Thursday night preseason games 8/15

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 hour ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

So if it was up to you who would you choose for the Bills HC, McDermott or Gase?

Ever since yolo posted that article about him, no thank you. Seem like a lunatic.  McDermott is a perfect fit for the franchise.... results pending of course. 

5 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

What I find interesting is that now the eyeball test is valid where last year it wasn't. I'm confused.

 

Josh my take longer to develop. I think everyone expected it’s possible. In five years from now Josh May well easily be the better player...

 

Darnold a headstart playing in a elite polished college program. 

 

 

 

Edited August 16, 2019 by Over 29 years of fanhood

[ColoradoBills]

2 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Ever since yolo posted that article about him, no thank you. Seem like a lunatic.  McDermott is a perfect fit for the franchise.... results pending of course. 

 

Same here.  I asked because Scott was sounding like he may want Gase over McDermott.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Just now, ColoradoBills said:

 

Same here.  I asked because Scott was sounding like he may want Gase over McDermott.

 

Ewww that’s gross 

[Heitz]

3 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Same here.  I asked because Scott was sounding like he may want Gase over McDermott.

 

A “non-Bills something” vs a “Bills something”, you know where he stands... ?

[ColoradoBills]

6 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

 

At this point in their careers it's pretty close. Both had good first years followed by bad 2nd years and a bad 3rd year for Gase.

 

This year will tell a lot. Need to see a significant improvement in offense and team record for the Bills. To this point the McDermott led Bills have had atrocious offenses after blowing up a pretty good one the year before he arrived. 

 

We agree on that.  Personally I like McDermotts slow, steady, rational approach.  Gase is opposite of that.

For my money it's not even close.........................but we will see this year.

[YoloinOhio]

16 hours ago, MAGA-Man said:

 

Yep, the Jets trading up with the Colts ahead of the Bills in 2018 could become another "thing" in Bills history. We'll find out.

The Jets didn’t trade up with the Colts ahead of the Bills. If the Jets hadn't made that trade, they would still have picked ahead of the Bills. They were already picking 6th. Also if Darnold had been there when the Bills were picking, I still think they would have taken Allen. That’s based on all we have seen/heard. Not saying it’s what they should have done (no one knows that yet) but i think it’s what they would have done. 

Edited August 16, 2019 by YoloinOhio

[SCBills]

59 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Really? The WRs are the same? Not really close, IMO.

 

Their WRs as a whole are much better than ours. Anderson, while a complete bone head, is a very good reciever. He'd easily be the best one on our roster. Enuwa is a good, physical compliment to him, and Crowder is a perfect slot guy.... just about anyone who isn't a Bills fan would tell you this. The Bills have a bunch of borderline #2 recievers and a good slot Beasley. 

 

Herndon is going to be a good TE in this league. Guy flashed big time last season. 

 

I like Darnold a lot and I don't think there is any question that he is going to be a good one for years to come and Bell is excellent when he is one the field.

 

The only question mark is their line. 

 

At this point in their careers it's pretty close. Both had good first years followed by bad 2nd years and a bad 3rd year for Gase.

 

This year will tell a lot. Need to see a significant improvement in offense and team record for the Bills. To this point the McDermott led Bills have had atrocious offenses after blowing up a pretty good one the year before he arrived. 

 

I mean, I literally just did a quick google search on WR’s and while it’s Bleacher Report, I don’t think this guy is a Bills homer.  

 

Bills 29.  Jets 23.  That’s pretty close.  Both ranked towards the bottom of the league, entering the season.  Each unit has some vets and potential. 

 

Bills OL, on paper, is drastically better than the Jets OL.  That’s a pretty big advantage if it plays out that way, no?  All we can do is predict right now. 

 

It really boils down to Allen and Darnold.  Both have enough to work with in Year 2....but you’re trying to sell us on a Jets Top 10 Offense.  I’m pretty sure only you, and Jets fans, feel that way. 

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/2837387-ranking-every-nfl-receiving-corps-heading-into-the-2019-season.amp.html

Edited August 16, 2019 by SCBills

[Houston's #1 Bills Fan]

17 hours ago, MAGA-Man said:

Darnold had ball placement skills.

That's what she said.....

[K-9]

1 hour ago, ScottLaw said:

Really? The WRs are the same? Not really close, IMO.

 

Their WRs as a whole are much better than ours. Anderson, while a complete bone head, is a very good reciever. He'd easily be the best one on our roster. Enuwa is a good, physical compliment to him, and Crowder is a perfect slot guy.... just about anyone who isn't a Bills fan would tell you this. The Bills have a bunch of borderline #2 recievers and a good slot Beasley. 

 

Herndon is going to be a good TE in this league. Guy flashed big time last season. 

 

I like Darnold a lot and I don't think there is any question that he is going to be a good one for years to come and Bell is excellent when he is one the field.

 

The only question mark is their line. 

Since their receivers and our receivers will never play against each other, I’ll ask a relevant question that fact poses:

 

Which receiver group will have the better success vs. the opposing secondary; Jets receivers vs. our secondary or our receivers vs. the Jets secondary? Since Jamal Adams is the only one from the Jets would would start in our D backfield, I know what my answer would be.

 

That O line question is huge. If they can’t stay out of unmanageable down/distance situations, it won’t matter much how good Darnold, Bell, and their receivers are. 

Edited August 16, 2019 by K-9

[ColoradoBills]

12 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

What slow, steady approach are you referring to?

 

I'll give you my take on the Beane/McDermott plan.  After looking at what they had to work with and what their "process" was,

I think they did the following as a priority.  I say priority for the sake of a better word.

 

1.  Implement the Process.  I see that as the character of the team.  This means getting rid of the players that don't fit and finding leaders.

2.  Dealing with the implication of Step 1.  This caused talent holes and cap issues. 

3.  Implement your drafting process.  It's the long term plan of drafting.

4.  Get the Defense lined out first.  McD is defensive minded and it makes sense doing what you know you are good at first.

5.  Securing the QB.  Lot's of effort and treasure went into getting Josh Allen.  Secured the defensive QB too.

6.  Put the appropriate talent around the QB.

7.  Rinse and repeat where needed and reap rewards (South Park humor).

 

I'm not saying this is exactly what they were thinking but only an example of what I think their long term thinking is like.

Step 1 thru 3 was implemented the 1st year.  Step 4 and 5 was last year.  This year it's step 6 and 7.

The timing of the steps are mine.

 

Now, they both have made wrong moves in players and staff choices but they seem to move on quickly from mistakes.

I know many will say they should of done all this at once but that isn't realistic especially when Step 2 was pretty deep.

I will start to judge the results of their "process" this year.

Go Bills!

[Houston's #1 Bills Fan]

BTW - Peterman went 8 for 8 last night. (only 41 yards, QB rating of 88).

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

Yeah, Gase pisses me off. 

 

He's being hailed as this masterful QB whisperer, but we saw what he did in his time with Miami. Let's not pretend that Tannehill and Cutler were complete trash. In fact, I remember some eager champing at the bit to trade for Cutler in the late stages of Marrone era. And with the way that the Dolphins front office threw around money on free agents, it's not as if they were trying to do it on the cheap. 

 

He's not a terrible coach scheme-wise, but he clearly lost the locker room last year. The Jets were 4-12 last year, and for good reason (and not just Darnold being a rookie) Yeah, they picked up an excellent running back, but I honestly don't see the talent to derserve the kind of hype they are getting.

[MJS]

9 minutes ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

Yeah, Gase pisses me off. 

 

He's being hailed as this masterful QB whisperer, but we saw what he did in his time with Miami. Let's not pretend that Tannehill and Cutler were complete trash. In fact, I remember some eager champing at the bit to trade for Cutler in the late stages of Marrone era. And with the way that the Dolphins front office threw around money on free agents, it's not as if they were trying to do it on the cheap. 

 

He's not a terrible coach scheme-wise, but he clearly lost the locker room last year. The Jets were 4-12 last year, and for good reason (and not just Darnold being a rookie) Yeah, they picked up an excellent running back, but I honestly don't see the talent to derserve the kind of hype they are getting.

Gase isn't a leader. That's his problem. As an offensive coordinator he's fine. But as a head coach he is a train wreck.

[YoloinOhio]

Just now, MJS said:

Gase isn't a leader. That's his problem. As an offensive coordinator he's fine. But as a head coach he is a train wreck.

I don’t even think he’s good at offense. His offense was ranked even lower than the Bills last year and that’s supposed to be the one area he’s good at. He can blame it on Loggains the OC, but he brought him over to the Jets so

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

1 minute ago, MJS said:

Gase isn't a leader. That's his problem. As an offensive coordinator he's fine. But as a head coach he is a train wreck.

I mean, I'm not complaining about that. In fact, I think it will lead to the Jets falling well short of expectations, which would be good for us.

 

I just get really annoyed at the fellating that national media guys have started on because it's a NY team and they got one flashy offensive free agent

[GunnerBill]

4 hours ago, billsfan1959 said:

It is interesting. Many of the same people who championed Tyrod and EJ as franchise caliber QBs, seem to feel Allen has little chance of ever becoming even an above average NFL QB. Just hoping their judgement about Allen is as wrong as their judgement about Tyrod and EJ.

 

To be fair I was out on EJ in camp his 2nd year and out on Tyrod by the Cincinnati game of his 2nd season starting. I have been toward the sceptical end on Allen but I feel he has a better chance than either of them had because he is more talented. 

3 minutes ago, MJS said:

Gase isn't a leader. That's his problem. As an offensive coordinator he's fine. But as a head coach he is a train wreck.

 

He 100% is not a leader but his resume as an OC is "he had a good offense with Peyton Manning" and for one season (in Chicago) Jay Cutler didn't suck playing for him. 

[GunnerBill]

56 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Since their receivers and our receivers will never play against each other, I’ll ask a relevant question that fact poses:

 

Which receiver group will have the better success vs. the opposing secondary; Jets receivers vs. our secondary or our receivers vs. the Jets secondary? Since Jamal Adams is the only one from the Jets would would start in our D backfield, I know what my answer would be.

 

That O line question is huge. If they can’t stay out of unmanageable down/distance situations, it won’t matter much how good Darnold, Bell, and their receivers are. 

 

But arguably none of our receivers would start for them. So it works both ways. Robby Anderson gave Tre White probably his toughest game last season torching him a couple of times. 

 

Anderson is legitimately good. He is certainly the best receiver across the two teams in my opinion. 

[K-9]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

But arguably none of our receivers would start for them. So it works both ways. Robby Anderson gave Tre White probably his toughest game last season torching him a couple of times. 

 

Anderson is legitimately good. He is certainly the best receiver across the two teams in my opinion. 

So, your answer is the Jets receivers would perform better against our secondary than our receivers would against their secondary. 

 

While I agree that Anderson is good and I like Enunwa as well, the collective numbers from both games last year combined don’t suggest that their receivers got the better of our secondary than our receivers got the better against theirs;  Anderson’s one long catch vs. White in the second game notwithstanding. 

 

And while I know that Darnold and Anderson didn’t play in the first game at MetLife and that was a huge advantage for us, that had no impact on how our receivers did against their secondary. And since we’ve upgraded our receiving corps and the Jets didn’t, I see no reason to believe that trend won’t continue. 

 

And I say that knowing that all preseason predictions go out the window the minute the regular season kicks off. ?

[GunnerBill]

5 minutes ago, K-9 said:

So, your answer is the Jets receivers would perform better against our secondary than our receivers would against their secondary. 

 

While I agree that Anderson is good and I like Enunwa as well, the collective numbers from both games last year combined don’t suggest that their receivers got the better of our secondary than our receivers got the better against theirs;  Anderson’s one long catch vs. White in the second game notwithstanding. 

 

And while I know that Darnold and Anderson didn’t play in the first game at MetLife and that was a huge advantage for us, that had no impact on how our receivers did against their secondary. And since we’ve upgraded our receiving corps and the Jets didn’t, I see no reason to believe that trend won’t continue. 

 

And I say that knowing that all preseason predictions go out the window the minute the regular season kicks off. ?

 

What I am saying is I think it is a closer contest than you make out. The Jets offense if the line holds up will be productive this year. Their skill position players are better than ours in my opinion. 

 

I don't think I am being a "disloyal" Bills fan by saying the Jets could be a half decent team. 

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

48 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

To be fair I was out on EJ in camp his 2nd year and out on Tyrod by the Cincinnati game of his 2nd season starting. I have been toward the sceptical end on Allen but I feel he has a better chance than either of them had because he is more talented. 

 

He 100% is not a leader but his resume as an OC is "he had a good offense with Peyton Manning" and for one season (in Chicago) Jay Cutler didn't suck playing for him. 

That's kinda my bone to pick with this bit of media buzz in his favor. I'm not saying he did a *bad* job with Tannehill and Cutler, but I marvel at the idea that someone, Mr. Turnover Sam Darnold is suddenly going to turn into the second coming of Tom Brady.

[K-9]

28 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

What I am saying is I think it is a closer contest than you make out. The Jets offense if the line holds up will be productive this year. Their skill position players are better than ours in my opinion. 

 

I don't think I am being a "disloyal" Bills fan by saying the Jets could be a half decent team. 

The term “disloyal fan” isn’t in my vocabulary. Especially when it comes to honest assessments of our opponents. If I can’t say an opponent is better without being labeled a “disloyal fan”, then whomever is labeling me as such doesn’t have a CLUE about competition. 

 

To the point at hand, what I’m saying is, our secondary is leaps and bounds better than theirs. And our poor receiving corps that got the better of them last season, is much improved this season. 

 

And again, none of our conjecture means squat when the regular season starts. 

[Rochesterfan]

23 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

It's incredible how a billion dollar product is so unbelievably inept. Goodell is a ***** show commissioner when it comes to integrity of the actual game. He's a joke.

 

 

 

I don’t get this at all.  Did Goodell make the call?  Is Goodell in the booth making the call?  Did Goodell blow the call in the playoffs?  Was Goodell on the coaching and GM committee that decided the rule change?

 

Goodell is a front piece for a billion dollar game where revenue keeps growing.  He rides a fine line between what is best for the owners and the league.  The joke is the result of coaches wanting more control and not understanding the consequences of their decision.  It was the same issue with the catch rule - that one (and this) is on the competition committee that wanted a change, but couldn’t define the change and made it worse.  None of this is on Goodell.

Edited August 17, 2019 by Rochesterfan

[YoloinOhio]

16 hours ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

 

I don’t get this at all.  Did Goodell make the call?  Is Goodell in the booth making the call?  Did Goodell blow the call in the playoffs?  Was Goodell on the coaching and GM committee that decided the rule change?

 

Goodell is a front piece for a billion dollar game where revenue keeps growing.  He rides a fine line between what is best for the owners and the league.  The joke is the result of coaches wanting more control and not understanding the consequences of their decision.  It was the same issue with the catch rule - that as on the competition committee that wanted a change, but couldn’t define the change and made it worse.  None of this is on Goodell.

Btw the call was fine. The push off was not seen on camera. You can even see the ref taking out his flag well before the ball arrived. 

[Rochesterfan]

32 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Btw the call was fine. The push off was not seen on camera. You can even see the ref taking out his flag well before the ball arrived. 

 

 

I saw that also, but people make their mind up and that is it.  Just gets frustrating when the same people spout the same false garbage over and over.  Especially once it has been proven false again and again.

[Rochesterfan]

4 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

 

Isnt Goodell responsible for the football operations, the rules and officiating? 

 

The guy is involved in everything. He deserves a lot of blame for bad NFL officiating. 

 

Nope - the competition committee adjust the rules with input from coaches and GMs. That is voted on by the league.  Goodell is not responsible for rules. He is responsible for business development decisions.  

 

Goodell has also been an advocate for full time officials and has gotten some of that, but not all the way. 

 

The set-up of the officials and the replay was again set by the competition committee.

 

Goodell can only do so much with officials because they are part of a collectively  bargained Union.  He tried to discipline some officials last year, but has limited power to do anything.

 

You can blame Goodell, but he has very little to do with rules and officiating- other than being the face piece.

 

Goodell actually tried to fix the catch rule by getting players to provide input to the competition committee, but that group still could not fix he issue.  He also tried to get more full time officials, but that was not pushed through the union - so he has to make due until their CBA is up and they can make changes if the owners approve.

 

If you want to complain about Goodell - then it should deal with the NFLPA, Stadium deals, TV deals, and other business related decisions.  Rules and enforcement is really under the competition committee that happens to have guys like Sean Payton on it that push issue the impacted their team - hence the new stupid pass interference rule.

21 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

 

Isnt Goodell responsible for the football operations, the rules and officiating? 

 

The guy is involved in everything. He deserves a lot of blame for bad NFL officiating. 

 

 

Additionally - if you watch the play and listen to the explanation provided by the league - the foul that was called occurred prior to the pass with an offensive push off that lead to the DB being out of position.  So even in the end if you want to blame Goodell - the correct call was probably made in this case.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

9 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

That's not really what I said though.

 

I said the Jets offense will be a top 10 unit in large part to their WRs. 

 

I think their OLine will be ok. Not great but not terrible.

 

 

And you're still wrong

[SCBills]

9 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

That's not really what I said though.

 

I said the Jets offense will be a top 10 unit in large part to their WRs. 

 

I think their OLine will be ok. Not great but not terrible.

 

 

Thats a lot of faith in Anderson, Enunwa, Crowder and 12 games of Herndon.  A unit most pundits have ranked in the bottom half of the league.  

 

There is potential there for those guys to be elevated by the play of Darnold.   

 

Bell and Montgomery is a nice RB tandem.  

 

Their OL’s ceiling is mediocre with a floor that could sabotage them.  

 

I do like Gase’s up-tempo Offense with Sam though.