle. But both are better then that little btch Tom Brady.

Nice!