I’d like to see the Bills bring back Shaq Lawson and pay him fairly.

[Beck Water]

9 hours ago, BarleyNY said:

That’s fair. I do think they should re-sign Shaq if he’ll take vet min with a VSB kicker. (Veteran Signing Bonus, which does not count against the salary cap.)

 

What is this?  I am unfamiliar with a "VSB kicker"  or Veteran Signing Bonus which does not count against the salary cap

 

What I'm familiar with is called "Veteran Cap Benefit" or "Veteran Salary Benefit", in which a player with 4 or more credited seasons signs at vet minimum for those seasons, but only counts against the cap for the minimum salary of a 2nd year player, plus any bonuses.  There is also a limit on the amount of bonuses that can be paid on such a contract, and the bonuses also count against the cap.

 

On the Bills at present, Kyle Allen, Matt Barkley, and Ike Boettger appear to have such contracts.  The way to tell is if their cap hit is less than their salary+bonus.

[Beck Water]

30 minutes ago, DapperCam said:

Lawson bouncing around the league was more about cost than him not being good enough to play.

 

It may not have been about his play; it may have been about behavior in the locker room or meeting rooms or towards the coaches, or perceived effort.

 

Consider: Shaq Lawson had a 3 year, $30M contract with the Fins, $21M fully guaranteed at signing, and they traded him after 1 year for a LB who was a disappointment to the Texans.  I think Miami ate a bunch of $$ on that - $4M signing bonus, $2.5M roster bonus.  But, they shed his $8.9M salary so you could be right that was a cap move.

 

The Texans then took on Lawson's guaranteed salary and converted it to signing bonus in April, then traded him to the Jets for a 6th round pick before the season, thus eating his signing bonus.  They clearly ate a bunch of $$ on that, and there's gotta be a reason.

 

The Jets then cut him before the last game of the season.  Who does that?  You don't cut a guy before the final game of the season if it's "about cost".  You're not saving that much $$.  You're doing it to send a message to the LR.

 

 

30 minutes ago, DapperCam said:

Jets fans said he was okay, but not worth his contract. He’d be getting a minimal contract for a vet rotational player, so it’s a totally different situation. McBeane will probably only bring him back if they don’t like the youth on the team to plug his spot.

 

Agree he'll likely be getting a minimum contract here, but the OP was about re-signing him for what the Bills gave Phillips: $3M or $4.2M or whatever.

[Thurman#1]

On 4/3/2023 at 5:56 AM, Tipster19 said:

He was a great soldier last year when we needed defensive help the most. He wants to be here and it would help keep continuity on the DL imo. I’m surprise this hasn’t happened yet, it looks like the money is the issue right now but with a little bit of effort this should get done fairly easily. A 1 year contract like Jordan Phillips’, would make the most sense at this time, you know with the salary restrictions that the Bills are currently facing. I’d also like to see this thread become a petition to help make this cause happen but if anybody disagrees then I’d like to know the reason(s) why, everybody has a right to their opinion so please let’s hear the pros and cons. Bring back Shaq!

 

 

While it's idiotic to think he's a league minimum player, and while he's a good soldier, there's a reason he's still available.

 

The market is pretty good at making sure guys get fair contracts. Not perfect. But pretty damn good. Shaq was tough, he worked hard, but he didn't display much of the glamour skills at DE that get guys paid at a high level at DE.

 

He'll get a contract somewhere, maybe even here, but it won't be for a lot, and there's a reason for that. $1.5M for a year, maybe? He's got value, but he's not much of a pass rusher and that's what everyone is looking for primarily.

[BarleyNY]

9 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

What is this?  I am unfamiliar with a "VSB kicker"  or Veteran Signing Bonus which does not count against the salary cap

 

What I'm familiar with is called "Veteran Cap Benefit" or "Veteran Salary Benefit", in which a player with 4 or more credited seasons signs at vet minimum for those seasons, but only counts against the cap for the minimum salary of a 2nd year player, plus any bonuses.  There is also a limit on the amount of bonuses that can be paid on such a contract, and the bonuses also count against the cap.

 

On the Bills at present, Kyle Allen, Matt Barkley, and Ike Boettger appear to have such contracts.  The way to tell is if their cap hit is less than their salary+bonus.

Yes, I meant Veteran Signing Benefit, not Veteran Signing Bonus. So sorry for the confusion that caused you. 

[Beck Water]

4 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

Yes, I meant Veteran Signing Benefit, not Veteran Signing Bonus. So sorry for the confusion that caused you. 

 

It was the part about not counting against the salary cap which confused me.

 

That would increase the market for veteran players FRFR

Edited April 4, 2023 by Beck Water

[BarleyNY]

1 minute ago, Beck Water said:

 

It was the part about not counting against the salary cap which confused me.

 

That would increase the market for veteran players FRFR

It didn’t look right when I typed it. I should’ve double checked it. 

[buffaloboyinATL]

On 4/2/2023 at 5:41 PM, Airseven said:

I was surprised by Lawson last season. He still has some fire left. Would’ve preferred to bring him back instead of Phillips.

Phillips is a good rotational DL, as long as he can stay healthy.  I am hoping has enough time to fully heal before this season.. That said, I would like to have Lawson back as well.  

[Beck Water]

11 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

While it's idiotic to think he's a league minimum player, and while he's a good soldier, there's a reason he's still available.

 

Last year the league minimum for a player with 6 credited seasons was $1.035M

Last year Shaq Lawson's contract with the Bills was for $1.035M with a $152k signing bonus

 

And in fact, he only counted $1.047 against the Bills cap instead of $1.187M (salary plus bonus) a situation called "Vet Salary Benefit" where teams sign a vet but he only counts what a 2nd year player would count against their cap.

 

So I'm not sure what's "idiotic" about thinking Lawson is a league minimum player, when in fact, last season, that's what he was.

 

I think part of the question is to what extent Lawson is, indeed, a "good soldier"

When a team makes a guy a substantial FA signing, then trades him out the door a year later, that's typically not the sign of a good soldier.

Then when the trade partner trades him off for a late round pick before the season, that's also a sign something's amiss

Then when the 3rd team cuts him just before the end of the season - That's a kick in the pants saying we'd rather elevate a PS guy then keep you in the building.

 

He seems to do well on the Bills though. 

 

He's not the dominating player we hoped for when Rex drafted him in the 1st round in 2016, but he has football talent. 

Edited April 4, 2023 by Beck Water

[ColoradoBills]

I would venture to say that Shaq Lawson will probably get signed under the vet salary benefit program after the draft.

There always is a chance that a DE on Beane's board is sticking out in the 5th or 6th rounds and that may affect his signing.

 

With Von Miller having a good chance of starting the season on PUP (or is on the team to start the season but not active), I see Shaq

as a good possibility of making the team (at least to begin with).  If anything, he is a good yardstick for a younger guy to beat out in camp.

 

 

[fmr60]

Somewhere down the line people have to understand the Bills have a limited amount of $. It's great to sign every free agent who is available but we have to be practical. If my thinking is correct Lawson is eligible for a $1.7M contract.  Not so bad. In due time I believe the Bills and Lawson will exercise that option.

 

[BuffaloButt]

League min. only!

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

On 4/4/2023 at 1:39 PM, ColoradoBills said:

I would venture to say that Shaq Lawson will probably get signed under the vet salary benefit program after the draft.

There always is a chance that a DE on Beane's board is sticking out in the 5th or 6th rounds and that may affect his signing.

 

With Von Miller having a good chance of starting the season on PUP (or is on the team to start the season but not active), I see Shaq

as a good possibility of making the team (at least to begin with).  If anything, he is a good yardstick for a younger guy to beat out in camp.

 

 

 

 I think Von has a good shot at playing week 1. He said at the end of January that the doctors gave him a time-frame of returning by August and he was hoping to beat that by a month or two to show teammates how hard of a worker he was. Almost like he had something to prove. On top of that I believe McDermott recently said Von was ahead of schedule in his recovery.

 

 

[ColoradoBills]

11 minutes ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

 

 I think Von has a good shot at playing week 1. He said at the end of January that the doctors gave him a time-frame of returning by August and he was hoping to beat that by a month or two to show teammates how hard of a worker he was. Almost like he had something to prove. On top of that I believe McDermott recently said Von was ahead of schedule in his recovery.

 

 

 

I know he is ahead of schedule, and we will have to see exactly what that means.  I for one would like to see him come around real S L O W.

He is not needed in September or even October.  He is needed in January and early February.

 

If he does for whatever reason start on PUP for the season, it's only 4 games.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

I want to pay him unfairly

 

 

[gobills1212]

Sure thing "Tipster" 

And just much would yo..er....How much is fair for Shaq?

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

Very good chance both Shaq and AJ Klein take snaps for the Bills next year at some point. 

[davefan66]

9 hours ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

I know he is ahead of schedule, and we will have to see exactly what that means.  I for one would like to see him come around real S L O W.

He is not needed in September or even October.  He is needed in January and early February.

 

If he does for whatever reason start on PUP for the season, it's only 4 games.

He is needed as soon as possible. Last year proved we need to win every game we can, can’t get down to the last week having to win to get AFC.  I would much rather be in control of our own destiny.

[ColoradoBills]

6 hours ago, davefan66 said:

He is needed as soon as possible. Last year proved we need to win every game we can, can’t get down to the last week having to win to get AFC.  I would much rather be in control of our own destiny.

 

I'm just saying at his age and importance you don't need to rush him back.  A reinjury would be devastating.

[GreggTX]

Take up a collection for him. I don't object to paying him, but we have cap issues.

[bmur66]

Notes were taken during the Bengal game. Shaq is one I would bring back. On another note. I don’t want to see Miller back until mid season and he should be bubble wrapped until almost playoff time. Just like he should have last year. I don’t care how bad he wants to play. He needs to be limited. They relied on him too heavily and his injury was almost predictable. 

Edited April 7, 2023 by bmur66