Magox

I don't want to get too down on the kid for his reactions but this is not some sort of action of his that is in a vacuum. There is a pattern of smugness to him and I believe that absolutely played a role in the reputation that Rosen has fairly or unfairly earned. If Allen hadn't been such a polarizing prospect because of the debate on who we should have drafted he'd be a kid that the Bills fan base would love. Hard working, blue collar and very intelligent player who is going to engulf himself to the Bills fan base. Which is something that I have a hard time believing that Rosen would have been. I could be wrong but that is my sense of things.

I have complete faith that this team, especially on the defensive side of the ball will be able to coach him up to realize his full potential. It's just a matter of whether or not the kid is hungry to learn because if he does, he will not only be a probowler but a generational ALL PRO talent that will lead this defense over the next decade.

Not sure if this was posted or not but a good balanced take on Edmunds. The short of it, he's got work to do but with the proper molding he could be a generational ALL PRO talent.

Why post here when they are in just about every other thread?

In regards to the injury history, I do think there was considerably more evidence pointing to Rosen being more of an injury risk than Allen. Obviously that may change but the body of work that is out there and considering their styles of play and their stature, strength, mobility and escapability point to Allen being able to avoid more injuries than Rosen. That's my opinion. In regards to Allen's ceiling and floor, the opinion that he is a high ceiling guy is well-documented but I believe there is a misnomer in regards to his floor. We keep hearing Boom or Bust and that may be the case but I disagree with that characterization. I happen to believe that his floor is much higher than popular belief. I think he's got the ability to be more accurate than the reputation that precedes him and I believe he has got a very Roethlisbergeresque sort of an ability to extend plays and throw it on the run and outside of the pocket. The kid is dynamite throwing the ball on the run and he likes to attack deep much like Roethlisberger. I think he's going to be a very exciting prospect for us when the play breaks down.

No where did he say "case closed" or even imply such a thing. As a matter of fact he said: "Some info to worry less" about his accuracy issues. That is in stark contrast to your overreaction to what he posted. He merely posted a data point which of course isn't all-encompassing but a data point none the less to show you that some QB's do indeed improve with their accuracy.

Explain to me what my "side" was. I'd rather see that than what you posted.

I want to preface these series of thoughts with the fact that I was hoping for Rosen over Allen. With that said one of the common gripes that I am hearing from some of our fans on this board is that Josh Allen is the bigger risk for this franchise than Rosen. The argument goes something along the lines that Rosen is the best pure passer, the most NFL ready therefore he's close to a sure thing. Whereas Allen is the big armed QB who is inaccurate similar to EJ Manuel and he's got Bust written all over him. On the surface this argument makes sense. However, there are huge gaping holes with this argument. A) One of the big things that people talked about including lots of whispers from NFL personnel is that Rosen was not a leader of men. Some questioned his demeanor and whether or not his heart was fully in the game. I don't know whether or not that stuff is true or not but it was definitely out there. I will say this, the little that I observed of him I definitely saw a smugness about him. Does that matter? I don't know. But it was certainly palpable and if I saw that after a few interviews then I'm certain that this reputation was observed by many others as well. The fact that his ex coach Mora could not give him a full-throated endorsement and even picked his in-state rival as being the QB who should be picked first to me screams of a red flag. Sure, Mora tried backtracking some and equivocating why he said that, but the bottom line is that he didn't feel the urge to gush about the player he coached. B) His injury concerns. Will he be a Bradford sort of player? I think that is a fair question. He's had a couple concussions and I believe a shoulder injury that kept him out for some time. He's not the most mobile QB, tends to hold on to the ball too long sometimes because he's a QB that likes to try to make plays but if you are in the NFL and you don't have great protection and you hold on to the ball too long and you are prone to some injuries, it's stands to reason to believe he could be an injury prone QB in this league. That is a risk. Allen on the other hand is a big hulking QB that can not only shake off arm tackles but he's very mobile and makes amazing throws on the run. Considering the offensive line we have, this is probably a better fit than Rosen is essentially just a pocket passer. While Allen has his shortcomings primarily in the accuracy department, it is an overblown charge that people make and it is without doubt in many cases an on-the-surface observation primarily to the famed 56% completion rate. There certainly is some there there. But a few things you have to keep in mind. A) This was a down-the-field sort of throwing offense which is more susceptible to producing higher incompletion rates B) His offensive line was very weak and he was constantly under duress. C) His WR's were very poor and they weren't able to get a lot of separation. His intermediate and long range passing is really good, where he struggles are his short passes. That is something that will have to be worked on and to me that is more a matter of setting his feet/mechanics and from what I've been reading it is something that he has worked on and improved, as evidenced in the Senior bowl game. He was the best performing QB that attended this year. The guy is also an anticipation thrower that can hit receivers in small windows. He's also a very intelligent guy and hard worker and a leader or men. Where he needs some work on the mental aspect are his progressions which of course is a very important element. To me, this is his biggest risk into becoming a franchise QB. While they both have their risks, it is a fallacy from my point of view to believe that Allen is the bigger risk considering that Rosen may have troubles leading his teammates and his injury risks. There is a reason why not only was the whisper campaign in NFL evaluator/GM circles in full effect to "stay away" from Rosen and the fact that teams in need of QB's early on decided to forgo him, not to mention that most mocks had Allen being selected over Rosen. It's not because he doesn't have the talent, it's because of these other concerns. Rosen could very well end up being the better QB, but the risks are there and they are reasonably undeniable. Again, this is not so much an argument of who is going to be the better QB it's to address the fallacy that Allen is the bigger risk.

Again, all the teams I mentioned passed on him. And the Dolphins clearly didn't like him enough to secure him. If a GM thinks there is a franchise qb to be had and they just sit and wait hoping he falls to your pick then it means one of three things A) you didn't have the draft capital to get him, which clearly wasn't the case here. B) the GM is incompetent for deploying hope as a strategy to get their franchise QB C) they didn't believe in him enough to secure him. Which is the most likely scenario

Considering that the Browns, Jets, Broncos, Bills passed up on him and that the Dolphins could have easily secured Rosen and they all passed on him, I suppose you could say that it wasn't just a Billsy sort of thing to do but an actual decision making GM sort of thing

You're getting there.

He understands football just fine. That's not the reasoned argument against him.

And for about an additional 20 million in cap space. But I get the frustration, Sammy was the best wide receiving decoy this franchise had ever seen.

His tweets that are allegedly racist from the race baiting peanut gallery were in reference to a song. Quoting lyrics

Bill, I think most of the hate comes from the fact that the stigma that follows him is one of an inaccurate passer, primarily because of his 56% passer rating. I think in some fans minds shades of EJ Manuel come to mind. To be honest with you alot of this is on-the-surface analysis because the fact is he played in a system that relied on the long ball (which he has a beautiful deep ball) that naturally will net a lower completion %, he had a bad line that didn't give a lot of time to throw the ball and awful receivers who couldn't separate. When you actually see the video of some of his games, you see that the label of being a woefully inaccurate passer simply aren't true. Yes, he does have some accuracy issues but not nearly as pronounced as what his reputation would have you believe. The kid makes unbelievable throws in right windows and on the run. He's also am anticipation thrower, something we haven't had in a long while. He's a hard worker and he is very bright. I don't believe he will be a bust and i happen to think his floor is much higher than most.

No

Oh no! You just triggered some of our fans because you said "he does have strong arm for outside winter ball".

Considering that Beane got the QB he wanted and very likely the LB as well, I'd give it an A. I guarantee you that they are feeling damn good about the events that took place this night.

Yes, but considering that Mayfield and Darnold were out of the question going into tonight, they got their guy. Plus if you read into what Beane has been saying for a while now, Allen was his prototypical QB that he's been wanting. Depends on how bad he plays, how bad the team plays and if he is able to draft another QB that he is able to hit on. As of right now, Beane has been looking good with many of the moves he's made. The thought that his job is in danger is a thought that goes through the minds of the nincompoops of this board.

Seeing those videos of Allen in that article from his career and the Senior Bowl definitely has me excited about the possibilities of what could be. Very impressive.

Not quite but something along these lines. I do think they see similarities in those players but Kuechly is the QB of that defense and Edmunds I think won't play that role. Edmunds I do believe will be a very dynamic football player on the defensive side of the ball though. His size and speed will allow McD to use him to match up against TE's. He'll probably be used to rush the passer at times and I believe he's going to be a sideline to sideline player that will be able to chase down his opponents. He's going to be multi purpose and has a good chance at being our best defender on our team after a few years. He's got it all. Allen, we'll just have to see. I know he's worked a lot on his footwork and you've heard it from a few "experts" that he's looked better. We all know his intangibles, they are off-the-charts. He's mobile, big with one of the strongest arms we've ever seen. I can see him breaking lots of arm tackles in the pocket, shrugging them off and extending plays. Bandit did a really good write up on him and after watching a lot more of the videos of Allen, I definitely came away a lot more impressed. I even said coming in to the draft that I was warming up to him and definitely see where the intrigue will be. I do believe Allen will be a starting caliber QB in this league, and I know he has the qualities to be a franchise QB, I just don't know whether he will be or not. Personally I was hoping for Rosen but I'm ok with Allen.

Exactly! This is who they wanted, this was their guy. They didn't get the consolation prize and settled on their pick. They went, traded up and got their guy. This argument is almost, not quite as silly as Beane's main criteria for selecting Allen because he can throw in the snow. Our fans on this board are a bunch of nincompoops.

It's going to happen and it's going to be the same nincompoops that are hooting and hollering over Beane's "weather" reference.

For those of you who believe that Beane primarily chose Allen because he is used to playing in the snow and bad weather, you are a bunch of idiots. They aren't going to put this much thought process because he has experience and the tools to play in this sort of weather. They chose him because they thought he was the best QB overall that was available for them. They clearly had Allen as either their #2 or #3 guy, they targeted him. They chose him above Rosen. Whether he turns out to be better or not is a whole another question but the fact is they thought he was the best guy for them. The weather is just a bunch of histrionics you little turds are using to justify your anger.

It's the same putzes over and over. Get used to it