Marcell Dareus

[Juror#8]

Yes it is. Its nothing. And you cannot compare a skill position like RB to a interior line position, either.

 

Yes you can, when what you're comapring is their respective values, at their respective positions, in a 12 game span.

 

And you may have missed the point that I was making...that being that people gave up on CJ and characterized him as a "bust" halfway into the season last year. If it's not fair for one, then it's not fair for the other.

 

 

 

Very few players come into the NFL and make an impact immediately. Even less do at non-skill postions.

 

Asking a guy to go from college to being a Pro-Bowl type of NFL player in one season is asking too much.

 

Bruce Smith didnt even do that.

 

I'm not arguing your point in this respect. I'm confused as to why you think that CJ deserved different treatment. Is it because he is a RB and that is *theoretically* an easier position in the NFL to transition into? So we don't look at each person individually and their [respective] amount of NFL experience?

 

Hmmmm. Ok.

 

Either way you wanna slice it, Dareus was *probably* the best pick (long term) but he hasn't improved the defense appreciably and we're still losing games. With Green, we would have won more games immediately (with competent offensive output) and the defense would have remained bad.

 

So there ya go.

[seq004]

As much as I hate to admitt it I have to agree. I try and key on him every game and half the time he just gets pushed around and I'm not talking on double teams. For where he was picked I expected more.

[RkFast]

Yes you can, when what you're comapring is their respective values, at their respective positions, in a 12 game span.

 

And you may have missed the point that I was making...that being that people gave up on CJ and characterized him as a "bust" halfway into the season last year. If it's not fair for one, then it's not fair for the other.

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not arguing your point in this respect. I'm confused as to why you think that CJ deserved different treatment. Is it because he is a RB and that is *theoretically* an easier position in the NFL to transition into? So we don't look at each person individually and their [respective] amount of NFL experience?

 

Hmmmm. Ok.

 

Either way you wanna slice it, Dareus was *probably* the best pick (long term) but he hasn't improved the defense appreciably and we're still losing games. With Green, we would have won more games immediately (with competent offensive output) and the defense would have remained bad.

 

So there ya go.

 

 

Its this simple...most players dont come into the NFL and are game changers immediately. Not even top picks.

 

So there you go.

[Juror#8]

Its this simple...most players dont come into the NFL and are game changers immediately. Not even top picks.

 

So there you go.

 

Ok. There we went.

[BobChalmers]

As much as I hate to admitt it I have to agree. I try and key on him every game and half the time he just gets pushed around and I'm not talking on double teams. For where he was picked I expected more.

 

That maps to absolutely nothing I've seen.

 

He's at NT and is getting doubled every time I look for him.

 

The few time he isn't I see him winning.

[PDaDdy]

Well, as long as we are whipping the dogs on this team it brings me to ask all Buffalo Bills fans an honest question. Has Marcell Dareus lived up to your expectations this year? I will answer it with a NO. I sure expected him to be way more dominate on the D line for us. He showed some flashes in a game or two and that's been about it. I thought he was going to be that run stopper up the middle for us and I just haven't seen it yet. Our defense seems like it's worse than years past. WTF!

 

Flame away!

 

Dareus doesn't hold the edge in the rushing game and unless they try to run straight up the middle to either side of the center I don't know that it is really his job to overcome double teams and make the tackles others should be making.

 

Let's not forget that he is playing out of position and was supposed to be the new kid on the line as an addition to Kyle Williams and Shawn "Good Gamble" Merriman.

[C.Biscuit97]

He's been our best defensive linemen and is emerging as a leader. Miller had the benefit of playing a position that allows for more glory and has a pro bowl rusher on the other side.

 

I truly believe when we get a healthy Kyle Williams back, Dareus will flat out dominate. Williams was never healthy this year.

[PDaDdy]

He's been our best defensive linemen and is emerging as a leader. Miller had the benefit of playing a position that allows for more glory and has a pro bowl rusher on the other side.

 

I truly believe when we get a healthy Kyle Williams back, Dareus will flat out dominate. Williams was never healthy this year.

 

At least somebody is paying attention. We need to stop this bashing of the good players. Seriously. These boards are so screwed up it's ridiculous. We complain about the good players and try to run them out of town. These idiots that say probowls mean nothing and get rid of guy X because he wants fair market value for his talents.

 

Worry about our weaknesses. How could we have spent SO many picks on our secondary in the last 8 years and it SUCKS!!!! Many of those picks were first rounders. How come we don't have great pass blockers on the o-line. Why did we trade one of two established WRs at the beginning of the year when we planned on running 4 and 5 WR sets? Why for the love of god can't we get a guy that can rush the passer? (Oh wait...forget we released him and he is with the Jets now).

 

These are the questions that need to be asked and much more importantly ANSWERED!!!

Edited December 6, 2011 by PDaDdy

[Stl Bills]

Hes ten games into his NFL career.

 

You expected him to parachute into the NFL and play like Justin Tuck right off the bat?

When he's the 3rd overall pick? Kind of. Aldon Smith is doing it.

[Swift Sylvan]

This is ridiculous. Football is a team game. Dareus is a rookie DT on a team where no one around him can capitalize on his playing. Dareus is good enough to be a dominant player and to be one of the key players for an outstanding defense. We haven't given him the talent around him to play off of his contribution.

 

This isn't madden where one player can dominate for an entire defense. Dareus has become target #1 with KW out for opposing offenses, therefore he is our best player on the DL.

 

We're trying to measure the success of a player without giving him a chance to actually succeed. This is why players like Justin Bannan, Ron Edwards, Jim Leonhard, and others can be average at best here and yet play vital roles on other teams. For the last 7 years our team has not given the players the talent and schemes to be successful.

[Just in Atlanta]

Judging by what? Sacks? Then, no, he doesn't have it.

 

But I don't think we have the film to truly see how the guy is playing. He seems to be getting penetration on the occasions the camera is focused on the line, but I also don't see him involved with a lot of tackles. He also seems to be getting double-teamed a lot.

 

The point is, I think we fans sometimes rush to judgment based on spotty evidence or sometimes-superficial stats. I also think that if this team actually drafts/signs an impact player or two for the Front 7 to ease his load, we won't be asking this question.

 

Us 20 and 30 somethings should listen to the old dogs on this board who remember Bruce Smith's rookie year. Seems his situation was similar.

[Paup 1995MVP]

Why is everyone such an apologist on this board for every Bills player? Come on fellas. Sure our front seven is weak. And Carrington and Dwan Edwards stink. But what has Dareus done to improve the players around him? Not a thing. It is his rookie year, and he does need some help around him. But looking at what game HE specifically is bringing every week, (besides the Washington game) you have to be somewhat underwhelmed. He almost never disengages from the O lineman who is blocking him, and rarely gets push into the backfield.

 

I agree that it is way too early to make a complete judgment on Dareus. However, so far he does not look like a dominant game changer. And moreso than that, he does not look like he plays with any sort of edge or chippiness to him. That being said, he has noone with KW out to learn from, and that is a big problem.

 

Can everyone believe how poor our front seven is? I just can not believe that anyone can accept the Defense that Nix has put together. Other than Barnett and Dareus (and neither has played anywhere near great) none of these guys should be playing NFL football in my opinion. Just a collection of small, slow unathletic football players. Maybe it is the scheme. But week after week, no team in the league gives up as many big plays, leaves guys wide open, or gets fewer stops than this group of losers. Amazing.

[BEAST MODE BABY!]

Can anyone tell me how many yards a game rushing we're allowing this year compared to last year? Thanks.

[The Wiz]

Ok so, we are asking about his ability to play and having it in the league when pretty much we have the same defense with the exception of Marcell, Williams and Sheppard?

 

With KW out, he's getting doubled non-stop.

 

Carrington has been a nice surprise but let's be honest. We can't start saying anything about him (good or bad) until the rest of the defense is first addressed.

 

Please don't make me make a reference to Maybin; other than that.

[bouds]

We should probably cut him, or maybe we can try to trade him for a 4th.

[Maury Ballstein]

Truth is, a great player makes those AROUND HIM better. I don't think Dareus is destined for the Hall of Fame, but could anyone name me a Hall of Famer who got his golden jacket, because his supporting cast was unbelievably good?

 

 

Can we wait til year 2 of the Dareus experiment before he makes those AROUND HIM better? Geeez

[3rdand12]

It's a fair question about his performance this year.

But by his quality of character on the team, his quotes and his style of play i dont think we could have gotten a better long term starter that will be respected by all offensesin good time. He has a long way to go and is progressing each game. He has been able to stay upright and in the game.

I feel that he may be one of our best picks in a long time. long time. No need for him to get all pro bowl ands***till we actually have a playoff team.

Staying healthy, keeping your head screwed on straight and play strong to the ball will be just fine for him and us.

I know it's a Bills mantra of sorts. But really, just wait till next year!! Go Bills

[JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS]

All you haters surprise me, being an older fan I remember Bruce Smith's first year in 1985, he did about the same as Dareus. There was talk of hime being a bust, he had Fred Serlas on the nose but until Talley and Bennett were on the OLB he didn't take off either. Let him learn the pro game and get KW back before judging...

+1

 

At least he's trying, and learning. He'll get better. Stevie is as good as he will ever get.

 

We should probably cut him, or maybe we can try to trade him for a 4th.

Hey that's my line!

[stony]

Judging by what? Sacks? Then, no, he doesn't have it.

 

But I don't think we have the film to truly see how the guy is playing. He seems to be getting penetration on the occasions the camera is focused on the line, but I also don't see him involved with a lot of tackles. He also seems to be getting double-teamed a lot.

 

The point is, I think we fans sometimes rush to judgment based on spotty evidence or sometimes-superficial stats. I also think that if this team actually drafts/signs an impact player or two for the Front 7 to ease his load, we won't be asking this question.

 

Us 20 and 30 somethings should listen to the old dogs on this board who remember Bruce Smith's rookie year. Seems his situation was similar.

 

But then again it would be pretty freaking stupid to judge a NT on sacks, right?

[The Wiz]

But then again it would be pretty freaking stupid to judge a NT on sacks, right?

Well most people do judge corners and safeties on how many picks they have so who knows

[BigBuff423]

I have to disagree with the original poster: the Defense has certainly been piss-poor and under-achieving but Dareus is one of the true bright spots on this Defense thus far. His stats do NOT tell the story and the absence of Kyle Williams only exacerbates the lack of statistics but yet underscores his future value....I think Dareus had a solid Rookie season all things considered and look forward to seeing what he can do next to a health KW!! Go BILLS!!

[Bills(70)]

I think Marcell would look better if the Bills had a greyhound on the end that could rush the passer and take away the OL's attention

You mean like a Maybin?

 

I kid...I kid...

[EldaBillsFan]

You mean like a Maybin?

 

I kid...I kid...

 

No don't kid....the fans and media ran maybin out of town......look at how look it took for mario williams to be an impact player.....its about patience when building a good defensive team

[JOE IN HAMPTON ROADS]

No don't kid....the fans and media ran maybin out of town......look at how look it took for mario williams to be an impact player.....its about patience when building a good defensive team

+1

It took Bruce Smith a couple years (and Talley and Bennett on the line) to get really good.

Eventually, he dominated . . . but it took awhile.

[K-9]

No don't kid....the fans and media ran maybin out of town......look at how look it took for mario williams to be an impact player.....its about patience when building a good defensive team

 

Nobody ran Maybin out of town except Aaron Maybin. Period.

 

Gee, if we only had Maybin we'd be playoff bound.

 

Laughable.

 

GO BILLS!!!

Edited December 7, 2011 by K-9

[Observer]

No don't kid....the fans and media ran maybin out of town......look at how look it took for mario williams to be an impact player.....its about patience when building a good defensive team

 

MAybe you didn't see Aaron Maybin in Buffalo. You know what he'd be doing as a Bills player? The same thing he did for the last 3 years. If you think that by the end of his contract, Aaron Maybin would have been a good player, you're loco.

[EldaBillsFan]

Nobody ran Maybin out of town except Aaron Maybin. Period.

 

Gee, if we only had Maybin we'd be playoff bound.

 

Laughable.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

If maybin was lazy, a trouble maker, not a good teammate, didn't practice or practice hard then its would have been him.... his issue was he couldn't maintain a certain weight and the Bills knew that..... they knew he was a speed edge pass rusher.....

 

Its easy for the organization to dump a player when seemingly the whole city wants him gone because they think a 21-22! Year old is a bust! Cmon .... if everyone was patient and used him correctly we'd see the results....people were calling Spiller a bust and he only started on game, now he has 2 starts under his belt and everyone is see why he was drafted.... patience,patience,patience....so when I hear talk about Dareus and people are complaining about him its foolish

Edited December 7, 2011 by EldaBillsFan

[KD in CA]

Nice article on MD. This guy is a stud.

 

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20111203/SPORTS03/112030330/Buffalo-Bills-Marcell-Dareus?odyssey=obinsite

[K-9]

If maybin was lazy, a trouble maker, not a good teammate, didn't practice or practice hard then its would have been him.... his issue was he couldn't maintain a certain weight and the Bills knew that..... they knew he was a speed edge pass rusher.....

 

Its easy for the organization to dump a player when seemingly the whole city wants him gone because they think a 21-22! Year old is a bust! Cmon .... if everyone was patient and used him correctly we'd see the results....people were calling Spiller a bust and he only started on game, now he has 2 starts under his belt and everyone is see why he was drafted.... patience,patience,patience....so when I hear talk about Dareus and people are complaining about him its foolish

 

Like I said, Maybin ran himself off the Bills. For whatever reason.

 

Anybody who would complain about the season Dareus is having either hasn't watched him play every game and/or doesn't know a damn thing about the game. He's an explosive, disruptive force that teams have to account for that can play multiple positions along the line which affords us a ton of flexibility. Injuries to KW, SM, and Kelsay have hurt his development more than anything. He's gonna be a good one for a long time.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[JTO]

Way too early to determine with the crappy DC on Buffalos payroll. Ask me again once Edwards is fired and Kyle, Merriman (healthy) are back.

[bbb]

Can anyone tell me how many yards a game rushing we're allowing this year compared to last year? Thanks.

 

Last year = a lot. This year = a lot.

[bbb]

Nice article on MD. This guy is a stud.

 

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20111203/SPORTS03/112030330/Buffalo-Bills-Marcell-Dareus?odyssey=obinsite

 

Thanks - this seems to sum it up very well. And, what I was saying earlier is what Gailey is saying. This is not a position that you notice unless there are sacks:

 

Dareus' rookie season has been competent, but not great. There are some who have been disappointed that he hasn't been more of a dominant player on the Bills' defensive line as he has only 29 tackles, 3.5 sacks and 1 fumble recovery.

 

No one on One Bills Drive is concerned, though.

 

"The only time people notice defensive linemen is when they get sacks," Gailey said. "He's still playing extremely well, plays hard, is a major factor inside versus the run and is learning to better transition from run to pass rush, which is a hard thing to do. I think he's getting better. He's continuing to progress. I don't think he's taken a step back at all."

 

Dareus had one great game against Washington where he had 2.5 sacks. Otherwise, he's been good, he knows he has to take it up a notch, and in time he believes he will.

 

"My responsibility is to stay patient, hold my double teams, and I think I'm doing what they want me to do," he said. "You can get stats if you hustle and that's the main thing. My role is to do whatever they want me to do and I love it."

[T master]

Well, as long as we are whipping the dogs on this team it brings me to ask all Buffalo Bills fans an honest question. Has Marcell Dareus lived up to your expectations this year? I will answer it with a NO. I sure expected him to be way more dominate on the D line for us. He showed some flashes in a game or two and that's been about it. I thought he was going to be that run stopper up the middle for us and I just haven't seen it yet. Our defense seems like it's worse than years past. WTF!

 

Flame away!

 

You can't expect one player to do it all !! He was doing much better when other D coordinators didn't focus on one player which i think they have been able to do with the lose of Williams , Merriman & others on the Bills D !!!

[Bufcomments]

to the OP ...are you downplay a guy who gets double team on every play????

 

Seriously??

 

I think once Kyle comes back and Merriman (hopefully) or somebody that can get to the QB off the edge Dareus is Pro bowl worthy even next year.

[John Cocktosten]

Pro football focus lists the top DT'/3-4 DE's so far this year and the Bills very own Marcel Dareus is right up there at the top with the best of them. For all you saying that he's not looking good keep in mind that DT/NT/3-4 DE is one of the most physically demanding positions in the game and usually has one of the biggest learning curves for rookies. He's playing more games than he ever has and doesn't get a break with the occasional Alcorn St. game. If the Bills had a competent edge rusher MD's efforts would be getting noticed even more.

 

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/11/30/pass-rushing-productivity-the-story-so-far/

 

 

Hopefully Buddy gets his mind right on draft day and pulls the trigger on at least 3 or 4 OLB's/DE's who can get after the passer and are not from D2 schools.

[Fixxxer]

This is Comedy. I'm staying the hell away from this turd of a thread.

 

:thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:

 

Did I say that outloud?

 

Yes, this is unreal, but that is how interwebs work.

[ieatcrayonz]

Pro football focus lists the top DT'/3-4 DE's so far this year and the Bills very own Marcel Dareus is right up there at the top with the best of them. For all you saying that he's not looking good keep in mind that DT/NT/3-4 DE is one of the most physically demanding positions in the game and usually has one of the biggest learning curves for rookies. He's playing more games than he ever has and doesn't get a break with the occasional Alcorn St. game. If the Bills had a competent edge rusher MD's efforts would be getting noticed even more.

 

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/11/30/pass-rushing-productivity-the-story-so-far/

 

 

Hopefully Buddy gets his mind right on draft day and pulls the trigger on at least 3 or 4 OLB's/DE's who can get after the passer and are not from D2 schools.

He might even be better if Williams waited for the ink on his new contract to dry before getting "injured".

[BiggieScooby]

Watching him knock Colt McCoy out in one ordinary hit made me wonder, than I saw that ESPN Sports Science show "bad things man!"

[Fan in Chicago]

Pro football focus lists the top DT'/3-4 DE's so far this year and the Bills very own Marcel Dareus is right up there at the top with the best of them.

Hopefully Buddy gets his mind right on draft day and pulls the trigger on at least 3 or 4 OLB's/DE's who can get after the passer and are not from D2 schools.

 

Nice to see him up there in the top 10 already. I like what I see from this year's draft class so far with Dareus, Williams, Hairston, Searcy contributing in a positive way even though the latter three got their chances due to injuries. We can only hope next year's draft is equally impressive and we would be on our way

[CBD]

Dwan Edwards also makes an appearance.