Delete This Account Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 hey, PTR: hope all's well. i seem to remember something you posted a little while ago that went something like this. ---- well, well, well Posted 12 September 2011 - 12:18 AM At the risk of starting another conflagration, I really want to know what the Buffalo sports media does when they are supposedly covering the team? Maybe John Wawrow could tell us. I can understand the national media has 31 other teams to cover and the Bills have been such an afterthought that few if any would bother to take a close look at us. But how do reporters, who's job it is to cover camp and practices, talk to players and coaches, etc, be so dead wrong on this team's prospects going into the season? Seriously, if all of you are so "shocked" by what you saw, what the f**k do you do all day? I do have a theory. Things have been so bad with the Bills the last 11 years that most of the press, thinking they are being unbiased, dismiss any good signs out of hand as being a mirage. And with the head gremlin Jerry Sullivan leading the charge, all the other reporters fall in line behind him. This is the only scenario I can imagine because the Bills didn't just expose the KC Chiefs today, they exposed the Buffalo News and WGR for short-changing local sports fans. PTR --- um ... well, ah ... in retrospect ... i think your theory was, well, disproved. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Trooth Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Oh there's a lot folks eating their printed words today. And many still are in denial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 (edited) Amateur opinionists that we are, there's not a single person on this board who's ineligible for a big old batch of "I told ya so", regarding one topic or another. I realize it was an unjustified slight on the local sports media, but I don't think PTR deserves to be singled out for a 3-month old post. Go back to September and most of us look like dumbies. Edited December 5, 2011 by SageAgainstTheMachine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 I like and respect you as a poster; however, this is a big FU post. Hence, so is my reply. I'm used to posters coming here the very morning after the Bills are officially eliminated from the playoffs... yet again, and posting how right they were to say the team sucked all along. I just never figured you for one of those classless jag offs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOBILLS78 Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Oh there's a lot folks eating their printed words today. And many still are in denial. Isn't that the truth. When they were 2-0 I actually went on this board and said they could "squeak out 8 or 9 wins." I'll never learn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 jw It's hard to post about the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfreak Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 hey, PTR: hope all's well. i seem to remember something you posted a little while ago that went something like this. ---- well, well, well Posted 12 September 2011 - 12:18 AM At the risk of starting another conflagration, I really want to know what the Buffalo sports media does when they are supposedly covering the team? Maybe John Wawrow could tell us. I can understand the national media has 31 other teams to cover and the Bills have been such an afterthought that few if any would bother to take a close look at us. But how do reporters, who's job it is to cover camp and practices, talk to players and coaches, etc, be so dead wrong on this team's prospects going into the season? Seriously, if all of you are so "shocked" by what you saw, what the f**k do you do all day? I do have a theory. Things have been so bad with the Bills the last 11 years that most of the press, thinking they are being unbiased, dismiss any good signs out of hand as being a mirage. And with the head gremlin Jerry Sullivan leading the charge, all the other reporters fall in line behind him. This is the only scenario I can imagine because the Bills didn't just expose the KC Chiefs today, they exposed the Buffalo News and WGR for short-changing local sports fans. PTR --- um ... well, ah ... in retrospect ... i think your theory was, well, disproved. jw You will find that at least every other post of PTR's is all about bashing media personnel. Seems he wanted to be one but failed and can't handle the fact that others succeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Amateur opinionists that we are, there's not a single person on this board who's ineligible for a big old batch of "I told ya so", regarding one topic or another. I realize it was an unjustified slight on the local sports media, but I don't think PTR deserves to be singled out for a 3-month old post. Go back to September and most of us look like dumbies. I'm not sure about "most". A lot of people were saying 4-6 wins back then if memory serves (and getting bashed for being a negative nancy mind you). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Interesting revenge piece (although poor PTR is a fish in a barrel)---such a thread started with jw as a target would have resulted in warnings from the mods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 I'm not sure about "most". A lot of people were saying 4-6 wins back then if memory serves (and getting bashed for being a negative nancy mind you). I guess I meant late September, once the Bills were 3-0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 hey, PTR: hope all's well. i seem to remember something you posted a little while ago that went something like this. [snippage] um ... well, ah ... in retrospect ... i think your theory was, well, disproved. jw Wow. Just wow. Aren't you the guy who comes on here trashing the board periodically about posters who lack class and make (what you deem) unjustified personal attacks? Find what you bring, maybe? Chan Gailey said it best after the first several wins. As I recall it was something to the effect of, there are some who thought we'd be a bad team, and we aren't as bad as they thought. Now that we've won, some are putting us on a pedestal, and we don't belong there either. Seems about right. Me, I thought the Bills lacked depth and could not sustain many injuries esp. on OL and D. And I thought the D sucked even when we were winning. Call me delusional if you like, but I think Promo's post that you dredged up still has some relevance: I can understand the national media has 31 other teams to cover and the Bills have been such an afterthought that few if any would bother to take a close look at us. But how do reporters, who's job it is to cover camp and practices, talk to players and coaches, etc, be so dead wrong on this team's prospects going into the season? Seriously, if all of you are so "shocked" by what you saw, what the f**k do you do all day? The media seemed to totally miss on predicting the Bill's early success, and then (with the injuries mounting) most missed on reporting their slide. This isn't unique to Buffalo, though. When I travel, and have the chance to watch cable and NFL network and such, I'm amazed by how shallow and lacking in depth/solid football understanding most of the media coverage is these days. It seems one used to both love and understand the game to be a sportswriter and football pundit, now all one needs is sarcasm and the ability to look good in a suit. Coming here to crow "I told you so" the day after the Bill's playoff hopes go down for the 12th straight year doesn't seem to change that, it just seems classless. Interesting revenge piece (although poor PTR is a fish in a barrel)---such a thread started with jw as a target would have resulted in warnings from the mods. Revenge, interesting choice of words. Wawrow has seemed to have a special status as a respected member of the news media. Interesting to see how this one goes down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bouds Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 (edited) Someone struck a nerve.... I guess you served him some crow, nice job! Edited December 5, 2011 by bouds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Coming here to crow "I told you so" the day after the Bill's playoff hopes go down for the 12th straight year doesn't seem to change that, it just seems classless. And it's more than just that. I think an unwritten rule of TSW is that you don't go dredging through old posts in an attempt to humiliate a specific person. If a thread just so happens to survive for a long time, or if new information of relevance comes to light - that's one thing. But this was uncalled for, in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 I guess I meant late September, once the Bills were 3-0. Not at 3-0 for me, but I must admit that at 5-2 I was questioning my assessment of the team a bit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bowery4 Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Hey PTR has been here forever, media types come and go (BTW, this was kind of a classless post). I used t respect your work, you just took it down about 5 notches. If I was to grade the media/ like they do to the team after every game, I would think most get low scores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMadCap Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 hey, PTR: hope all's well. i seem to remember something you posted a little while ago that went something like this. ---- well, well, well Posted 12 September 2011 - 12:18 AM At the risk of starting another conflagration, I really want to know what the Buffalo sports media does when they are supposedly covering the team? Maybe John Wawrow could tell us. I can understand the national media has 31 other teams to cover and the Bills have been such an afterthought that few if any would bother to take a close look at us. But how do reporters, who's job it is to cover camp and practices, talk to players and coaches, etc, be so dead wrong on this team's prospects going into the season? Seriously, if all of you are so "shocked" by what you saw, what the f**k do you do all day? I do have a theory. Things have been so bad with the Bills the last 11 years that most of the press, thinking they are being unbiased, dismiss any good signs out of hand as being a mirage. And with the head gremlin Jerry Sullivan leading the charge, all the other reporters fall in line behind him. This is the only scenario I can imagine because the Bills didn't just expose the KC Chiefs today, they exposed the Buffalo News and WGR for short-changing local sports fans. PTR --- um ... well, ah ... in retrospect ... i think your theory was, well, disproved. jw There's nothing quite as satisfying as pointing out the shortcomings of others is there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 And it's more than just that. I think an unwritten rule of TSW is that you don't go dredging through old posts in an attempt to humiliate a specific person. If a thread just so happens to survive for a long time, or if new information of relevance comes to light - that's one thing. But this was uncalled for, in my opinion. Happens all the time. First thing I do is check to see if I'm part of the original post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 (edited) Wow, can't believe I'm going to defend PTR here, but... The Buffalo sports media isn't in much of a position to thump its chest these days. You all have been underachieving for years - maybe not you specifically JW, but certainly as a group. There is very little meaningful, serious reporting on the Bills and Sabres. No one seems willing to ask the tough questions of Ralph and his cronies, for fear of being exiled from the small circle of team insiders. Honestly, the media has lagged almost as much as the Bills have over the last 15 years or so. And to make matters worse, many of you seem extremely thin-skinned when it comes to the slightest notion of criticism. It didn't take much to drive Tim Graham away from this site, and this thread is more of the same. You know what? Do a better job, be a bit more honest and rigorous in yoru reporting, and you'll command more respect. With the time it took to sift through old posts in order to respond to some perceived slight from an anonymous internet poster from months ago, you could've written a serious article about the pervasive mismanagement that has dogged this franchise for decades. Like, the fact that they only make roster moves to sell season tickets in July and August, and seem perfectly content with a late-season nosedive because the key revenues have already been pocketed. The story practically writes itself, yet for years has been almost completely unwritten... Edited December 5, 2011 by Coach Tuesday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 (edited) I think what jw meant to imply was that the media knew all along that Fred Jackson would be on pace for 1,600 yards and a Pro Bowl nod only before getting cut down due to injury. They all knew that Kyle Williams (the agreed upon heart and soul of our defense) would be stuck on the shelf after week 6. They all knew that in spite of the talent that exists on our roster, and the heart that our players showed early on, the universe WOULD come around and bite Buffalo in its big fat a$$, like it always does. That's the media's job, right? To predict based on an intuition derived from the forces of the cosmos. TRUTH. Edited December 5, 2011 by The Big Cat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Not really sure what the point of this thread is. To crap on the optimistic fans who were excited about how the Bills started the season??? I'm naturally an optimist person. But it's time to switch. I'm just going to talk about how bad the Bills are and then come back to brag about it when they start losing. It's going to be so awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOBILLS78 Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Hey PTR has been here forever, media types come and go (BTW, this was kind of a classless post). I used t respect your work, you just took it down about 5 notches. If I was to grade the media/ like they do to the team after every game, I would think most get low scores. Please specify your reasons. I don't live in WNY, so I'm looking from afar, but it doesn't seem to me that they miss much. They might be late on some things, but that's just the nature of reporting in a Web-driven age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homey D. Clown Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 If opinions were like A--holes this place would be an airport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOBILLS78 Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Not really sure what the point of this thread is. To crap on the optimistic fans who were excited about how the Bills started the season??? I'm naturally an optimist person. But it's time to switch. I'm just going to talk about how bad the Bills are and then come back to brag about it when they start losing. It's going to be so awesome. Don't worry, you'll look like a genius the day Nickelback is inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan_in_raleigh Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Classless act by JW very immature Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SageAgainstTheMachine Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Wow, can't believe I'm going to defend PTR here, but... The Buffalo sports media isn't in much of a position to thump its chest these days. You all have been underachieving for years - maybe not you specifically JW, but certainly as a group. There is very little meaningful, serious reporting on the Bills and Sabres. No one seems willing to ask the tough questions of Ralph and his cronies, for fear of being exiled from the small circle of team insiders. Honestly, the media has lagged almost as much as the Bills have over the last 15 years or so. And to make matters worse, many of you seem extremely thin-skinned when it comes to the slightest notion of criticism. It didn't take much to drive Tim Graham away from this site, and this thread is more of the same. You know what? Do a better job, be a bit more honest and rigorous in yoru reporting, and you'll command more respect. With the time it took to sift through old posts in order to respond to some perceived slight from an anonymous internet poster from months ago, you could've written a serious article about the pervasive mismanagement that has dogged this franchise for decades. Like, the fact that they only make roster moves to sell season tickets in July and August, and seem perfectly content with a late-season nosedive because the key revenues have already been pocketed. The story practically writes itself, yet for years has been almost completely unwritten... This is a good point. In addition to following the Bills and Sabres, I'm a fan of the Yankees. During the baseball season (heck, even during the off-season) there is daily thought provoking content about the Yankees from a variety of local (NYC) sources. Most available material regarding Buffalo sports usually doesn't travel very far beyond banal fan-talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UConn James Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Amateur opinionists that we are, there's not a single person on this board who's ineligible for a big old batch of "I told ya so", regarding one topic or another. I realize it was an unjustified slight on the local sports media, but I don't think PTR deserves to be singled out for a 3-month old post. Go back to September and most of us look like dumbies. And yet, Promo does deserve to be singled out for his continual unmitigated, Polly-Anna, Utopia vision of Scrooge McDuck Ralph Wilson and Ralph's bag-men. Anybody with any sense could see that this team's concept of depth is paper-thin. As long as RW is alive and determines the general course of this team and a #1 focus on increasing the bottom line by fielding as many UDFAs as they can get away with, this will be a dead franchise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Cocktosten Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 If JW started this thread about any other poster than I would call foul. That being said, Promotional Robot has set this tone with his attacks on posters who he doesn't agree with. JW comes on this board to add OBJECTIVE INSIGHT into the Bills situation and then gets called out for his opinions. Well it turns out that he'sRIGHT so he's calling for a little redemption. Good for you JW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Thanks jw for this honor. I guess that thread really stayed with you. I am currently waiting for a connecting flight home at BWI, having attended all 3 Sabres, UB and Bills losses this weekend. I wil provide my official response once I get back. I am the first one to say people should own their words so I don't mind jw dredging this up. And I will say I am 100% unapologetic for my position. There is no question that bad news is more fun than good news when it comes to Buffalo sports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Cocktosten Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Classless act by JW very immature Classless acts breed classless acts. I am currently waiting for a connecting flight home at BWI, BWI? I had you pegged as someone who is involved in politics with your nonsensical, self important ramblings. Now it all makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBill Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 The sad realiy is that the Bills pattern of giving the fan base a glimmer of hope and then folding like a house of cards has happened again. I really wonder if we all aren't just Charlie Browns believing that Lucy will let us kick the ball this time. There can be no doubt that the Bills decade long (now going into the second one) period of "suck" starts with ownership and the front office. That is where the focus should be not on a fight between fans and the media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted December 5, 2011 Author Share Posted December 5, 2011 Thanks jw for this honor. I guess that thread really stayed with you. I am currently waiting for a connecting flight home at BWI, having attended all 3 Sabres, UB and Bills losses this weekend. I wil provide my official response once I get back. I am the first one to say people should own their words so I don't mind jw dredging this up. And I will say I am 100% unapologetic for my position. There is no question that bad news is more fun than good news when it comes to Buffalo sports. PTR: it was the vigorous bile, and anger posed in your thread -- calling us all out as being unprofessionals, lacking vision and perspective -- in which i took offense to. this is not about good news or bad news. i was actually on board with this team at 4-1. and yet, back then, there was no pleasing some on this board when anything hinting at being negative was broached. and, if i recall, you were the one leading the anti-media charge. sure, some consider this a classless act. i've been wrong. and i'll be wrong again. but to go to the extent that you did in opening this initial thread was both, in my opinion, very much overboard and classless in itself. you opened yourself up to criticism in part because you've spent much time on this board criticizing the media for being amateurish, blind and overly negative. and yet, you continue to bang this drum that bad news is good news. no it's not. i personally enjoyed covering the Sabres two runs to the Eastern Conference finals. and i had a sense of excitement when the Bills got off to their fast start and actually wondered if what i saw initially was somehow wrong. ... turns out, some of the media's intitial impressions were correct. trouble is, you'd never give the media any credit. and that's why i started this thread. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Classless acts breed classless acts. BWI? I had you pegged as someone who is involved in politics with your nonsensical, self important ramblings. Now it all makes sense. Ha ha ha! Good one! 100% wrong but hilarious nonetheless. You certainly put your reading comprehension skills on display. Read my post again. Note I said "connecting flight" meaning my trip is only half way done. Also most folks know I live in New Hampshire. After all it only says that under my avatar. But you also demonstrate the shoot first, ask questions later mindset of most of the negative posters here. It's so much easier to rattle off the old tired cliches than to analyze what's really going on. Stay classy JC. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 This is me clicking into this thread... http://gifs.gifbin.com/3204840swsw.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UConn James Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Also most folks know I live in New Hampshire. After all it only says that under my avatar.PTR No.... No, it doesn't. Or is that, like the Bills' startling lack of OL/LB depth going into the season, just my lying eyes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfreak Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 (edited) If JW started this thread about any other poster than I would call foul. That being said, Promotional Robot has set this tone with his attacks on posters who he doesn't agree with. JW comes on this board to add OBJECTIVE INSIGHT into the Bills situation and then gets called out for his opinions. Well it turns out that he'sRIGHT so he's calling for a little redemption. Good for you JW. Totally agreed. After about the second or third week this year, someone recalled a post from a couple years earlier after they signed Fitz, and called me out personally because I said I didn't think it was a great signing. They acted like Fitz was going to the Hall of Fame after two or three games and I was an idiot-who has the last laugh now? Edited December 5, 2011 by billsfreak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 Totally agreed. After about the second or third week this year, someone recalled a post from a couple years earlier after they signed Fitz, and called me out personally because I said I didn't think it was a great signing. They acted like Fitz was going to the Hall of Fame after two or three games and I was an idiot-who has the last laugh now? The Bills suck, so you win. Congrats!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 hey, PTR: hope all's well. i seem to remember something you posted a little while ago that went something like this. ---- well, well, well Posted 12 September 2011 - 12:18 AM At the risk of starting another conflagration, I really want to know what the Buffalo sports media does when they are supposedly covering the team? Maybe John Wawrow could tell us. I can understand the national media has 31 other teams to cover and the Bills have been such an afterthought that few if any would bother to take a close look at us. But how do reporters, who's job it is to cover camp and practices, talk to players and coaches, etc, be so dead wrong on this team's prospects going into the season? Seriously, if all of you are so "shocked" by what you saw, what the f**k do you do all day? I do have a theory. Things have been so bad with the Bills the last 11 years that most of the press, thinking they are being unbiased, dismiss any good signs out of hand as being a mirage. And with the head gremlin Jerry Sullivan leading the charge, all the other reporters fall in line behind him. This is the only scenario I can imagine because the Bills didn't just expose the KC Chiefs today, they exposed the Buffalo News and WGR for short-changing local sports fans. PTR --- um ... well, ah ... in retrospect ... i think your theory was, well, disproved. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 (edited) Totally agreed. After about the second or third week this year, someone recalled a post from a couple years earlier after they signed Fitz, and called me out personally because I said I didn't think it was a great signing. They acted like Fitz was going to the Hall of Fame after two or three games and I was an idiot-who has the last laugh now? The fans of every other team in the AFC east. Edited December 5, 2011 by CodeMonkey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfreak Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 The Bills suck, so you win. Congrats!! Thanks. Everyone with a brain knew the Bills sucked, the issue was Fitzputrid-but you are too busy trying to criticize people to read the post first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted December 5, 2011 Share Posted December 5, 2011 You will find that at least every other post of PTR's is all about bashing media personnel. Seems he wanted to be one but failed and can't handle the fact that others succeed. I didn't know that... explains a lot.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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