2023 MVP: Lamar will win it with 15 fewer TDs than Josh Allen (end of season talk pg 75+)

[FireChans]

Just now, C.Biscuit97 said:

Can’t disagree except that the Ravens stomped them. But this should be a non qb year. 

Ravens stomped them, but that was more a reflection on the Brocketship crashing back to earth. CMC still ate.

[Punch]

13 minutes ago, BeastMaster said:

The media hate and reluctance to ever give Josh his due kind of reminds me of a man that the media vilified for years and told you he would start WW3 and that anyone who thought that man was good was not good for democracy. 

[Warcodered]

 

 

[C.Biscuit97]

19 minutes ago, BeastMaster said:

The RAVENS stomped the best team on the road...not just Lamar. That's why their defense has been top notch all season and Lamar has mediocre to good numbers. He has complimented the defense very well this season.

 

Lamar didn't outduel Brock Purdy in a battle that showcased who the better QB was...Purdy imploded and the Ravens capitalized on turnovers and great field position. Lamar had a fine game, but this wasn't a demonstration as to how high of a level Lamar Jackson was on. The Niners did everything they could to hand Baltimore the win, and even with all those turnovers, Lamar didn't close the door and the defense had to get yet another INT late to seal it.

 

Josh has 16 more TD's than Lamar and is accounting for 83% of his teams touchdowns, while LJ is at 55%.

 

If Josh plays well and the Bills beat Miami after Baltimore beats them and they get the two seed, it would be criminal to give Lamar the MVP over Josh

Their defense is 1st while our awful defense is 4th!!!! https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2023/opp.htm

 

our offense averages 2 more yards/ game while we have a better Wr1, possibly wr2 (obj is washed), a better rb, and haven’t had their star TE for 3 games.  https://www.espn.com/nfl/stats/team
 

I think Allen is the better overall qb. I just think this board hates to give Lamar credit. He needs to prove it in the playoffs but his impact on them is undeniable. If the Bills were challenging for the 1 seed, Allen is the favorite. But they aren’t and it’s been a super inconsistent season. 
 

 

[Punch]

10 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

 

 

FWIW, this discussion in the media re: Allen is becoming more prevalent as the Bills continue winning. Its also clearly backed up in his increasing Vegas odds.

[PatsFanNH]

25 minutes ago, BeastMaster said:

The RAVENS stomped the best team on the road...not just Lamar. That's why their defense has been top notch all season and Lamar has mediocre to good numbers. He has complimented the defense very well this season.

 

Lamar didn't outduel Brock Purdy in a battle that showcased who the better QB was...Purdy imploded and the Ravens capitalized on turnovers and great field position. Lamar had a fine game, but this wasn't a demonstration as to how high of a level Lamar Jackson was on. The Niners did everything they could to hand Baltimore the win, and even with all those turnovers, Lamar didn't close the door and the defense had to get yet another INT late to seal it.

 

Josh has 16 more TD's than Lamar and is accounting for 83% of his teams touchdowns, while LJ is at 55%.

 

If Josh plays well and the Bills beat Miami after Baltimore beats them and they get the two seed, it would be criminal to give Lamar the MVP over Josh

Well expect the criminal to happen then.  Besides that let him win that and Allen win the more important MVP…. SB MVP. 

[Warcodered]

1 minute ago, Punch said:

FWIW, this discussion in the media re: Allen is becoming more prevalent as the Bills continue winning. Its also clearly backed up in his increasing Vegas odds.

Well as Dak and Hertz have fallen away and more recently Purdy imploding the latest sacrifice at the alter of not Allen is Lamar. While team wins sort of works, the stat disparity is just really hard to ignore.

[C.Biscuit97]

3 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

Well as Dak and Hertz have fallen away and more recently Purdy imploding the latest sacrifice at the alter of not Allen is Lamar. While team wins sort of works, the stat disparity is just really hard to ignore.

So if the Bills were the most consistent team from start to finish; had to go the whole season without Cook; Diggs missed 3 games; and we had the lead for basically 95% of games, you would think Lamar was the mvp with a worse record but better stats? 

[Warcodered]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

So if the Bills were the most consistent team from start to finish; had to go the whole season without Cook; Diggs missed 3 games; and we had the lead for basically 95% of games, you would think Lamar was the mvp with a worse record but better stats? 

If Josh had Lamar's stats scoring only what 55% of that teams TDs, yeah I wouldn't think he'd win the MVP, I'd think the team as a whole was playing some really solid team football but our QB wasn't carrying us.

[Ya Digg?]

4 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

So if the Bills were the most consistent team from start to finish; had to go the whole season without Cook; Diggs missed 3 games; and we had the lead for basically 95% of games, you would think Lamar was the mvp with a worse record but better stats? 

The reality is the MVP is just a stats award. It goes to the QB with the best stats. There is quite the gap between Josh and Lamar statistically and if the Bills can finish with the 2 seed, I think it will be really hard to give Lamar the award 

[C.Biscuit97]

1 minute ago, Warcodered said:

If Josh had Lamar's stats scoring only what 55% of that teams TDs, yeah I wouldn't think he'd win the MVP, I'd think the team as a whole was playing some really solid team football but our QB wasn't carrying us.

Find this hard to believe. There would be a riot on this board if that was the case and I’d lead it. 
 

mVP tends to go to the best player on the best team. I guess we’ll see if history is made this year. I put some money in Allen so I’m be happy haha. But I just want playoff success ultimately.

[C.Biscuit97]

3 minutes ago, Ya Digg? said:

The reality is the MVP is just a stats award. It goes to the QB with the best stats. There is quite the gap between Josh and Lamar statistically and if the Bills can finish with the 2 seed, I think it will be really hard to give Lamar the award 

But it’s really not. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/awards/ap-nfl-mvp-award.htm
 

in the last 15 years (could more but I didn’t feel like checking), the MVP winners averages 12/13 wins. One was Matt Ryan, which could be Allen’s best case, who went 11-5 and beat out Brady (28 td/ 2 ints 14-2, best the Falcons in the SB) and Peterson who had 2,000 yards. 
 

also besides Mahomes, most MVPs don’t win the SB so do we even want Allen to win it? This a bills board haha. 

[julian]

Madden cover

league MVP

super bowl

Super bowl MVP

 

This is his destiny this year

[Scott7975]

15 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

But it’s really not. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/awards/ap-nfl-mvp-award.htm
 

in the last 15 years (could more but I didn’t feel like checking), the MVP winners averages 12/13 wins. One was Matt Ryan, which could be Allen’s best case, who went 11-5 and beat out Brady (28 td/ 2 ints 14-2, best the Falcons in the SB) and Peterson who had 2,000 yards. 
 

also besides Mahomes, most MVPs don’t win the SB so do we even want Allen to win it? This a bills board haha. 

 

You're neglecting that all those winners were also top of the league in stats.  Lamar isn't top of the league in anything.  I don't think Allen will get it.  I don't actually think he ever will.  I do think if Lamar gets it this year then the award is about as big of a farce as the pro bowl.  Lamar deserved it the year he got it.  He hasn't done crap to deserve it this year.

Edited December 26, 2023 by Scott7975

[Orlando Tim]

For Lamar to be leading now is absurd, he is the third best QB in the AFC this year. I am going with CMC right now and unless Josh or Tyreek really ball out the last two weeks he should win. No other players matter nearly as much to their teams. 

[dma0034]

24 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

But it’s really not. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/awards/ap-nfl-mvp-award.htm
 

in the last 15 years (could more but I didn’t feel like checking), the MVP winners averages 12/13 wins. One was Matt Ryan, which could be Allen’s best case, who went 11-5 and beat out Brady (28 td/ 2 ints 14-2, best the Falcons in the SB) and Peterson who had 2,000 yards. 
 

also besides Mahomes, most MVPs don’t win the SB so do we even want Allen to win it? This a bills board haha. 

 

Brady missed 4 games that year or he would have won

[CSBill]

3 hours ago, Warcodered said:

Would you look at that some logical thinking.

 

 

It’s refreshing to hear someone callout Keyshawn for what his stupid takes are, garbage! It still mystifies me they give him a microphone and actually pay him to spew his nonsensical drivel. 

[KingBoots8]

29 minutes ago, julian said:

Madden cover

league MVP

super bowl

Super bowl MVP

 

This is his destiny this year

Don’t tease me like that, good lord I’m trying to work 😂

[julian]

It’s down to week 18 for the MVP, unless Miami goes into Baltimore wins and wraps up the east and if that happens it should be Tyreek, but if week 18 is for the division then it’s the MVP bowl between Tyreek and Allen, winner of the division gets the MVP.

[BeastMaster]

3 hours ago, Scott7975 said:

 

You're neglecting that all those winners were also top of the league in stats.  Lamar isn't top of the league in anything.  I don't think Allen will get it.  I don't actually think he ever will.  I do think if Lamar gets it this year then the award is about as big of a farce as the pro bowl.  Lamar deserved it the year he got it.  He hasn't done crap to deserve it this year.

What's also funny is that nobody was pushing for LJ as MVP until lastnighta game.

 

Purdy implodes, and now LJ vaults into frontrunner for MVP? Again, he had a fine game, but this wasn't him delivering a signature performance to beat Purdy and the Niners...Purdy ***** the bed, and SF never got their offense going. Most of the credit here should go to the Ravens defense, with LJ complimenting it and taking advantage of the numerous times he was given great field position.

 

It's just strange that the guy that nobody was talking about because his numbers weren't there suddenly is the favorite because of this one game where the defense was clearly the catalyst and Jackson himself just played his part. 

 

I really don't understand how this game suddenly vaults him to the top. If you wanna say we should start taking him as a serious MVP candidate now, I'm OK with that.

 

Bottom line is that Josh should be right there with anyone, but needs to win out with at least 500 more pass yards and at least 5 more TD's to legitimately win

Edited December 26, 2023 by BeastMaster