This offseason Quarterback options

[BuffaloHokie13]

Christ and we need the Ravens to Win tonight.

 

It is cold and chilly now in the DC area. 45 degrees expected around 10PM.

Can confirm, short sleeves and no jacket today was a poor choice. Walking to lunch was rather chilly compared to how things have been.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Dont forget to add the NYGiants in that equation......how long can they rely on Eli....his career is almost @ the end and no successor behind him yet.....

sure they do. Geno Smith (or did they dump him?)

[grb]

I still support Tyrod to a degree

 

Huh. I left my electron microscope at home and totally missed that.

How small "a degree" are we talking here?

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Can confirm, short sleeves and no jacket today was a poor choice. Walking to lunch was rather chilly compared to how things have been.

poor? that was a dumb choice !!!

 

 

I'm getting ready to hang up the windbreaker and break out my winter Bills jacket(s)

Edited October 26, 2017 by ShadyBillsFan

[grb]

I just read where Flacco is having the worst season of his career

 

http://www.espn.com/blog/baltimore-ravens/post/_/id/40012/joe-flaccos-fall-from-super-bowl-mvp-to-31st-ranked-passer-hits-national-stage

that's what a tally of 13 teams. Nearly half the league.

 

To be fair, he has absolutely no help. But I understand real quarterbacks don't need quality skill players.....

[RoyBatty is alive]

Trade up and grab a QB, let Tyrod walk or if he does well enough maybe we can get a draft pick for him. We would have two young QBs and the money being paid to Tyrod can be used on other positions.

I would love to see them grab Josh Rosen, maybe we won't have to trade up too far to get him.

So many teams looking to do the same thing, trading up is going to be epically expensive this year, unless of course most of the leading QBs continue to disappoint like Darnold. This was supposed to be such a great QB class a lot of teams were hoping for their franchise QB.

[xRUSHx]

So many teams looking to do the same thing, trading up is going to be epically expensive this year, unless of course most of the leading QBs continue to disappoint like Darnold. This was supposed to be such a great QB class a lot of teams were hoping for their franchise QB.

Every year the follow QB class is better and the one coming up isn't so good, wash repeat

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

 

To be fair, he has absolutely no help. But I understand real quarterbacks don't need quality skill players.....

lol.

[mannc]

 

 

 

 

- Tyrod has a winning record as a starter...he is doing it this year with injuries....lack of talent on offense.....a running game that is not dominant like it was last year and that is WITH going against top defenses at the beginning of the season. I still need to see more consistancy from him before I think he shoud be the guy going forward but it is not the worst option in the world especially if we can get our deep threat passing game going again. The ball is in Tyrod's court here.

 

 

John, I know you're not anti-Tyrod, but I don't understand why you keep talking about Tyrod's lack of consistency. IMO, his consistency is one of his greatest strengths. Like any QB, Tyrod's not going to put up the same numbers every game; his stats are going to fluctuate based on the strength of the opposing defense, the Bills' gameplan, and the game situation. He's always going to protect the ball and you'll never see him throw three or four picks in a game, like say Eli Manning or Matt Ryan. He also probably won't throw for 400 yards and 4 TDs in this offense.

 

I think what you really mean is that you'd like to see sustained improvement in Tryod's game, and I think we're seeing it this year, despite his less than overwhelming supporting cast.

Edited October 26, 2017 by mannc

[JM2009]

I believe he was a huge EJ fan and thinks Tyrod stole any chance EJ had at being a starter in the NFL.

This is true for a bunch of them.

[RyanC883]

I think this is a great post by the OP.

 

I'm not overly impressed by Cousins, esp. with the salary he will command.

 

I'd draft a QB--but as Kirby suggested, take who is there for us. We have a TON of picks. We can use that to draft a QB, starting caliber WR, starting caliber DL, starting caliber OL, starting caliber LB and/or safety. I wouldn't trade picks away. I'd draft away.

 

In terms of QB next year: let TT be the starter unless Peterman and/or rookie beats him out. Or TT goes bonkers the next few weeks.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

Available QBs--

Cousins (probably too expensive)

Brees (probably re-signs)

Bradford (probably overpaid)

 

Probably available --

Tyrod

Glennon

Hoyer

Mccown

 

I would personally take the Eagles approach to this... They signed Bradford and daniels... then still got the QB they wanted in Wentz... then got a pretty decent return for bradford.

 

So for me it's keep Tyrod - just so as not to show your cards at the draft. It's very possible that a couple of teams picking near the top will have QBs be it cousins or the colts with luck - and we have a lot of ammo to move up and grab our guy if we want to.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

John, I know you're not anti-Tyrod, but I don't understand why you keep talking about Tyrod's lack of consistency. IMO, his consistency is one of his greatest strengths. Like any QB, Tyrod's not going to put up the same numbers every game; his stats are going to fluctuate based on the strength of the opposing defense, the Bills' gameplan, and the game situation. He's always going to protect the ball and you'll never see him throw three or four picks in a game, like say Eli Manning or Matt Ryan. He also probably won't throw for 400 yards and 4 TDs in this offense.

 

I think what you really mean is that you'd like to see sustained improvement in Tryod's game, and I think we're seeing it this year, despite his less than overwhelming supporting cast.

Consistency is repeating the same thing game after game after game after game.

 

for clarity - Consistency with his best games, not his meh games.

Who's asking for him to throw for 400 ypg? No one that I know of.

[John from Riverside]

John, I know you're not anti-Tyrod, but I don't understand why you keep talking about Tyrod's lack of consistency. IMO, his consistency is one of his greatest strengths. Like any QB, Tyrod's not going to put up the same numbers every game; his stats are going to fluctuate based on the strength of the opposing defense, the Bills' gameplan, and the game situation. He's always going to protect the ball and you'll never see him throw three or four picks in a game, like say Eli Manning or Matt Ryan. He also probably won't throw for 400 yards and 4 TDs in this offense.

 

I think what you really mean is that you'd like to see sustained improvement in Tryod's game, and I think we're seeing it this year, despite his less than overwhelming supporting cast.

This year is the year I have been most impressed by Tyrod because he is doing as much as he has in the past with much much less......Clay was the best TE in the league when he went down....Zay Jones was a counted on rookie that has the yips......we bring in a future HOF WR and he quits on the team......his OL is shaky due to injuries......his other targets are getting hurt.....a brought in street FA WR has the most catches this year.

 

I just want to see him sustain it for the year.....he has already thrown over the middle.....thrown from the pocket......engineered a 4th quarter comeback (should have been 2) and he did it against the good defenses in our schedule.

 

I still have hope.

 

When I talk about drafting a qb I firmly believe in taking certain positions when they are supposed to be the strength of the draft.....

[Dragonborn10]

TT is the QB next year. If he keeps playing this well they will not waste a first round pick to trade up. That would be GM suicide.

I would draft WR, LB, OL, and QB with the top 4 picks in no particular order.

I see nothing wrong with adding a QB early next year unless Peterman has looked good in practice and is a true viable option if TT misses time.

[John from Riverside]

TT is the QB next year. If he keeps playing this well they will not waste a first round pick to trade up. That would be GM suicide.

I would draft WR, LB, OL, and QB with the top 4 picks in no particular order.

I see nothing wrong with adding a QB early next year unless Peterman has looked good in practice and is a true viable option if TT misses time.

I actually think Peterman could totally become our Frank Reich

[billsfan_34]

Step 1- get into the playoffs- makes it more appealing to a top FA

 

Step 2- Restructure and trade 99- I know, easier said that done

 

Step 3- Go after Garrapolo or Cousins

 

Step 4- do not give away any draft picks- use them all- get the most value unless someone is willing to give up alot for a pick. Todays NFL is all about drafting well and having a top ten trigger man.

[mannc]

Step 1- get into the playoffs- makes it more appealing to a top FA

 

Step 2- Restructure and trade 99- I know, easier said that done

 

Step 3- Go after Garrapolo or Cousins

 

Step 4- do not give away any draft picks- use them all- get the most value unless someone is willing to give up alot for a pick. Todays NFL is all about drafting well and having a top ten trigger man.

So, make the playoffs for the first time in 18 years, then promptly jettison the QB who got you there in favor of a much more expensive free agent? Gotcha...

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

So, make the playoffs for the first time in 18 years, then promptly jettison the QB who got you there in favor of a much more expensive free agent? Gotcha...

why not? Baltimore dumped Trent Dilfer just after they won their Super Bowl.

(sarcasm and truth)

[Wayne Arnold]

This will all come into focus over the next month. Tons of Tyrod clutter on this board but in fact, the next 4-6 weeks will determine his career. If he can step up and propel the offense forward through what look to be some real shootouts against elite QBs, it will change the conversation. If he can't, they'll be looking hard for a new signal caller this offseason.

 

Kirk Cousins is soooo flawed, though. I pity the franchise that shackles itself to him with a $100M contract. The only location that makes sense is S.F. where he knows the offense well already.

 

Cousins looks like he's 5-7, 120 pounds when he's on the field. Just not a physically gifted player at all, which hurts him.

[billsfan_34]

So, make the playoffs for the first time in 18 years, then promptly jettison the QB who got you there in favor of a much more expensive free agent? Gotcha...

Careful with the spin please. We wont get far with Taylor- he is limited in many ways and has been discussed over and over. If you are happy with just the playoffs so be it. Personally, I want to win the big one and it wont happen with TT. Sad thing is I really like the guy and want him to succeed but he just cant stretch the field and has no anticipation in his throws. So yes, shame on me for wanting a top flight QB at the helm.

[BuffaloFan68]

Rudolph & Rosen are the 2 currently at the top of my wish list.

Let's Go Buffalo!!!!!

[John from Riverside]

Careful with the spin please. We wont get far with Taylor- he is limited in many ways and has been discussed over and over. If you are happy with just the playoffs so be it. Personally, I want to win the big one and it wont happen with TT. Sad thing is I really like the guy and want him to succeed but he just cant stretch the field and has no anticipation in his throws. So yes, shame on me for wanting a top flight QB at the helm.

Here is a little news flash for you......franchise qbs are also not a slam dunk to the big one......

 

see Andrew Luck

[JaCrispy]

I think our problem has been that we throw our rookie QBs into the fire too early and don't give them a chance to learn the behind the scenes stuff first. Then, they can just let the game come to them. Have them get used to the NFL for a year and then say let's see what ya got. This is a unique opportunity for Buffalo to give a young QB as many weapons as they want with all the draft picks they have.

I wouldn't mind staying put and drafting Luke Falk...we could go into next season with Tyrod as the starter in the final year of his contract with Peterman the #2...Falk could have a red shirt first year to learn the system as the #3 QB and then compete with Peterman for starter in 2019.

[mead107]

Tyrod will be the starter next year.

[JaCrispy]

Tyrod will be the starter next year.

I think you may be right, sir.

[mead107]

Good chance he could be one of the top 5 QBs this year. That could put a different spin on a lot of things

[Simon Says]

Signing Cousins might not be possible...Bills dont have the best cap situation...who would you cut to make room for him? How would that affect the team, dead cap and otherwise? i think the plan is to draft well; 6 guys or so that can continue next year. There are several older or injured players to replace soon: Kyle, Lorenzo, Wood, Incognito, maybe Clay?

Edited October 26, 2017 by Pablocruise

[Kirby Jackson]

Every year the follow QB class is better and the one coming up isn't so good, wash repeat

Sorry but this is a big pet peeve of mine on here. Thats just not true. Scouting is done a year out. The 2018 QB class was thought to be one of the best in forever. Thats in large part because of the depth of the class. Every group isnt the same. Thats just a lazy argument that people continue to make. Maybe the 2018 class hasnt lived up to its giant expectations but they arent all the same.

[billsfan_34]

Here is a little news flash for you......franchise qbs are also not a slam dunk to the big one......

 

see Andrew Luck

Never said they were- Cousins has a large enough body of work to take the risk. Also, luck was well on his way until his line couldnt keep him upright.

[JohnC]

Sorry but this is a big pet peeve of mine on here. Thats just not true. Scouting is done a year out. The 2018 QB class was thought to be one of the best in forever. Thats in large part because of the depth of the class. Every group isnt the same. Thats just a lazy argument that people continue to make. Maybe the 2018 class hasnt lived up to its giant expectations but they arent all the same.

Where I disagree with your take (and always have) is the issue shouldn't be about the class's overall talent and depth as it is whether you are in a position to select a good prospect even in a thin qb draft class. Would Watson been a good selection last year? I say yes. Would Dak Prescott or Carr been good selections? In all these examples the Bills were in a position to secure a good qb prospect. Of course there are no guarantees and never will be. But when you are an organization that hasn't had a franchise qb in a quarter century then there needs to be a more aggressive response to addressing that position compared to teams that already have a franchise qb.

[Kirby Jackson]

Where I disagree with your take (and always have) is the issue shouldn't be about the class's overall talent and depth as it is whether you are in a position to select a good prospect even in a thin qb draft class. Would Watson been a good selection last year? I say yes. Would Dak Prescott or Carr been good selections? In all these examples the Bills were in a position to secure a good qb prospect. Of course there are no guarantees and never will be. But when you are an organization that hasn't had a franchise qb in a quarter century then there needs to be a more aggressive response to addressing that position compared to teams that already have a franchise qb.

Yes, John selecting a QB that turned out good is always a good idea. Carr had 3 QBs go ahead of him and Dak had 7 before him. You can always cherry pick a successful QB and say that we should have taken that guy. That is, and continues to be, an incredibly weak argument based entirely with the benefit of hindsight. You cant just pick the best guy out of a group and say, we could have had him. We could have had Kessler, Cook or Hackenberg too.

 

Thats why a good QB class is important. Its a numbers game. If the class is deeper, in theory, the gap between the 3rd and 4th QB is much smaller than the gap from Dak to Sackenberg. The 2018 class was thought to have up to 7 QBs in round 1!! Thats not like the EJ draft. It may not end up as good as originally thought but the level of talent is still higher than most. The odds (very important word there) are better of hitting when the talent is deeper. Its all a crap shoot. We dont know how a guy will play until he plays so we have to use the information that we have prior to him playing to anticipate.

Edited October 27, 2017 by Kirby Jackson

[GunnerBill]

Yes, John selecting a QB that turned out good is always a good idea. Carr had 3 QBs go ahead of him and Dak had 7 before him. You can always cherry pick a successful QB and say that we should have taken that guy. That is, and continues to be, and incredibly weak argument based entirely with the benefit of hindsight. You cant just pick the best guy out of a group and say, we could have had him. We could have had Kessler, Cook or Hackenberg too.

 

Thats why a good QB class is important. Its a numbers game. If the class is deeper, in theory, the gap between the 3rd and 4th QB is much smaller than the gap from Dak to Sackenberg. The 2018 class was thought to have up to 7 QBs in round 1!! Thats not like the EJ draft. It may not end up as good as originally thought but the level of talent is still higher than most. The odds (very important word there) are better of hitting when the talent is deeper. Its all a crap shoot. We dont know how a guy will play until he plays so we have to use the information that we have prior to him playing to anticipate.

 

And I agree with your principle Kirby. I just think the 2017 class was better than the talking heads had it and was ALWAYS sceptical about the "2018 has 7 1st round QBs" line. If Darnold stays in school and the top 3 in this class end up Rosen, Rudolph, Mayfield I think there is a genuine question about whether the 2018 class really is better than the 2017 one (I know we won't know the final answer until a few years down the line). Any thought about punting on a QB in 2017 BECAUSE of the 2018 class was, to me, misguided. Now I don't believe that is actually what the Bills did.... I don't think McDermott wanted to take a shot until he had his guys in the personnel room.

[SoTier]

I think too many posters here ignore reality when they claim that the Bills haven't tried to get a QB in the draft. Drafting a QB isn't the same as drafting a WR or RB or OT. The nature of the position requires that the team have only 1 starting QB at a time, which means that when teams draft a first round QB, they aren't going to spend another high pick on another one until they figure out if the first one is a keeper. If they have a keeper, they aren't likely to draft a replacement until said starting QB is closing in on retirement. Furthermore, a mistake in drafting a high round QB usually has serious consequences.

 

In 2002, the Bills traded a first round pick to get Drew Bledsoe, a proven starter who had been displaced by the much younger Tom Brady. This wouldn't have been a mistake if the Bills had invested in talent around him and kept him longer. They simply released him in 2005 because they wanted to start JP Losman (who was definitely not ready to play) and he went to Dallas to end his career.

 

In 2004, they traded their 2005 first rounder, 2004 second rounder, and a fifth rounder to trade back into the first round to pick up JP Losman at #22. That was a mistake. It's likely Losman would have been around in the second, and if he wasn't, Matt Schaub lasted until the third, and he turned out to be a serviceable starter for several years. What was worse about trading up for Losman was that the Bills lost all chance to grab Aaron Rodgers who lasted until #24 in 2005 ... and the Bills 2005 pick would have been #18. They could have also taken Jason Campbell in 2005. Even in a "deep" QB class, ya gotta pick the right guy.

 

Once the Bills had Losman, they weren't drafting another first round QB until they knew what they had in him. Economically, it wasn't even possible since there was no rookie salary scale at that time. Besides, who was there to pick?

• In 2006, the first rounders were Vince Young, Matt Leinart, and Jay Cutler.
• In 2007, JaMarcus Russell and Brady Quinn were the first rounders.
• The Bills did take Trent Edwards in the third, and Jauron wanted him as the starter so the Bills passed on Joe Flacco in 2008.
• 2009 saw Matthew Stafford at #1, Mark Sanchez at #5, and Josh Freeman at #18.
• Sam Bradford, at #1, was the only QB worth anything in the 2010 class.
• In 2011, a supposedly "great" QB class, Cam Newton went #1 followed by Jake Locker, Blaine Gabbert, and Christian Ponder. Like 2004, the Bills choices in this draft came back and bit them in the arse: they passed on AJ Green to take Dareus and they passed on Andy Dalton to take Aaron Williams whose career was shortened by injury.
• In 2012, the Bills might have traded up to get RG III but lucky for them, they didn't. Both Luck and Tannehill were gone before their turn. They traded up for TJ Graham rather than take Russell Wilson or Kirk Cousins in the third. Like in 2004, ya gotta take the right guy!
• In 2013, the Bills decided to draft a first round QB well before the draft because they didn't want to pay Fitzpatrick, which in hindsight was probably foolish. The 2013 QB class was terrible, they missed two chances to break the Drought in 2013 and 2014 with better QB play, and they probably sank more $$ into QBs than if they had just kept Fitzy (they had to pay Manuel plus Kolb plus Orton) ... and they didn't draft Derek Carr in 2014 because they had Manuel.

Basically, the Bills had realistic shots at good QBs in 2008, 2011, and 2012. Only 1 of those was a first rounder, so claiming that the Bills haven't been "aggressive" enough in pursuing a franchise QB simply ignores who was available and what constraints the Bills faced, some of their own making but most just by lack of opportunity. I'll account them "guilty" of missing badly on Wilson and Cousins in 2012, but then, so did much of the rest of the NFL.

 

Hopefully, they won't repeat past mistakes in 2018 ... just don't repeat 2004 or 2013: picking a first round QB just to placate an unhappy fan base.

Edited October 27, 2017 by SoTier

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

I hear Drew Brees, Teddy Bridgewater and Jimmy Garoppolo are FA's next spring.

just to name a few

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/quarterback/

[BuffaloHokie13]

I hear Drew Brees, Teddy Bridgewater and Jimmy Garoppolo are FA's next spring.

just to name a few

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/quarterback/

Old, Bad, and Unproven?

Edited October 27, 2017 by BuffaloHokie13

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Old, Bad, and Unproven?

39 year old Drew Brees .... unproven? (at age sixty 39 is young)

[Kirby Jackson]

 

And I agree with your principle Kirby. I just think the 2017 class was better than the talking heads had it and was ALWAYS sceptical about the "2018 has 7 1st round QBs" line. If Darnold stays in school and the top 3 in this class end up Rosen, Rudolph, Mayfield I think there is a genuine question about whether the 2018 class really is better than the 2017 one (I know we won't know the final answer until a few years down the line). Any thought about punting on a QB in 2017 BECAUSE of the 2018 class was, to me, misguided. Now I don't believe that is actually what the Bills did.... I don't think McDermott wanted to take a shot until he had his guys in the personnel room.

To your credit Gunner you banged the table for Watson. He looks like a stud. At the same time, Trubisky looks lost, Kizer is worse and Mahomes hasn't taken a snap so we have no idea on him. From the sound of it the Bills are disappointed in Peterman.

 

My point is it has to be the guy not a guy. If the class is deeper the chances of the guy are greater. The depth of this class, still, IMO is greater. That holds especially true if guys come out.

39 year old Drew Brees .... unproven? (at age sixty 39 is young)

Brees was old, Bridgewater bad and Jimmy G unproven Edited October 27, 2017 by Kirby Jackson

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Brees was old, Bridgewater bad and Jimmy G unproven

 

I was fishing for the people who wanted all 3 here. Give it time, its still early.

[Kirby Jackson]

 

I was fishing for the people who wanted all 3 here. Give it time, its still early.

I still love Brees (most underrated player of this generation). Edited October 27, 2017 by Kirby Jackson