I doubt Beane risks both 1st round picks

[BringBackOrton]

1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I have been of the belief that the Bills were targeting this QB class for over a year. I don’t think that has changed. They loaded up on assets to make the move for a high level QB in the heralded class of 2018. 

 

On a a side note, this is a great draft to trade up because it isn’t a great draft. It’s a bad draft for WR, edge, OT, and DB. This draft is one where you strike on quality and not quantity. Every draft is different in that sense.

This is sooooo true.  This draft is top heavy in tons of positions.  When RB is the deepest position out there, you trade up and get your guys.  The third best WR prospect in this draft may have been #6 or 7 last year.

[RochesterRob]

1 hour ago, Reed83HOF said:

http://13wham.com/sports/buffalo-bills/bills-are-overdue-to-invest-in-franchise-qb

 

No team in the NFL has invested less in the quarterback position over the last 18 years than the Buffalo Bills. In 2013 they selected Erik Rodriguez (EJ) Manuel in the first round. That is the only time they have used either a first or second round pick in the draft on a quarterback during those nearly two decades. How rare is that? In that same time frame only 7 other NFL teams have also not taken a quarterback in the first two rounds. But it doesn’t take a genius to figure out why those teams have stayed away from a pick. The Giants (Eli) Ravens (Flacco) Chargers (Rivers) Saints (Brees) have the long time starters. The outliers? The Cowboys who hit a home run with free agent Tony Romo and may have one with 4th rounder Dak Prescott and the Seahawks who broke all the rules by finding Russell Wilson in the 3rd. I think it is well past time for the Bills to stop bargain shopping and go in on a quarterback to lead this franchise.

  If the intent was to indicate malaise that is one thing but to say the Bills simply overlooked the position by not using 1st round picks is another.  Further, it kind of cherry picks by stopping at 18 years versus going back to 1997 which was the end of the Kelly era.  Todd Collins even though not a first was a very highly regarded prospect whose failing was he could not put the team on his shoulders when the occasion called for it.  Then we gave up a first I believe when we acquired Rob Johnson from the Jags who in theory should have been entrenched during the first third or more of this 18 year period the author talks about.  Then we used another first to acquire Bledsoe from the Patriots with the idea he would have been around and productive for at least half a decade.  Then we had Losman where we used a first.

33 minutes ago, BuffaloBillsGospel said:

I'm going to say they stockpiled picks last season for the QB crop this season. They looked foolish passing on Watson as he now looks like he could be a top guy in the league I can't see them not trading up even with the holes we have, none are bigger than QB, the rest you can fill in but it's obvious you can't hide the QB play. 

  Watson does not have his SB ring and Hall of Fame bust just yet.

[Johnny Hammersticks]

No quarterback in this draft, like a Carson Wentz, to “mortgage the farm” to move up for.  I’d stay put and stockpile talent with our draft assets unless a guy like Allen or Mayfield slide into the teens.  I’d be happy with giving up 21 or 22, a late round pick, and maybe a pick in 2019 to move up 7-9 spots.  

 

I’d also be happy with Lamar Jackson at 21.

[RochesterRob]

1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I have been of the belief that the Bills were targeting this QB class for over a year. I don’t think that has changed. They loaded up on assets to make the move for a high level QB in the heralded class of 2018. 

 

On a a side note, this is a great draft to trade up because it isn’t a great draft. It’s a bad draft for WR, edge, OT, and DB. This draft is one where you strike on quality and not quantity. Every draft is different in that sense.

  While they no doubt were targeting a QB last year the plan to do it on the cheap which was expecting to finish around 4-12 or 5-11 never happened.  Instead of finishing in the top 7 or 8 picks where the cost to go up to 3 would have been less than a number 1 pick most years all of a sudden got way more expensive than originally anticipated.

[Kirby Jackson]

2 hours ago, RochesterRob said:

  While they no doubt were targeting a QB last year the plan to do it on the cheap which was expecting to finish around 4-12 or 5-11 never happened.  Instead of finishing in the top 7 or 8 picks where the cost to go up to 3 would have been less than a number 1 pick most years all of a sudden got way more expensive than originally anticipated.

That’s certainly true but I don’t think that they are mad about it. I’m sure that McDermott and company aren’t like “damn, I wish that we were 4-12 instead of in the playoffs.” It helps in situations like Vontae Davis for example. He wouldn’t be here now if the Bills were 4-12. 

Edited March 4, 2018 by Kirby Jackson

[K-9]

14 minutes ago, RochesterRob said:

  If the intent was to indicate malaise that is one thing but to say the Bills simply overlooked the position by not using 1st round picks is another.  Further, it kind of cherry picks by stopping at 18 years versus going back to 1997 which was the end of the Kelly era.  Todd Collins even though not a first was a very highly regarded prospect whose failing was he could not put the team on his shoulders when the occasion called for it.  Then we gave up a first I believe when we acquired Rob Johnson from the Jags who in theory should have been entrenched during the first third or more of this 18 year period the author talks about.  Then we used another first to acquire Bledsoe from the Patriots with the idea he would have been around and productive for at least half a decade.  Then we had Losman where we used a first.

  Watson does not have his SB ring and Hall of Fame bust just yet.

I appreciate you pointing out the firsts used on Bledsoe and Losman during the time frame mentioned. Lazy reporting.

[Boatdrinks]

20 minutes ago, RochesterRob said:

  If the intent was to indicate malaise that is one thing but to say the Bills simply overlooked the position by not using 1st round picks is another.  Further, it kind of cherry picks by stopping at 18 years versus going back to 1997 which was the end of the Kelly era.  Todd Collins even though not a first was a very highly regarded prospect whose failing was he could not put the team on his shoulders when the occasion called for it.  Then we gave up a first I believe when we acquired Rob Johnson from the Jags who in theory should have been entrenched during the first third or more of this 18 year period the author talks about.  Then we used another first to acquire Bledsoe from the Patriots with the idea he would have been around and productive for at least half a decade.  Then we had Losman where we used a first.

  Watson does not have his SB ring and Hall of Fame bust just yet.

The fact remains that the Bills as a franchise have never just stayed put and used their first pick in round one on a QB. The highest pick they spent was on Jim Kelly and that worked out pretty well. Since then, the team has taken on other teams leftovers, sat back and let lesser prospects fall to them, and even used a first round pick in a year where no prospect warranted a first. Fwiw, they could have stayed put at 10 and taken Watson and spent only one 1st round pick with no future outlay of draft capital. He may not be in the HOF, but early returns look promising. The teams braintrust needs to understand the value of the QB position and hopefully realizes the lack of urgency in acquiring a top QB has held the franchise back for decades. 

Edited March 4, 2018 by Boatdrinks

[RochesterRob]

5 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

The fact remains that the Bills as a franchise have never just stayed put and used their first pick in round one on a QB. The highest pick they spent was on Jim Kelly and that worked out pretty well. Since then, the team has taken on other teams leftovers, sat back and let lesser prospects fall to them, and even used a first round pick in a year where no prospect warrented a first round pick. The teams braintrust understands the value of the QB position and hopefully realizes the lack of urgency in acquiring a top QB has held the franchise back for decades. 

  Not completely true.  Rob Johnson was a low mileage demonstrator (a couple of 300 yard NFL games as a body of work) and Bledsoe for the majority of his career had 300 yard games.  Losman and down the line were showroom models that did not have one NFL game on them.  Going back to Bledsoe if OL Mike Williams had panned out among other functions to maintain the OL then Bledsoe might have had better protection increasing his performance and lasting in Buffalo a couple seasons longer than he did.

[ColoradoBills]

Using the 2 1st and maybe even the extra 2nd to go get a QB is well within reason.

I don't see what is wrong with that IF OBD thinks the guy is worth it.

 

Just a thought on "sitting on 21".  There is no guarantee on that either.

OBD has to be aware that if a team like Pittsburg or New Orleans likes that guy they could jump us

with a trade with Detroit for about a 2nd.

 

Nothing is sure in the draft.  Nothing.

[Buddo]

48 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

So 3 wont cost to much but 2 will. That makes No Sense. 

 

 

It actually does if you start looking at draft charts and what values you have to come up with to account for that. The jump up to 2nd from 3rd, will be enough to cost us not just most of this draft's picks, but also some of next years. I'd dread to think what the cost could be to go up to #1.

[John from Riverside]

2 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

 

That would make zero sense. They got the Draft Capital they got for the ability go get their QB. There has been nothing during last season that should change that plan

Maybe they aquired the capital so they could aquire A qb and still be able to take players high at other positions........

 

I dont know if they do that but its a possibility

[elltrain22]

If you really believe & think that, then, with all do respect, you are going to be wrong! They (McBeane) have 1-2 targets, and have had them for while, and they will be aggressive to get a franchise QB, as they should

[ColoradoBills]

1 minute ago, elltrain22 said:

If you really believe & think that, then, with all do respect, you are going to be wrong! They (McBeane) have 1-2 targets, and have had them for while, and they will be aggressive to get a franchise QB, as they should

 

.....and if those 2 go to Cleveland and NYG, then what?

[elltrain22]

Get Baker Mayfield. 

[RochesterRob]

5 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

Maybe they aquired the capital so they could aquire A qb and still be able to take players high at other positions........

 

I dont know if they do that but its a possibility

  Acquire a QB using a single pick or at the most a very high first coupled with a third or less to maneuver into the top 5.  Also, while this was going on Rosen, Darnold, etc had yet to play their senior seasons so they could not be 100 percent sure as to how they would slot out.

[ColoradoBills]

Just now, elltrain22 said:

Get Baker Mayfield. 

 

Well if they like him yes.  But that is targeting 3.

All I'm saying is OBD needs to have plan ABC and D for getting a QB this year.

I'll add all this draft talk is meaningless until we see what happens with the FA QB's.

We all will know a lot more in 2 weeks.

[RochesterRob]

4 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

.....and if those 2 go to Cleveland and NYG, then what?

  I would estimate the odds as being very likely that this happens especially if the QB's grade out extremely high.  

[elltrain22]

Just now, ColoradoBills said:

 

Well if they like him yes.  But that is targeting 3.

All I'm saying is OBD needs to have plan ABC and D for getting a QB this year.

I'll add all this draft talk is meaningless until we see what happens with the FA QB's.

We all will know a lot more in 2 weeks.

 

I think they do. They know the landscape just like you and I do. I believe that Rosen is their target, but I also think they like Allen/Darnold/Mayfield, in that order. I think it all depends on how the draft shakes out. 

 

As it looks now, there is an average chance Cleveland takes Barkely 1st, and then the Giants pass on QB, which then opens up so many trade down possiblities for us

[Boatdrinks]

12 minutes ago, RochesterRob said:

  Not completely true.  Rob Johnson was a low mileage demonstrator (a couple of 300 yard NFL games as a body of work) and Bledsoe for the majority of his career had 300 yard games.  Losman and down the line were showroom models that did not have one NFL game on them.  Going back to Bledsoe if OL Mike Williams had panned out among other functions to maintain the OL then Bledsoe might have had better protection increasing his performance and lasting in Buffalo a couple seasons longer than he did.

Im not sure what 300 yard games have to do with anything, but it is true that the Bills have never simply stayed put and used their first overall selection in round one to draft a QB. Johnson had exactly one start to his credit ( vs BAL) with the Jaguars when the Bills surrendered a first round pick for him. The Bills also passed on a chance to select Johnson with one of their own mid round picks in the 95 draft. Bledsoe was probably the closest thing the team has had to a real NFL QB since the Kelly era, but he had nine seasons on him in an era where QBs got crushed. He was never mobile to begin with, and the changes in the defensive game rendered Bledsoe obsolete. Regardless, it's hard to argue that the Bills franchise has placed a premium on finding Jim Kelly's replacement the last twenty years. 

[John from Riverside]

13 minutes ago, elltrain22 said:

If you really believe & think that, then, with all do respect, you are going to be wrong! They (McBeane) have 1-2 targets, and have had them for while, and they will be aggressive to get a franchise QB, as they should

You do realize that the draft is extremely unpredictable......and there are 31 other teams all looking to get better?

 

I takes two to make the trade...if someone else offers more....we dont get the trade.....we have team ahead of us in the draft slotting who might be willing to give a kings ransom to move

 

Our kings ransom might not be as much as their kings ransom

 

That is why you look at all scenarios.   THis is a draft where a talented QB will probably be available at 21