How was Josh able to finish the game with a concussion?

[Richard Noggin]

Feels like the GB Halloween game two years ago. Many thought Allen got concussed in that game (end of first half right?) but avoided concussion protocol. His play certainly cratered suddenly in the 2nd half and lingered there for at least a couple weeks after (losses to NYJ and MIN)...we all know there were likely contributing domestic distractions "beginning" the night before that GB game, but there was much chatter about Allen getting his bell rung that night, much like the last two weeks. 

 

Are we so much better than the Dolphins with how we allow Allen to take damage and keep playing? Is the NFL for that matter SO BLIND as to allow some of the hits the Ravens especially targeted upon Allen without punishment of any kind? 

[Jauronimo]

  On 10/9/2024 at 10:26 PM, Savage said:

Perhaps,

 

but it’s not hard to see when someone is knocked out cold.

 

 

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People who are knocked out cold do not kick their feet up and down to the best of my knowledge.

 

 

[Dibs]

"How was Josh able to finish the game with a concussion?"

 

Because he's F'ing Superman, that's how!

[Mr. WEO]

  On 10/9/2024 at 11:03 PM, Malazan said:

 

 

So the NFLPA, ie the player's union who sued the league over concussions, is in on it too? The independent neurologists are hired by both NFL and NFLPA.

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what does that have to do with my post?

  On 10/10/2024 at 12:57 AM, Rew said:

https://www.nfl.com/playerhealthandsafety/health-and-wellness/player-care/concussion-protocol-return-to-participation-protocol

 

The blue tent sideline evaluation includes both team staff and independent (UNC) required to clear them for play. 

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where is "handing smelling salts to impacted player" on that checklist?

 

Also, as I aid before, there's no way a neurologist can do such a a complete assessment as required above  in 4 minutes or less.

[Mango]

I have rewatched the game and the whole thing really just gives off second half of GB vibes and it took Allen weeks to get his groove back.

There were a couple of posters that were surprised that Allen wasn't evaluated for a concussion late in the Ravens game after the trick play and he smashed his head and his shoulder. Totally unqualified conjecture, but I wonder if he rattled his bell there and this is what you get when you spend the week after a concussion exercising, watching film, and studying the playbook?

[Savage]

  On 10/9/2024 at 11:03 PM, Malazan said:

 

 

So the NFLPA, ie the player's union who sued the league over concussions, is in on it too? The independent neurologists are hired by both NFL and NFLPA.

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Nobody is IN on anything.

 

there’s no way he could have assessed properly in that shot a time.

[Jerome007]

  On 10/9/2024 at 8:48 PM, Savage said:

The NFL doesn’t care.

it’s all about the $$$$.

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That's not even the argument you think it is. Josh missing a few plays at the end of a 1PM game doesn't cost the NFL any $$$$. Josh having his career cut short because of untreated concussions, that does cost the NFL - and the BILLS!!!! - money. You think the Dolphins have gotten great TV ratings of late?

 

I sure hope the BILLS do what's right by Josh and really make sure he is OK to play. Yeah a GM and HC can be fired if they lose too much, but much of the Bills brass and certainly the owners want their star players performing as long as possible. Not win at any cost a regular season game.

 

On that replay shown on this plage, it's like what those at the game saw: Josh is moving his feet from the pain from the get go. He is not out. Now, that doesn't mean he hasn't got a concussion but no I don't think he was out cold.

Edited October 10, 2024 by Jerome007

[Malazan]

  On 10/10/2024 at 2:25 PM, Savage said:

Nobody is IN on anything.

 

there’s no way he could have assessed properly in that shot a time.

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The neurologist approved and hired by NFLPA believes they can so can you educate me on why they're wrong? I assume you've done your own research.

[BarleyNY]

I want to address how this will impact the Bills and Allen moving forward, especially Monday night and in the next few games. No one on these boards knows with certainty whether Allen was concussed or if he was knocked unconscious. We can speculate and we all have our opinions on the likelihood of each, but he passed the tests (such as they are) and went back into the game.

 

But here’s the thing: It looked bad. Like really bad. And it got a fair bit of bad press. And we all saw how a very similar situation with Tua played out on the field and in the media. I will confidently say that the league does not want a repeat of that PR nightmare. So if Allen bounces his head off the turf again - especially with so many watching on MNF - don’t expect him to be allowed back in the game. It’ll be Trubiaky Time (shudder).

 

The refs will hopefully get the memo and protect the heck out of him (and old man Rodgers too), but the Jets will be going after him. It’s up to the coaches, his teammates and, most of all, Allen himself to keep him safe and sound. I, for one, will not be complaining about the Bills running the ball too much or Allen throwing it away to preserve his health. 

Edited October 10, 2024 by BarleyNY

[first_and_ten]

  On 10/8/2024 at 3:28 AM, Simon said:

 

It's entirely possible that McDermott did not know that Allen was out for a couple seconds.

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That is true, but are You telling me that nobody upstairs saw what I saw? Are you saying they withheld that information from the head coach? 

[first_and_ten]

  On 10/10/2024 at 9:57 PM, BarleyNY said:

I want to address how this will impact the Bills and Allen moving forward, especially Monday night and in the next few games. No one on these boards knows with certainty whether Allen was concussed or if he was knocked unconscious. We can speculate and we all have our opinions on the likelihood of each, but he passed the tests (such as they are) and went back into the game.

 

But here’s the thing: It looked bad. Like really bad. And it got a fair bit of bad press. And we all saw how a very similar situation with Tua played out on the field and in the media. I will confidently say that the league does not want a repeat of that PR nightmare. So if Allen bounces his head off the turf again - especially with so many watching on MNF - don’t expect him to be allowed back in the game. It’ll be Trubiaky Time (shudder).

 

The refs will hopefully get the memo and protect the heck out of him (and old man Rodgers too), but the Jets will be going after him. It’s up to the coaches, his teammates and, most of all, Allen himself to keep him safe and sound. I, for one, will not be complaining about the Bills running the ball too much or Allen throwing it away to preserve his health. 

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This one game does not supersede risking our franchise quarterback's long term health. What the incident with Josh hitting his head on the turf this past Sunday tells me is that the concussion protocol is a joke. 

 

Another thing that I've noticed lately is that the refs are allowing some hits on Josh that would be a penalty if they happened to Mahomes and other quarterbacks. Are they protecting quarterbacks or not? Is josh being held to a lower standard because he can run? 

[mikemac2001]

  On 10/10/2024 at 5:33 AM, Jauronimo said:

People who are knocked out cold do not kick their feet up and down to the best of my knowledge.

 

 

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Great post 

 

I think his head did hit hard but maybe was selling a high hit but him kicking his feet is more frustration or pain then concussed 

[Doc]

  On 10/10/2024 at 9:57 PM, BarleyNY said:

I want to address how this will impact the Bills and Allen moving forward, especially Monday night and in the next few games. No one on these boards knows with certainty whether Allen was concussed or if he was knocked unconscious. We can speculate and we all have our opinions on the likelihood of each, but he passed the tests (such as they are) and went back into the game.

 

But here’s the thing: It looked bad. Like really bad. And it got a fair bit of bad press. And we all saw how a very similar situation with Tua played out on the field and in the media. I will confidently say that the league does not want a repeat of that PR nightmare. So if Allen bounces his head off the turf again - especially with so many watching on MNF - don’t expect him to be allowed back in the game. It’ll be Trubiaky Time (shudder).

 

The refs will hopefully get the memo and protect the heck out of him (and old man Rodgers too), but the Jets will be going after him. It’s up to the coaches, his teammates and, most of all, Allen himself to keep him safe and sound. I, for one, will not be complaining about the Bills running the ball too much or Allen throwing it away to preserve his health. 

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It won't impact anything.  The Jets will go hard after Josh and try and hit him late like they always have.  If they go for his head his teammates will pummel whoever tries and Rodgers will be a dead man.

 

And sure a lot was made of the incident because people believe he got knocked out based on a clip that doesn't show everything.  Meanwhile fans at the game said he was moving the entire time, the training staff surely would have known he was unconscious and had him pulled from the game, he got up and went to the sidelines under his own power and completely normally, got cleared to return, waved off the smelling salts and then did a post game presser without any signs of a concussion. 

 

And again the notion that the Bills somehow don't care about Josh but do care about someone like, say,Taylor Rapp is probably the most interesting belief in this whole thing.  I'm not sure why mistakes made by other teams means the Bills are suddenly just as dumb.

[Rew]

  On 10/10/2024 at 12:44 PM, Mr. WEO said:

 

what does that have to do with my post?

 

where is "handing smelling salts to impacted player" on that checklist?

 

Also, as I aid before, there's no way a neurologist can do such a a complete assessment as required above  in 4 minutes or less.

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Dude, sometimes it reads like you are being difficult for the sake of being difficult.  Your original comment was "he was evaluated by an independent neurologist??  when?".  Your questions were answered by 2 different people with the same data backed response.  There is a well defined process that includes an independent neurologist.  You can say you think it's an inadequate evaluation, but you really believe he wasn't independently evaluated?

[Governor]

Spencer Brown is going to get Josh killed. It’s time to get him out of there.

[Mr. WEO]

  On 10/11/2024 at 1:25 AM, Rew said:

Dude, sometimes it reads like you are being difficult for the sake of being difficult.  Your original comment was "he was evaluated by an independent neurologist??  when?".  Your questions were answered by 2 different people with the same data backed response.  There is a well defined process that includes an independent neurologist.  You can say you think it's an inadequate evaluation, but you really believe he wasn't independently evaluated?

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we all know the published process, my point isn't hard to understand...dude.

 

what i have said twice is that no one could do a proper neuro e v a l (per their own protocol) in 4 minutes or less, no matter how many neurologists were in that tent.  An "independent" neurologist could not credibly do so.

 

 

[Malazan]

  On 10/11/2024 at 11:37 AM, Mr. WEO said:

 

we all know the published process, my point isn't hard to understand...dude.

 

what i have said twice is that no one could do a proper neuro e v a l (per their own protocol) in 4 minutes or less, no matter how many neurologists were in that tent.  An "independent" neurologist could not credibly do so.

 

 

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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/41740543/nfl-nflpa-bills-allen-was-properly-evaluated-concussion

 

 

[Doc]

  On 10/11/2024 at 10:59 PM, Malazan said:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/41740543/nfl-nflpa-bills-allen-was-properly-evaluated-concussion

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No surprise.  The Bills aren't/weren't going to risk Josh's health.

[ColoradoBills]

He whacked his head hard.  Was it enough to "officially" be a concussion.  I don't know and I can't see how any one of us fans can.

 

Boxers take shots to the head and get dazed all the time.  Every one of those hits are not a concussion.

 

I do know that I don't want to see him get whacked again this week.

 

[Doc]

  On 10/11/2024 at 11:31 PM, ColoradoBills said:

He whacked his head hard.  Was it enough to "officially" be a concussion.  I don't know and I can't see how any one of us fans can.

 

Boxers take shots to the head and get dazed all the time.  Every one of those hits are not a concussion.

 

I do know that I don't want to see him get whacked again this week.

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No matter where you fall on the "did he suffer a concussion or not," we all agree with the bolded.