dgrochester55 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) Clearly the answer is no. Teams do not give up draft picks for fun. There was a market for Allen and Rosen, plus the chance of Miami picking them. We needed to trade up to get someone. I think the front offices in the NFL know a little more about the draft than the sudden outbreak of amateur keyboard analysts that come out of the woodwork after draft day? Was Allen the right guy? I'm worried about that, it remains to be seen. We all knew coming in that Buffalo needed to trade up and give up picks to get one of the top quarterbacks in this class. I do not know why this is such a huge surprise to everyone. Edited April 27, 2018 by dgrochester55 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buff76ers Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 14 hours ago, BullBuchanan said: Mason Rudolph would have been better than Allen by September and likely his whole career. That’s weird, I didn’t hear Rudolph’s name last night. Did you? For him being so much better I would have figured he would be a 1st round pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullBuchanan Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 20 minutes ago, Buff76ers said: That’s weird, I didn’t hear Rudolph’s name last night. Did you? For him being so much better I would have figured he would be a 1st round pick. You could say the same thing about Carr, Wilson, and Cousins. Hindsight is weird, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) Shefter literally came live on air, after the Cardinals pick, and said the Cardinals had tried trading up for Allen but were outbid by Buffalo. Id say that’s about a 100% guarantee that Allen wouldn’t be there at 12. Edited April 27, 2018 by SCBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 11 hours ago, 4thandGoal said: Allen would have went to the Cardinals at 10 and rosen to the dolphins at 11--- we would have been stuck with mason rudolph That was the fear Although I was also a Lamar Jackson fan.....but if Beane had identified HIS guy....then go GET HIM and that is what he did 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 Of we would’ve waited and AZ made the trade and Allen was taken by the Bills, this would’ve been the most epically fail draft ever imo. They wanted someone and they got that someone. Coulda shoulda woulda is garbaggio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEraBills Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 He wouldn't have been there at 12 and I think he was their #2 QB so rather than losing out on him they pulled the trigger. There was nothing they could do to get their #1 guy, namely Darnold. When thinking about it in that sense, I'm not too mad with it because Allen was most likely their #2 and they couldn't do anything about Darnold, especially when Cleveland took Mayfield #1. Once that happened you knew Darnold was going to the Jets. And just like many people said about a month ago, the Giants are not trading #2 for anything and it showed last night. Gettleman had to chance to take Darnold and didn't so that tells me he wasn't trading out regardless. He took his guy and didn't take a chance of losing out on him. I get mad initially but it's starting to sink in. These are the cards we've been dealt. Just hope we can play the best hand we can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 Nope. He was long reported as Arizona's 1st choice. Seeing what we paid and what they paid for 10 says to me that we were competing with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JinxedBill1 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) What gets me is that it seems the giants gave the bills the option to get to 2 but it cost too much. So in a few years we will have to revisit if Allen and what we get today is greater than Darnold and limited picks for the best few years. Plus Darnold is with the Jets. Darnold > Allen, edmounds, picks today and next year or Allen, edmounds, picks today and next year > Darnold. Edited April 27, 2018 by JinxedBill1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hsker4life Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) Schefter is pretty good at what he does, and he claims Arizona wanted Allen over Rosen. Regardless, if you think you have your franchise QB, you don't let giving up two 2nd round picks stop you from ensuring you get him. Edited April 27, 2018 by Hsker4life 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmel Corn Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 I also doubt he would have been there. Between AZ and Miami, they would have grabbed both Josh's before 12. Most Miami fans doubt that Tannehill can take them to a championship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meistersinger Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 As for the first part of the question, I do not believe Allen would have been there at 12 if we just stayed put. It's possible Rosen might have been, since Arizona might have traded up and taken Allen leaving Rosen. It's also possible that teams like New England or New Orleans might have traded up to 10 or 11, but couldn't put together enough to get to 7, so as the guy keeps falling, more teams are now willing to pay the smaller price it takes to move up and get him. Or possibly Miami liked Allen but didn't like Rosen - if Miami offered their 1 and 2 to TB, both picks being better than our 1 and 2, we would obviously have to beat that price to make the deal. Maybe Miami didn't make that offer but TB told us they did - then Beane got snookered. Or maybe TB heard that this was the offer we gave to Denver, so if we were willing to give up that much for Allen to Denver, why not give the same thing to TB for Allen? Did we overpay by giving up 2 second rounders? I think that is a yes, but some times you have to do that. A lot depends on how enthusiastic they were for Allen. These were the possible options the Bills could have offered: (point values come from a commonly referenced trade chart) Both firsts - Pick 12 for 1200 points, pick 22 for 780 points, total of 1980 1 first plus 2 seconds - Pick 12 for 1200, pick 53 for 370, pick 56 for 340 - total of 1910 1 first plus 1 second plus 1 third - Pick 12 for 1200, pick 53 for 370, pick 65 for 265 - total of 1835 1 first plus 1 second - Pick 12 for 1200, pick 53 for 270 - total of 1570 - this would have been fair value at this point. Here are the points needed for various picks 4 - 1800 points 5 - 1700 points 6 - 1600 points 7 - 1500 points It has been reported that the Bills had an agreement with both the Browns and the Broncos for a deal - at a minimum, that would have required at least our first pick in each of the first, second and third rounds to get Cleveland to say yes. I doubt Cleveland would have considered any deal that did not include both firsts - they already have a huge pile of picks, so no need to stockpile more in the later rounds. Basically, I think Beane had arrived at the conclusion that he would be willing to give up 1 first and both seconds to Denver in order to get Allen. Once he decided he would give up that much for Allen, don't think of it as trading for a "pick" but trading for a "player". Presumably, we would not have given up that much for any other elite player on the board like Chubb or Barkley, even though the point value would have been the same. The Bills need for a QB, coupled with the Bills determination that they liked Allen a lot more than Rosen, forced them to pay up. And it's possible they liked Allen better than any QB, including Mayfield and Darnold - neither of whom are sure-fire can't-miss prospects either. So if they were really getting the best QB in a QB rich draft, then that would be a small price to pay. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 20 hours ago, Awwufelloff said: I'm almost positive he would have been. Giving up all we did to move up 5 spots was quite dumb, a side from drafting Allen over Rosen... no Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 20 hours ago, Logic said: No. Schefter reported that the Cardinals wanted him, and that had been reported by other draft analysts recently. I think they still would have traded up, but would have taken Allen at 10 instead of Rosen. Now...would ROSEN have been available at 12? Very possibly. I was so happy to see if one of them would have fallen to 12. I don''t know why the Cards would want Allen so bad, Rosen and Fitz seem like the perfect pairing. Accuracy to a guy that finds the perfect spot every play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 (edited) 21 hours ago, Awwufelloff said: I'm almost positive he would have been. Giving up all we did to move up 5 spots was quite dumb, a side from drafting Allen over Rosen... If you're almost positive, it must be the truth. That's the beauty of saying something else should have happened. Edited April 28, 2018 by PromoTheRobot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billspro Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 20 hours ago, Success said: Doubt it. They did the right thing - if you like a qb, you don’t risk waiting. Still can’t believe they did it and kept their other 1st rounder. Very true, you don’t mess around if you believe in a guy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aceman_16 Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehfeuh57 Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 It was amazing enough he dropped to 7, and your talking about 12?! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manther Posted April 28, 2018 Share Posted April 28, 2018 22 hours ago, Awwufelloff said: I'm almost positive he would have been. Giving up all we did to move up 5 spots was quite dumb, a side from drafting Allen over Rosen... Maybe, maybe not. I personally don’t think he would have been there at #12. And, if you have one guy above the others you don’t chance it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QB12 Posted May 4, 2018 Share Posted May 4, 2018 Yes, he would have still been there for the taking at the 12th pick if the Bills didn't move up to take him before then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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