BR - Ranking Every NFL QB's Supporting Cast for 2020

[LABILLBACKER]

Baltimore way too low...Chargers way too high? Buffalo at 8 is about right. That's about where their power ranking should be.

[Kirby Jackson]

57 minutes ago, JetsFan20 said:

Its the same offense sans Gore with Moss and Diggs.

Exactly

 

The point was that Singletary, Brown and Beasley way outperformed their preseason ranking of 24. 2 of them had career years and the other averaged 5.1 YPC. If they were to rank them retrospectively the Bills were probably 16ish. Now you add in a number one receiver and bump the rest down a notch and you have a high end group. Take arguably the worst RB in the NFL out of a rotation and add a talented rookie and that group improves. You had a rookie RB and a rookie that room presumably will take a step forward. Thats how you go from 16ish to 8. Everything moved in the right direction. There’s a CHASM between the Bills skill players and the skill players of the Jets, Pats and Dolphins.

Edited June 12, 2020 by Kirby Jackson

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

4 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Baltimore had a LOT of guys who could  catch TDs last season....

 

.....And their WRs just got better after the draft.  

because the defenses focused too much on Jackson and it left people open for easy scores.  
 

like the Bills game.  1 blown defensive play 

 

[JetsFan20]

8 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Exactly

 

The point was that Singletary, Brown and Beasley way outperformed their preseason ranking of 24. 2 of them had career years and the other averaged 5.1 YPC. If they were to rank them retrospectively the Bills were probably 16ish. Now you add in a number one receiver and bump the rest down a notch and you have a high end group. Take arguably the worst RB in the NFL out of a rotation and add a talented rookie and that group improves. You had a rookie RB and ate that presumably will take a step forward. Thats how you go from 16ish to 8. Everything moved in the right direction. There’s a CHASM between the Bills skill players and the skill players of the Jets, Pats and Dolphins.

The Bills were the 24th ranked offense in total yds. Not sure what you mean by pre season rank

[Mr. WEO]

12 minutes ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said:

because the defenses focused too much on Jackson and it left people open for easy scores.  
 

like the Bills game.  1 blown defensive play 

 

 

 

I don't believe that.  Far more TDs than any other team does not = "1 blown defensive play"

[Kirby Jackson]

19 minutes ago, JetsFan20 said:

The Bills were the 24th ranked offense in total yds. Not sure what you mean by pre season rank

Thought you were taking about the BR skill position ranking from last year. I apologize. 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

21 minutes ago, JetsFan20 said:

The Bills were the 24th ranked offense in total yds. Not sure what you mean by pre season rank

I will take the 32nd ranked offense if the teams wins a SB. 

 

Last year’s #s are already different with Gore gone and Moss’s gain 

 

[Watkins101]

12 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

LOL Baltimore at only #20?  Behind Detroit?  And Carolina??  This is a joke.

 

Baltimore scored more TDs than any other team....by a wide margin. Plus they just picked up Dobbins.  Plus a 4.39 slot WR  and traded into the 6th to get the most prolific WR in the FBS the past 2 years.

Baltimore's offense was based largely on an elite Oline, and a QB that performed at an extremely high level as a dual threat. That team could run the ball, which opened up the passing game. It was not mainly because of the positions being evaluated in this article. They contributed, yes, but if Josh Allen and our Oline had those weapons, we wouldn't really be special on offense. The scheme, the base of the Oline, and the elite athleticism of Lamar Jackson made that offense. 

 

They had good quality running backs and tight ends, but their wide receivers are iffy, and I would guess those matters the most to people evaluating the rosters at the positions wr/te/rb.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

11 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

I don't believe that.  Far more TDs than any other team does not = "1 blown defensive play"

being the wise ass that I am 

 

1 blown call per game 16 TD’s.  

Jackson deserves credit... maybe he’s getting too much credit

 

 being Tyrod Taylor 2.5 , IMO the success won’t last very long.   
 

[Mr. WEO]

Just now, Watkins101 said:

Baltimore's offense was based largely on an elite Oline, and a QB that performed at an extremely high level as a dual threat. That team could run the ball, which opened up the passing game. It was not mainly because of the positions being evaluated in this article. They contributed, yes, but if Josh Allen and our Oline had those weapons, we wouldn't really be special on offense. The scheme, the base of the Oline, and the elite athleticism of Lamar Jackson made that offense. 

 

They had good quality running backs and tight ends, but their wide receivers are iffy, and I would guess those matters the most to people evaluating the rosters at the positions wr/te/rb.

 

 

See:  2020 NFL Draft.  Same O-line, more weapons now.  Detroit has 1, maybe 2 weapons.  Baltimore is stacked.  I would swap all their TE/WR/RB with the Bills in a heartbeat.  TGHere's no doubt the Bills would instantly be a higher scoring O--even with its current O-line.

1 minute ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said:

being the wise ass that I am 

 

1 blown call per game 16 TD’s.  

Jackson deserves credit... maybe he’s getting too much credit

 

 being Tyrod Taylor 2.5 , IMO the success won’t last very long.   
 

 

 

ha

[Watkins101]

8 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

See:  2020 NFL Draft.  Same O-line, more weapons now.  Detroit has 1, maybe 2 weapons.  Baltimore is stacked.  I would swap all their TE/WR/RB with the Bills in a heartbeat.  TGHere's no doubt the Bills would instantly be a higher scoring O--even with its current O-line.

 

 

ha

I would not make that swap. 

 

For the Ravens:

Rb: among the best in the league, likely made better by adding Dobbins, though Ingram may lose a step.

 

Te: last year, among the best in the league, traded away one of their The for a second, so likely a downgrade from last year.

 

Wr: among the worst in the league. Last year, their top Wr had 584 yards. When I was trying to look up their Wrs, there were numerous articles about the Ravens should trade for X receiver. You don't see that with a good recieving corps. Two of them he Ravens top 3 recieving options were Te last year, and one left. 

 

In the author's mind, Wr is likely the most important position out of the three, and because of that, the ranking does make some sense.

 

 

 

 

[Mr. WEO]

Just now, Watkins101 said:

I would not make that swap. 

 

For the Ravens:

Rb: among the best in the league, likely made better by adding Dobbins, though Ingram may lose a step.

 

Te: last year, among the best in the league, traded away one of their The for a second, so likely a downgrade from last year.

 

Wr: among the worst in the league. Last year, their top Wr had 584 yards. When I was trying to look up their Wrs, there were numerous articles about the Ravens should trade for X receiver. You don't see that with a good recieving corps. Two of them he Ravens top 3 recieving options were Te last year, and one left. 

 

In the author's mind, Wr is likely the most important position out of the three, and because of that, the ranking does make some sense.

 

 

 

 

if the author feels his ranking is mostly about WR, he doesn’t make that apparent.

 

The TE Baltimore lost was their least productive.  
 

Baltimore drafted one perhaps two rookie WR as starters.  In today’s NFL,  rookie WRs can make an immediate impact, especially on a team with a limited route tree.

 

[Watkins101]

5 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

if the author feels his ranking is mostly about WR, he doesn’t make that apparent.

 

The TE Baltimore lost was their least productive.  
 

Baltimore drafted one perhaps two rookie WR as starters.  In today’s NFL,  rookie WRs can make an immediate impact, especially on a team with a limited route tree.

 

Most Rookies do not make an immediate impact. They drafted a slot Wr, and a Wr in the 6th. round. It's reasonable the slot Wr plays, but the 6th rounder is unlikely to significantly contribute. They lost their #2 Te, their 3rd best recieving option. They run a lot of 2TE sets, so that will be a significant loss.

[JetsFan20]

10 hours ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said:

I will take the 32nd ranked offense if the teams wins a SB. 

 

Last year’s #s are already different with Gore gone and Moss’s gain 

 

I don’t think the Bills will likely ever have a top 10 offense under McDermott by design. His formula is defense/ball control.

 

In today’s NFL you need to throw the ball around to have a top 10 offense. Your point is valid-top 10 offense doesn’t mean you are going to win football games. 

[thebandit27]

8 minutes ago, JetsFan20 said:

I don’t think the Bills will likely ever have a top 10 offense under McDermott by design. His formula is defense/ball control.

 

In today’s NFL you need to throw the ball around to have a top 10 offense. Your point is valid-top 10 offense doesn’t mean you are going to win football games. 

Have you considered that McDermott’s model has been defense/ball control by necessity up to this point?

 

Also, the “gotta throw the ball” thing isn’t correct. 7 of the top 10 teams in rushing attempts in 2019 finished top 10 in points scored.

[BisonMan]

Every time I read one of these articles, it seems the author doesn't watch many (any?) Bills' games. He writes about Dawson Knox:

 

"The Mississippi product is a reliable if unspectacular checkdown option"

 

Seriously? That is just about the opposite of what you'd write about Knox. He led the league in drop percentage (unreliable) and is most noted for some spectacular catches...and ANGRY RUNS!!!!!!

 

You'd think a guy with the same name (Knox), you'd follow him at least a little before writing about him.

 

[Mr. WEO]

5 hours ago, Watkins101 said:

Most Rookies do not make an immediate impact. They drafted a slot Wr, and a Wr in the 6th. round. It's reasonable the slot Wr plays, but the 6th rounder is unlikely to significantly contribute. They lost their #2 Te, their 3rd best receiving option. They run a lot of 2TE sets, so that will be a significant loss.

 

Hurst had 28  more yards all season than Nick Boyle, which is not significant.  He was 5th on the team in targets, He was clearly more valuable to the Ravens in trade.  If they thought the his being gone was a significant loss, they wouldn't have traded him.

 

No most rookies don't make an impact, yet the Ravens had one who did just this year!  Plus slot receivers are going to get a lot of work this year in that Offense.

 

Of the top of my head other rookies who made an immediate impact just last season alone:  Samuels, AJ Brown, DK Metcalf, Darius Slayton, Hardman, Diontae Johnson, Marquis Brown (the only 1st rounder) Renfrow...all had at least 500 yards, 3 TDs.  

 

[Ecmic82]

On 6/11/2020 at 9:05 PM, JetsFan20 said:

Its the same offense sans Gore with Moss and Diggs.

I mean, yeah, if you consider everything outside of personnel moves to be of no impact on unit ability year-over-year.

Edited June 14, 2020 by Ecmic82

[SCBills]

On 6/11/2020 at 7:59 AM, JetsFan20 said:

I’m not sure I see that much of a gap between the Bills and everyone else. 
 

Last year the Jets and Dolphins had among the worst OL in the league while the Pats and Bills has pretty good lines. The Jets and Dolphins both invested significant resources in that area and it remains to be seen what the outcome will be.

 

Skill position wise the Bills look a lot better because of Diggs, but I think it’s a little outlandish to think one player makes that much of a difference. 

We, unfortunately, saw the importance of a #1 first hand in our WC loss to the Texans as Hopkins came alive in the second half.   Meanwhile we had WRs dropping big plays and failing to toe-tap in bounds. 
 

The easy argument for Buffalo’s supporting cast is now having a true #1, which makes Brown a top end #2 and Beasley the third option in the slot.   No more forcing a #2 to be our #1 and our slot to be our #2.....something the Jets were also doing last year with Robbie and Crowder.  
 

Add in a second year Singletary and Knox, with Moss replacing the corpse of Gore.  
 

The rebuilt OL was middle of the pack last year and returns every starter this year. 
 

Edited June 14, 2020 by SCBills

[Sherlock Holmes]

On 6/11/2020 at 10:33 AM, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

McCafrey and Moore for sure...

McCaffrey alone puts Carolina 1st... 

[machine gun kelly]

On 6/12/2020 at 8:08 AM, JetsFan20 said:

I don’t think the Bills will likely ever have a top 10 offense under McDermott by design. His formula is defense/ball control.

 

In today’s NFL you need to throw the ball around to have a top 10 offense. Your point is valid-top 10 offense doesn’t mean you are going to win football games. 

That’s not true.  McD used the talent he had on the field and knew he could win which he has made the playoffs two of the last three years with knowing he could immediately impact a defense studying under the great Jimmy Johnson (Philly not Dallas), he had runners, a mobile, tough QB, and only last year picked up a durable #2, and #3 WR.  Now he has a true #1, and a Carson type bruiser to compliment DS.  Next year is a deep TE draft so expect we add a top TE there.  It’s a long term sustainable plan for success.  The Bills could absolutely be a #1 running offense, #10-12 passing offense meaning overall well into the top 10.  It keeps going back to if and hopefully Allen takes another leap in year 3.  
 

By the way, I don’t know if you’re handle is a joke, or if you somehow are a Bills and Jets fan, that doesn’t make sense.  Half my life was in Buffalo, and the second half has been in Tampa.   Therefore almost no conflict with a Bills fan first always!  But a Bucs fan second.  I only root against the Bucs once every four years.  Yes, The Bills game and proudly wear my Bills jersey every 8 years when they play in Tampa.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

On 6/12/2020 at 8:18 AM, thebandit27 said:

Have you considered that McDermott’s model has been defense/ball control by necessity up to this point?

 

Also, the “gotta throw the ball” thing isn’t correct. 7 of the top 10 teams in rushing attempts in 2019 finished top 10 in points scored.

Balance.  That is the key.  
 

I think the Bills can jump up to 15-20 from (what was it?) 24th ranked offense.  
 

 

[SCBills]

I don’t think any of us have a clue what McDermott truly wants to do.   We can guess based on his conservative nature thus far, but last years offensive talent was a 2nd year QB, rookie RB, #2 WR, slot WR, rookie TE and an OL with 4 new starters. 
 

Not hard to see why he’d play it safe with a Top 10 defense, as frustrating as it was. 

[Alphadawg7]

On 6/11/2020 at 4:53 AM, thebandit27 said:

Without looking at the list, I’d probably have Buffalo somewhere in the 9-11 range. I’ll say 11 behind KC, LAR, NO, TB, Arizona, Cleveland, Seattle, Detroit, Atlanta, and Dallas.

I’d say we have a better supporting cast around him than Seattle, Detroit, and Rams.

 

Just overall, from RBs, WRs, TEs, and OL...I think we have a better cast than those guys now.  

[thebandit27]

1 minute ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I’d say we have a better supporting cast around him than Seattle, Detroit, and Rams.

 

Just overall, from RBs, WRs, TEs, and OL...I think we have a better cast than those guys now.  

I disagree but I don’t think it’s crazy to put Buffalo ahead. Except at TE, those other teams are probably clear and away better. WRs are largely a push and I have to think Buffalo has the RB edge.

[Alphadawg7]

1 minute ago, thebandit27 said:

I disagree but I don’t think it’s crazy to put Buffalo ahead. Except at TE, those other teams are probably clear and away better. WRs are largely a push and I have to think Buffalo has the RB edge.

It’s not a huge margin, but I do think Bills have best supporting cast amongst Bills, Rams, Seattle, and Detroit.

WR -  Bills have the best WR of all 3 teams in Diggs.  It’s not a wide margin, but I think Diggs is the best overall WR amongst the 4 teams.  Brown is right there for best 2nd WR, although it’s splitting hairs between him, Rams (not sure how is actually considered #2 for Rams), and Metcalf...with Metcalf having the most upside IMO.  Cole is easily the best 3rd WR of the group.  So for me, while close, I give the edge to Bills.

 

TE - I think of this group, Rams have best TE group because they got 2 good ones.  Bills have upside, but still young.  
 

RB - Seattle has best RB stable, but Bills very well could be there with them or better this year.  But edge is Seattle for sure right now.

 

OL - This is the difference maker for me, I think we not only have the best OL, but the deepest OL of these teams and it should even be better this year.
 

So for me, only team with more than one top personnel groups of these 4 teams is Bills.  I’d put Seattle a close second, then Rams and Lions are both closely ranked behind them.   
 

Just my 2 cents

[Kirby Jackson]

5 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

It’s not a huge margin, but I do think Bills have best supporting cast amongst Bills, Rams, Seattle, and Detroit.

WR -  Bills have the best WR of all 3 teams in Diggs.  It’s not a wide margin, but I think Diggs is the best overall WR amongst the 4 teams.  Brown is right there for best 2nd WR, although it’s splitting hairs between him, Rams (not sure how is actually considered #2 for Rams), and Metcalf...with Metcalf having the most upside IMO.  Cole is easily the best 3rd WR of the group.  So for me, while close, I give the edge to Bills.

 

TE - I think of this group, Rams have best TE group because they got 2 good ones.  Bills have upside, but still young.  
 

RB - Seattle has best RB stable, but Bills very well could be there with them or better this year.  But edge is Seattle for sure right now.

 

OL - This is the difference maker for me, I think we not only have the best OL, but the deepest OL of these teams and it should even be better this year.
 

So for me, only team with more than one top personnel groups of these 4 teams is Bills.  I’d put Seattle a close second, then Rams and Lions are both closely ranked behind them.   
 

Just my 2 cents

Golladay is the best IMO. He’s coming off a big year. Jones also could be considered the best #2 of the group. The Lions WRs are strong.

[FireChans]

19 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

It’s not a huge margin, but I do think Bills have best supporting cast amongst Bills, Rams, Seattle, and Detroit.

WR -  Bills have the best WR of all 3 teams in Diggs.  It’s not a wide margin, but I think Diggs is the best overall WR amongst the 4 teams.  Brown is right there for best 2nd WR, although it’s splitting hairs between him, Rams (not sure how is actually considered #2 for Rams), and Metcalf...with Metcalf having the most upside IMO.  Cole is easily the best 3rd WR of the group.  So for me, while close, I give the edge to Bills.

 

TE - I think of this group, Rams have best TE group because they got 2 good ones.  Bills have upside, but still young.  
 

RB - Seattle has best RB stable, but Bills very well could be there with them or better this year.  But edge is Seattle for sure right now.

 

OL - This is the difference maker for me, I think we not only have the best OL, but the deepest OL of these teams and it should even be better this year.
 

So for me, only team with more than one top personnel groups of these 4 teams is Bills.  I’d put Seattle a close second, then Rams and Lions are both closely ranked behind them.   
 

Just my 2 cents

The WR debate is interesting because if you try to rank #1 v #1, #2 v #2 etc, you may get a different response than bundling all the talent together.

 

Like Woods and Coop are better than Brown and Beasley but is the difference in them greater than their Difference to Diggs?

[Alphadawg7]

54 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Golladay is the best IMO. He’s coming off a big year. Jones also could be considered the best #2 of the group. The Lions WRs are strong.

I like Golladay a lot, I just think Diggs is the better all around WR and a top 5 talent at his position.  It’s not a wide margin, just if I could pick one I would take Diggs as he is statistically already a better deep threat and better at contested catches than Golladay, and those are Golladay’s best attributes.  Diggs is also probably the best route runner in the NFL

 

Jones is the most over rated WR in this discussion.  I’d take Brown, whoever is the the actual #2 for Rams, or Metcalf over Jones without thinking twice.  
 

He’s not bad by any means, but he is so inconsistent week to week.  He’s the smaller poor mans version of Cooper.  He is capable of some big games no doubt, but too often he is taken out of games and disappears.  But season totals are respectable to solid because of the couple of big game.  I laugh every year when someone drafts him way too early in fantasy football and always tell people you might as well start scanning the waiver wire now because you’re gonna drop him after playing him 4 weeks in a row after a big game to see him do squat.  
 

37 minutes ago, FireChans said:

The WR debate is interesting because if you try to rank #1 v #1, #2 v #2 etc, you may get a different response than bundling all the talent together.

 

Like Woods and Coop are better than Brown and Beasley but is the difference in them greater than their Difference to Diggs?

WR debate is really close, but having the best route runner in Diggs, who also has led NFL in both deep balls and contested catches, just makes him the top guy of all the talented group IMO.  Then to have a top end number 2 in Brown with the best route running slot of the group in Cole, I think Bills get the overall edge.  All 4 teams do have a good WR core, so it’s not a lock or landslide by any means.  

Edited June 15, 2020 by Alphadawg7

[blacklabel]

On 6/11/2020 at 9:27 AM, JetsFan20 said:

Rebuttal #3 Zach Moss is a 3rd round pick, how do you know he’s a massive upgrade over Frank Gore? The Jets drafted a RB in the 4th round who could turn out to be better than Moss (nobody knows with rookies). 

 

Sooo... you think their fourth round RB will find more success than your big fat free agent acquisition in Le'Veon Bell? The same Le'Veon Bell who was a beast behind Pittsburgh's OL only to crash with the Jets OL for a whopping 3.2 yards a carry? The fourth round kid is gonna do better than Bell and Moss as well? I mean, anything can happen... but I'd say that....

 

...I can pretty much promise you that Zack Moss will have a better year than Gore did last season... and probably this season. Nothing against Gore, we all know he's a legend and despite his on-field contributions being less than great, what he offered the young guys in the meeting rooms is where his value was, and a big reason why Beane signed him. I'd say Buffalo has a middle of the road OL right now, but Gore made it look like he had a JV team in front of him. Save for a few nice runs it always seemed to be two yards and a cloud of dust... or smacking into the backside of his OL. But then Devin Singletary would check in and find room to run all over the place, so... that gives me faith that Zack Moss can do better than ol' Frank. 

Edited June 15, 2020 by blacklabel