What is Clay doing 8 yards deep in the end zone?

[Billsfan1972]

23 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

All22 wasn’t up yet when I looked, but that will tell the painful story of the near win 

46 minutes ago, OrtonHearsaWho said:

Is there a video that shows the entire field during the last play, or at least one that focuses more on Clay?  As mentioned here and in another thread, I think the bigger issue with Clay on the last play is that he didn't come back to the ball and/or stumbled when he attempted to do so.  It just seemed like the ball was in the air long enough for him to come back to the ball a lot more than he did.

 

If video it exists in another post just let me know.

1 hour ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

 

I remember hearing on radio that all the receivers ran deep to end zone 

 

Go to the end and can see enough that there was plenty of time to adjust, no one within 20 yards and also can see 3 Bills in the back of the end zone.

 

Also the third down pass to Zay was not PI and frankly should have too been caught.  

 

 

Edited December 3, 2018 by Billsfan1972

[row_33]

2 hours ago, Clyde Smith said:

Slight? 

 

i wouldn't want to be judged based solely on the worst play of my career (still pending I guess)

 

trying to be nice to Clay as the rage subsides almost 24 hours later

 

38 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

In the calm light of day, the guy had a shot to catch it but didn't. 

 

It's a shame, it was a beautifully chaotic thing  to watch unfold, and it sure would have been exciting for the rookie to win one like that.

 

 

 

 

 

he may have been the most surprised person there or watching on TV to find the ball was coming right at him and 100% catchable

 

 

[Buffalo716]

3 hours ago, BillsRdue said:

If that was a 6 year old Little Loop WR instead of Clay that ball would have been caught.  It was like a soft pop fly to center field, a complete lack of judgement and depth perception until it was too late. Clay is a POS.

Ok let’s be real, that still wasn’t a soft pop fly for a 6 year old. Allen threw that ball like 50+ yards and it got there in like 3 seconds .

 

There isn’t any 6 year old that could catch that ball if we are being honest 

 

Clay should have but no child could lol

Edited December 3, 2018 by Buffalo716

[row_33]

13 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Ok let’s be real, that still wasn’t a soft pop fly. Allen threw that ball like 50+ yards and it got there in like 3 seconds .

 

There isn’t any 6 year old that could catch that ball if we are being honest 

 

Clay should have but no child could lol

 

do you watch what QBs and WRs do nonchalantly in warmups for NFL games?

 

 

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, row_33 said:

 

do you watch what QBs and WRs do nonchalantly in warmups for NFL games?

 

 

Yes. 

 

He said a 6 year old coulda caught that... that’s absolutely false. 

 

That is not a soft pop fly for a 6 year old. That was my point

 

for a grown NFL player, obviously 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

8 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Ok let’s be real, that still wasn’t a soft pop fly. Allen threw that ball like 50+ yards and it got there in like 3 seconds .

 

There isn’t any 6 year old that could catch that ball if we are being honest 

 

Clay should have but no child could lol

 

I give my 9 yr old a 50/50 shot at catching that, but he’s an intense competitor. 

[row_33]

11 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Yes. 

 

He said a 6 year old coulda caught that... that’s absolutely false. 

 

That is not a soft pop fly for a 6 year old. That was my point

 

for a grown NFL player, obviously 

 

sometimes sports fans engage in a little bit of fun hyperbole, sometimes they exaggerate, sometimes they use metaphors or similes

 

sometimes they engage in tired old tropes

 

thanks for letting us know though.... 

 

 

[WideNine]

Lofton questioned the same thing on the air - said that Clay acted like he had to keep his feet in the end zone rather than come back more to the ball.

 

These plays and decisions happen in seconds and I will never say it is easy, but the general rule is if it hits you in the hands you should make the catch. I think Clay should go, not because I am mad at the player, but rather because his injuries keep him off the field too much and I would rather have the team develop or bring in a TE that Josh can build up some chemistry with and he is just not performing up to his contract/expectations.

Edited December 3, 2018 by WideNine

[Buffalo716]

5 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

I give my 9 yr old a 50/50 shot at catching that, but he’s an intense competitor. 

You are being a father with pride.

 

there is 0 chance with full equipment in the heat of the game a 9 year old catches that. You are just being loving , not realistic 

 

i played D1 ball, I wasn’t catching that at 9 in an NFL game... maybe as a high schooler 

 

no child is catching that ball in the moment. 

4 minutes ago, row_33 said:

 

sometimes sports fans engage in a little bit of fun hyperbole, sometimes they exaggerate, sometimes they use metaphors or similes

 

sometimes they engage in tired old tropes

 

thanks for letting us know though.... 

 

 

I get that ? 

 

sarcasm doesn’t translate over the internet and it’s hard to tell when someone’s serious 

 

clay dropped it... but I wouldn’t compound it by saying a child would’ve won the game for us ... because that just makes me sad... and it’s unrealistic 

Edited December 3, 2018 by Buffalo716

[LABILLBACKER]

4 hours ago, Clyde Smith said:

If that was Croom instead of Clay, then that ball would have been caught.

I agree, you're taught in pop warner to come back toward your qb if he's running for his life. Clay has been useless his entire career with the Bills. Just another drop to remember him by.

5 minutes ago, WideNine said:

Lofton questioned the same thing on the air - said that Clay acted like he had to keep his feet in the end zone rather than come back more to the ball.

 

These plays and decisions happen in seconds and I will never say it is easy, but the general rule is if it hits you in the hands you should make the catch. I think Clay should go, not because I am mad at the player, but rather because his injuries keep him off the field too much and I would rather have the team develop or bring in a TE that Josh can build up some chemistry with and he is just not performing up to his contract/expectations.

 if he starts coming back to the ball he easily catches it at the 2-yard line and we have first and goal with probably 30 seconds left, plenty of time to run 4 plays.....

[Joeziehmer]

13 minutes ago, WideNine said:

Lofton questioned the same thing on the air - said that Clay acted like he had to keep his feet in the end zone rather than come back more to the ball.

 

These plays and decisions happen in seconds and I will never say it is easy, but the general rule is if it hits you in the hands you should make the catch. I think Clay should go, not because I am mad at the player, but rather because his injuries keep him off the field too much and I would rather have the team develop or bring in a TE that Josh can build up some chemistry with and he is just not performing up to his contract/expectations.

Lofton also said that Clay had pretty much lost his job to Jason Croom and Logan Thomas.  Keeping around a bench warmer for pass protection and run blocking is about right for Below Buffalo.  

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, Joeziehmer said:

Lofton also said that Clay had pretty much lost his job to Jason Croom and Logan Thomas.  Keeping around a bench warmer for pass protection and run blocking is about right for Below Buffalo.  

 

Here's the snap count for the year.  Yeah it sure looks like Clay lost his job LOL.  

 

[WideNine]

11 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Here's the snap count for the year.  Yeah it sure looks like Clay lost his job LOL.  

 

 

Sad that a gimpy Clay is our go-to guy. Still does not change my mind that it is a position ripe for upgrade.

[Royale with Cheese]

Just now, WideNine said:

 

Sad that a gimpy Clay is our go-to guy. Still does not change my mind that it is a position ripe for upgrade.

 

Yeah I would like an upgrade than Clay but I just needed to point out the obvious error by Joe.

[Alphadawg7]

Clay was just planning for our draft position to help us find his replacement as an apology for stealing so much money from the Bills.  So ease up guys, this was his way to make amends 

[WideNine]

9 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Yeah I would like an upgrade than Clay but I just needed to point out the obvious error by Joe.

 

It's all good.

 

The Wall can get a bit hectic - it is not for the faint of heart.... or the error-prone.

[jkirchofer]

You know...I stopped watching the game in the 3rd Quarter, so I hadn't seen the play and was willing to give Clay the benefit of the doubt. Just watched it on Youtube....I would spend the rest of the season evaluating the other tight ends and make sure Clay didn't see the field again in a Bills uniform.

[row_33]

2 hours ago, jkirchofer said:

You know...I stopped watching the game in the 3rd Quarter, so I hadn't seen the play and was willing to give Clay the benefit of the doubt. Just watched it on Youtube....I would spend the rest of the season evaluating the other tight ends and make sure Clay didn't see the field again in a Bills uniform.

 

can you believe the high % on here blaming Allen on this?

 

a few insisted he really didn't have much to avoid in the rush....

 

 

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

22 hours ago, BobChalmers said:

 

I've got no problem with Croom and Thomas as talented projects and backups.  Thomas is useful as an emergency /trick play QB too.

 

I do have a problem with them being the starters at this point in their careers.

 

Clay is obviously not very good and catching passes - this is hardly the first time he failed to complete a make-able play - he did it to TT a lot too. 

I wouldn't waste time with any of these TE's. Antonio Gates is 70 and he is better than everyone on our roster at the TE position.

[billsredneck1]

19 hours ago, WideNine said:

Lofton questioned the same thing on the air - said that Clay acted like he had to keep his feet in the end zone rather than come back more to the ball.

 

These plays and decisions happen in seconds and I will never say it is easy, but the general rule is if it hits you in the hands you should make the catch. I think Clay should go, not because I am mad at the player, but rather because his injuries keep him off the field too much and I would rather have the team develop or bring in a TE that Josh can build up some chemistry with and he is just not performing up to his contract/expectations.

exactly what happened.....period....and stupid

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

maybe that was where the designed play was called.    

 

Josh scrambled backwards what 20 yards avoiding pressure before he recovered 10 of that back when he made the pass.

 

Yes, Clay should have caught it 

and 

Yes, Josh underthrew the ball.  

 

[Bookie Man]

Awareness 68

[elroy16]

Anyone have access to the all-22? I'd be interested to see what Clay was doing before the ball was thrown. In the replays it looks like there's no one in front of Clay. It's 4th and 11 with enough time on the clock that they didn't need a score there, it looks like he should have been coming back towards Allen even before he made the throw. At least be back near the goal line and give your QB some help.

 

 

[njbuff]

It's over and Clay will no longer be a Bill at seasons end.

 

My interest is the release of Clay a cap hit or cap savings. I wonder if anyone knows?

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

2 hours ago, elroy16 said:

Anyone have access to the all-22? I'd be interested to see what Clay was doing before the ball was thrown. In the replays it looks like there's no one in front of Clay. It's 4th and 11 with enough time on the clock that they didn't need a score there, it looks like he should have been coming back towards Allen even before he made the throw. At least be back near the goal line and give your QB some help.

 

 

there was no one near him.  

 

Maybe he was thinking  "if I catch it with my feet in the EZ its a sure TD"

 

Was he fully aware he had a 5 to 10 foot bumper he could have come out caught it and "fell" back in.   

 

[elroy16]

1 hour ago, njbuff said:

It's over and Clay will no longer be a Bill at seasons end.

 

My interest is the release of Clay a cap hit or cap savings. I wonder if anyone knows?

 

$4.5 million dead cap hit if he's cut

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/charles-clay-7893/

 

 

With the amount of room they have, that's not much, and there's no hit after next year. 

[Domdab99]

I love how everyone just assumes it's easy to track where a flying, fluttering ball coming right at you from 40 yards away is going to land. 

[njbuff]

2 minutes ago, Domdab99 said:

I love how everyone just assumes it's easy to track where a flying, fluttering ball coming right at you from 40 yards away is going to land. 

 

Allen was running for his life, you expect perfect precision on his part.

 

Clay is paid a lot of money to make plays.

 

Make the darn play.

[Domdab99]

18 minutes ago, njbuff said:

 

Allen was running for his life, you expect perfect precision on his part.

 

Clay is paid a lot of money to make plays.

 

Make the darn play.

 

said like a guy who's never played the game

[elroy16]

24 minutes ago, Domdab99 said:

I love how everyone just assumes it's easy to track where a flying, fluttering ball coming right at you from 40 yards away is going to land. 

 

 

It's not even that part that annoyed me. It was Clay standing in the corner of the end zone while your QB has scrambled to the opposite side of the field. If it was the last play of the game, fine, but there was time and he didn't need to force Allen into that tough of a throw. 

 

This is why I want to see the all-22. Was he just standing at the back of the end zone? With the amount of time Allen was scrambling, it seems like Clay should have had time to already come back to at least the goal line when the throw was made. 

Edited December 4, 2018 by elroy16

[Domdab99]

7 minutes ago, elroy16 said:

 

 

It's not even that part that annoyed me. It was Clay standing in the corner of the end zone while your QB has scrambled to the opposite side of the field. If it was the last play of the game, fine, but there was time and he didn't need to force Allen into that tough of a throw. 

 

This is why I want to see the all-22. Was he just standing at the back of the end zone? With the amount of time Allen was scrambling, it seems like Clay should have had time to already come back to at least the goal line when the throw was made. 

 

lol now this I can see getting upset over...know idea what Clay was doing. Maybe he was lost. 

[njbuff]

15 minutes ago, Domdab99 said:

 

said like a guy who's never played the game

 

Total BS.

 

I bet you Gronkowski makes that play 100 out of 100 times.

[Domdab99]

2 minutes ago, njbuff said:

 

Total BS.

 

I bet you Gronkowski makes that play 100 out of 100 times.

 

Yeah, because real football is so much like Madden. Just make the play, right??

[njbuff]

1 minute ago, Domdab99 said:

 

Yeah, because real football is so much like Madden. Just make the play, right??

 

I can see your argument if Allen missed that throw by a mile, but Clay was in the area code to make the catch.

 

If you wanna defend Clay, that’s fine.

 

It’s over and let’s move on to the Jets.

 

Allen has a chance to further his development, which sets up for an exciting off season and a lead up to the start of 2019.

 

 

[Domdab99]

3 minutes ago, njbuff said:

 

I can see your argument if Allen missed that throw by a mile, but Clay was in the area code to make the catch.

 

If you wanna defend Clay, that’s fine.

 

It’s over and let’s move on to the Jets.

 

Allen has a chance to further his development, which sets up for an exciting off season and a lead up to the start of 2019.

 

 

 

I'm not a Clay fan, but that kind of throw is about as difficult to gauge as any on the field. It's easier for a receiver to gauge a ball as he's running at an angle from the throw, and/or running in the same direction as the throw or perpendicular to it. 

 

Coming straight back to a fluttering ball from a QB with a howitzer for an arm, well, it's really not at all surprising that Clay misplayed it some. 

 

Should he have caught it? Probably. But I understand why he didn't. 

[Nitro]

My question is why do they think hands of stone can make a catch in a clutch situation.   Clay is done.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

1 hour ago, Nitro said:

My question is why do they think hands of stone can make a catch in a clutch situation.   Clay is done.

KB Stone hands was cut. 

 

Clay remains.   

 

 

[njbuff]

1 hour ago, Domdab99 said:

 

I'm not a Clay fan, but that kind of throw is about as difficult to gauge as any on the field. It's easier for a receiver to gauge a ball as he's running at an angle from the throw, and/or running in the same direction as the throw or perpendicular to it. 

 

Coming straight back to a fluttering ball from a QB with a howitzer for an arm, well, it's really not at all surprising that Clay misplayed it some. 

 

Should he have caught it? Probably. But I understand why he didn't. 

 

Fair wnough.

[Bookie Man]

#handsOfClay

[elroy16]

Here's a crappy gif of the final play.

 

https://i.imgur.com/XGNOC0X.gifv

 

 

As expected, Clay runs to the middle of the back of the end zone and then coasts to his right until Allen throws it. Also not shocking, Benjamin runs down the right sideline to the back of the end zone and then runs past Clay towards the middle of the back of the end zone. 

 

What's kind of interesting is there's a defender near Clay when Allen throws it, but he starts running with KB and leaves Clay wide open.

 

 

Not good execution on the final, most important play of the game. They've got 3 guys in the end zone like they have to score on the play. Really the main conclusion I draw from this play is that they desperately need to practice a similar situation in practice and also scramble drills.