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Fumble vs Forward pass/incomplete


PirateHookerMD

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4 minutes ago, PirateHookerMD said:

Has anyone found an article/clarification on the fumble play? seemed pretty clear it was an incomplete pass. 

I think it was a missed call. Even the rules expert they had on the broadcast couldn't understand the call.

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I think it should have been ruled a forward pass, but whatever it was Allen needs to stop doing it. He's tried that little volleyball set move a few times now and it looks like it's going to be a problem every time he does it. In a way I'm glad the refs ruled it as a fumble so the coaching staff has more ammo to convince Allen it's the wrong way to execute that play. 

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2 minutes ago, klos63 said:

I think it was a missed call. Even the rules expert they had on the broadcast couldn't understand the call.

 

...now THERE IS a real shocker.....on the Matthews hit, Al "Useless" Riveron said it was the correct call....McAulay broke down the verbiage of the rule citing adjectives "unnecessary" and deliberate" as far as Matthews NOT pile driving...said it was a non-call.......yet 'ol Al was out in front with his "correct call" garbage........."rules" and "expert" in the same sentence is a quintessential oxy moron...

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7 minutes ago, jletha said:

That was a major blunder by the refs and Id bet their getting told they were wrong by the league. Every rules expert said that it was clearly a forward pass. Not sure how hte refs screwed that up honestly.

Since all reviews go through the league office, the time for the league to tell them the got it wrong would’ve been when McDermott challenged, but instead it was upheld. 

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10 minutes ago, VW82 said:

I think it should have been ruled a forward pass, but whatever it was Allen needs to stop doing it. He's tried that little volleyball set move a few times now and it looks like it's going to be a problem every time he does it. In a way I'm glad the refs ruled it as a fumble so the coaching staff has more ammo to convince Allen it's the wrong way to execute that play. 

Regardless of whether or not the call was missed, I totally agree with you.


Allen needs to stop doing that little move as it is a turnover waiting to happen.

 

 

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19 minutes ago, VW82 said:

I think it should have been ruled a forward pass, but whatever it was Allen needs to stop doing it. He's tried that little volleyball set move a few times now and it looks like it's going to be a problem every time he does it. In a way I'm glad the refs ruled it as a fumble so the coaching staff has more ammo to convince Allen it's the wrong way to execute that play. 

 

8 minutes ago, Fadingpain said:

Regardless of whether or not the call was missed, I totally agree with you.


Allen needs to stop doing that little move as it is a turnover waiting to happen.

 

Shovel passes are standard fare.  You don't stop doing it because the refs are idiots.

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3 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

 

Shovel passes are standard fare.  You don't stop doing it because the refs are idiots.

 

Agreed, but in the future, they might want to increase the distance between Josh and the receiver so it's totally obvious, even without a replay, that the ball goes forward. With or without the bad call, it seems like that would be safer anyway.

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27 minutes ago, VW82 said:

I think it should have been ruled a forward pass, but whatever it was Allen needs to stop doing it. He's tried that little volleyball set move a few times now and it looks like it's going to be a problem every time he does it. In a way I'm glad the refs ruled it as a fumble so the coaching staff has more ammo to convince Allen it's the wrong way to execute that play. 

 

What Allen is doing is how the play is designed. Marcus Murphy needs to time it better. He had already ran past Allen by the time Allen had the ball. He needs to be a couple steps back so the snap goes to Allen and then Allen pushes it to Murphy. They've dialed it up three times now and it worked the first time with Foster for a gain of 8 or something. The last two times it hasn't gone well.

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8 minutes ago, blacklabel said:

 

What Allen is doing is how the play is designed. Marcus Murphy needs to time it better. He had already ran past Allen by the time Allen had the ball. He needs to be a couple steps back so the snap goes to Allen and then Allen pushes it to Murphy. They've dialed it up three times now and it worked the first time with Foster for a gain of 8 or something. The last two times it hasn't gone well.

 

Well then it's a crappy play design because too much can go wrong trying to float the ball in mid air like that with a receiver running full tilt in between the center and QB as the ball is being snapped. There's just too little room to work with. Catch it and hand it off. Simple.

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Just now, PirateHookerMD said:

My understanding is that the entire point of executing the play they did, was so in the very instance if the ball is dropped, that it counts as an incomplete pass.

 

I hope the Bills ask for clarification. 

That's just it. It's a low risk play since any other time I've seen it not work, the refs run in blowing the whistle for an incomplete. Yesterday, even after taking another look, they said it was a fumble. Doesnt make much sense since there was clearly no 'hand off' to fumble when you slow it down and watch the replay. 

 

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1 hour ago, VW82 said:

I think it should have been ruled a forward pass, but whatever it was Allen needs to stop doing it. He's tried that little volleyball set move a few times now and it looks like it's going to be a problem every time he does it. In a way I'm glad the refs ruled it as a fumble so the coaching staff has more ammo to convince Allen it's the wrong way to execute that play. 

 

1 hour ago, Fadingpain said:

Regardless of whether or not the call was missed, I totally agree with you.


Allen needs to stop doing that little move as it is a turnover waiting to happen.

 

 

The failure of that play was all on Murphy

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