Kirby Jackson Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 6 minutes ago, Putin said: I’m sorry but when you are wearing your company’s uniform you are working , unless you are on the way home AGAIN MOST of us , obviously NFL players are special and we are all beneath them The example that you used was taking a knee with a line of 20. If the cashier does that they are not able to do their job. If a NFL player takes a knee during the anthem they are still able to do their job. That’s why I used the 3rd down example. That’s the same thing as the cashier with the line. The employee, in that case, is deciding between doing their job and protesting. It’s apples and oranges. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Putin Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 1 minute ago, DCOrange said: If we're trying to make the analogy accurate, would my boss care if I'm kneeling at my computer instead of sitting or standing? No, she would not. It's not like the players are refusing to play (at least not yet). Kneeling doesn't impact their ability to do their job in any way whatsoever. I’m just trying to make a point that many of us don’t have the right to protest or do anything but our jobs while we are on the company’s time , 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 Just now, Putin said: I’m just trying to make a point that many of us don’t have the right to protest or do anything but our jobs while we are on the company’s time , Many do though 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Putin Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: Many do though Most probably don’t ! Edited June 14, 2020 by Putin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCOrange Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 3 minutes ago, Putin said: I’m just trying to make a point that many of us don’t have the right to protest or do anything but our jobs while we are on the company’s time , They aren't really doing it on the company's time in the way that you're imagining one of us doing it though. They're doing it before their work actually begins. It just so happens that professional athletes are in the public eye before they actually start working in a way that we are not. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 1 minute ago, Putin said: Most probably don’t That’s a pretty bold assumption. I work for a very large Fortune 500 company. We are encouraged to speak up and speak out. I think that’s probably the case in most large companies. It comes, in part, for fear of looking discriminatory but also to make people feel heard. It’s as much of a workplace culture thing as anything. The difference is that I don’t have an audience. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dickleyjones Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 3 minutes ago, Putin said: Most probably don’t But for the ones that do...protesting is fine, right? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 Anyone who says they’re going to kneel now, after doing and saying nothing for three years to support Kaepernick, should be hooted off the stage. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dickleyjones Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 1 minute ago, DCOrange said: They aren't really doing it on the company's time in the way that you're imagining one of us doing it though. They're doing it before their work actually begins. It just so happens that professional athletes are in the public eye before they actually start working in a way that we are not. Nah. They are working. And they are given permission to protest. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Putin Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 (edited) 18 minutes ago, dickleyjones said: But for the ones that do...protesting is fine, right? Obviously !!! But I’m sure that most of business owners would never allow his/hers employees to do anything in their stores that would make them lose customers, right ?? Edited June 14, 2020 by Putin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 (edited) 17 minutes ago, mannc said: Anyone who says they’re going to kneel now, after doing and saying nothing for three years to support Kaepernick, should be hooted off the stage. They almost have to kneel out of necessity at this point at the risk of a character assassination by the angry mob. We are seeing people lose their livelihoods over this. The cancel culture is real strong right now. Edited June 14, 2020 by Bangarang 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 I would expect just about every player on every team to kneel This year. What will be interesting is whether the message will be lost/diluted because “everyone is now doing it.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 1 hour ago, dickleyjones said: If it is not offensive then it does nothing. It is a protest. It is not meant to be polite. getting a reaction of offense is exactly the point! Perhaps, but that doesn’t answer why we refuse to accept the explanations offered by those who choose to take a knee. They’ve explained time and time again why, but people have this obsession to make it about something else entirely. I’m curious about that mentality, not the protest itself. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dickleyjones Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 2 minutes ago, K-9 said: Perhaps, but that doesn’t answer why we refuse to accept the explanations offered by those who choose to take a knee. They’ve explained time and time again why, but people have this obsession to make it about something else entirely. I’m curious about that mentality, not the protest itself. it is because people tend to have a very difficult time seeing things as others see them. they can only see something from their perspective. it is unfortunate, but quite human. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 57 minutes ago, Putin said: How many people here can peacefully protest at work ? No not during lunch break but during actual work time that you are getting paid for , can a cashier at a grocery get on his knee for 5 minutes and peacefully protest while there’s 20 people waiting line ? Or maybe I can call my boss and tell him I had to shut down the rig ( oil production) because my guys wanted to peacefully protest? Most of us have two options either follow the company policy OR find another job GO BILLS !!! Their parent organization, the NFL, is saying they’re OK with it. So it has no bearing on what your organization does or does not do. And spare me the protest at work stuff with respect to this. Players work at practice, work at film study, and so on. If you want to say the only time they work is on game day, then strictly speaking they are not working during playing of the anthem as they are not actually playing during that time. When I go to games I stand. I would rather everyone stand and not go to the restroom, or to get a beer, or start cheering before the song is actually over. I also get their protest, and I understand their position that they do not intend disrespect to soldiers. From you user user name it seems clear you want to dictate terms to others. That is not how our country works. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 2 minutes ago, dickleyjones said: it is because people tend to have a very difficult time seeing things as others see them. they can only see something from their perspective. it is unfortunate, but quite human. Cuts both ways. Cuts every which way actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 Just now, dickleyjones said: it is because people tend to have a very difficult time seeing things as others see them. they can only see something from their perspective. it is unfortunate, but quite human. I appreciate this and agree, but I’m still trying to get to the “why.” Human nature is one important variable to be sure but what’s at the root of that evolution? There are tribal elements involved but it goes farther than that, I think. Anyway, I appreciate the incite you offered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dickleyjones Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 15 minutes ago, K-9 said: I appreciate this and agree, but I’m still trying to get to the “why.” Human nature is one important variable to be sure but what’s at the root of that evolution? There are tribal elements involved but it goes farther than that, I think. Anyway, I appreciate the incite you offered. Like all roots of evolution it is about survival. Those who did not fully trust their circle died young. Now that we have evolved beyond that we humans struggle with the forces of blind loyalty vs considering the opposite viewpoint. And really, you only have one brain you can only ever see things from your viewpoint. you have to make an effort to get your brain to see things from someone else's point of view. an effort many don't have the time or willpower to make. and i agree with @mead107 it cuts all ways. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 2 hours ago, Artful Dodger said: I voted "no" because I don't want to be reminded about political or social problems when I'm watching sports. Sports is supposed to be an escape. On the other hand, if it makes the players happy and they play harder and as a result, the Bills get one or two more wins, I'm all in favor of it. Politics have always been a part of sports and sports have always been a part of politics. From Roman Emperors crowning gladiators and charioteers with laurel wreathes to Presidents throwing out the first baseball and inviting champions to the White House. Sports are part of society as is politics. They can't help but mix and always have. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted June 14, 2020 Share Posted June 14, 2020 8 hours ago, StHustle said: https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/29307489/texans-jj-watt-says-taking-knee-american-flag Not sure a head coach has kneeled with players during the anthem. Interesting. I love to see that Watt get it. I'm really interested to see how the board would feel if McDermott announced he would kneel with his players. I personally would love to see it as long as he truly wants to protest the American government, but not if he is simply doing it to build some sort of stronger report with the players. I'd really love to see McDermott keep it out of the media. Whether a player or coach chooses to kneel or stand - that is their choice. Not knowing them, I won't judge them. I will, however, respect their right to choose. In the future, I'd like to see them keep the anthem out of the pregame ceremonies. It's relatively new. It is for show, anyway. Just get rid of it. Play it while the players are still in the locker room, or don't play it at all. It's a football game. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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