Bills Don't have Receiver Problem, they have a perception problem-- Jim Kubiak BN

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, SCBills said:

Shakir - Good slot, but not elite 

 

Palmer - WR3, with potential to be a WR2

 

Keon - Maybe the worst starting WR in the NFL

 

Samuel - Can’t stay healthy, WR3/4 when healthy, expensive 

 

Moore - WR4/5 

 

Shavers - WR6

 

Kincaid - Big Slot as a TE, can’t stay healthy, OC doesn’t use him when he is

 

Knox - Good TE2, massive cap hit 

 

Hawes - Should be the TE2 on a team that doesn’t misappropriate assets 

 

Three good receiving backs - Don’t use them as such, when we do it’s the same concepts from last year that teams have film in and have shut down 

 

Did I miss anything? 

i mean...this was the plan as far as the offense goes. it doesn't look the way it does by accident

 

but i also don't understand people who think there's some untapped potential there. it's honestly one of the worst pass catching groups i can recall 

[Comebackkid]

6 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

who has a worse pass catching group than us?

 

just the browns, right?

who knows because the scheme sux.      its not like ne has world beater wr's   but maye is accruate and gets the ball out quick and they 

are coached fairly well.  

when miami was on fire the first year and put 70 on denver.    we had lost our previous 2 games and looked like ass.   

then we come out and put 50 on miami...with the same players...   schemes matter...coaching matters.  

[LabattBlue]

15 minutes ago, RunTheBall said:

I seriously believe all we are missing is a consistent intermediate passing game in the 15-30 range. 

All we are missing? Not to mention terrible safety play, two injury prone lb’s, and a rookie cb who missed all of training camp, yet needs to play due to no other options. 

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, Comebackkid said:

who knows because the scheme sux.      its not like ne has world beater wr's   but maye is accruate and gets the ball out quick and they 

are coached fairly well.  

when miami was on fire the first year and put 70 on denver.    we had lost our previous 2 games and looked like ass.   

then we come out and put 50 on miami...with the same players...   schemes matter...coaching matters.  

are we throwing the ball at the lowest rate in the league simply because the 'scheme sucks' or maybe that was the plan all along?

 

did we just magically appear w a bunch of really average pass catchers or is that maybe a byproduct of the design?

[HappyDays]

2 hours ago, BullBuchanan said:

Who was the most important player for the Philly offense last year?

 

AJ Brown. Jordan Mailata a close 2nd.

[Scott7975]

29 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

Why are you throwing 15-20 yards down the field?

If you're rushing for 5+ yards a carry, there's absolutely no reason to take high risk plays mailing the ball down the field. Tom Brady won a lot of Super Bowls using guys like Julian Edelman the way the Bills use Shakir.

 

Because no offense is going anywhere being 1 dimensional all the time. Eventually you are going to run into games that Cook is not getting 5 yards per carry. There is absolutely a reason to throw 15-20 yards down the field. Because it makes a defense defend the whole field and opens up the shorter stuff. It's very difficult to dink and dunk all game long and sustaining long ass drives. Also, Josh is not the precision passer that Brady was. It's not what makes him special.

Tom Brady threw the ball all over the field.

[SCBills]

4 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

All we are missing? Not to mention terrible safety play, two injury prone lb’s, and a rookie cb who missed all of training camp, yet needs to play due to no other options. 

Hancock and Bishop have potential. 
 

We have 4 LB’s that are starting quality.  Rotation them if need be.  Shaq, TB, Milano and Dorian don’t concern me right now. 
 

Hairston was always the answer.  Now we’ll see if he’s the right answer.  He has  over half the season to show us if he is.  You don’t draft a CB in RD1, opposite a CB you just paid and then freak out about the position .. at least not yet.  Let’s hope we never have to. 
 

WR by a mile helps this team and then maybe a DT, depending on the timelines for Jones and Sanders. 
 

CB depth, dependent upon on Strong. 
 

Hard to know when we have zero knowledge of timelines for the injured guys outside Oliver. 

[RyanC883]

3 hours ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

No, Jim. We indeed have a receiver problem. No one can get open, which also forces us to turn to the run. I fear that soon that will lead to a RB problem  because Cook is taking a lot of hits and we have no capable RB behind him to take some of the early season wear and tear off.

 

We are one dimensional with the most gifted QB on Earth. It's like taking the tires off a Ferrari and replacing them with sandbags.

 

keeping the Ferrari in the garage because you've refused to get it gas, and driving a Pinto because it's still getting you from point A to B.  Well, as you stated, that Pinto will wear out at some point.  And then the Ferrari is still stuck in the garage.  

[Casey D]

25 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Did not say they did. 

 

And the Bills have done more in the playoffs than Lewis. True. There are the same number of Lombardi's in our case as the Bengals to show for it. Also true.

Yep.  Just not sure why you cite Bengals as somehow have achieved more as an organization.  But ces't le vie. 🙂

[CincyBillsFan]

10 minutes ago, Buffalo4Life01 said:

Why are you so averse at saying Allen sucked?  Would you say he simply 'under performed' in the Texans game last year or would you agree he really, really sucked in that game?  For what it's worth, I don't think Allen has sucked for a full game this year.  But I think he certainly has sucked at times, including the great majority of the first half of the Panthers game.  Just dreadful and missing open receivers.  But as he normally tends to do, he bounced back in the 2nd half and played quite a bit better.  Hopefully he puts together two good halves of football this Sunday, something he has not done in over a month. 

First, I am adverse to saying Allen sucked this season because it would be inaccurate. When you say someone "sucked" it means they were awful for the game.  Last season Allen sucked against Houston - the only game you could claim he did.  Two years ago Allen sucked against the Jets in the opener.  But having seen what "sucked" looks like from a QB I can say that Allen has not sucked this season.

 

Second, I give Allen the benefit of the doubt because he has been elite for the last 5 seasons.  I'm not big on "what have you done for me lately".  After all ingrates are among the worst kinds of people.  

 

Third, I don't break up games into Allen "sucked" in the first half but was great in the 2nd half.  That is silly and in it's logical extreme you would be saying that Allen sucked on that pass but not on the next one.  If you asked me abut Mahomes on Monday night I would say that he played great after struggling in the 1st half.  So yea Allen struggled in the 1st half against Carolina but played very well in the 2nd half.

 

My question to you is why are some of you so quick to characterize Allen s sucking when he struggles or under performs?  

 

 

[SectionC3]

20 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Shakir - Good slot, but not elite 

 

Palmer - WR3, with potential to be a WR2

 

Keon - Maybe the worst starting WR in the NFL

 

Samuel - Can’t stay healthy, WR3/4 when healthy, expensive 

 

Moore - WR4/5 

 

Shavers - WR6

 

Kincaid - Big Slot as a TE, can’t stay healthy, OC doesn’t use him when he is

 

Knox - Good TE2, massive cap hit 

 

Hawes - Should be the TE2 on a team that doesn’t misappropriate assets 

 

Three good receiving backs - Don’t use them as such, when we do it’s the same concepts from last year that teams have film in and have shut down 

 

Did I miss anything? 

Not one single thing I disagree with.  I hope we come into KC w a creative game plan.  The Daboll rope a dope from 2021 was one of the best I’ve ever seen.  

[Comebackkid]

11 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

are we throwing the ball at the lowest rate in the league simply because the 'scheme sucks' or maybe that was the plan all along?

 

did we just magically appear w a bunch of really average pass catchers or is that maybe a byproduct of the design?

Dabolls last year was throwing the ball every single down.   dont even run.    I can see mcD wanting some balance because 

Ds were adjusting and it wasnt working out.

 

Then Dorsey came in with no clue what he was doing and there was no balance there either.

 

so then Brady comes in with the mind set that we need control...we need to run the ball.

 

only now its just a reversal of extremes.

 

so yeah i think to some extent its by design, but i think the design is more how brady is calling the offense.

 

If we could run and throw all over the field No One is going to complain about it.

 

So yeah a lot of it now is also scheme...I think its more by design though than intent. 

 

by that i mean that we wanted to design, create a running offense but we didnt intend to killl the passing game. 

 

[Stads]

I think they might have a receiver problem

[Comebackkid]

15 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Because no offense is going anywhere being 1 dimensional all the time. Eventually you are going to run into games that Cook is not getting 5 yards per carry. There is absolutely a reason to throw 15-20 yards down the field. Because it makes a defense defend the whole field and opens up the shorter stuff. It's very difficult to dink and dunk all game long and sustaining long ass drives. Also, Josh is not the precision passer that Brady was. It's not what makes him special.

Tom Brady threw the ball all over the field.

Brady excelled at knowing what was goin on all over the field at any given moment...if u made a mistake he took advantage..

he was very good at biding his time and picking his shots...   but he definately took them.   

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, Comebackkid said:

Dabolls last year was throwing the ball every single down.   dont even run.    I can see mcD wanting some balance because 

Ds were adjusting and it wasnt working out.

 

Then Dorsey came in with no clue what he was doing and there was no balance there either.

 

so then Brady comes in with the mind set that we need control...we need to run the ball.

 

only now its just a reversal of extremes.

 

so yeah i think to some extent its by design, but i think the design is more how brady is calling the offense.

 

If we could run and throw all over the field No One is going to complain about it.

 

So yeah a lot of it now is also scheme...I think its more by design though than intent. 

 

by that i mean that we wanted to design, create a running offense but we didnt intend to killl the passing game. 

 

killing the passing game as a byproduct of creating a running offense is what happens when you give the task to a bunch of mediocre offensive minds 

[LabattBlue]

14 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Hancock and Bishop have potential. 
 

We have 4 LB’s that are starting quality.  Rotation them if need be.  Shaq, TB, Milano and Dorian don’t concern me right now. 
 

Hairston was always the answer.  Now we’ll see if he’s the right answer.  He has  over half the season to show us if he is.  You don’t draft a CB in RD1, opposite a CB you just paid and then freak out about the position .. at least not yet.  Let’s hope we never have to. 
 

WR by a mile helps this team and then maybe a DT, depending on the timelines for Jones and Sanders. 
 

CB depth, dependent upon on Strong. 
 

Hard to know when we have zero knowledge of timelines for the injured guys outside Oliver. 

The post made it seem like the only thing missing from the Bills winning a SB was a WR who can open up the intermediate passing game.  My response…do you think this is a defense that can get the Bills to a SB, let alone win it?

Edited 3 hours ago by LabattBlue

[Buffalo4Life01]

2 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

First, I am adverse to saying Allen sucked this season because it would be inaccurate. When you say someone "sucked" it means they were awful for the game.  Last season Allen sucked against Houston - the only game you could claim he did.  Two years ago Allen sucked against the Jets in the opener.  But having seen what "sucked" looks like from a QB I can say that Allen has not sucked this season.

 

Second, I give Allen the benefit of the doubt because he has been elite for the last 5 seasons.  I'm not big on "what have you done for me lately".  After all ingrates are among the worst kinds of people.  

 

Third, I don't break up games into Allen "sucked" in the first half but was great in the 2nd half.  That is silly and in it's logical extreme you would be saying that Allen sucked on that pass but not on the next one.  If you asked me abut Mahomes on Monday night I would say that he played great after struggling in the 1st half.  So yea Allen struggled in the 1st half against Carolina but played very well in the 2nd half.

 

My question to you is why are some of you so quick to characterize Allen s sucking when he struggles or under performs?  

 

 

Who said Allen sucked in the 1st half and was great in the 2nd half?  No one that I know of.  I said he sucked in the 1st half but played quite a bit better in the 2nd half.  It's just shocking to me the number of people who fail to admit Allen IS currently part of the problem.  Regardless of the surrounding circumstances, he isn't playing good football right now and I'm quite sure he'd admit that behind closed doors as well.  

 

To answer your question, It's become comical that almost no one has the stones to ever say a bad thing about Allen.  No way can the all mighty Josh Allen play poorly without it having to do with other circumstances.  It's just crazy to me.  I've talked to fans of other teams who have noticed that it's almost an unspoken rule, you aren't allowed to criticize Allen in the media or in public.  He hasn't played good football this season. He IS NOT the biggest part of the problem but he IS a part of it.  He isn't seeing the field well, he's bailing clean pockets far too quickly, and he has regressed with this footwork.  Again, I'm sure he would admit that behind closed doors as well.  He has proven that he is good enough to bounce back from this type of funk as he has done so many times in the past.  I expect him to show up and play better Sunday.  

[Comebackkid]

Just now, GoBills808 said:

killing the passing game as a byproduct of creating a running offense is what happens when you give the task to a bunch of mediocre offensive minds 

dont disagree.

 

never understood giving a superbowl team rookie coaches.   

[colin]

we have bad WRs, but great RBs and TEs.  the solution is to put our best people on the field and be balanced running and passing.  it just so happens our QB and RB are two of the best runners at their position in the NFL, and our OL is a run blocking machine.  allen looked uncomfortable vs carolina because he is uncomfortable playing under center.  he is also a better qb playing under center.  who cares if he's uncomfortable?  let's just put up 40 points and embarrass opponents.

[BuffaloBillyG]

16 minutes ago, Casey D said:

Yep.  Just not sure why you cite Bengals as somehow have achieved more as an organization.  But ces't le vie. 🙂

Based on at the very least getting past KC in the playoffs  and getting to play for the Lombardi once is achieving more than being Andy Reid's personal Washington Generals come playoff time.