Does the 2023 Bills defence get a pass because McD is coaching it?

[Boatdrinks]

25 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

How about they force a few 3 & outs?  Lawrence had 200 yards passing the first half.

Amazing how different a defense looks down 2 starting CBs, an all pro LB , starting DE and their best interior D lineman. 

[Royale with Cheese]

6 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Glad you were looking forward to it.

 

Review the play by play and how many third and longs Jax converted ( many inside their 10 yard line).  One play flips the field.

.

Sorry I'm not a yes man here on The Stadium Wall

 

We had one healthy defensive end by the 4th quarter who was exhausted.  One.

[boyst]

3 minutes ago, Freddie's Dead said:

 

They came up with two turnovers and were down to third-string players.

did you see or notice anything was wrong with the defense or see flaws in any part of that 1/3?

[RiotAct]

27 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

The game was 11-7 entering the 4th.

 

this is it exactly.

 

The game was there for the taking if Diggs comes up with that 50/50 ball

[The Red King]

You can't handwave injuries away, and the time of possession was skewed bad b/c a perfectly healthy offense couldn't move the ball.

 

A patchwork D missing two of their best players generated two turnovers in the red zone and kept the Bills in that game.

 

The Bills D were an elite unit all season.  Tre goes down late last week, Milano early this week and all of a sudden the team has a harder time getting the other team off the field?  It's...*gasp*...almost like losing five defensive player actually makes a defense worse !

 

Anyone that argues otherwise...don't bother debating them.  They'd have to be incredibly dim not to see it, or they're willfully ignorant, locked into confirmation bias.  Either way, you're not going to change their mind.

Edited October 9, 2023 by The Red King

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Q: what's the primary concern of the defense?

 

Perhaps the OP can answer that question

 

[boyst]

1 minute ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

We had one healthy defensive end by the 4th quarter who was exhausted.  One.

they kept sending him in ears pinned back, unfortunately. it takes a bigger toll for him to run block, gap protect, or set the edge but we limited his effectiveness by design of the play and scheme.

 

if we dropped more into coverage without rushing 5/6 he may not have had to fight so hard all the time.

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, Boatdrinks said:

Amazing how different a defense looks down 2 starting CBs, an all pro LB , starting DE and their best interior D lineman. 

 

Not only that, our other starting DE, Floyd was out as well.  We basically had our top 3 DE's out.

[Warcodered]

1 minute ago, boyst said:

 

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all of you need to make an argument and statements about the defense without mentioning the offense. everyone keeps playing the game... "yeah but the offense..." and it needs to be a nonstarter of the conversation. the defense had a lot of problems in play, execution, schemes, and coaching.

 

i can leverage some argument on injury but this staff wasn't prepared for that when they must be considering we have some old ass players.

 

so please, try again to address the topic of mcdermotts defense without a red herring or obfuscating the offensive liability.

When the defense is keeping it under 20, has been holding them out of the endzone since the first quarter without any help from the Offense scoring points until the point where on key downs they literally have some of players that have been making plays on the sidelines getting oxygen, yes I say the offense failed them. You hold the other team to their 4 point lead for over half the ***** game, how else are you supposed to frame it?

[boyst]

Just now, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Not only that, our other starting DE, Floyd was out as well.  We basically had our top 3 DE's out.

which is why it was ridiculous we went in with von miller out. we went in with 2 adequate DE's and a backup, and a recovering injured Miler.

 

it'd have made more sense to hold off on miller and brought up ??anyone else.

[Billsfan1972]

2 minutes ago, The Red King said:

You can't handwave injuries away, and the time of possession was skewed bad b/c a perfectly healthy offense couldn't move the ball.

 

A patchwork D missing two of their best players generated two turnovers in the red zone and kept the Bills in that game.

 

The Bills were an elite unit all season.  Tre goes down late last week, Milano early this week and all of a sudden the team has a harder time getting the other team off the field?  It's...*gasp*...almost like losing five defensive player actually makes a defense worse !

 

Anyone that argues otherwise...don't bother debating them.  They'd have to be incredibly dim not to see it, or they're willfully ignorant, locked into confirmation bias.  Either way, you're not going to change their mind.

Again explain the 3rd and long conversions inside the 10.  500 yards offence by Jax.  Yep they were great.    

[boyst]

Just now, Warcodered said:

When the defense is keeping it under 20, has been holding them out of the endzone since the first quarter without any help from the Offense scoring points until the point where on key downs they literally have some of players that have been making plays on the sidelines getting oxygen, yes I say the offense failed them. You hold the other team to their 4 point lead for over half the ***** game, how else are you supposed to frame it?

i do not give you any credit on the answer. so i ask like anyone else....

 

where did the defense have short comings? there were plenty that no one has brought up, even myself.

[BillsFan2313]

35 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Yep not Frazier so many are happy.

 

Yes injuries too.

 

Yesterday they were not good, but get a pass.  Is this because of McD

 

40 mins top is on them.  But of course reading blame on the offence. They were not great the play calling was atrocious which seems to always be the case in close games but at the end of the day the defence was meh.....

 

They were down 4 starters, two were in game when already down to the 3rd and 4th CB. 

[Alphadawg7]

38 minutes ago, FireChans said:

The defense gets a pass because they lost 5 starters and still played better than a perfectly healthy offense over the course of the game. 
 

If your rickety defense holds a team to 11 points through 3.5 Q’s and your offense can only muster 7 points and keeps going three and out, there’s one unit that deserves the lion share of the blame. 

 

This. 

 

I mean I don't really understand how this thread can even exist today TBH

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

I think the defense played admirably given all the injuries.

 

HOWEVER

 

We allowed 474 yards, 29 first downs, and 38 minutes TOP**. 1st asterisk for the offense playing poorly (especially early) which is a big factor in TOP. 2nd asterisk for the Jags drives being sustained by weak penalty calls. 

 

If I'm grading the defense I'd give them a C-. The 5 sacks and 2 fumbles bring them up from a failing grade. 

[FireChans]

11 minutes ago, boyst said:

 

-----------------------

 

 

 

all of you need to make an argument and statements about the defense without mentioning the offense. everyone keeps playing the game... "yeah but the offense..." and it needs to be a nonstarter of the conversation. the defense had a lot of problems in play, execution, schemes, and coaching.

 

i can leverage some argument on injury but this staff wasn't prepared for that when they must be considering we have some old ass players.

 

so please, try again to address the topic of mcdermotts defense without a red herring or obfuscating the offensive liability.

Yes, the defense had lots of problems.

 

Elam can’t cover a soul, our safeties look old and slow, the Jags gashed us on the ground, the backup linebackers were hit or miss, Von Miller didn’t look great, and their overall performance would have looked much worse if AJE didn’t make a couple of huge plays.

 

And despite all of that, the scoreboard still read 11 points in the fourth Q. 

[Billsfan1972]

1 minute ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

This. 

 

I mean I don't really understand how this thread can even exist today TBH

Because Bills fans here love excuses.  

 

As for the offense, I blame Dorsey thinking dinks and dunks and keeping Allen on a leash is the best use of his talent.

 

[boyst]

3 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

This. 

 

I mean I don't really understand how this thread can even exist today TBH

see below

2 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Yes, the defense had lots of problems.

 

Elam can’t cover a soul, our safeties look old and slow, the Jags gashed us on the ground, the backup linebackers were hit or miss, Von Miller didn’t look great, and their overall performance would have looked much worse if AJE didn’t make a couple of huge plays.

 

And despite all of that, the scoreboard still read 11 points in the fourth Q. 

we are quick to make excuses for things that are inexcusable. having williams as a backup when he had no business on that field was inexcusable. he is not fit for a backup. klein is on the ps, and kirksey retired. both would have been better. we know their floor and it was higher than what williams offered.

 

the coverage schemes matching up elam to get burned constantly almost seemed like the coaches hate him. hyde is great and haad good leverage against ridley several times. he got beat, though. we could have done more to change the pressures which were not working to offer more coverage.

 

several things are getting forgotten and forgiven that fall on mcdermotts plate. including letting dorsey call a ***** hitch and pitch with several seconds on the clock?!?! that ***** was middle school. if mcdermott didn't know that play was going in than he needs to be fired. if mcdermott let it go in to be run he needs to be fired. that play call was inexcusable.

[Billsfan1972]

2 minutes ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

I think the defense played admirably given all the injuries.

 

HOWEVER

 

We allowed 474 yards, 29 first downs, and 38 minutes TOP**. 1st asterisk for the offense playing poorly (especially early) which is a big factor in TOP. 2nd asterisk for the Jags drives being sustained by weak penalty calls. 

 

If I'm grading the defense I'd give them a C-. The 5 sacks and 2 fumbles bring them up from a failing grade. 

Again 474 yards was a gutsy performance according to many.  The fumbles were deep in Buffalo territory and were on third down.  Yes was a possible 6 points.

 

Would rather have stopped Jax on 3rd and 11 from their 5 & 7 yard lines that would have flipped the momentum, TOP and game.

   

[Alphadawg7]

9 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Because Bills fans here love excuses.  

 

As for the offense, I blame Dorsey thinking dinks and dunks and keeping Allen on a leash is the best use of his talent.

 

 

Let me see if I understand you...the defense losing its best players is an excuse...the same defense who entered the London game BEFORE losing most those players was:

• 2nd fewest points allowed
• Largest margin of victory in NFL
• First in sacks
• First in Interception
• First in takeaways

And that is despite the fact we faced the top offense in the NFL in Miami, still the only team to shut them down and first to sack Tua.  But its an excuse when that same defense enters the game missing its starting corners in Tre and Benford and its best DE in Groot...then loses its best overall player in Milano and what had been the best DT in the NFL so far this year in Jones.  That is an excuse?

 

Guys who missed the game, exited the game, or had to miss plays in the game with injuries or other issues:

Tre, Benford, Groot, Milano, Jones, Von, Taron, and AJE.  I mean, that wouldn't be a terrible start to a pro bowl roster, and that is an excuse? And YET we still had only gave up 11 points until late into the 4th quarter.  

 

Come on...this thread is unreal.  The defense was utterly gutted and devastated Sunday.  Jones played 4 snaps for crying out loud, one of which where he got hurt was a massive tackle for loss to force a 3 and out.  

 

Excuses...you mean facts.  

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by Alphadawg7