Is there a chance that Beane obliterates the roster this offseason to add cap space?

[Process]

Taylor's gone obviously. Glenn should be moved too.

 

Also dump Clay. He's been overrated and over paid since we signed him. He's nothing special at this point and drops a ton of balls, can easily be replaced. 

[26CornerBlitz]

2 minutes ago, Process said:

Taylor's gone obviously. Glenn should be moved too.

 

Also dump Clay. He's been overrated and over paid since we signed him. He's nothing special at this point and drops a ton of balls, can easily be replaced. 

 

Releasing Clay in 2018 makes no sense as the best TE on the team and it provides exactly zero dollars of cap relief.  

Edited February 1, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

1 minute ago, Process said:

Taylor's gone obviously. Glenn should be moved too.

 

Also dump Clay. He's been overrated and over paid since we signed him. He's nothing special at this point and drops a ton of balls, can easily be replaced. 

I think that Clay has been the leading receiver over the last 3 seasons.   w/o a Pro Bowl replacement, I'd keep him until Buffalo can find better 

[Process]

4 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Releasing Clay in 2018 makes no sense as the best TE on the team and it provides exactly zero dollars of cap relief.  

Well that obviously changes things.. I was going off of the OP saying it would provide 4.5 mill of cap space 

[Mat68]

I think Buffalo will keep Shady.  He was very good last year.  However, I could see the majority of those players being cut.  I think if you move Alexander to situational pass rusher he can lead the special teams and get some sack off the edge and can earn his salary.  Interested to see Beanes first full off season.  I dont expect Buffalo getting into bidding wars for any Fa.  That includes Qb.  The cost for Cousins would be the opposite of building through the draft.  By building through the draft I beileve that means that is where to get difference makers and franchise corner stones.  I think they will look to fill the holes of the roster with mid tier guys.  The right fit and you can find some diamonds.  Like Hyde and Poyer last offseason.  The Bills were 8-4 when Gaines played so I think he is a priority to resign.  Beane likes Benjamin so after his knee heals up I expect buffalo to extend him this year to lower his cap hit.  The roster will be churned just as much as it was last year.  This year they have more picks and more cap space to work with.  

Edited February 1, 2018 by Mat68

[dollars 2 donuts]

3 hours ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

Because there are so many holes on the roster they need every every promising young player they can get via the draft. Having eight picks in the first five rounds (four in the first two) is huge. To throw that away would be unfortunate.

 

 

or, Wayne, they could be strategic with Free Agents, like they were with Poyer and Hyde.

[Wayne Arnold]

30 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Releasing Clay in 2018 makes no sense as the best TE on the team and it provides exactly zero dollars of cap relief.  

 

After June 1st, releasing Clay would add $4.5 to the cap as stated in the OP.

[YattaOkasan]

2 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

After June 1st, releasing Clay would add $4.5 to the cap as stated in the OP.

Did you put the post June 1st numbers for everyone?  That doesnt really work.

 

The league allows each team to designate up to two players per year as a June 1 cut for cap purposes prior to June 1.

https://overthecap.com/explaining-the-june-1st-designation/

 

Also its just putting the dead money off.  Beane said we were better with the cap but we werent there yet (don't have the link from senior bowl IIRC).  That makes me think we won't see huge relief by using the June 1st designation like for Taylor.

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

After June 1st, releasing Clay would add $4.5 to the cap as stated in the OP.

 

It's an awful idea that leaves a void at TE (that hurts both the run and passing game) as is your premise to gut the team.  Beyond that increases the dead money for '19. 

[Mat68]

19 minutes ago, dollars 2 donuts said:

 

 

or, Wayne, they could be strategic with Free Agents, like they were with Poyer and Hyde.

This.  I almost guarantee Beane would much rather bring in 5 or 6 mid tier at the same cost of signing Cousins.  The largest contract imo wont be over 40 mil total and i expect that to be a DT or DE.  They have the space to add 2 Hyde level Fa and 5 Poyer level.  Then use the Draft to add what you cant find in Fa.  A franchise Qb and sideline to sideline baker.  In round 3 add a running back or pass catcher.  

[26CornerBlitz]

3 minutes ago, YattaOkasan said:

Did you put the post June 1st numbers for everyone?  That doesnt really work.

 

The league allows each team to designate up to two players per year as a June 1 cut for cap purposes prior to June 1.

https://overthecap.com/explaining-the-june-1st-designation/

 

Also its just putting the dead money off.  Beane said we were better with the cap but we werent there yet (don't have the link from senior bowl IIRC).  That makes me think we won't see huge relief by using the June 1st designation like for Taylor.

 

They also have to deal with the cap ramifications of Eric Wood's retirement.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

On 1/31/2018 at 11:39 AM, Wayne Arnold said:

The Buffalo Bills currently have $31,336,937 million in 2018 cap space. Good for 16th in the NFL. Not terrible, but not great.

 

Which of these moves could you see Beane end up doing? What are the chances that he does them all?

 

1. Releasing QB Tyrod Taylor prior to the March signing bonus deadline would add $15.44 million to the 2018 cap (no-brainer)
2. Releasing OG Richie Incognito would add $6.425 million to the 2018 cap.
3. Releasing DE Jerry Hughes would add $4.6 million to the 2018 cap.
4. Releasing RB Lesean McCoy would add $3.7 million to the 2018 cap.
5. Releasing LB Lorenzo Alexander would add $2.85 million to the 2018 cap.
6. Releasing OT Jordan Mills would add $1.95 million to the 2018 cap.
7. Releasing DE Ryan Davis would add $1.225 million to the 2018 cap.
8. Releasing OG Vlad Ducasse would add $1.02 million to the 2018 cap.

 

Obviously Wood is a complicated situation, but I can't help but think there's a way to eliminate his contract from the cap. If the Bills were somehow able to pull that off, that would add an additional $8.625 million to the 2018 salary cap.

 

If Beane somehow dumped all of these players (including managing to remove Wood's salary from the cap), that would add $45.835 million to the salary cap, more than doubling it for a grand total of $77.17 million - which would be 5th in the NFL (behind only 49ers, Browns, Colts and barely the Jets).

 

In addition, they could also make the following moves after June 1st:

 

1. Trading OT Cordy Glenn after June 1st would add $11.25 million to the 2018 cap
2. Releasing TE Charles Clay would add $4.5 million to the 2018 cap
3. Releasing FB Patrick Dimarco would add $1.55 million to the 2018 cap
4. Releasing WR Andre Holmes would add $1.2 million to the 2018 cap

 

That would add another $18.5 million to fill roster holes.

 

The questions you have to ask are:

 

• Is Tyrod Taylor worth $15.44 million? I say no.
• Is Richie Incognito worth $6.425 million? That's a tougher one - I would say no because I think they can get better value than that at the guard position, but I could go either way.
• Is Jerry Hughes worth $4.6 million? I say yes.
• Is Shady worth $3.7 million? I say yes, but I don't feel too strongly about it. IMO we just saw Shady's last fully healthy season.
• Is Lorax worth $2.85 million? I'm on the fence with this one as I think his presence at defensive end could replace Shaq Lawson, in which case we could get a mid-round pick for Shaq.
• Is Jordan Mills worth $1.95 million? I might be in the minority on this one but I say yes. He exceeded expectations in 2018.
• Is Ryan Davis worth $1.225 million? I say definitely yes - adds very good DLine depth for relatively cheap.
• Is Vlad Ducasse worth $1.02 million? Probably depends on the new run scheme.

 

Thoughts?

 

Hughes is our best pass rusher - we really cant afford to cut him even if his production doesn't necessarily meet his pay.  Incognito and Lorax are on expiring deals, they can factor into 2019 comp picks if they walk (also incognito was a pro bowler - are we trying to get worse?).  Lorax I could see - but his entire deal is basically non guaranteed.  Why not see if someone can take his job?  

 

If we cut McCoy we literally have no running backs on the roster - and you save 3.7 million on the cap.  Will his replacement cost more than 3.7 million?  Probably.  Will he be as good?  Probably not.  

Ducasse and Miller cost a total of like 2 million.  If we draft a potential replacement I'm all for cutting one - but only if a replacement is brought in.

Moving Glenn will be tough - his value is super low and his salaries are high.  I'm sure they still want to get out of some of the bad deals, and make some savings.  But we are already carrying a large dead money amount for 2018.

[Wayne Arnold]

10 minutes ago, YattaOkasan said:

Did you put the post June 1st numbers for everyone?  That doesnt really work.

 

The league allows each team to designate up to two players per year as a June 1 cut for cap purposes prior to June 1.

https://overthecap.com/explaining-the-june-1st-designation/

 

Also its just putting the dead money off.  Beane said we were better with the cap but we werent there yet (don't have the link from senior bowl IIRC).  That makes me think we won't see huge relief by using the June 1st designation like for Taylor.

 

CornerBlitz said that Clay's release would provide "zero dollars of cap relief," which is false and I simply pointed that out. I don't want to release Clay.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

1 hour ago, Process said:

Well that obviously changes things.. I was going off of the OP saying it would provide 4.5 mill of cap space 

I started a 2018 Cap thread.  In it there is a link to Spotrac/NFL Salary cap where you can "manage" the Bills roster / Cap.   

Have a go at it and some of your questions might be answered.  

 

Buffalo Bills 2018 Salary Cap

Edited February 1, 2018 by ShadyBillsFan

[QuoteTheRaven83]

I wouldn't be shocked if we released/traded Shady and Hughes.

Edited February 1, 2018 by QuoteTheRaven83

[Pete]

Keep Shady, Ingognito, Clay, Hughes.  I am baffled that any Bills fan would want any of them released.  They are part of our foundation.  We are $29 million under the cap.  After we trade/cut Glenn and Tyrod- that should add another $26 million (if I recall right).  Cutting Ryan Davis saves us over $1 million, although we are thin at DT and that might not be wise.  Andre Holmes led team in special teams plays, so my guess is he is back.  With potentially $45 million under cap, a plethora of draft picks, and building upon playoff showing- the 2018 Bills should be much improved and have potential to go deep into playoffs

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

11 minutes ago, Pete said:

Keep Shady, Ingognito, Clay, Hughes.  I am baffled that any Bills fan would want any of them released.  They are part of our foundation.  We are $29 million under the cap.  After we trade/cut Glenn and Tyrod- that should add another $26 million (if I recall right).  Cutting Ryan Davis saves us over $1 million, although we are thin at DT and that might not be wise.  Andre Holmes led team in special teams plays, so my guess is he is back.  With potentially $45 million under cap, a plethora of draft picks, and building upon playoff showing- the 2018 Bills should be much improved and have potential to go deep into playoffs

just over $50.1 Mil if you cut Taylor and renegotiate the top 3 or 4 salaries 

 

you could then spend $30 mil on a QB and still have $25 Mil to play with (if you chose to) 

[BigBuff423]

3 hours ago, Lurker said:

 

Tough to do, now that playoff expectations have been raised.    The pressure from the 'pitchfork and torches' portion of the fan base will be a lot different this year.

 

With a more difficult schedule and so much uncertainty at QB and both O and D lines, rebuilding the roster pretty much insures "year one" of the next playoff drought, IMO...  

 

You could also look at it this way: they made the playoffs, shot the monkey that was on their back, and now have some time "equity" and credit with the fans to use a year to finalize all the intended changes. 

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

5 hours ago, Wayne Arnold said:

 

I admit I'm a little confused about Taylor's financial situation because of the bonus that is due in March. I had assumed that if they traded/released him before that bonus that that money would be added to the cap.

 

 

I don't think Beane finds the dead cap all that relevant with regard to his personnel decisions. It's all about the value of the player and how much money would be added to the cap with his release and whether it's worth it or not. He's not going to stay up at night worrying about dead cap that Whaley caused by doling out dumb contracts.

 

I think the dead cap is stuck from the renegotiations from when Tyrod took less money in 2017 and fewer years to stay on. That signing bonus stays annualized IIRC and advances to dead cap if cut.

 

2 hours ago, Process said:

Well that obviously changes things.. I was going off of the OP saying it would provide 4.5 mill of cap space 

 

I think the numbers are a bit off. Clay can be cut for $4.5 after June first, but it won't provide cap relief for FA season even if we designate him. It would only provide cap relief for emergency free agents, and push the rest of the dead money to 2019. It makes more sense to keep him for his year at least.

[RochesterRob]

43 minutes ago, BigBuff423 said:

 

You could also look at it this way: they made the playoffs, shot the monkey that was on their back, and now have some time "equity" and credit with the fans to use a year to finalize all the intended changes. 

  This should be the outlook for fans but you know it will not be especially here.   The riverboat gambler mentality abounds here.