Ranking the 15 greatest Bills ever

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

All I know is Brian Moorman better be on everyone’s list.

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

22 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Poyer wasn't here long enough? He was here 8 years and was brilliant for 7 of them! 

I think both Poyer and Hyde are right on the fringe of best bills ever but I have a hard time separating them and I think they just are slightly off the list. But I mean…gun to my head both are better or more important then Tasker. I just tried to do right by the Bills history 

Edited 2 hours ago by Brianmoorman4jesus

[GunnerBill]

7 minutes ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

I think both Poyer and Hyde are right on the fringe of best bills ever but I have a hard time separating them and I think they just are slightly off the list. But I mean…guy to my head both are better or more important then Tasker. I just tried to do right by the Bills history 

 

I can see that, but I don't think that is about longevity which was more my issue with your original post. It is about the sum of the whole (ie. the pairing) being greater than the sum of the parts. And I do get that. Personally I always thought Poyer was the more impactful playmaker but possibly because he knew he could take a risk or two because Hyde would always be in position to cover him. 

[eball]

Tasker's not one of the 15 greatest Bills...not by a longshot.

 

[gonzo1105]

1. Bruce Smith

2. Jim Kelly

3. Josh Allen

4. O.J Simpson

5. Andre Reed 

6. Jack Kemp

7. Thurman Thomas

I think these 7 have to be in everyone’s top 15

After that

 

Joe D, Tasker, Kyle Williams, Eric Moulds, Cornelius Bennett, Fred Jackson, Daryl Talley, Billy Shaw, Reuben Brown, Cookie Gilchrist, Elbert Dubenion, Dion Dawkins, Kent Hull all have to be in consideration. 

 

[Utah John]

On 6/12/2025 at 4:20 PM, njbuff said:

I’ll start with who belongs on be list and worry about the rankings later.

 

Kyle Williams

Thurman Thomas

Jim Kelly

Andre Reed 

Joe Delamielleure

Eric Moulds

Bruce Smith

OJ Simpson

Kent Hull

Cornelius Bennett

Josh Allen

Billy Shaw

Butch Byrd

Cookie Gilchrist

Steve Tasker

 

 

Happy to see Moulds, Reed, and Byrd added.  Maybe there isn't room but Sestak was soooo good I would like him here too.

[BigDingus]

1 hour ago, gonzo1105 said:

1. Bruce Smith

2. Jim Kelly

3. Josh Allen

4. O.J Simpson

5. Andre Reed 

6. Jack Kemp

7. Thurman Thomas

I think these 7 have to be in everyone’s top 15

After that

 

Joe D, Tasker, Kyle Williams, Eric Moulds, Cornelius Bennett, Fred Jackson, Daryl Talley, Billy Shaw, Reuben Brown, Cookie Gilchrist, Elbert Dubenion, Dion Dawkins, Kent Hull all have to be in consideration. 

 

 

My man! Glad to see more Ruben Brown respect!

[Ballsy]

On 6/13/2025 at 7:22 AM, Kirby Jackson said:

There’s not one thing Kelly did better than Allen. 

Except take his team to Superbowls....

[Lafromboise]

On 6/13/2025 at 4:22 AM, AverageAllensSuspensor said:

1. Scott Norwood

2. Aaron Maybin

3. EJ Manuel

4. J.P. Losman

5. Mike Williams

6. Sammy Watkins

7. Cierre Wood

8. Tom Cusineau

9. John McCargo

10. T.J. Graham

11. James Hardy

12. Lodis McKelvin

13. Trent Edwards

14. Ron Edwards

15. Erik Flowers

I was waiting for this post.

[Paup 1995MVP]

On 6/13/2025 at 7:22 AM, Kirby Jackson said:

There’s not one thing Kelly did better than Allen. In fact, Kelly was bad in the playoffs. Frank Reich was 2-0 in that span. Don’t confuse winning with a good QB for winning because of a good QB. The early 90’s Bills were the 2025 Eagles. The difference is Jalen Hurts is a better playoff performer than Kelly. There’s not a single thing that Jim Kelly was better at than Josh Allen.

 
I used the Jalen Hurts argument earlier in the offseason. Jim Kelly was the Jalen Hurts of his day. He was a top 5ish QB that won a lot. Josh Allen is the MVP of the league. It’s not comparable. 
 

EDIT: I’m not sure what anyone is disagreeing with? What is there to disagree with? We can Google their statistics in the playoffs. I’m not sure that a reasonable argument can be made, skill wise as to anything Kelly did better than Allen. Toughness was Kelly’s best quality. Allen has that in spades as well. I’m not sure why the topic of Allen being better than Kelly bothers Bills fans? Honestly, it’s not very close. 

It is closer than you make it out to be KJ.  
 

Playing QB in the 80’s and 90’s was a whole different game.  Have you forgotten how violent the NFL used to be?!  Go watch the hit Jim Burt put on Joe Montana in the 1986 Divisional playoff game in the Meadowlands.  It will refresh your memory.  And how about the hit Bruce put on Boomer Esiason that knocked him out on the Rich Stadium frozen turf when he was with the Jets. 
 

Josh Allen is a better athlete.  But Jim Kelly was an awesome gunslinger.  

[Kirby Jackson]

45 minutes ago, Ballsy said:

Except take his team to Superbowls....

So Trent Dilfer is better than Allen? Jalen Hurts? Brad Johnson? Nick Foles? Jeff Hostetler? Those guys must be better than Kelly too because they WON Super Bowls. That’s the dumbest argument ever made. 
 

Someone said throw the deep ball earlier and that’s fair. Kelly was also elite calling the game. We haven’t seen that from Allen. 

13 minutes ago, Paup 1995MVP said:

It is closer than you make it out to be KJ.  
 

Playing QB in the 80’s and 90’s was a whole different game.  Have you forgotten how violent the NFL used to be?!  Go watch the hit Jim Burt put on Joe Montana in the 1986 Divisional playoff game in the Meadowlands.  It will refresh your memory.  And how about the hit Bruce put on Boomer Esiason that knocked him out on the Rich Stadium frozen turf when he was with the Jets. 
 

Josh Allen is a better athlete.  But Jim Kelly was an awesome gunslinger.  

When I compare players, I compare them vs. their contemporaries to avoid the “game was different back then” argument. Josh Allen is the MVP of the league. He’s been a top 3 QB and top 10 overall player for 5 straight years. Jim Kelly wasn’t that in his era. He was, and people hate this, a lot like Hurts is now. He was in the next tier of QBs and had the best roster in football. He was the right guy for them. If Josh Allen quarterbacked those early 90’s team they have AT LEAST 2 Super Bowls. If Jim Kelly quarterbacked these Bills teams they would look a lot like Bucs do now. 

Edited 17 hours ago by Kirby Jackson

[Paup 1995MVP]

3 hours ago, gonzo1105 said:

1. Bruce Smith

2. Jim Kelly

3. Josh Allen

4. O.J Simpson

5. Andre Reed 

6. Jack Kemp

7. Thurman Thomas

I think these 7 have to be in everyone’s top 15

After that

 

Joe D, Tasker, Kyle Williams, Eric Moulds, Cornelius Bennett, Fred Jackson, Daryl Talley, Billy Shaw, Reuben Brown, Cookie Gilchrist, Elbert Dubenion, Dion Dawkins, Kent Hull all have to be in consideration. 

 

Stop w the Dion Dawkins nonsense.  He is a good not quite very good O lineman.  John Fina level.  Conner McGovern is more talented.  Dion Dawkins is a legend in his own mind.  He should not be in the same sentence as Kent Hull.  
 

where is Terrance McGhee on your list?

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

 

Someone said throw the deep ball earlier and that’s fair. Kelly was also elite calling the game. We haven’t seen that from Allen. 

 

I can't really comment on Kelly but I think Josh's understanding pre-snap has really come on under Brady (because the offense requires it more of him). However there is no way right now I'd let Josh Allen call the entire game. He gets too amped up at times as it is and I think he'd call his own number every play because he thinks he is the best player on the field. And he is right. But you can't win in the NFL that way. I understand by way of anecdote that maybe Kelly was guilty of that in SBXXV too. But I think generally he must have been pretty good at it. 

[Paup 1995MVP]

4 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

So Trent Dilfer is better than Allen? Jalen Hurts? Brad Johnson? Nick Foles? Jeff Hostetler? Those guys must be better than Kelly too because they WON Super Bowls. That’s the dumbest argument ever made. 
 

Someone said throw the deep ball earlier and that’s fair. Kelly was also elite calling the game. We haven’t seen that from Allen. 

When I compare players, I compare them vs. their contemporaries to avoid the “game was different argument.” Josh Allen is the MVP of the league. He’s been a top 3 QB and top 10 player for 5 straight years. Jim Kelly wasn’t that in his era. He was, and people hate this, a lot like Hurts is now. He was in the next tier of QBs and had the best roster in football there. He was the right guy for them. If Josh Allen quarterbacked those early 90’s team they have AT LEAST 2 Super Bowls. If Jim Kelly quarterbacked these Bills teams they would look a lot like Bucs do now. 

I understand what you are saying. But Jim Kelly is much better than Jalen Hurts could ever dream of being.  
 

Jim Kelly was a top echelon player in the NFL his entire career.  That being said Josh Allen would have beaten the Giants and the Cowboys in the 4th Super Bowl.  The Redskins and Cowboys 1st Super Bowl would have also been closer.
 

Dan Marino threw a football better than any human being that has ever lived.  But he didn’t win a Super Bowl. 
 

it’s a team game.  Josh Allen is amazing. Hopefully w some studs on defense we will achieve our destiny this year.  But please don’t compare Kelly to Hurts.  I am not a Hurts fan.  So that Hurts.  Lol
 

 

[Kirby Jackson]

7 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I can't really comment on Kelly but I think Josh's understanding pre-snap has really come on under Brady (because the offense requires it more of him). However there is no way right now I'd let Josh Allen call the entire game. He gets too amped up at times as it is and I think he'd call his own number every play because he thinks he is the best player on the field. And he is right. But you can't win in the NFL that way. I understand by way of anecdote that maybe Kelly was guilty of that in SBXXV too. But I think generally he must have been pretty good at it. 

I wish Kelly didn’t predate you here. I’d be super interested in your perspective. He would call whole games pretty much at the LOS. It was wild. Josh gets that “sugar high Josh” at times. Exactly what you said would give me some pause in him doing more at the LOS. I’d say he’s good at it. Kelly was one of the best ever at it.

3 minutes ago, Paup 1995MVP said:

I understand what you are saying. But Jim Kelly is much better than Jalen Hurts could ever dream of being.  
 

Jim Kelly was a top echelon player in the NFL his entire career.  That being said Josh Allen would have beaten the Giants and the Cowboys in the 4th Super Bowl.  The Redskins and Cowboys 1st Super Bowl would have also been closer.
 

Dan Marino threw a football better than any human being that has ever lived.  But he didn’t win a Super Bowl. 
 

it’s a team game.  Josh Allen is amazing. Hopefully w some studs on defense we will achieve our destiny this year.  But please don’t compare Kelly to Hurts.  I am not a Hurts fan.  So that Hurts.  Lol
 

 

Lol, I’m sorry and know that’s a little controversial. Hurts is a top 5-10 QB. Kelly was closer to 5 but Hurts has been elite in 2 Super Bowls. He’s won one. He may very well win another. FWIW, I definitely have Kelly over Hurts but in a few years that could change. If Hurts wins another and plays well, he has the better career IMO. 

[Big Turk]

On 6/12/2025 at 6:27 PM, MJS said:

Funny. I was thinking about posting a thread about the top 10 Bills of all time. This is how I would probably rank it:

 

1) Bruce Smith (DE)
2) Jim Kelly (QB)
3) Thurman Thomas (RB)
4) Josh Allen (QB)
5) Andre Reed (WR)
6) OJ Simpson (RB)
7) Kent Hull (C)
8 ) Kyle Williams (DT)
9) Mike Stratton (LB)
10) Fred Smerlas (DT)

11) Cornelius Bennett (LB)

12) Billy Shaw (LG)

13) Eric Moulds (WR)

14) Joe DeLamielleure (RG)

15) Steve Tasker (WR)

 

It is hard to rank Tasker, but I can see him as a top 15 Bills player.

 

(Edited)

 

There is no way Kelly is ahead of Allen. Zero chance. It's not even close honestly. And I watched every game Kelly played in.

 

And if you want to give some nonsensical argument that it's because he appeared in 4 straight Super Bowls, look no farther than the Bills defense allowing an average of 8.3 points per game and a total of 33 points. 

 

Or essentially the same number of points the Bills allowed to the Chiefs in last year's AFC championship game.

Edited 15 hours ago by Big Turk

[gonzo1105]

57 minutes ago, Paup 1995MVP said:

Stop w the Dion Dawkins nonsense.  He is a good not quite very good O lineman.  John Fina level.  Conner McGovern is more talented.  Dion Dawkins is a legend in his own mind.  He should not be in the same sentence as Kent Hull.  
 

where is Terrance McGhee on your list?

While I think your overreacting, I put him on the list because of his solid longevity. He’s been a Bill for 8 years. He most likely at minimum will be here for 10 years and has been a pro bowler 4 of those years(not that it means much nowadays) He’s probably honestly last on that list and will he probably seem like Kent Hull was when his career is over. 
 

I actually like McGee being mentioned again due to his longevity in the uniform. He’d probably be in the same tier as Dawkins in my opinion but I wouldn’t crush you or anyone else for mentioning him 

[BananaB]

Josh Allen is not only the best football to play for the Bills but probably the best football player ever. Championships are about situations and Josh has been on the bad side of that. Jmo

[Big Turk]

4 hours ago, Paup 1995MVP said:

It is closer than you make it out to be KJ.  
 

Playing QB in the 80’s and 90’s was a whole different game.  Have you forgotten how violent the NFL used to be?!  Go watch the hit Jim Burt put on Joe Montana in the 1986 Divisional playoff game in the Meadowlands.  It will refresh your memory.  And how about the hit Bruce put on Boomer Esiason that knocked him out on the Rich Stadium frozen turf when he was with the Jets. 
 

Josh Allen is a better athlete.  But Jim Kelly was an awesome gunslinger.  

 

It is not close. Not even remotely close.

 

Allen is the most productive player in the history of the NFL on a per game basis in both the regular and post season.

 

Allen is literally doing something nobody has ever done before 5-6x a season or more.

 

Kelly threw more than 30 TD passes one time. One!

 

Allen is so much better than Kelly it's a joke anyone would even compare them, let alone put Kelly higher because they have some nostalgic bias of misremembering Kelly's play here and thinking it was far better than it actually was.

 

Kelly was very good, but he was never even close to Allen's level either in play or talent.

 

And that's simply the inconvenient truth many don't want to admit. But I watched every game Kelly played in as a Bill and never saw Kelly do anything close to what Allen has.

 

Not even Jim Kelly himself would say he was better than Allen. No need for anyone else to.

Edited 13 hours ago by Big Turk

[97bills]

On 6/12/2025 at 5:55 PM, MJS said:

I have Kelly over Allen as well. Kelly took us to 4 superbowls. It isn't a list of talent. Considering the overall Impact, I think Kelly did more. But I have no doubt that Allen will surpass him.

For me it’s how bad Kelly played in those Super Bowls. If Allen had the team Kelly did , well we probably have at least one or two….