Bills sign Jordan Poyer (to PS)

[Delete_Delete_Delete]

1 minute ago, syhuang said:

 

Well… that’s certainly A choice of words…

[djp14150]

5 hours ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

This is so dumb.  He is cooked

Maybe to coach the DBs?

[TheBrownBear]

5 minutes ago, Delete_Delete_Delete said:

Well… that’s certainly A choice of words…

Who amongst us isn't excited by the idea of pouring ourselves into other guys?

[djp14150]

1 hour ago, eee1776 said:

Is George Wilson available? Anyway Folks keep saying to mentor the young players on Defense. Isn't that why we have coaches?

Sometimes young players listed to former players they can relate to, not their grandpa.

[TheBrownBear]

21 minutes ago, chris heff said:

Is a wife that doesn’t speak actually an option?

Have you seen the movie Companion?

[Shaw66]

1 hour ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Yup, he chooses his scheme over playmakers.  And you wonder why we never sniff a SB.

Yes. Every season, McDermott takes another run at proving this point. 

 

I didn't watch Poyer at all last season, but so many people around here say that he simply no longer could compete physically. Assuming that's true, then Poyer is the best example ever. Cam Lewis, Levi Wallace, Dane Jackson, Klein - there's a long list of excellent scheme players with limited athleticism who were on the field ahead of better athletes.  

[Prospector]

16 minutes ago, TheBrownBear said:

Who amongst us isn't excited by the idea of pouring ourselves into other guys?

Poyer is always well groomed, so maybe he wants to groom the young guys too

[That's No Moon]

2 hours ago, JGMcD2 said:

This is so disingenuous, and you know it. Teams are allowed to carry 6 veterans.

Looking back to 2020, when practice squads expanded to 16 players, the Bills have actually been better than most at developing practice squad talent. Even then we’re talking about just five players making and sticking on the 53-man roster in that span. It’s not costing anyone a spot.

It's costing the Bills a slot they could use on a veteran that they could keep up to speed to plug in if needed.

[hondo in seattle]

I'm with the folks who don't get the negativity.  The naysayers tell us that Poyer is "washed."  Yet, Poyer played 90.6% of the defensive snaps with the Fins last season.  Apparently, as bad as he might have been, he was better than their other safeties.  PFF ranked Poyer 97th of 171 safeties who played enough snaps to qualify.  In other words, of the safeties who suited up and played, Poyer was roughly average.  In short, he's not godawful horrible.

 

Plus, he was signed to the practice squad.  Assuming no catastrophic injuries to our safeties, he's not going to see the game field very much.  Instead, his teammates will see him on the practice field, in meeting rooms, and in the locker room where he will be a positive addition.   Especially because he's a true believer in The Process, knows McD's system inside out, and has more NFL experience than our top four safeties combined.  

 

Edited August 27 by hondo in seattle

[Beck Water]

22 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

Yes. Every season, McDermott takes another run at proving this point. 

 

I didn't watch Poyer at all last season, but so many people around here say that he simply no longer could compete physically. Assuming that's true, then Poyer is the best example ever. Cam Lewis, Levi Wallace, Dane Jackson, Klein - there's a long list of excellent scheme players with limited athleticism who were on the field ahead of better athletes.  

 

Poyer is on the practice squad.  Players on the practice squad are generally only on the field if all of the better athletes are unavailable.

Cam Lewis was also only on the field when the better athletes were unable to go. 

Ditto AJ Klein - he only saw the field when the LBs ahead of him were injured.  Who exactly are these available better athletes at the position he was playing, that he kept off the field?

 

Levi Wallace was a starter, so you got me there.  But I'm curious as to the identity of the superior athletes you feel he was played ahead of.  Dean Marlowe?  Jaquan Johnson?  Siran Neal?

 

14 minutes ago, That's No Moon said:

It's costing the Bills a slot they could use on a veteran that they could keep up to speed to plug in if needed.

 

Who are these proven veterans, better than Poyer, who are lining up to sign to our practice squad?

Edited August 27 by Beck Water

[BobbyC81]

Is Gabe Davis next?

[Beck Water]

21 minutes ago, BobbyC81 said:

Is Gabe Davis next?

 

The Jaguars are paying $5.7M to not have him on the team.  

[Bad Things]

Maybe he's here so Keon can break his wrists?

 

Even Steven.

Edited August 28 by Bad Things

[NewEra]

1 hour ago, GoBills808 said:

Yup and you can quote me going all the way back to 2019 if you want

 

The lions share of the Bills success is due to Allen

Pretty sure everyone on earth agrees.  No one is disputing that

[Wraith]

26 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

I'm with the folks who don't get the negativity.  The naysayers tell us that Poyer is "washed."  Yet, Poyer played 90.6% of the defensive snaps with the Fins last season.  Apparently, as bad as he might have been, he was better than their other safeties.  PFF ranked Poyer 97th of 171 safeties who played enough snaps to qualify.  In other words, of the safeties who suited up and played, Poyer was roughly average.  In short, he's not godawful horrible.

 

Plus, he was signed to the practice squad.  Assuming no catastrophic injuries to our safeties, he's not going to see the game field very much.  Instead, his teammates will see him on the practice field, in meeting rooms, and in the locker room where he will be a positive addition.   Especially because he's a true believer in The Process, knows McD's system inside out, and has more NFL experience than our top four safeties combined.  

 

Indeed, PFF had Poyer rated higher than Taylor Rapp, Cole Bishop, and Damar Hamlin last season. I also threw in Justin Simmons and Kyle Dugger for comparison as those names have come up this preseason. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 27 by Wraith
Forgot Cole Bishop

[benderbender]

I need an episode of Hard Knocks where Poyer pitches to his wife the possibility coming back to Buffalo. 

Edited August 27 by benderbender
a small but very vocal segment

[That's No Moon]

2 hours ago, JGMcD2 said:

This is so disingenuous, and you know it. Teams are allowed to carry 6 veterans.

Looking back to 2020, when practice squads expanded to 16 players, the Bills have actually been better than most at developing practice squad talent. Even then we’re talking about just five players making and sticking on the 53-man roster in that span. It’s not costing anyone a spot.

Let me articulate my problem better. It's another re-signing of a guy they are familiar with. If this were the only one, or one of a couple, fine, whatever. It has always been part of what Beane and McDermott do. We make fun of it with the Carolina thing and that has now continued with former Bills coming back. It's evidence that they have a fairly closed circle of people they are willing to give opportunities to. Brian Gaine gets fired in Houston and where does he end up? When Joe Schoen gets fired in NY in December is there any doubt that he will come back to Buffalo? Signing Dane Jackson this spring was inexpensive, but it cost them the opportunity to explore a different and potentially better player, and keeping him on the practice squad now does the same thing.  The pro scouting department couldn't find a single CB in the league that they rated more highly than Dane Jackson? He was the easy go-to because they know him. Same with Jordan Phillips. There were dozens of defensive tackles available and they reached for a guy who is pretty close to done, but is someone they know. Tre White seems like a great guy, it also seems like he's pretty close to physically done, but he was brought back. Cole Beasley was done but was brought back, ditto John Brown. AJ Klein was brought back after he was done, had to play in a key spot, and cost them big time. There was nobody else?

 

These back of the roster guys seem unimportant and they are, until they have to play. The NFL has injuries. That isn't going to stop.  The point of the PS for teams is to keep guys around and keep them prepared to play in an unexpected situation. They can choose to keep up to 6 veterans on the PS. These are the guys who would be the most likely to see action. The Bills are effectively choosing to only keep 5. Franklin, Feeney, Jackson, Wilkerson, and Phillips. The 6th is Poyer who as we saw the last 2 years, is done physically. Will that matter? Hopefully not. Rather than keeping a safety who can actually play safety that they can take the time to teach the defense if they need to play them (because apparently it's very difficult for a safety to learn) they kept a ST guy that the ST coach knows and the withered husk of another guy they know.

 

Obviously they don't do this with every hire and they've brought plenty of people in from the outside over the years, but they do it enough and over a long enough period of time that it gives me questions. Are they really open to all the potential solutions out there? Are they really listening to pro scouting or have they molded pro scouting into only giving them the answer they want to hear?

 

When your default choice is to go with what you know or who you know you aren't opening yourself up to other opportunities and you're locking yourself into a set of outcomes.  Think of it this way, if you had a group of players who weren't able to get it done when they were younger, healthier and better, why do you want to lock yourself into having those people back when they are older, more broken, and worse? Does it make your organization the best it can be or is it comfortable? Is Tre White here because he's the best option at CB2/3 or is it because you know he's good in the locker room and won't be a problem? Keep in mind, that doesn't mean that someone else you bring in to be that CB2/3 will necessarily be an issue, it's that you don't know.  Tre White doesn't have an upside to his development curve, the best he's going to be is what he is today and he will only get worse from here. Same with Dane Jackson, Jordan Phillips, Jordan Poyer etc. There isn't an upside to win. There is downside risk though. These guys are actually being counted on to provide key depth. When they are called on and can't deliver you've hurt yourself by keeping them around past their expiration dates. If you have to bring in Jordan Poyer to coach your safeties, maybe it's that your actual coach isn't getting it done. If you need to bring those guys back to teach the younger players your culture, you don't actually have a culture.

 

I'm sure this will get downvoted to hell. Whatever. When a safety gets hurt and the "Will Jordan Poyer play?" thread starts just remember why he's here and it's not because he was the best choice.

[Shaw66]

45 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Poyer is on the practice squad.  Players on the practice squad are generally only on the field if all of the better athletes are unavailable.

Cam Lewis was also only on the field when the better athletes were unable to go. 

Ditto AJ Klein - he only saw the field when the LBs ahead of him were injured.  Who exactly are these available better athletes at the position he was playing, that he kept off the field?

 

Levi Wallace was a starter, so you got me there.  But I'm curious as to the identity of the superior athletes you feel he was played ahead of.  Dean Marlowe?  Jaquan Johnson?  Siran Neal?

 

 

I wasn't talking about guys on the team. I was talking about players who were free agents around the league, guys who had been starters and were clearly better, athletically, than guys the Bills were playing or had on the practice squad. McDermott doesn't want guys who execute their assignments 95% of the time, even if they're superb athletes. 

 

Kair Elam was one on the roster and better physically than guys who were playing. 

[DrDawkinstein]

Just now, That's No Moon said:

Let me articulate my problem better. It's another re-signing of a guy they are familiar with. If this were the only one, or one of a couple, fine, whatever. It has always been part of what Beane and McDermott do. We make fun of it with the Carolina thing and that has now continued with former Bills coming back. It's evidence that they have a fairly closed circle of people they are willing to give opportunities to. Brian Gaine gets fired in Houston and where does he end up? When Joe Schoen gets fired in NY in December is there any doubt that he will come back to Buffalo? Signing Dane Jackson this spring was inexpensive, but it cost them the opportunity to explore a different and potentially better player, and keeping him on the practice squad now does the same thing.  The pro scouting department couldn't find a single CB in the league that they rated more highly than Dane Jackson? He was the easy go-to because they know him. Same with Jordan Phillips. There were dozens of defensive tackles available and they reached for a guy who is pretty close to done, but is someone they know. Tre White seems like a great guy, it also seems like he's pretty close to physically done, but he was brought back. Cole Beasley was done but was brought back, ditto John Brown. AJ Klein was brought back after he was done, had to play in a key spot, and cost them big time. There was nobody else?

 

These back of the roster guys seem unimportant and they are, until they have to play. The NFL has injuries. That isn't going to stop.  The point of the PS for teams is to keep guys around and keep them prepared to play in an unexpected situation. They can choose to keep up to 6 veterans on the PS. These are the guys who would be the most likely to see action. The Bills are effectively choosing to only keep 5. Franklin, Feeney, Jackson, Wilkerson, and Phillips. The 6th is Poyer who as we saw the last 2 years, is done physically. Will that matter? Hopefully not. Rather than keeping a safety who can actually play safety that they can take the time to teach the defense if they need to play them (because apparently it's very difficult for a safety to learn) they kept a ST guy that the ST coach knows and the withered husk of another guy they know.

 

Obviously they don't do this with every hire and they've brought plenty of people in from the outside over the years, but they do it enough and over a long enough period of time that it gives me questions. Are they really open to all the potential solutions out there? Are they really listening to pro scouting or have they molded pro scouting into only giving them the answer they want to hear?

 

When your default choice is to go with what you know or who you know you aren't opening yourself up to other opportunities and you're locking yourself into a set of outcomes.  Think of it this way, if you had a group of players who weren't able to get it done when they were younger, healthier and better, why do you want to lock yourself into having those people back when they are older, more broken, and worse? Does it make your organization the best it can be or is it comfortable? Is Tre White here because he's the best option at CB2/3 or is it because you know he's good in the locker room and won't be a problem? Keep in mind, that doesn't mean that someone else you bring in to be that CB2/3 will necessarily be an issue, it's that you don't know.  Tre White doesn't have an upside to his development curve, the best he's going to be is what he is today and he will only get worse from here. Same with Dane Jackson, Jordan Phillips, Jordan Poyer etc. There isn't an upside to win. There is downside risk though. These guys are actually being counted on to provide key depth. When they are called on and can't deliver you've hurt yourself by keeping them around past their expiration dates. If you have to bring in Jordan Poyer to coach your safeties, maybe it's that your actual coach isn't getting it done. If you need to bring those guys back to teach the younger players your culture, you don't actually have a culture.

 

I'm sure this will get downvoted to hell. Whatever. When a safety gets hurt and the "Will Jordan Poyer play?" thread starts just remember why he's here and it's not because he was the best choice.

 

I think you're complaint would sound way more valid if the Bills sucked, and werent considered one of the top 3 teams in the league for over 5 years running and hadnt made 2 AFC Championship appearances in the McBeane tenure.

 

I'm all for taking the next step to get to and win a Super Bowl, but it's tough to argue against bringing guys back when we've been so successful. It should also be noted that most of those guys we bring back were quickly scooped up by other teams and overpaid because of their time with the Bills. They may seem like broken down retreads (and some are), but to other teams they're valuable assets. What looks like trash to us is treasure to other teams because our standard is so high nowadays.

 

I'm not counting on any of them to be All Pro, or even make the pro bowl. And Im on record saying we'll lose any and every game Poyer starts. But same could be said for almost any practice squad player around the league.

 

It's not like they've passed on a number of better players that were available. These arent the drought years. We're not retreading Coy Wire Larry Tripplett.

[Chandler#81]

Was there a clause in the contract that his wife can’t comment publicly?🤞