2023 NFL draft LIVE thread

[SCBills]

Let’s all hope Levis and Hooker go Round 2, we get some more RB’s taken early and someone starts the run on Tight Ends as soon as possible.  Some corners and safeties maybe.  I’m starting to think we’re content at LB so, by all means, let’s move some of them as well.  
 

Push OL, DL and WR down the pipe to us. 

[BillsFan4]

This ma6 have already been mentioned (I didn’t feel like looking through 50+ pages) but it looks like the Texans actually gave up their own 1st round pick next year in that trade up. Yikes! 
 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/04/28/nick-caserio-were-not-worried-the-points-and-what-the-trade-chart-says/

 

Quote

Houston used Cleveland’s original pick at No. 12, its own 2024 first-round pick, the 33rd overall pick this year, and a 2024 third-round selection to get back up. The Texans also received the 105th overall pick from Arizona.

dumb!

[Straight Hucklebuck]

12 hours ago, Roundybout said:

I don’t think I realized how thin he was either 

He weighed in at 173 at the Combine

[78thealltimegreat]

The Eagles draft was two Georgia kids with question marks. When three teams in front of the Eagles supposedly wouldn’t even touch the guy that’s a problem.

I do really really like the Christian Gonzalez to the Pats the Pats problem isn’t corner it’s bigger things but he is a heck of a player.

The Bills quite frankly took the kid with the best hands in the draft and made will make Josh Allen’s life so easy with how he can get open Josh needs to buy him a house when he negotiates his new contract. 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

5 hours ago, Solomon Grundy said:

Philly won day 1, IMO

With that said, last year he had 18 tackles, 3.5 sacks. 

 

The year before it was 3 sacks. 

 

But I do agree with the point at large, recreating the Georgia defense is not a bad idea. 

[SCBills]

Love the Kincaid pick, but two things I can do without…

 

1) “If he wasn’t there, we were gonna trade back”.  All I think about is Basham. 
 

2) “Don’t think of him as a “xxx”, think of him as a pass catcher/weapon”.  Nope, don’t think I will.  We did that all last off-season.  
 

Again, love the pick and love the player… but my goodness, I don’t want to hear those phrases ever again. 
 

Edited April 28, 2023 by SCBills

[NewEra]

4 hours ago, Billsatlastin2018 said:

100%! 👍

 

Buffalo does not, nor will it ever play the back half of the Season under climate control. So,when the wind, rain, sleet and snow are coming down, we DO NOT need a fleet of 5’9 SEC track stars that are difficult to see beside oversized Corners. We need big men, with a Kelce type profile, to move the ball.

 

The Bills got theirs! It is now up to the OC to design plays, lots of them, to take advantage of this advantage.

Exactly.  He’s an elite pass catcher.  He won’t be dropping the ball in any condition. His catch radius and catching prowess allows him to be open even when he’s not.  Run, turn, catch, rac, first down. 
 

and then there’s his ability as a pass catcher- route runner on all 3 levels.  He’s got it all as a receiver.  And that’s what he’ll be for us.  

2 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Love the Kincaid pick, but two things I can do without…

 

1) “If he wasn’t there, we were gonna trade back”.  All I think about is Basham. 
 

2) “Don’t think of him as a “xxx”, think of him as a pass catcher/weapon”.  Nope, don’t think I will.  We did that all last off-season.  
 

Again, love the pick and love the player… but my goodness, I don’t want to hear those phrases ever again. 
 

1) that’s stupid

2)that’s also stupid 

 

sorry….. but it is

[4merper4mer]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

On the basis that I have followed this right and it is about the Packers.... Ted Thompson stood down for ill health. He only survived 4 years after doing so and was in a pretty bad way the final 2 years of his life. 

 

Trying to use that as any sort of indicment on Brandon Beane is out of order in any event.

 

Yes. He is dead. He was terminally ill. Bad example.

Are you trying to say Beane is immortal?  PleSe join the crowd or be labeled an apologist.

[GunnerBill]

6 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Love the Kincaid pick, but two things I can do without…

 

1) “If he wasn’t there, we were gonna trade back”.  All I think about is Basham. 
 

2) “Don’t think of him as a “xxx”, think of him as a pass catcher/weapon”.  Nope, don’t think I will.  We did that all last off-season.  
 

Again, love the pick and love the player… but my goodness, I don’t want to hear those phrases ever again. 
 

 

I have some sympathy will point #2.... but in fairness that isn't the Bills themselves that is Sal C spitting out the state propaganda on WGR. In the days when Khalil Shakir could play outside and OJ Howard and James Cook were going to pass catching pieces in our offense. It was daft when he said it, and even dafter in hindsight. 

 

I think it applies less to Kincaid. And you can look at him as a weapon akin to a receiver. But my word was that frustrating last summer. 

[SCBills]

4 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Exactly.  He’s an elite pass catcher.  He won’t be dropping the ball in any condition. His catch radius and catching prowess allows him to be open even when he’s not.  Run, turn, catch, rac, first down. 
 

and then there’s his ability as a pass catcher- route runner on all 3 levels.  He’s got it all as a receiver.  And that’s what he’ll be for us.  

1) that’s stupid

2)that’s also stupid 

 

sorry….. but it is

Kincaid is a TE who has elite WR skills and can, and will, play in the slot. 
 

There. That’s what he is. 
 

Sometimes you need to define what a guy is for you.  
 

Last year we thought we could get by with “pass catchers”.    Yet most of us knew there were issues in that view. 
 

Kincaid doesn’t give me the worry I had last season, but the philosophy of “pass catchers” when you’re weak at WR is bs. 
 

Are we still weak at WR?  I don’t know… If Kincaid is our big slot.  Maybe not.  Maybe now it’s a strength and we see the Davis everyone envisioned after the KC playoff game. 

[GunnerBill]

5 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Kincaid is a TE who has elite WR skills and can, and will, play in the slot. 
 

There. That’s what he is. 
 

Sometimes you need to define what a guy is for you.  
 

Last year we thought we could get by with “pass catchers”.    Yet most of us knew there were issues in that view. 
 

Kincaid doesn’t give me the worry I had last season, but the philosophy of “pass catchers” when you’re weak at WR is bs. 
 

Are we still weak at WR?  I don’t know… If Kincaid is our big slot.  Maybe not.  Maybe now it’s a strength and we see the Davis everyone envisioned after the KC playoff game. 

 

I think we have better potential outside options behind Davis with the two guys we brought in as FAs too. They both have a bit of inside / outside flex and would be better as 3rd outside guys than Jake Kumerow. Not sure I'd yet call it a strength but I do think it's upgraded as a collection of "pass catchers"  

[SCBills]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think we have better potential outside options behind Davis with the two guys we brought in as FAs too. They both have a bit of inside / outside flex and would be better as 3rd outside guys than Jake Kumerow. Not sure I'd yet call it a strength but I do think it's upgraded as a collection of "pass catchers"  

Ha, I agree.  
 

Harty and Year 2 Shakir have me intrigued.  
 

Still feels like we’re relying on Davis to make a jump as it currently stands though… and heaven forbid Diggs misses any time. 

[NewEra]

27 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

The Eagles draft was two Georgia kids with question marks. When three teams in front of the Eagles supposedly wouldn’t even touch the guy that’s a problem.

I do really really like the Christian Gonzalez to the Pats the Pats problem isn’t corner it’s bigger things but he is a heck of a player.

The Bills quite frankly took the kid with the best hands in the draft and made will make Josh Allen’s life so easy with how he can get open Josh needs to buy him a house when he negotiates his new contract. 

That’s what they said about Warren Sapp and Randy Moss.  2 exceptional talents that were top 5 players in the draft (of not higher)

 

It’s a risk…. Every player drafted is a risk. 

4 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Ha, I agree.  
 

Harty and Year 2 Shakir have me intrigued.  
 

Still feels like we’re relying on Davis to make a jump as it currently stands though… and heaven forbid Diggs misses any time. 

I think Davis, while being WR2 will be more of option 3-4 and play more of the role he had played prior to 2022.  More like 70% of the snaps as opposed to 90%.

 

I think Kincaid will be our WR2 without the label as such.  Maybe not early on, but towards the playoffs and going forward.  I expect him to be our main slot WR.

 

I also think Harty will play more outside than people think.

[NewEra]

18 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Kincaid is a TE who has elite WR skills and can, and will, play in the slot. 
 

There. That’s what he is. 
 

Sometimes you need to define what a guy is for you.  
 

Last year we thought we could get by with “pass catchers”.    Yet most of us knew there were issues in that view. 
 

Kincaid doesn’t give me the worry I had last season, but the philosophy of “pass catchers” when you’re weak at WR is bs. 
 

Are we still weak at WR?  I don’t know… If Kincaid is our big slot.  Maybe not.  Maybe now it’s a strength and we see the Davis everyone envisioned after the KC playoff game. 

Kincaid will be playing a lot in the slot.  Beane said it.  He said he’d play out wide some.  He’s a mismatch and a label isn’t needed.  
 

I don’t see the problem with having “pass catchers” if that how someone wants to “label” them.  Labels are of no consequence 

[SCBills]

4 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Kincaid will be playing a lot in the slot.  Beane said it.  He said he’d play out wide some.  He’s a mismatch and a label isn’t needed.  
 

I don’t see the problem with having “pass catchers” if that how someone wants to “label” them.  Labels are of no consequence 

They are when you’re weak at a position and don’t properly address the weakness due to the hope a concept absolves it. 

[GunnerBill]

5 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Kincaid will be playing a lot in the slot.  Beane said it.  He said he’d play out wide some.  He’s a mismatch and a label isn’t needed.  
 

I don’t see the problem with having “pass catchers” if that how someone wants to “label” them.  Labels are of no consequence 

 

I think the issue is more that the state media was spitting it out last year when it was baloney. I confess that phrase winds me the ***** up too now for the same reason. Even though the logic of it does actually work with Kincaid.

[78thealltimegreat]

19 minutes ago, NewEra said:

That’s what they said about Warren Sapp and Randy Moss.  2 exceptional talents that were top 5 players in the draft (of not higher)

 

It’s a risk…. Every player drafted is a risk. 

I think Davis, while being WR2 will be more of option 3-4 and play more of the role he had played prior to 2022.  More like 70% of the snaps as opposed to 90%.

 

I think Kincaid will be our WR2 without the label as such.  Maybe not early on, but towards the playoffs and going forward.  I expect him to be our main slot WR.

 

I also think Harty will play more outside than people think.

Those were different risks that’s marijuana use. When you’re Carter and show up at your own draft day fat and out of shape then add to that what’s going off the field good luck with giving this guy a multimillion dollar contract. 

As for Smith he had a great combine but olinemen will engulf him cause he is undersized. 
 

[NewEra]

14 minutes ago, SCBills said:

They are when you’re weak at a position and don’t properly address the weakness due to the hope a concept absolves it. 

Kincaid is a TE because he’s labeled a TE.  Beane said it himself, when he’s out there- it’ll be more 11 or 11.5 personnel than 12.  Basically telling us that Kincaid is a WR.  A WR that will play some TE

[SCBills]

Just now, NewEra said:

Kincaid is a TE because he’s labeled a TE.  Beane said it himself, when he’s out there- it’ll be more 11 or 11.5 personnel than 12.  Basically telling us that Kincaid is a WR.  A WR that will play some TE

Yes .. and I said I’m not as worried this year as I was last year.  
 

You just took issue with my tongue in cheek annoyance at the term “pass catchers” and I’m explaining why. 
 

I think our base offense, as it stands looks like this: 

 

WR (3) Diggs - Kincaid - Davis

TE (1) Knox

 

Rotational WR (2) Shakir / Harty 

 

RB (2) Cook/Harris

 

Gadget (1) Hines

 

I foresee the Bills being in primarily 12 personnel disguised as 11 personnel.  
 

I think it has a ton of potential.  
 

I’d still like one more legit WR to push Davis & safeguard against Diggs or Davis missing any time. 

 

 

[Reed83HOF]

3 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Yes .. and I said I’m not as worried this year as I was last year.  
 

You just took issue with my tongue in cheek annoyance at the term “pass catchers” and I’m explaining why. 
 

I think our base offense, as it stands looks like this: 

 

WR (3) Diggs - Kincaid - Davis

TE (1) Knox

 

Rotational WR (2) Shakir / Harty 

 

RB (2) Cook/Harris

 

Gadget (1) Hines

 

I foresee the Bills being in primarily 12 personnel disguised as 11 personnel.  
 

I think it has a ton of potential.  
 

I’d still like one more legit WR to push Davis & safeguard against Diggs or Davis missing any time. 

 

 

Should help the running game be more effective when they kick Kincaid to the OL to help block. All dependent on dorsey having some gimme plays and scheming players open and running multiple plays from the same formation and on Josh to not force every pass and to actually throw short

[MrEpsYtown]

10 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Yes .. and I said I’m not as worried this year as I was last year.  
 

You just took issue with my tongue in cheek annoyance at the term “pass catchers” and I’m explaining why. 
 

I think our base offense, as it stands looks like this: 

 

WR (3) Diggs - Kincaid - Davis

TE (1) Knox

 

Rotational WR (2) Shakir / Harty 

 

RB (2) Cook/Harris

 

Gadget (1) Hines

 

I foresee the Bills being in primarily 12 personnel disguised as 11 personnel.  
 

I think it has a ton of potential.  
 

I’d still like one more legit WR to push Davis & safeguard against Diggs or Davis missing any time. 

 

 

 

Teams will have to pick their poison. Will you play a 4-3 base and ask an OLB to cover Kincaid? Or do you play a 4-2-5 and risk getting gashed. 

 

Philly has used 12 or as Beane called it 11 1/2 personnel to create mismatches for years.

 

There are some great explanations here...This article is literally gold: 

https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2020/9/1/21403795/eagles-film-room-benefits-12-personnel-zach-ertz-dallas-goedert-tight-ends-contract-philadelphia-nfl

 

 

This instantly puts a defense in a bind. If they decided to keep 7 men in the box, the offense will have a numbers advantage and should be able to find a gap unblocked. If they put 8 in the box you are forcing them to play a single high safety. 

 

 

Some other good stuff: 

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=566603448626979

https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2018/12/21/18152254/philadelphia-eagles-zach-ertz-dallas-goedert-nick-foles-12-personnel

 

 

Edited April 28, 2023 by MrEpsYtown

[NewEra]

34 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think the issue is more that the state media was spitting it out last year when it was baloney. I confess that phrase winds me the ***** up too now for the same reason. Even though the logic of it does actually work with Kincaid.

Idk…. Maybe I just wasn’t paying enough attention to it to notice last year

[NewEra]

34 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

Those were different risks that’s marijuana use. When you’re Carter and show up at your own draft day fat and out of shape then add to that what’s going off the field good luck with giving this guy a multimillion dollar contract. 

As for Smith he had a great combine but olinemen will engulf him cause he is undersized. 
 

it wasn’t just weed with moss.  There were character concerns.  Regarding Sapp, the nfl security report allegedly claimed sapp had failed a cocaine test and 6 weed tests (including one at the combine). In 1996, that’s character concern.  Slightly different than Carter, I agree, but still the same basis.  Character.  

 

Size could be an issue for smith, no doubt.  He’s the same size as Hassan Reddick, the guy he’ll replace in 2024. I think he’s in the perfect position.  He’ll be a rotational pass rusher early on while he gains weight.  He can develop into a problem.  I think he’s a 3-4 OLB but I also think Philly will find a way to use him properly.  

 

[78thealltimegreat]

1 minute ago, NewEra said:

it wasn’t just weed with moss.  There were character concerns.  Regarding Sapp, the nfl security report allegedly claimed sapp had failed a cocaine test and 6 weed tests (including one at the combine). In 1996, that’s character concern.  Slightly different than Carter, I agree, but still the same basis.  Character.  

 

Size could be an issue for smith, no doubt.  He’s the same size as Hassan Reddick, the guy he’ll replace in 2024. I think he’s in the perfect position.  He’ll be a rotational pass rusher early on while he gains weight.  He can develop into a problem.  I think he’s a 3-4 OLB but I also think Philly will find a way to use him properly.  

 

They better the level of QBs they will play this year is slightly better than it was last year until the Super Bowl. 

[Never NEVER Give-up]

Kincaid!  Huh . . . .  we all called that, didn't we?!?!?

[WickedGame]

5 hours ago, Jerboski said:

I mean aren’t you pissed as well in the bar scenario 

Nope. I’m not that thirsty. 

[T&C]

Tonight is the run on wide receivers... I'll guess that 12 will be taken.