Mass shooting at El Paso Walmart/and also Dayton OH

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

who needs a gun. ban knives too?

 

4 dead, 2 wounded in Southern California stabbings

 

The 33-year-old Garden Grove man was taken into custody after he came out of a 7-Eleven in Santa Ana, southeast of Los Angeles, and dropped a knife along with a handgun that he had taken from a guard, police said.

 

The violence appeared to be random and the only known motives seem to be "robbery, hate, homicide," Garden Grove police Lt. Carl Whitney said at a news conference.

 

"We know this guy was full of anger and he harmed a lot of people tonight," he said.

 

The suspect and all the victims were Hispanic, he added.

 

The attacks on more than a half-dozen places took place over about two hours in Garden Grove and neighboring Santa Ana.

[DC Tom]

5 minutes ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

who needs a gun. ban knives too?

 

4 dead, 2 wounded in Southern California stabbings

 

The 33-year-old Garden Grove man was taken into custody after he came out of a 7-Eleven in Santa Ana, southeast of Los Angeles, and dropped a knife along with a handgun that he had taken from a guard, police said.

 

The violence appeared to be random and the only known motives seem to be "robbery, hate, homicide," Garden Grove police Lt. Carl Whitney said at a news conference.

 

"We know this guy was full of anger and he harmed a lot of people tonight," he said.

 

The suspect and all the victims were Hispanic, he added.

 

The attacks on more than a half-dozen places took place over about two hours in Garden Grove and neighboring Santa Ana.

 

Was it a revolving knife, or an assault knife with a detachable magazine and a bayonet lug?

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

Just now, DC Tom said:

Was it a revolving knife, or an assault knife with a detachable magazine and a bayonet lug?

definitely modified.

[3rdnlng]

35 minutes ago, DC Tom said:

 

Was it a revolving knife, or an assault knife with a detachable magazine and a bayonet lug?

Laser Knife,  according to the Police Captain in Garden Grove.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

On 8/7/2019 at 5:18 PM, DC Tom said:

 

I could tell you if the board's search function worked properly.  But probably upwards of 10,000.

 

...and a testament......9,998 outta 10,000 ain't too bad a BA, right?....Trout ain't even THAT good.....just askin'.............

[3rdnlng]

1 hour ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...and a testament......9,998 outta 10,000 ain't too bad a BA, right?....Trout ain't even THAT good.....just askin'.............

No but the native ones put up a good fight.

[Tiberius]

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/el-paso-suspect-said-he-was-targeting-mexicans-told-officers-he-was-the-shooter-police-say/2019/08/09/ab235e18-bac9-11e9-b3b4-2bb69e8c4e39_story.html  All a hoax I tell ya! 

Quote

 

EL PASO — The suspect accused of killing 22 people at an El Paso Walmart told authorities that he was targeting “Mexicans” and confessed to carrying out the shooting rampage when he surrendered to authorities, according to police.

Law enforcement officials responding to the scene on Saturday spotted a car stopped at an intersection not far from the Walmart, an El Paso police detective wrote in an arrest warrant affidavit obtained by The Washington Post. They then saw a man — identified as Patrick Crusius, the 21-year-old charged with capital murder in the case — get out of the car with his hands in the air, the affidavit said.

[Read the arrest warrant affidavit]

He told them, “I’m the shooter,” Detective Adrian Garcia said in the affidavit, which was filed to a judge on Sunday, the day after the shooting.

 

According to Garcia’s affidavit, Crusius waived his right to an attorney and agreed to speak, telling police he traveled from Allen, Tex., a suburb of Dallas, with an assault rifle and multiple magazines.

“The defendant stated once inside the store he opened fire using his AK-47 shooting multiple innocent victims,” Garcia wrote. The detective added that Crusius said his targets were “Mexicans.”

 

 

[bdutton]

2 hours ago, Tiberius said:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/el-paso-suspect-said-he-was-targeting-mexicans-told-officers-he-was-the-shooter-police-say/2019/08/09/ab235e18-bac9-11e9-b3b4-2bb69e8c4e39_story.html  All a hoax I tell ya! 

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/has-anyone-actually-read-the-el-paso-manifesto%3F_amp%3Dtrue&ved=2ahUKEwih4_W98PbjAhXmUd8KHeZWBvIQFjAKegQIChAB&usg=AOvVaw3CrFjSv2JtbsuAkbseci3S&ampcf=1

 

So what did Crusius actually write? The Times story did not link to the manifesto, nor did many other media accounts. Most news organizations decided that even though the manifesto is clearly part of the El Paso story, they should not give Crusius the exposure he sought by linking to its full text. So many stories have included just a few snippets from the document. (The Washington Examiner has also decided not to link to the manifesto, but it can be easily found on the internet.)

But since the manifesto has become such an important part of the moment's political debate, it is worth looking at the whole thing. And the impression one gets after reading the manifesto is quite different than some press accounts.

First, to be clear: The manifesto is insane. Part of it discussed commonly debated issues such as the environment and the economy in ways that are well within the boundaries of political conversation going on today — indeed, that might have come out of the New York Times or many other outlets. Other parts of it mixed in theories on immigration from far right circles in Europe and the U.S. Then it threw in beliefs on "race-mixing" straight from the fever swamps. And then it concluded that the solution is to murder Hispanic immigrants, going on to debate whether an AK-47 or an AR-15 would best do the job. By that point, Crusius had veered far from both reality and basic humanity.

 

 

[Boatdrinks]

On 8/7/2019 at 5:08 PM, Tiberius said:

This is a right wing talking point. People have been "radicalized" influenced by propaganda forever. Joseph Goebbels was from a good Catholic family, didn't stop him

Hogwash. Why is having the basis of a traditional nuclear family , teaching boys traditional masculine roles ( and to become righteous , just young men ) considered to be right wing  or radical ? It’s accepted psychology that boys are different from girls, and having both a mother and father present fulfills a need. Anyway, it s not guaranteeing a good outcome, just increasing the odds. There are always exceptions, and religion has zero to do with it either imo. 

[Tiberius]

13 hours ago, bdutton said:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/has-anyone-actually-read-the-el-paso-manifesto%3F_amp%3Dtrue&ved=2ahUKEwih4_W98PbjAhXmUd8KHeZWBvIQFjAKegQIChAB&usg=AOvVaw3CrFjSv2JtbsuAkbseci3S&ampcf=1

 

So what did Crusius actually write? The Times story did not link to the manifesto, nor did many other media accounts. Most news organizations decided that even though the manifesto is clearly part of the El Paso story, they should not give Crusius the exposure he sought by linking to its full text. So many stories have included just a few snippets from the document. (The Washington Examiner has also decided not to link to the manifesto, but it can be easily found on the internet.)

But since the manifesto has become such an important part of the moment's political debate, it is worth looking at the whole thing. And the impression one gets after reading the manifesto is quite different than some press accounts.

First, to be clear: The manifesto is insane. Part of it discussed commonly debated issues such as the environment and the economy in ways that are well within the boundaries of political conversation going on today — indeed, that might have come out of the New York Times or many other outlets. Other parts of it mixed in theories on immigration from far right circles in Europe and the U.S. Then it threw in beliefs on "race-mixing" straight from the fever swamps. And then it concluded that the solution is to murder Hispanic immigrants, going on to debate whether an AK-47 or an AR-15 would best do the job. By that point, Crusius had veered far from both reality and basic humanity.

 

 

What he said to the police was all you need to know. He was gunning down Mexicans. 

[mead107]

Just in Chicago this year over 1600 people shot 

https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html

 

 

Edited 19 minutes ago by mead107

 

 

Edited August 10, 2019 by mead107

[Tiberius]

7 minutes ago, mead107 said:

Just in Chicago this year over 1600 people shot 

https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html

 

 

Edited 19 minutes ago by mead107

 

 

Don't stop there, here is a list of all the mass shootings in the US just this year: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_the_United_States_in_2019

 

crazy! 

[mead107]

2 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Don't stop there, here is a list of all the mass shootings in the US just this year: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_the_United_States_in_2019

 

crazy! 

How about lightning? 

 

Ban lightning ⛈ 

 

https://www.weather.gov/safety/lightning-fatalities

[3rdnlng]

For some strange reason I tend to be suspicious of the MSM reluctance to publish the entire manifesto and just feed us excerpts. Not that I have a reason to distrust them of course.

 

 

[Q-baby!]

12 hours ago, mead107 said:

How about lightning? 

 

Ban lightning ⛈ 

 

https://www.weather.gov/safety/lightning-fatalities

You’re an idiot. 

[mead107]

2 minutes ago, Q-baby! said:

You’re an idiot. 

Thank you. 

[RaoulDuke79]

13 hours ago, mead107 said:

Just in Chicago this year over 1600 people shot 

https://www.chicagotribune.com/data/ct-shooting-victims-map-charts-htmlstory.html

 

 

Edited 19 minutes ago by mead107

 

 

I'm sure stricter background checks would have prevented these folks from using stolen guns to shoot one another up. I'd love to know how many of these shootings were committed with a gun that was legally purchased by the shooter. 

[Koko78]

3 minutes ago, RaoulDuke79 said:

I'm sure stricter background checks would have prevented these folks from using stolen guns to shoot one another up. I'd love to know how many of these shootings were committed with a gun that was legally purchased by the shooter. 

 

The real problem is that they have not posted enough "gun free zone" signs around the city. That will end the violence!

[mead107]

Chicago has some of the toughest gun laws.   

 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Interesting these happen the same week Epstein is suicided. There are no coincidences.

[Q-baby!]

18 minutes ago, Koko78 said:

 

The real problem is that they have not posted enough "gun free zone" signs around the city. That will end the violence!

Yeah, so just do nothing, it’s working so well. 

[keepthefaith]

1 hour ago, RaoulDuke79 said:

I'm sure stricter background checks would have prevented these folks from using stolen guns to shoot one another up. I'd love to know how many of these shootings were committed with a gun that was legally purchased by the shooter. 

 

Great question.  Tough to answer because in more than 80% of the shooting murder cases, an arrest is never made. Link to 2018 stats and numbers for other recent years very similar. 

https://heyjackass.com/category/2018-stats/

[B-Man]

THE INCONVENIENT TRUTH ABOUT THE EL PASO SHOOTER:

Who wrote ‘Our lifestyle is destroying the environment of our country … creating a massive burden for future generations. Corporations are heading the destruction of our environment by shamelessly over-harvesting resources … the next logical step is to decrease the number of people in America using resources. If we can get rid of enough people, then our way of life can become more sustainable’?

 

The answer, if media reports are accurate, is Patrick Crusius, the man accused of the El Paso massacre. The words appeared in his testament, entitled (in homage to Al Gore?) The Inconvenient Truth, which he seems to have put online before decreasing the number of people in America by 22.

 

Who said, on Twitter, ‘I want socialism, and I’ll not wait for the idiots to finally come round to understanding’? Connor Betts, the man accused of shooting nine people, including his sister, in Dayton, Ohio.

 

This week’s reporting of the two atrocities has painted Crusius as a white supremacist. This does not seem to be accurate. In his manifesto, he is against ethnic mingling and mass immigration, but his view that immigrants should be killed is based not on racial superiority theory, but on his sense that too many people pollute the environment of America. He despairs of persuading his fellow Americans to change their consumerist lifestyles, so he decides to attack the ‘invaders’ instead.

 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

13 hours ago, mead107 said:

Chicago has some of the toughest gun laws.   

 

 

...agree.....and they do an admiral job supplying them.....

[B-Man]

 

 

 

.WAIT, IS SHE EVEN ALLOWED TO SAY THAT? 

 

Former DNC Chair Donna Brazile: Trump ‘Had Nothing To Do’ With Mass Shootings.

 

 

 

 

 

.

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

[B-Man]

ROGER KIMBALL ON “WHITE SUPREMACY:” Like Manna to the Left.

Readers of Nineteen Eighty-Four will remember the daily ritual in which the inhabitants Oceania are required to watch a film depicting the hated Emmanuel Goldstein, enemy of the state. In Orwell’s novel, the hate-fest was only two minutes long, whereas the supposed anti-white supremacist fanatics have their propaganda on an endless loop.

 

Back in May, PJ Media’s Sarah Hoyt put her finger on what the rallies against “white supremacism” are really all about when she noted that “We Don’t Have a Problem with White Supremacy. We Have a Problem with Leftist Supremacy.” Bingo. “The left is obsessed with white supremacists,” Hoyt observed, “the way that children are obsessed with Santa Claus, and for more or less the same reasons.” Santa doesn’t exist, but the presents pile up every December 25 because the right people have a stake in perpetuating the myth of his existence.

 

Another curious feature of the hysteria over the made-up tort of white supremacism is that its very frenetic quality, instead of highlighting its disingenuousness and absurdity, tends instead to function as a sort of camouflage. Parsing the psychological dynamics of this phenomenon would doubtless take us into deep waters—I’m not at all sure I can explain it—but the Freudians would probably explain in terms of the idea of projection: concealing one’s own unpalatable impulses from oneself by attributing them to another.

 

 

 

 

 

.

[B-Man]

 

 

The victims at Walmart weren't expecting to get murdered when they went in to buy JUST A LOAF OF BREAD either Max.

 

It's about being PREPARED TO PROTECT YOURSELF anytime, anywhere.

[3rdnlng]

8 minutes ago, B-Man said:

 

 

The victims at Walmart weren't expecting to get murdered when they went in to buy JUST A LOAF OF BREAD either Max.

 

It's about being PREPARED TO PROTECT YOURSELF anytime, anywhere.

If you look close enough you'll notice she's buying white bread. Yes, white bread, not pumpernickel or rye. She won't even reach down to grab the honey wheat Thomas English Muffins.

[B-Man]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

[Koko78]

4 hours ago, B-Man said:

WAIT, IS SHE EVEN ALLOWED TO SAY THAT? 

 

Former DNC Chair Donna Brazile: Trump ‘Had Nothing To Do’ With Mass Shootings..

 

Eh, she's on Fox News now, therefore she is now identified as a straight, white, old, Republican male. Therefore, she is not to be listened to, believed, or allowed to order food at restaurants.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

was this posted yet?

 

 

 

 

 

Trump’s First Year Ends in Twice as Many Mass Shootings Than ...

www.globalresearch.ca/trumps-first-year-ends-in...

Over the course of Trump’s first year in office a total of 112 people died in 10 separate massshooting events.

The list includes the nation’s deadliest attack in Las Vegas on October 1, 2017 which claimed 58 lives and injured over 800 victims. These findings are rather acute for a President who ran on a pro-gun platform.

[B-Man]

Why Trump El Paso Picture Triggered the Left

by David Catron

Original Article

 

 

 

We have long ago become inured to Democratic politicization of mass shootings and the accompanying tirades against President Trump suggesting he is somehow responsible for these atrocities. Consequently, the Left’s exploitation of the recent massacres in the cause of gun control was all too predictable. This time, however, they added a new ruse to their rhetorical repertoire. After El Paso and Dayton, Democrats failed to dissuade Trump from visiting the victims, an omission they would have inevitably denounced as callous, the Left went berserk when he and the First Lady posed for a photo with an infant survivor of the El Paso shooting and two relatives.

 

The phony outrage erupted when the First Lady posted a tweet about the El Paso and Dayton visits that contained a photo featuring herself holding the baby, Paul Anchondo, and his Uncle Tito with his arm around the president. Why would this upset anyone? Well, it turns out that Tito Anchondo, like his brother Andre — who was killed shielding his son from the gunfire — is a Trump supporter. This photo undermines two carefully cultivated leftist myths: that Hispanics by definition disapprove of Trump and that he is a Mexican-hating racist. This was too much for the Democrats and their media allies, who, with characteristic hypocrisy, attacked Trump for politicizing the tragedies.

 

But as NPR reported, Tito Anchondo doesn’t see it that way and suggests that his brother would also have rejected the claim: “My brother was very supportive of Trump.” To Democratic claims that Trump’s rhetoric has incited mass shootings, he said, “I think people are misconstruing President Trump’s ideas.” He also told NPR, “We should be coming together as a country at this time instead of threatening each other with hate messages.” Anchondo told the AP on Friday that Trump “was just there to give his condolences and he was just being a human being.” The Democrats aren’t having any of this, of course. 

 

More at the link:

[B-Man]

2 hours ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

 

was this posted yet?

 

 

 

 

‘A media own goal’: Washington Post page on mass shootings shows how rare they are

Um, this does not show readers what they think it shows readers:

 

 

Quote

Noah Pollak@NoahPollak

If you want to stoke outrage about this issue it's probably better not to highlight the fact that only 22 people a year are killed in mass shootings in a country of 300M+. A media own goal. https://twitter.com/markdubya/status/1160565570225549312 …

 

 

 

.

Everything must be politicized though:

Quote

Randy Barnett

✔@RandyEBarnett

The WaPost unintentionally puts recent shootings in perspective. This is a very rare event and marginal cause of deaths—even deaths by murder. But if we keep politicizing these events to accomplish our policy objectives, we just might manage to make them more common. https://twitter.com/markdubya/status/1160565570225549312 …

 

 

 

 

 

I don't think it downplays mass shootings to point out that a little over 1,200 deaths in 54 years is not exactly the terrifying plague that this implies it is. For perspective, 60 times more people died from opioid overdoses in 2017 alone.

 

 

For context: Many on the left argue that late-term abortions are very rare and therefore not a big issue, but there are 10,000-12,000 such abortions every year.

[Koko78]

5 minutes ago, B-Man said:

 

Quote

Randy Barnett

✔@RandyEBarnett

The WaPost unintentionally puts recent shootings in perspective. This is a very rare event and marginal cause of deaths—even deaths by murder. But if we keep politicizing these events to accomplish our policy objectives, we just might manage to make them more common. https://twitter.com/markdubya/status/1160565570225549312 …

 

 

I think that's rather the point of the media/political circus.

[Tiberius]

Trump right back on course again. Did the shooter smile from jail when he heard about this?

The Post reports,

 

Quote

“Immigrants here legally who use public benefits — such as Medicaid, food stamps or housing assistance — could have a tougher time obtaining a green card under a policy change announced Monday that is at the center of the Trump administration’s effort to reduce immigration levels.”

 

[bdutton]

We don't have a gun problem.

 

We have a media fixated on a tiny segment of firearm related deaths in order to further an agenda.

 

[B-Man]

Because ALL the homegrown and "converted" terrorists should be  addressed, not just those the libs want to highlight

Republican Sen. Martha McSally wants to make domestic terrorism a federal crime

USA Today, by Yvonne Wingett Sanchez

Original Article

 

 

Sen. Martha McSally wants to make domestic terrorism a punishable crime in the wake of two mass shootings potentially tied to ideologically motivated violence in California and Texas.

 

McSally, R-Ariz., intends to introduce legislation when the Senate returns from the summer recess to create a law in the federal criminal code to address domestic terrorism.

Federal authorities use other laws, such as weapons offenses and hate crimes, to charge such acts. 

 

McSally said in a written statement to The Arizona Republic that it is important to call domestic terrorism by its name — and to create laws to address it as such. 

 

Her legislation, which is still being drafted, would characterize violent acts as domestic terrorism, would seek to combat domestic terrorism and would aim to make sure victims of domestic terrorism are properly recognized

[DC Tom]

37 minutes ago, B-Man said:

Because ALL the homegrown and "converted" terrorists should be  addressed, not just those the libs want to highlight

Republican Sen. Martha McSally wants to make domestic terrorism a federal crime

USA Today, by Yvonne Wingett Sanchez

Original Article

 

 

Sen. Martha McSally wants to make domestic terrorism a punishable crime in the wake of two mass shootings potentially tied to ideologically motivated violence in California and Texas.

 

McSally, R-Ariz., intends to introduce legislation when the Senate returns from the summer recess to create a law in the federal criminal code to address domestic terrorism.

Federal authorities use other laws, such as weapons offenses and hate crimes, to charge such acts. 

 

McSally said in a written statement to The Arizona Republic that it is important to call domestic terrorism by its name — and to create laws to address it as such. 

 

Her legislation, which is still being drafted, would characterize violent acts as domestic terrorism, would seek to combat domestic terrorism and would aim to make sure victims of domestic terrorism are properly recognized

 

I am dead-set against this sort of legislation being enacted in a country where words are violence and a hat is terrorism.

[B-Man]

 

“How do you propose to end mass shootings then?”

 

 

I get that question whenever I object to more “gun control” as a response to the latest tragedy.  I have long held, and continue to hold, the position that more restrictions on law-abiding gun owners is not the answer to mass murder.  It doesn’t work.  It just leaves the law abiding helpless in the face of criminal violence.

 

First, let’s dispense with that “end”. I hate to tell you this, but you can’t end them.  “Gun control” certainly cannot.  France’s strict gun control did not prevent Charlie Hebdo nor the 2015 Paris attacks.  India’s draconian gun laws did not prevent Mumbai.  Norway’s gun laws did not stop the spree shooter there.  And so on.

 

“Ending” is an unachievable target.  No matter what you do, somebody, somewhere, who intends to harm others–particularly if the’re looking at going out in a blaze of “glory” (with “infamy” serving for their purpose)–will find a way to do it.  When you use it as a justification for restrictions on the law abiding there is no end to that.  No restrictions will ever be enough.  So it will always be an excuse for more restrictions.  And if at any point anyone objects, you can do then as you do now and say “Don’t you care about the victims of gun crime?”

 

Sorry if you don’t like that, but the truth hurts sometimes.

 

So, can’t end them, not entirely, but you can improve the situation.  In fact, you can improve it a lot.

 

“Ah, hah!” you say. “Gun control, right?”

Nope.  In fact, gun control is a large part of the problem.  The vast, vast majority of mass shootings of the “spree killer” type (which is what most people think of when you say “mass shooting” and is different in causes and dynamics than the “domestic murder-suicide” types and the “gang war” types, both of which require different approaches to reduce) happen in gun free zones.  The El Paso shooter, in his manifesto (of which only his rant on immigration got widespread publication in the media; for some reason they didn’t bother to mention his rant on the environment and his rant on business) said:

 

Remember: it is not cowardly to pick low hanging fruit. AKA (sic) Don’t attack heavily guarded areas to fulfill (sic) your super soldier COD [Call of Duty first person shooter video game] fantasy. Attack low security targets. Even though you might out gun a security guard or police man, they likely beat you in armor, training and numbers. Do not throw away your life on an unnecessarily dangerous target. If a target seems too hot, live to fight another day.

 

More than 90 percent of mass shootings happen in gun free zones.  Numbers vary depending on source (which can vary in how they’re counted) but the figures I’ve seen range from 92 to 97 percent.  Yes, even the Fort Hood massacre, on an Army base, and the Norfolk Navy Yard shooting, Navy base, were “gun free zones” for this purpose–the military forbade personnel from being armed unless they were doing so as part of their duties–Stateside that meant Military Police on duty.

 

These shootings tend to stop once the shooter encounters armed resistance.  Indeed, as I have noted before, FBI studies covering 2000 to 2017 had 33 cases of spree killers where armed citizens were present.  In 25 of them, the armed citizen totally stopped the attack.  In an additional 6 the armed citizens reduced the number of casualties.  That’s 94% of the time the situation is made better by armed citizens being present.  And what about the claim that people “getting caught in the crossfire” would make the situation worse?  Those same reports also give the number of innocents killed by the armed citizens in those incidents.  It’s a surprising number, all told.  That number?

 

Zero.

 

So, with that information in hand, here’s my approach to dealing with mass shootings:

 

More At the Link:

 

 

.

Edited August 15, 2019 by B-Man

[B-Man]