Crusher Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 And that goal is a totally fair statement to make - I think Taylor is about a mid-rank NFL QB, the kind who might get you into the playoffs if your D is strong, but maybe not take you very far once you're there. The kind Alex Smith has been, since he was traded to KC. I think the Bills should be turning over every rock and watching this year's crop of college QB with exquisite care in the hope of turning up 1-2 guys with a chance to be better. But that's a very different discussion than saying Taylor's an NFL backup, or crap, or whatever the word of the day may be. You know what the funny thing is about all of this? I said Tyrod had a solid game, and it was a usual performance. These TT guys need to stop getting so unnerved over any comment not glowing of Tyrod...that's the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 (edited) Let me see if I understand this... You're essentially saying that unless I'm going to commit to doing an All-22 breakdown of every throw from every NFL QB every single week, that I cannot make a comment about Tyrod's missed opportunities? Sorry, but that's just slightly unreasonable IMO. I think, on the other hand, that for me to say that I've watched enough NFL QBs both live and on All-22 to say that guys like Alex Smith, Kirk Cousins, and Sam Bradford don't miss those opportunities is hardly going out on a limb. For example, here's a breakdown of Alex Smith from Thursday night: https://www.arrowheadpride.com/2017/9/11/16286126/alex-smiths-all-22-vs-the-patriots-so-that-was-pretty-good You're welcome to disagree with me if you like, but I find the measuring stick that you're asking for to be a bit much. You can do whatever your heart desires and I don't mean anything negative about it. I applaud your efforts to look at film. All I'm saying is that creating any post about the number of plays Tyrod "left on the field" is a pointless endeavor because there is no point of comparison league wide. It's not even a quantifiable stat because you have absolutely no idea where the first read was or should have been or what the progression should have been. It's a 100% subjective and arbitrary post that provides absolutely no factual insight. The fact is, you have no idea if the number of plays Tyrod leaves on the field is a high number or a low number, compared to other QB's in the NFL. Edited September 12, 2017 by bobobonators Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 Let me see if I understand this... You're essentially saying that unless I'm going to commit to doing an All-22 breakdown of every throw from every NFL QB every single week, that I cannot make a comment about Tyrod's missed opportunities? Sorry, but that's just slightly unreasonable IMO. I think, on the other hand, that for me to say that I've watched enough NFL QBs both live and on All-22 to say that guys like Alex Smith, Kirk Cousins, and Sam Bradford don't miss those opportunities is hardly going out on a limb. For example, here's a breakdown of Alex Smith from Thursday night: https://www.arrowheadpride.com/2017/9/11/16286126/alex-smiths-all-22-vs-the-patriots-so-that-was-pretty-good You're welcome to disagree with me if you like, but I find the measuring stick that you're asking for to be a bit much. Um ... wasn't that particular game the best game in Smith's entire life?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 Why is Phillip Rivers a "Franchis QB"? His team losses a lot and doesn't make the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 1 week of stats is meaninglessness when we have 15 more games to play. No. It's not meaningless. It's like at least 6% meaningful, unlike the preseason everyone was whining about, which was ZERO percent meaningful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 Then saying he's a backup in the NFL is a totally meaningless statement. That's a cop out. If he's a backup, by the definition of backup it means there are 32 guys who play QB better than he does. Name them. Go. No. It doesn't. That is an amateur take. It's irresponsible and it's lazy. Steve Young was a backup. Aaron Rodgers was a backup. Corner cases, yes, but everyone knew they were going to be better than most starters in the league. The definition of a backup is that they are the next in line QB for the team they're on. It has nothing to do with comparing them to other backups, or starters, across the league. But if you insist, how about this ... every team's starter is better than Tyrod Taylor except McCown, Savage, Tolzien, Bortles and Hoyer. Backups who are better than Taylor (in my opinion, of course, cupcake): Garrapalo, Watson, Trubisky, Mahomes, Kizer, McCarron and Moore. And I'll top it off with a Free Agent - Kaepernick. There's your 32+ who I would rather have start for Buffalo. I didn't even throw Peterman in there!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 No. It doesn't. That is an amateur take. It's irresponsible and it's lazy. Steve Young was a backup. Aaron Rodgers was a backup. Corner cases, yes, but everyone knew they were going to be better than most starters in the league. The definition of a backup is that they are the next in line QB for the team they're on. It has nothing to do with comparing them to other backups, or starters, across the league. But if you insist, how about this ... every team's starter is better than Tyrod Taylor except McCown, Savage, Tolzien, Bortles and Hoyer. Backups who are better than Taylor (in my opinion, of course, cupcake): Garrapalo, Watson, Trubisky, Mahomes, Kizer, McCarron and Moore. And I'll top it off with a Free Agent - Kaepernick. There's your 32+ who I would rather have start for Buffalo. I didn't even throw Peterman in there!! You probably shouldn't call other people's opinions "bush league" again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 You probably shouldn't call other people's opinions "bush league" again. I didn't, nor would I. I said it was bush league to compare Tyrod Taylor to Cam Newton. That's not an opinion. It's an action. I respect that some people, he he, think Tyrod and Newton are comparable. That's fine. But to actually throw the comparison out there ... that's what I judged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted September 12, 2017 Author Share Posted September 12, 2017 I didn't, nor would I. I said it was bush league to compare Tyrod Taylor to Cam Newton. That's not an opinion. It's an action. I respect that some people, he he, think Tyrod and Newton are comparable. That's fine. But to actually throw the comparison out there ... that's what I judged. This doesn't really make any sense at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 This doesn't really make any sense at all It's fine if people want to compare the two. The problem I have is then people try to compare them. Why is that difficult? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 I'd like any of you guys to point out all the plays that TT missed receivers that were open he should have seen and hit. Seriously. Maybe there were a lot in the second half but I just watched the whole first half in the all 22 and looked just for that and there might have been one, on the last play of the half for the Bills, and it wouldn't have made much difference. And he wasn't wide open. There was a play where he stared down Matthews way too long and then looked off him and went to the second guy and only THEN did Matthews become open. But there is no way any QB could, would or should have waited. He waited too long as it was. There was a play where a guy in the left was mostly uncovered but it was a three step drop with a four yard out to the right. Again, no reason any quarterback anywhere could be accused of missing. Arguably, on TTs best play of the game, one could say there was another guy open that he missed, but that was the play TT eluded the rush, amazingly looked downfield and then threw a dart off balance for a third and long first down over the middle to Matthews. So I find it hard to fault him for a great pass and first down. There was a play where no one was open at all forever, he was flushed out of the pocket and then halfway across the field a guy became open but there is zero way to fault any QB. He would have been benched on the spot for throwing all the way across the field against the flow. Not a chance and he didn't become open from forever. Please let me know of one play in the first half where TT legitimately missed a guy who was open and he should have seen and hit. Even the one play I am saying he might have missed was debatable. I kept waiting to see these plays and they never came. Zay Jones got zero separation the entire half. Matthews got very very little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 I'd like any of you guys to point out all the plays that TT missed receivers that were open he should have seen and hit. Seriously. Maybe there were a lot in the second half but I just watched the whole first half in the all 22 and looked just for that and there might have been one, on the last play of the half for the Bills, and it wouldn't have made much difference. And he wasn't wide open. There was a play where he stared down Matthews way too long and then looked off him and went to the second guy and only THEN did Matthews become open. But there is no way any QB could, would or should have waited. He waited too long as it was. There was a play where a guy in the left was mostly uncovered but it was a three step drop with a four yard out to the right. Again, no reason any quarterback anywhere could be accused of missing. Arguably, on TTs best play of the game, one could say there was another guy open that he missed, but that was the play TT eluded the rush, amazingly looked downfield and then threw a dart off balance for a third and long first down over the middle to Matthews. So I find it hard to fault him for a great pass and first down. There was a play where no one was open at all forever, he was flushed out of the pocket and then halfway across the field a guy became open but there is zero way to fault any QB. He would have been benched on the spot for throwing all the way across the field against the flow. Not a chance and he didn't become open from forever. Please let me know of one play in the first half where TT legitimately missed a guy who was open and he should have seen and hit. Even the one play I am saying he might have missed was debatable. I kept waiting to see these plays and they never came. Zay Jones got zero separation the entire half. Matthews got very very little. I actually think TT played pretty well on Sunday. I criticize the hell out of him (fairly), but I also give credit where it's due. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackFergy Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 Recipe ideas? (I just had to get to Page 40) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
likei've Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 (edited) I hope the Bills plan to "unleash" Taylor this week. Didn't see it last week. Has the guy ever even called an audible? Do they trust him to? Edited September 12, 2017 by likei've Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 I'd like any of you guys to point out all the plays that TT missed receivers that were open he should have seen and hit. Seriously. Maybe there were a lot in the second half but I just watched the whole first half in the all 22 and looked just for that and there might have been one, on the last play of the half for the Bills, and it wouldn't have made much difference. And he wasn't wide open. There was a play where he stared down Matthews way too long and then looked off him and went to the second guy and only THEN did Matthews become open. But there is no way any QB could, would or should have waited. He waited too long as it was. There was a play where a guy in the left was mostly uncovered but it was a three step drop with a four yard out to the right. Again, no reason any quarterback anywhere could be accused of missing. Arguably, on TTs best play of the game, one could say there was another guy open that he missed, but that was the play TT eluded the rush, amazingly looked downfield and then threw a dart off balance for a third and long first down over the middle to Matthews. So I find it hard to fault him for a great pass and first down. There was a play where no one was open at all forever, he was flushed out of the pocket and then halfway across the field a guy became open but there is zero way to fault any QB. He would have been benched on the spot for throwing all the way across the field against the flow. Not a chance and he didn't become open from forever. Please let me know of one play in the first half where TT legitimately missed a guy who was open and he should have seen and hit. Even the one play I am saying he might have missed was debatable. I kept waiting to see these plays and they never came. Zay Jones got zero separation the entire half. Matthews got very very little. There is a new angle that was just posted in another thread. The infamous "whose fault was it?" Clay or TT. It's clear now that TT had Clay for an easy TD had he thrown it to Clay as soon as he broke on the route. TT was half a second too slow on delivering that ball. Also on the very same play Zay is wide open for an easy TD throw, he was essentially right behind Clay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mead107 Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 Clay had his hands on it. Catch the damm ball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 (edited) There is a new angle that was just posted in another thread. The infamous "whose fault was it?" Clay or TT. It's clear now that TT had Clay for an easy TD had he thrown it to Clay as soon as he broke on the route. TT was half a second too slow on delivering that ball. Also on the very same play Zay is wide open for an easy TD throw, he was essentially right behind Clay I will look at it. To me, and I have seen it about eight times, it was both a kinda bad pass and a dropped ball. There is no question he could have made a better pass. And high and behind are extra hard to make. But to me there is also no question that your big dollar TE has to make that touchdown catch when it hits his hands like that. Both things can be true. I don't think you can use a play like that as an example of "missing open receivers" when the play is clearly there to be had, he looks at Clay all the way, he's open for a touchdown and it should have been a touchdown. You can blame him for not throwing a good pass, sure. But IMO you can't say that he missed a way open guy in Zay Jones. Btw, where is that link to the pass. I can't find it. Edit. Found it. Doesn't change my opinion of it. Not great pass. Still should have been caught. Edited September 12, 2017 by Kelly the Dog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 It's fine if people want to compare the two. The problem I have is then people try to compare them. Why is that difficult? I'm really trying, and I don't get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky Landing Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 It's fine if people want to compare the two. The problem I have is then people try to compare them. Why is that difficult? It's OK to have an opinion, as long as you don't express it. Did I get it right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted September 12, 2017 Share Posted September 12, 2017 It's OK to have an opinion, as long as you don't express it. Did I get it right? No, not at all. I'm a dick for a lot of reasons, but not respecting others' opinions isn't one of them. I didn't have a problem with people comparing Tyrod to Newton. I only had a problem with somebody bothering to compare the two. I'm really trying, and I don't get it. Hey ... we agreed on something in another thread. Baby steps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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