[Please Change Title]Zay Jones

[BuffaloBillsGospel]

5 minutes ago, blacklabel said:

 

I agree with part of this (not sure the USC guy is a future HOF QB) but yeah, sometimes the switch from a small school (where he was the focal point of the offense) to the NFL can have a negative impact on a rookie. I think that Carolina game really got into his head and has been something he's had to deal with all season. 

 

Fans of the game are starved for instant gratification and when it doesn't happen it doesn't take long for a group to start calling some kid a bust 15 games into his NFL career. And comparing him to guys like JuJu or Kupp isn't really fair considering the QBs those guys have throwing them the ball. Goff has taken a huge step forward and Roethlisberger has been a top 5 QB for years now. 

 

Not the USC QB, I meant Big Ben as the future HOF QB.

[blacklabel]

4 minutes ago, BuffaloBillsGospel said:

 

Not the USC QB, I meant Big Ben as the future HOF QB.

 

Oh, my bad. I misread. Yeah, I agree, the Berger is going to the Hall. 

[twoandfourteen]

1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Nice way to not answer the question.  60 catches for 1047 yards with 9 TDs.   Pretty lousy huh?  

 

Relative to other "stud" WRs, 60 catches isn't exactly "great" either. 

 

Odell's numbers:  91-1305-12, 96-1450-13, 101-1376-10. 

 

As a side note, in only 4 games this year OBJ's stat line is 25-302-3 on 41 targets from a starting QB who was also benched this season. 

 

Zay Jones, Jordan Matthews, and Deonte Thompson also have 25 receptions.

[BobChalmers]

1 hour ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

To all the Tyrod apologists in this thread

 I'm not blaming tyrod for his bad hands although I'm sure at least a few were because of bad throws I blame tyrod for bad stats (yards, catches) etc for all wrs especially when your comparing these stats against his peers on other teams 

 

Tyrod makes all his receivers look bad b/c he only vaguely throws the ball "at" them.  At their toes, behind them in their routes, those are Tyrod's "catchable" balls.  Deonte looks good on the deep stuff where he can run under TT's random passes.  

 

Watching every game I was and remain certain Zay's confidence was broken early from so many poorly thrown balls.

Edited December 26, 2017 by BobChalmers

[BillsfanAZ]

Lets get a little perspective here. Zay has dropped balls he should have caught but there were a ton of passes thrown his way that would have been highlight catches if he was able to pull the ball in. Other throws were not even worth trying for. This website shows that only 63% of the passes thrown Jone's way were catchable. https://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/zay-jones/. You can put in random WR's names and see just about all of them are 70% or higher. Watching Taylor throw the ball at Olearys feet on 4th down is all I need to see of Taylor.  

[ctk232]

4 hours ago, chef4131 said:

I understand a rookie season does not a career make but Bills moved up in round 2 to pick Zay.    JuJu went late second round and Cooper Kupp early in round 3.

Aside from the rookie season adjustment, the biggest issue, imho, is that he's been playing out of position all season. He's been our WR2 and at times with injuries WR1 when his skillset, experience, and route knowledge is all built for the slot. Now he's lined up in the slot this season and has seen some success, but it's more the lack of an overall, consistently healthy WR corps that has forced him into routes he hasn't had much, if any experience in. Not making excuses, for a high 2nd rd pick you'd hope to see the adjusment be more natural, or at least look like Robert Woods did as a 2nd rd pick. I still have hope that Zay develops throughout the rest of the season and could do with more targets, but I don't see it happening outside of the slot.

 

Benjamin could be a solid WR1 with his size to play the big vaccuum role. Since he's lacking the speed for a truly explosive receiver, either Thompson or someone else needs to fill the WR2 speed role to keep safeties honest and provide a constant deep threat. That leaves Zay in the WR3 slot role and he may develop into the solid option he was projected to be. Should the miracle happen we could be seeing a fairly solid corps.

[Dread321]

I'm sorry but I've been saying Zay was a bust since week 2. I was hoping he'd prove me wrong, but we really should have taken Juju. Zay Jones is Hardy 2.0. 

[billsbackto81]

Not buying it, not yet. Kid has the talent and has shown promise at times. Sure he's got some jitters.  They traded up for him and that brings unwanted pressure. Very few WRs blow it up their rookie season and having Tyrod throwing in a run first scheme isn't helping. 

[CEN-CAL17]

A perineal QB that contends for the AFC Championship year in year out, The #1 Draft Pick in last years Draft along side an OC at the top of his game in this league vs TT, a QB who can’t see over his line, struggles with timing, accuracy and reading defenses, can’t make an audible at the line, and throws for 59 yds in a game we trail and need a QB to sling the ball. Not to mention leads the league in sack nearly every year and constantly put the offense at 3rd an long cause he doesn’t have the mental side of the game.

 

Is it that hard to figure out? Zay always looked better with Peterman, Peterman and Zay will look much better once the game slows down for them, most professionals say that happens going into year 2.

[BuffaloBillyG]

5 hours ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

No not making an excuse for Zay but when your comparing him to other wrs who clearly have a better qb throwing him the ball, it's hard to compare. Zay has had some bad hands this year for sure.. 

But look at goodwin this year compared to playing with tyrod etc...

Or, you could say look at Goodwin when he managed to stay healthy and devote himself to football instead of track in the off season. Either way.

[CEN-CAL17]

26 minutes ago, Dread321 said:

I'm sorry but I've been saying Zay was a bust since week 2. I was hoping he'd prove me wrong, but we really should have taken Juju. Zay Jones is Hardy 2.0. 

 

26 minutes ago, Dread321 said:

I'm sorry but I've been saying Zay was a bust since week 2. I was hoping he'd prove me wrong, but we really should have taken Juju. Zay Jones is Hardy 2.0. 

Juju wouldn’t have done crap without AB and Bryant then give him Tyrod instead of Rothlisburger... people can’t be serious.

 

Why do fans think Tyrod is legit enough to make a rookie WR standout?

Fans on this team are so far removed from what a franchise QB looks like and has the potential to do for a team they argue stuff like,” Zay Jones is a bust”, Goodwin is better because “he is healthy and focused more on football”.... unbelievable.

[Dread321]

2 minutes ago, 1ZAYDAY1 said:

 

Juju wouldn’t have done crap without AB and Bryant then give him Tyrod instead of Rothlisburger... people can’t be serious.

 

Why do fans think Tyrod is legit enough to make a rookie WR standout?

I have been a fan of Juju since his high school days. I think he's a better player than Zay "Butterfingers" Jones, no matter who the QB.

 

I'm not asking for Zay Jones to be Antonio Brown, but he hasn't really done much for being a second round pick. 

[CEN-CAL17]

1 minute ago, Dread321 said:

I have been a fan of Juju since his high school days. I think he's a better player than Zay "Butterfingers" Jones, no matter who the QB.

 

I'm not asking for Zay Jones to be Antonio Brown, but he hasn't really done much for being a second round pick. 

Most players in this league become successful based on the team around them.

 

Give me a healthy Jordan Matthews, Kelvin Benjamin and Ben Roethlisberger plus the Steelers Oline I bet Zay doubles his stats from playing with Tyrod VLad Mills a banged up Benjamin and our #2 Thompson who was picked up like 6 weeks ago....

 

Its to hard to say unless they are in the same situation. And it’s not close, hence why Pittsburgh will be probably playing in the AFC championship game for like the 5 or 6 time under Roethlisberger.

His drops are a little concerning, but his drops for the most part have come with good coverage 

[Dread321]

1 minute ago, 1ZAYDAY1 said:

Most players in this league become successful based on the team around them.

 

Give me a healthy Jordan Matthews, Kelvin Benjamin and Ben Roethlisberger plus the Steelers Oline I bet Zay doubles his stats from playing with Tyrod VLad Mills a banged up Benjamin and our #2 Thompson who was picked up like 6 weeks ago....

 

Its to hard to say unless they are in the same situation. And it’s not close, hence why Pittsburgh will be probably playing in the AFC championship game for like the 5 or 6 time under Roethlisberger.

I can see what you're saying, just disappointed in the many drops he had this year and thought we'd see more out of him. I do hope Zay proves me wrong next year, if we get a better passing game going. 

[Agent 91]

5 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Tyrod is a factor, but you're forgetting to account for Kyle Shanahan's offense as opposed to Hackett's Roman's,  and Dennison's.

Tyrod never had Hackett 

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, Agent 91 said:

Tyrod never had Hackett 

 

True.  Roman/Lynn/Dennison.

[What a Tuel]

5 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Really good but those weren't precision type passes. There were a lot of just chuck it up and have Sammy come down with it, which is Tyrod's best pass.

 

i posted it before but Chris Hogan had more YAC in 2016 than Sammy did in his last 2 years here.

 

This can't be understated. So many times we get a 6 yard pass that could've been 15 yard gains if they didn't have to adjust to Tyrod's inaccuracy. They adjust and immediately either fall or get tackled. Or worse we lose a game because a wide open WR (Zay Jones) isn't hit in the numbers for a go ahead TD. Amazing adjustment to even almost come up with that ball.

[starrymessenger]

Not worried about Zay. I think he's going to be good. Looks to me to be a better fit in the slot than outside. Maybe he will wind up like Nelson Agholor who took a few years to come around, and only after he was moved permanently to the slot position. 

As has been mentioned many times it usually takes a while for WR to transition from college to the NFL. Both Mike Williams and Corey Davis were taken at the top of the draft, where they deserved to be, and neither has done much either - but odds are they will certainly get there. Just too much talent and no real red flags.

The one guy I loved coming out was JuJu. I never even heard of Zay before the Senior Bowl and obviously had never seen him play. But JuJu is playing with a HOF QB and is part of a receiving corps that is flat out elite. Big difference for a young player. 

Zay will be fine.

[C.Biscuit97]

56 minutes ago, What a Tuel said:

 

This can't be understated. So many times we get a 6 yard pass that could've been 15 yard gains if they didn't have to adjust to Tyrod's inaccuracy. They adjust and immediately either fall or get tackled. Or worse we lose a game because a wide open WR (Zay Jones) isn't hit in the numbers for a go ahead TD. Amazing adjustment to even almost come up with that ball.

Good post. As a receiver, that should be a catch if it hits your hands. But that was not a good pass, especially to a rookie in their 2nd NFL game.

 

Tyrod has strengths but there's a reason every wr does better when they don't play with him.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

5 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Good post. As a receiver, that should be a catch if it hits your hands. But that was not a good pass, especially to a rookie in their 2nd NFL game.

 

Tyrod has strengths but there's a reason every wr does better when they don't play with him.

 

Exactly. Ergo, the statement I've made 100000 times here:

Sammy watkins was like $10000 rims on an 85 Taurus.

 

[C.Biscuit97]

7 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

 

Exactly. Ergo, the statement I've made 100000 times here:

Sammy watkins was like $10000 rims on an 85 Taurus.

 

I don't completely disagree.  But even though you laugh at it, Sammy opens up everything else in the offense. He was the one receiver Tyrod was effective throwing to and just him as a deep threat would open up running lanes for McCoy.  No one respects Jordan Matthews on defense.

 

i also would have felt much better about Sammy catching that pass than Zay and that one game could be the difference in making the playoffs in a hot garbage AFC.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, C.Biscuit97 said:

I don't completely disagree.  But even though you laugh at it, Sammy opens up everything else in the offense. He was the one receiver Tyrod was effective throwing to and just him as a deep threat would open up running lanes for McCoy.  No one respects Jordan Matthews on defense.

 

i also would have felt much better about Sammy catching that pass than Zay and that one game could be the difference in making the playoffs in a hot garbage AFC.

 

I'm of the belief that absolutely NOTHING else matters in the NFL if you don't have a QB, and a pocket QB at that.

 

there's nothing wrong with SOME mobility, but when it's your only real asset, that's a problem.

 

[twoandfourteen]

13 minutes ago, joesixpack said:

 

I'm of the belief that absolutely NOTHING else matters in the NFL if you don't have a QB, and a pocket QB at that.

 

there's nothing wrong with SOME mobility, but when it's your only real asset, that's a problem.

 

 

 

[BillsfanAZ]

7 hours ago, Dread321 said:

I'm sorry but I've been saying Zay was a bust since week 2. I was hoping he'd prove me wrong, but we really should have taken Juju. Zay Jones is Hardy 2.0. 

I love how fans are so football smart they can look at a player in his rookie season and know if he is a bust. The majority of WRs and RB's do not have a great rookie year. How are Corey Davis and Mike Williams doing this season. Both of those players have better QB's than the Bills. 

7 hours ago, KelsaysLunchbox said:

Or, you could say look at Goodwin when he managed to stay healthy and devote himself to football instead of track in the off season. Either way.

my wife is a 49ers fan so I have watched the games. Hoyer and Garoppollo are way more accurate than Taylor. Goodwin is having a good season but it could be better because he has dropped balls that hit him in the chest. 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

11 hours ago, BillsfanAZ said:

Lets get a little perspective here. Zay has dropped balls he should have caught but there were a ton of passes thrown his way that would have been highlight catches if he was able to pull the ball in. Other throws were not even worth trying for. This website shows that only 63% of the passes thrown Jone's way were catchable. https://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/zay-jones/. You can put in random WR's names and see just about all of them are 70% or higher. Watching Taylor throw the ball at Olearys feet on 4th down is all I need to see of Taylor.  

63%?   Holy **** 

[simpleman]

I have not given up totally on Zay yet. I would not call him a bust yet, but he had better be a much better player in next year's preseason, or he could be a late cut. He has a horrible target/catch ratio and has shown horrible hands. I admit I was a Krupp supporter in the draft, and he has not exactly lit up the league either his first season. Zay was definitely not worth the extra draft pick Buffalo spent on him, but bad drafting is a Buffalo tradition, and that is not his fault.