Scrappy Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Just for laughs, who would you like to see hit the curb after camp breaks (if camp breaks)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coseybedaman Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Kyle Williams and Stevie Johnson Just kidding obviously. I could do without Akin Ayodele & any tight end you would consider the starter . I want to give Maybin one more season and see if Merriman & Wannstedt can coach him up a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffalo1 Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Kelsay and Whitner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Kelsay and Whitner Winner winner chicken dinner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockinon Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Pick a right tackle that started last year. Doesn't matter which one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillnutinHouston Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Since you asked about starters, I wouldn't want to see any cut. Maybe traded - then you at least try to get some value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Hangartner, so wood and Urbik can start Andre davis.... I got my reasons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSBill Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Winner winner chicken dinner yeap! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Cut? There are a few benches for sure. Kelsay is just too lost in this system but he'd be a late cut for me once you see guys like merriman in camp. Who counts as starter at RT? Was stroud considered a starter? He'd be top 3-4 after last year. Otherwise mostly positions I'd like to seeimproved, which is a different question Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basskik11 Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Pick a right tackle that started last year. Doesn't matter which one. lol...pick any 2~! :wallbash: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
....lybob Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Not starters buy McCargo and Maybin come to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonborn10 Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Kelsay and Moorman Kelsay is obvious - even at DE he is horrible but at OLB he might even be worse than Maybin Moorman is living off hype at this point. He was awful last year and if he has a bad training camp I say it's time to go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qdawg in philly Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Pick a right tackle that started last year. Doesn't matter which one. LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bladiebla Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Out of the starters only Kelsay comes to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Edwards and Stroud, and they're already gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrappy Posted July 6, 2011 Author Share Posted July 6, 2011 Kelsay & Whitner were my first 2 thoughts as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Edwards and Stroud, and they're already gone. Stroad is but Edwards is still there... and he had a pretty good year by most accounts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanThru-N-Thru Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Corey McIntyre and Chris Kelsay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob in STL Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Just for laughs, who would you like to see hit the curb after camp breaks (if camp breaks)? We drafted tons of help on defense so cut he two weakest links in the defense last year: 1. Stroud - already gone, enter Dareus. 2. The "other ILB" next to Poz - Davis/Adeloye/ or whoever. Enter Sheppard. That does not even adequately address last years most woeful Bills linebackering corps ever, including Maybin. We need Merriman to make a comeback and then move Kelsey to backup DE where he belongs. Clear out the junk at TE and RT. We need a backup QB too. Lots of room for improvement on this roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrappy Posted July 6, 2011 Author Share Posted July 6, 2011 The Bills have some major holes to fill still & with a harder schedule, I think there is trouble coming. That's basically the premise of what I am reading here, is that a safe conclusion?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 None of them. We don't have that type of depth. If you can move someone to the bench, great Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Kelsay x2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDD Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 The Bills have some major holes to fill still & with a harder schedule, I think there is trouble coming. That's basically the premise of what I am reading here, is that a safe conclusion?? Very safe conclusion. Let's face it. The Bills roster pretty much sucks. They better not screw it up and risk not having first crack at Andrew Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justnzane Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 None of them. We don't have that type of depth. If you can move someone to the bench, great this. Also, I still don't understand the blind hatred thrown at Whitner. It wasn't his fault that Dick and Marv overreached to draft him. He is not a Polamalu, Reed, Berry, Sanders caliber player, but he also isn't Raion Hill, Keion Carpenter, Coy Wire, or Travares Tillman either. He is an average starter for an in the box scheme for a SS. He'll get a ton of tackles in run support, but he won't get you a ton of picks. It is what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbosrrgood Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 (edited) Whitner first and foremost in my mind, mistake prone, big play prone, VASTLY overrated, cocky, and money hungry. He isn't even the best player at his position on the team...bye bye...He is surely gone anyway. For the second, any of the mediocre LB's they tried starting last year..High on my list, Torbor, Ayodele. I have no real love for POZ in the 3-4 either. The only reason I say keep Kesley, is that despite his troubles in the 3-4, we have no one else that is effective in 4-3 fronts. He was very effective in those situations last year. He is not a LB and should not be asked to play as one. He isn't going anywhere anyway, recently signed to heavily incentive based contract. Those calling for Moorman to be cut are showing signs of insanity IMO. Granted last year wasn't his best, but he was still better than most other punters last year, and is almost certainly better than anyone we would replace him with. We have WAY BIGGER PROBLEMS TO DEAL WITH than to worry about one of the few players on this team that actually has proven talent. Don't forget, the special teams was awful all around, with new coaching. this. Also, I still don't understand the blind hatred thrown at Whitner. It wasn't his fault that Dick and Marv overreached to draft him. He is not a Polamalu, Reed, Berry, Sanders caliber player, but he also isn't Raion Hill, Keion Carpenter, Coy Wire, or Travares Tillman either. He is an average starter for an in the box scheme for a SS. He'll get a ton of tackles in run support, but he won't get you a ton of picks. It is what it is. I wouldn't call it blind hatred...I would call it an honest reaction to his play on the field. The guy is a safety, you cant have him "shoulder tackling" every time, which leads to MANY missed or broken tackles resulting in BIG PLAYS. Countless times I watched him go for the big hit and bounce off opposing players, only to have them keep on running. Yes, he is very aggressive, and will get ok stats for tackles, especially with our leaky run D, but that does not indicate talent or success. When he lands a big hit or tackle, great...but it's not worth all of the ones he doesn't make. Maybe even more importantly, the guy simply can't cover, especially TE's. That doesn't bode well going against a team like NE....I'd take Keion Capenter over him, and Coy Wire was drafted as and played LB his for almost his entire NFL career, not a great comparison. Edited July 6, 2011 by Turbosrrgood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DDD Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 this. Also, I still don't understand the blind hatred thrown at Whitner. It wasn't his fault that Dick and Marv overreached to draft him. He is not a Polamalu, Reed, Berry, Sanders caliber player, but he also isn't Raion Hill, Keion Carpenter, Coy Wire, or Travares Tillman either. He is an average starter for an in the box scheme for a SS. He'll get a ton of tackles in run support, but he won't get you a ton of picks. It is what it is. +1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fitz's Beard Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Stroad is but Edwards is still there... and he had a pretty good year by most accounts I think he meant the other Edwards...the one that couldn't cut it as a backup for the Jags either? The Edwards you are referring to did in fact have a decent year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrappy Posted July 6, 2011 Author Share Posted July 6, 2011 I think he meant the other Edwards...the one that couldn't cut it as a backup for the Jags either? The Edwards you are referring to did in fact have a decent year Yeah, I wouldn't get rid of our current Edwards at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsMagic1 Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 Kelsay and Whitner my first thoughts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justnzane Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 (edited) Whitner first and foremost in my mind, mistake prone, big play prone, VASTLY overrated, cocky, and money hungry. He isn't even the best player at his position on the team...bye bye...He is surely gone anyway. For the second, any of the mediocre LB's they tried starting last year..High on my list, Torbor, Ayodele. I have no real love for POZ in the 3-4 either. The only reason I say keep Kesley, is that despite his troubles in the 3-4, we have no one else that is effective in 4-3 fronts. He was very effective in those situations last year. He is not a LB and should not be asked to play as one. He isn't going anywhere anyway, recently signed to heavily incentive based contract. Those calling for Moorman to be cut are showing signs of insanity IMO. Granted last year wasn't his best, but he was still better than most other punters last year, and is almost certainly better than anyone we would replace him with. We have WAY BIGGER PROBLEMS TO DEAL WITH than to worry about one of the few players on this team that actually has proven talent. Don't forget, the special teams was awful all around, with new coaching. I wouldn't call it blind hatred...I would call it an honest reaction to his play on the field. The guy is a safety, you cant have him "shoulder tackling" every time, which leads to MANY missed or broken tackles resulting in BIG PLAYS. Countless times I watched him go for the big hit and bounce off opposing players, only to have them keep on running. Yes, he is very aggressive, and will get ok stats for tackles, especially with our leaky run D, but that does not indicate talent or success. When he lands a big hit or tackle, great...but it's not worth all of the ones he doesn't make. Maybe even more importantly, the guy simply can't cover, especially TE's. That doesn't bode well going against a team like NE....I'd take Keion Capenter over him, and Coy Wire was drafted as and played LB his for almost his entire NFL career, not a great comparison. That is a whole lot of wording for non-blind hatred. Football Outsiders actually graded whitner pretty decently against the pass as the ranked him highly for limiting YAC. That said, he has one of the weaker run support scores due to making tackles on average 8 yards down the field. This is in large part because he was about the most consistent run defender besides Kyle Williams and Dwan Edwards last year. I can agree with you that he was not the right pick, but he is far from the biggest problem on the team. As far as best players on the team I think he ranks in the mid teens, and I'd rather get rid of #52 and #53 and replace them with better talent. I would cut, McCargo as he has been utterly useless on to this regime, and I would probably get rid of the crappiest tight end on roster. EDIT from Football outsiders: http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2011/best-and-worst-run-stop-rates-2010 As you can see, the list of worst Run Stop Rates is basically all free safeties. The cornerbacks with the lowest Stop Rate (minimum 20 plays) were Brent Grimes and Stanford Routt at 30 percent. Also, if you're looking at that list, you may be surprised by just how many run tackles Donte Whitner made last year: 94. That's 25 more than any other defensive back in the league. The Buffalo front seven wasn't really doing the best job of stopping opposition runners. Whitner was fifth in the entire league in the number of Run Plays, behind only four inside linebackers (Jerod Mayo, Paul Posluszny, Stephen Tulloch, and London Fletcher). The next-highest defensive back was Antrel Rolle, who was tied for 29th. With all the Buffalo players listed on the Worst Run Stop Rate lists above, you really see what a problem run defense was for the Bills and it just makes you appreciate Kyle Williams even more. Williams led the Bills in Run Defeats (11), Run Stop Rate (77 percent), and yards per play on runs (2.1). Fourteen different players had at least 20 run tackles for Buffalo and Marcus Stroud was the only other one with a Run Stop Rate above 70 percent (just barely, at 70.5 percent) while Spencer Johnson (2.8) was the only other one to make his average run tackle within three yards of the line of scrimmage. Edited July 6, 2011 by justnzane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 I think he meant the other Edwards...the one that couldn't cut it as a backup for the Jags either? The Edwards you are referring to did in fact have a decent year Wow I totally forgot about that guy haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrappy Posted July 6, 2011 Author Share Posted July 6, 2011 That is a whole lot of wording for non-blind hatred. Football Outsiders actually graded whitner pretty decently against the pass as the ranked him highly for limiting YAC. That said, he has one of the weaker run support scores due to making tackles on average 8 yards down the field. This is in large part because he was about the most consistent run defender besides Kyle Williams and Dwan Edwards last year. I can agree with you that he was not the right pick, but he is far from the biggest problem on the team. As far as best players on the team I think he ranks in the mid teens, and I'd rather get rid of #52 and #53 and replace them with better talent. I would cut, McCargo as he has been utterly useless on to this regime, and I would probably get rid of the crappiest tight end on roster. That's a pick em option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Vader Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 I can only think of one starter I would get rid of and that's Andra Davis. For a player who has experience in the 3-4 scheme, he showed me nothing. I'd rather keep Ayodele & Torbor, at least they made plays. The only other player I'd consider cutting would be Donte Whitner. My biggest issue with Whitner is how consistently he gets beaten by Tight Ends in pass coverage. Aside from that he is an above average safety, and I would'nt mind if the Bills kept him. But, if he demands to be paid like Polamalu, then forget it. he is not worth breaking the bank for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPCinSYR..NY Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 how about coach's and then it would still be edwards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrappy Posted July 7, 2011 Author Share Posted July 7, 2011 how about coach's and then it would still be edwards Wink, I'd like to go off the board for $50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyC81 Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Very safe conclusion. Let's face it. The Bills roster pretty much sucks. They better not screw it up and risk not having first crack at Andrew Luck. I can see the "let's tank the last X # of games" posts formulating already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justnzane Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 That's a pick em option. yep essentially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 this. Also, I still don't understand the blind hatred thrown at Whitner. It wasn't his fault that Dick and Marv overreached to draft him. He is not a Polamalu, Reed, Berry, Sanders caliber player, but he also isn't Raion Hill, Keion Carpenter, Coy Wire, or Travares Tillman either. He is an average starter for an in the box scheme for a SS. He'll get a ton of tackles in run support, but he won't get you a ton of picks. It is what it is. I'd cut the DC and OC and hire some people that know what they are doing. If ya cut Donte then who will make up the tackles for DL and LB's when they are caught out of position and wiff on their tackles?......Ahh wth, let them score and maybe the first thing I said will happen. I don't think Kelsay makes a bad DE, just a bad OLB..... so this whole thought of drafting for the 3-4 and then taking 4 D linemen in Nix's first year makes no sense to me. Then he drafts only 2 LB's this draft a 3rd and a 6th. I sure hope Kelvin Sheppard can become a starter and make an impact this year. It would be nice to finally have someone start that Nix drafted... besides of course da beast, MD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defend Greece Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 (edited) 1. Kelsay as a linebacker 2. Kelsay as a defensive lineman And all the kelsay lovers who keep saying he isn't that bad.... HE IS!! How many times are you going to be happy with teams running by him and 4-5 sacks a year Edited July 7, 2011 by Defend Greece Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted July 7, 2011 Share Posted July 7, 2011 Wow I totally forgot about that guy haha But… but… you're Captain Hindsight! Your super strengths are supposed to include retrospective infallibility AND a perfect memory… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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