PFF’s top 32 LBs

[MrEpsYtown]

PFF is terrible

[blacklabel]

14 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

He definitely should be above a number of guys at the bottom.

 

But this kind of highlights my feeling that we shouldn't have been in a rush to extend Bernard. He took a pretty sizable step back between 2023 and 2024.

 

Between his performance last season and his penchant for getting dinged up (and at a position that isn't a premium one) - I wouldn't have locked in the kind of long term deal he was given until I saw him return to his 2023 form this season. 

 

If he doesn't, I'd have put that money elsewhere and Drafted a replacement. Bernard was easily #5 on the list of guys to allocate cap to retain between him, Benford, Rousseau, Shakir, and Cook.

 

You're missing one of the key things they really value in him and that's his intelligence. Dude just knows ball and understands the complexities of McDermott's system. QB of the defense as they say. 

 

Sometimes the whole picture gets missed when people question why certain guys get second contracts. For Bernard it's what he brings on the field as well as in the meeting rooms, film sessions and game planning. Smart dude. 

[Paup 1995MVP]

18 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

He definitely should be above a number of guys at the bottom.

 

But this kind of highlights my feeling that we shouldn't have been in a rush to extend Bernard. He took a pretty sizable step back between 2023 and 2024.

 

Between his performance last season and his penchant for getting dinged up (and at a position that isn't a premium one) - I wouldn't have locked in the kind of long term deal he was given until I saw him return to his 2023 form this season. 

 

If he doesn't, I'd have put that money elsewhere and Drafted a replacement. Bernard was easily #5 on the list of guys to allocate cap to retain between him, Benford, Rousseau, Shakir, and Cook.

Interesting thoughts on Bernard.  Was very surprised that he wasn't top 32 in the league.  He had a great 2023, and an OK 2024.  I think he is an above average athlete with great instincts on what is going on around him on the field.  Is he Fred Warner?  No.  But he is certainly light years ahead of Tremaine Edmunds as an NFL LB.

 

Your opinion on Bernard being #5 on who you pay of the guys up for extensions is interesting.  I think his 2023 season was much better than any season Rousseau has put together.  Rousseau has been consistently above average.  But not consistently great by any means.  I think Bernard has a higher ceiling as a football player than Rousseau.  But overall keeping both is good for the team.  Bernard just needs to stay healthy.  I wish he would put on an extra 10-12 pounds.  LB's should weigh at least mid 230's to take the pounding they get week in and week out.

[wppete]

Dotson over Bernanrd? 😂

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

22 minutes ago, wppete said:

Dotson over Bernanrd? 😂

 

It's just based on the grades that PFF put together.  Bernard didn't have a good year by his own standards, and a very poor year by PFF's standards.  

[Mikie2times]

Some here argue Bernard is a Pro Bowl LB. Which was always dumb. He's a fringe starter on a lot of teams and works here based on scheme. 

[Beck Water]

On 5/28/2025 at 1:34 PM, RoscoeParrish said:

An actual terrible list.

 

Not even trying to have Bills bias here, but Greenlaw plays 34 snaps in 2024 and he’s top 5, but Milano playing the second half of 2024 is an honorable mention due to injuries?

 

Yeah, it kind of reads like "I've Heard of Him" or "PFF graded him well"

Greenlaw played 34 snaps last season.  It's not just Greenlaw - Okereke missed 5 games.  Edgerrin Cooper didn't just miss games with a hammy, he didn't take over as the starter until the last 3-ish games.  They acknowledge TJ Edwards wasn't so good last year and they included him based on previous history.  Pace only played 10 games.  Mosely is a FA, which kind of says how NFL GMs see him (eg not as a top 32 LB)

 

TUNE OUT THE NOISE...TUNE OUT THE NOISE

 

3 hours ago, wppete said:

Dotson over Bernanrd? 😂

 

Indeed.  There is a reason Bernard won the starting MLB gig over Bernard, and that the Bills moved on from Dodson.

8 hours ago, MrEpsYtown said:

PFF is terrible

 

I see no lies

Edited 22 hours ago by Beck Water

[That's No Moon]

On 5/28/2025 at 2:43 PM, BuffaloBillyG said:

Dodson #29. Good for the guy. Not thrilled he's a Dolphin now.

Go watch the Seattle game. I'm thrilled to see him twice a year and if there is anyone who knows what he CANT do it's the Bills.

[BuffaloBillyG]

14 hours ago, That's No Moon said:

Go watch the Seattle game. I'm thrilled to see him twice a year and if there is anyone who knows what he CANT do it's the Bills.

Well, admittedly I didn't see him play is Seattle. But I did catch a few of his games with the Dolphins. Not sure if it was just a better scheme fit or them using him to his strength better...but he was playing at a "Pro Bowl" level in Miami.

 

In fact, where he struggled the most in Buffalo (coverage) he actually showed out in Miami. He posted the NFLs #1 overall coverage grade for LBers from week 11 on (which is when he joined Miami.).

[Mailman]

On 5/28/2025 at 1:37 PM, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

Surprised Edmunds didn't make the list.

Especially for how young he is.

He is closing in on legal drinking age, isn't he? 😆

[Mat68]

2 hours ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Well, admittedly I didn't see him play is Seattle. But I did catch a few of his games with the Dolphins. Not sure if it was just a better scheme fit or them using him to his strength better...but he was playing at a "Pro Bowl" level in Miami.

 

In fact, where he struggled the most in Buffalo (coverage) he actually showed out in Miami. He posted the NFLs #1 overall coverage grade for LBers from week 11 on (which is when he joined Miami.).

I disagree using PFF as a single measure.  Dodson being schemed around and having a less effective defense doesn't make him a better player.  He is a limited athlete that gets more neutral grades than negative ones due to not being in a position to make a play.  By not being in position to make the tackle or stop the pass he isnt graded on it . Bernard will have a lower tackle|stop %. Because he is traveling further to make the plays.  The fumble vs the Ravens is likley a negative because Andrews made the catch.  Mind you Bernard had the entire middle and was on an island with Andrews.  Came up made the play and strip in a position Dodson would never be put in or able to make.  No one can watch the Bills in 23 and 24 and say with a straight face Dodson is a better linebacker.   Not one.  Shoot PFF linebaker and interior line analytics in the sun.  The plays Bernard misses Dodson would not be in position to make.  The plays Bernard does make Dodson doesnt… 

[BuffaloBillyG]

1 hour ago, Mat68 said:

I disagree using PFF as a single measure.  Dodson being schemed around and having a less effective defense doesn't make him a better player.  He is a limited athlete that gets more neutral grades than negative ones due to not being in a position to make a play.  By not being in position to make the tackle or stop the pass he isnt graded on it . Bernard will have a lower tackle|stop %. Because he is traveling further to make the plays.  The fumble vs the Ravens is likley a negative because Andrews made the catch.  Mind you Bernard had the entire middle and was on an island with Andrews.  Came up made the play and strip in a position Dodson would never be put in or able to make.  No one can watch the Bills in 23 and 24 and say with a straight face Dodson is a better linebacker.   Not one.  Shoot PFF linebaker and interior line analytics in the sun.  The plays Bernard misses Dodson would not be in position to make.  The plays Bernard does make Dodson doesnt… 

I agree with not using PFF as a singular measurement. As a matter of fact I'm a believer that you should never take ANY metric as a singular measurement. 

 

However, in Dodson's case the number actually met (what I believe to be still the most accurate measurement) the eye test. As I said I watched him in several of his Dolphin games. He was magnificent. 

 

No where am I saying he's better, worse or the same as Bernard. I never made any comparison not did I mention him. My response was about Dodson. As you point out they don't even play the same position.

[Mat68]

31 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

I agree with not using PFF as a singular measurement. As a matter of fact I'm a believer that you should never take ANY metric as a singular measurement. 

 

However, in Dodson's case the number actually met (what I believe to be still the most accurate measurement) the eye test. As I said I watched him in several of his Dolphin games. He was magnificent. 

 

No where am I saying he's better, worse or the same as Bernard. I never made any comparison not did I mention him. My response was about Dodson. As you point out they don't even play the same position.

Because he was schemed around.  You cant be in the conversation for Probowl when you are playing 50% of the defensive snaps.  He was taking out so his limitations wouldn't be magnified.  Dolphins struggled vs the TE position even in the wins during that stretch.  This is where analytics and real life clash.  He is a back up/ 2 down linebacker in the NFL.