Joe Marino says all-22 Review shows Josh deserves a lot of blame for Pats Loss

[90sBills]

5 hours ago, billybob71 said:

this thread is depressing

‘Same ***** different day’ - Josh Allen

[oldmanfan]

29 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

Well if you're looking for reasons to be pessimistic just consider how the Bills coaching/management brain trust may be well on their way to ruining Allen. 

 

Instead of a forceful personality like DaBoll, who was willing to get in the trenches and argue with McD about what the O should be, we have a compliant OC who is faithfully executing the McD vision of how an offense should compliment his defense.  So the guy that benched Tyrod Taylor to give Peterman a shot in 2017 and then decided that Allen wasn't ready to start in 2018 but Peterman was is now setting the strategic mission for Allen and the offense.  I've got a bad feeling that this will not end well for the Bills.

 

One last observation.  Remember in the 2nd quarter of the 2021 KC playoff game when the Bills got the ball after a punt at midfield and they ran it three straight times and didn't get the 1st down?  That always bothered me and I suspect that what happened there was that McD yelled at DaBoll for not doing enough (running the ball) to protect his D from Mahomes while DaBoll was arguing that his responsibility is to score.  I will go to my grave believing those play calls by DaBoll were a big F you to McD in that game.

 

 

 

 

So now there is a conspiracy by the OC against the HC in the middle of a playoff game?  

[90sBills]

26 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Mahomes has more...33 on the year, he is running more than ever. Allen had 124 rushes last year to Mahomes 66, almost double. Now Mahomes has more than Allen. That isn't maximizing anything, especially when a bunch of Allen's "runs" have come on QB sneaks and the final failed lateral attempt last game counted as a run.   

That’s why I said ‘about’. Mahomes is 33 and Allen is 29 in week 7. There’s a lot of games left. At this pace they’ll both be in the 60s-70s by year’s end. Having him doubled Mahomes’ attempts last year is not sustainable for a qb. That’s what the coaching staff is try to do…sustain him for the long term. 

[CincyBillsFan]

Just now, oldmanfan said:

So now there is a conspiracy by the OC against the HC in the middle of a playoff game?  

No but I've always thought that sequence was weird, very weird.  If you can go back and re-watch it. And people are people.  If McD got on the head phones and yelled at DaBoll to run the ball I could see this exact reaction - even in the middle of the game.  I know that's a lot of "ifs" but I've never forgotten that series and thought it stood out in comparison to how DaBoll called the rest of the game.

 

Both coaches were very professional during their years together and we didn't see the likely bad blood between the two. But we saw it after that Sunday night game.

 

 

[90sBills]

34 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

he’s not Mahomes. Let’s stop comparing him to Mahomes. If he could read the field consistently like  Mahomes he would have shown us that by years six already.

 

Allen has other tools in his tool bag. Might as well let him use those as well.

I think in the rushing attempts context he is like Mahomes. Able to scramble and pick up chunks of yards. Just don’t hurdle and truck people. 

[Big Turk]

6 minutes ago, 90sBills said:

That’s why I said ‘about’. Mahomes is 33 and Allen is 29 in week 7. There’s a lot of games left. At this pace they’ll both be in the 60s-70s by year’s end. Having him doubled Mahomes’ attempts last year is not sustainable for a qb. That’s what the coaching staff is try to do…sustain him for the long term. 

 

Oh really?  How is that working out for Jackson and Hurts who were 50-60+ more than Allen last year?

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

https://twitter.com/ErikJTurner/status/1716551777388998713?s=20

 

y u no embed, link?

 

Edited October 24, 2023 by Pine Barrens Mafia

[Process]

Josh did not do a good job reading the defense and was very indecisive vs the pats. Don't need to watch the all 22 to see that. He had a very rough game. 

 

There were guys getting open at the snap for quick passes that should have helped negate the pats pass rush. Josh didn't go to them.

 

Yes our o line was bad sunday. But Josh made them look worse by dancing around instead of hitting quick reads. 

 

Was Daboll's system a better fit and make things easier for Josh? Does he need to put more work in? I don't know, but hopefully he gets things figured out.

[90sBills]

2 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Oh really?  How is that working out for Jackson and Hurts who were 50-60+ more than Allen last year?

So you think Allen is closer to Jackson and Hurts than he is to Mahomes? Because I don’t…so those two are not on my radar for Allen’s comps. Allen’s comps should be Mahomes and Burrow if he’s who we think he is. Comparing him to two ‘running’ qb’s like Jackson and Hurts is a disservice imo.  

[90sBills]

5 hours ago, Success said:

There are actually fans here suggesting that we trade Allen.

 

That is simply incomprehensible to me.  Does anyone remember the time between Kelly and Allen?  Does anyone remember Orton, Edwards, Losman, Lewis, Tuel?

 

It can take a LONG time to find a franchise QB.  And Allen is very likely to be the best QB in this franchise's history..

 

 

Where are you seeing ‘fans’ suggesting we trade him? There was one guy that said it sarcastically like he had in other Allen threads but no one else from what I’ve seen. But I’m only on page 8 lol. 

[Low Positive]

9 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

https://twitter.com/ErikJTurner/status/1716551777388998713?s=20

 

y u no embed, link?

 

He has so many options here against the blitz, but he holds the ball waiting for Knox to complete his route. Just horrible by Josh here.

[Gugny]

1 hour ago, Mango said:

Not to be pedantic, but at least for me I when I talk about Allen I don’t think he stinks, and I don’t think he’s lazy. I do think he could be better in a few areas that would help him and the team level up. 
 

Fitz sucked at some things like accuracy. But Allen can be better. Not sure if that makes sense. 

I feel like, when the chips are down, Josh has historically (and figuratively) curled up into a fetal position, stick his thumb in his mouth and rocked himself to sleep. 
 

I feel like he made an improvement in that area a couple years ago, but something set him back at the 1/4 mark of last season and it’s clearly carried over into this season. 
 

My “lazy” comment was in reference to the reports that he’s not a diligent film watcher. 
 

And to Gunner’s earlier point, he seems to have regressed with regard to reading defenses. 
 

I have been a Josh fan since the second we drafted him and I still am. 
 

But something is amiss. 

[WotAGuy]

Josh must have broken up with his girlfriend three weeks in a row now. The cops must be sick of showing up at his house every week. He looks to be in shock most of the time. 

[Einstein]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Was over the summer. Wanna say it was on McAfee but others will remember better than I.

 

I actually kinda dismissed it as offseason chatter at the time. But others have raised since and.... welll it makes you wonder...

This is incredibly disappointing to me. 

I'm not sure how this wasn't a bigger deal at the time. 

Your QB stating that they are not big into film... unacceptable.

 

And unacceptable on the coaches for allowing it too.

[Mango]

1 minute ago, Gugny said:

I feel like, when the chips are down, Josh has historically (and figuratively) curled up into a fetal position, stick his thumb in his mouth and rocked himself to sleep. 
 

I feel like he made an improvement in that area a couple years ago, but something set him back at the 1/4 mark of last season and it’s clearly carried over into this season. 
 

My “lazy” comment was in reference to the reports that he’s not a diligent film watcher. 
 

And to Gunner’s earlier point, he seems to have regressed with regard to reading defenses. 
 

I have been a Josh fan since the second we drafted him and I still am. 
 

But something is amiss. 

I’m not sure he’s regressed at reading defenses as much as he’s being asked to focus on areas of his game that amplify that weakness. 
 

I keep reading that taking away Josh’s ability to run is taking away his best ability, hampering his game, etc. The other side of that coin is that he isn’t able to read and react with his arm super efficiently. 

This is the same thing we heard about Lamar and Cam. 
 

It sort of is what it is. He will have to evolve. A new OC can help work around that for sure. But if we keep working around it and he doesn’t evolve the bill will come due. 

 

2 minutes ago, Einstein said:

This is incredibly disappointing to me. 

I'm not sure how this wasn't a bigger deal at the time. 

Your QB stating that they are not big into film... unacceptable.

 

And unacceptable on the coaches for allowing it too.

I am out of pocket; trying to pull it up. But it’s a bear. 
 

I am going to try and paraphrase as best possible. It was along the lines of “Of course I watch film. But I try not to get too wrapped up in it because teams tend to play us a lot differently than what we see on film. I prefer to trust my eyes, read, react. I like to play fast and loose.”
 

I think it might have been @Beck Water who has the quote. But we disagree on interpretation. 

[Aimee75]

50 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

Josh wasn't his best, but when he left the field the Bills were winning by 3. Josh didn't let the Patsies march down for a TD.

Adam Schein makes some great points on this game, though he has a lot of issues with our head coach, and thinks he is holding the team back.

 

I am not going to say much about Joe Marino, I have seen him say this stuff before. No idea if he is a "Josh hater" or not, but I feel like there is some gaslighting going on here. Go ahead and talk about his reads, missed throws, WHATEVER, he got the team the lead with less than 2 minutes left, and we lost. For me, that is all I need to know. I don't care how sluggish the start is(I mean, I care a little) or how long it takes to get things going, I care about the end result. Against a sad Patriots team, I think 25 points should have been more than enough. MHO.

[Simon]

27 minutes ago, FrenchConnection said:

He has so many options here against the blitz, but he holds the ball waiting for Knox to complete his route. Just horrible by Josh here.

 

The Mike is coming free and outside of waiting for Knox, there are zero options that result in a TD on that play.

He does a nice job avoiding the sack and buying extra time with his eyes downfield, but nobody comes open on that side of the field.

He was smart not to force it on 2nd down, take the incompletion and give themselves another shot at it.

Anybody second-guessing that is being an armchair QB after the fact.

[Einstein]

15 minutes ago, Mango said:

I am out of pocket; trying to pull it up. But it’s a bear. 
 

I am going to try and paraphrase as best possible. It was along the lines of “Of course I watch film. But I try not to get too wrapped up in it because teams tend to play us a lot differently than what we see on film. I prefer to trust my eyes, read, react. I like to play fast and loose.”
 

I think it might have been @Beck Water who has the quote. But we disagree on interpretation. 

Thank you sir.

[Big Turk]

What if McD is causing issues on offense especially in the 1st half by trying to force Allen/Dorsey to "dial it down" and help the D by staying on the field and playing more ball control but then when it doesn't work and they have to play catch up in the 2nd half, he takes the limiters off and they go back to looking like normal?

 

I am starting to get a sneaking suspicion McD is causing issues he doesn't need to be causing. McD preaching "complimentary football" but what if that means it works far better by letting the offense get into a track meet and forcing teams to play catch up all night?

Edited October 24, 2023 by Big Turk

[LABILLBACKER]

8 hours ago, Dopey said:

Dan Orlovski showed at least three clips where the hot read was open on a blitz and Josh ignored them. There’s a lot of people that are not going to like this thread.  Hard for many to accept it. He needs to play better. 

I rarely ever remember Josh going to a hot read this season or last. And with Daboll it was always about going downfield.