Suitable Edmunds Replacements in the draft

[MrEpsYtown]

11 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He is kinda positionless in this scheme though. Projects much better as a will in a 3-4.

 

And he won't make it to our 2nd round pick. He is a better, more experienced, big school version of Troy Anderson who went to the Falcons one pick after our original 2nd rounder last year. I think Sanders is a lock to come off the board in the first 50 picks. 

Great comp on Sanders. And I think most of these guys are going in that late 1 early second range and won’t make it to our second pick. I’m looking forward to your ranking on some of these guys. 
 

On Simpson, it seems they used him off the edge a lot as a blitzer, but I also think he played well in the box. I think he is a nickel linebacker and I do think he would fit well in our base 4-2-5. Is he a true mike? I’m not sure, but we don’t really have one anymore. His 2021 film has him playing a ton of sam in a 4-3 under look with Spector and Skalski stacked in the box. This year he looked pretty good off ball stacked in the box. He might be more Thomas Davis, Shaq Thompson than Luke Keuchly and that’s ok imo. But I love his traits. Also a Charlotte kid so there is a good chance McBeane saw this kid play in HS. 

[MrEpsYtown]

5 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Whereas I think Jack could make it to our 2nd round pick and could even slide into round 3. If this was 1995 he might be a first round pick but I think his relatively pedestrian lateral movement will put some teams off. Gonna be a bit more scheme specific. I doubt the Bills see him as a fit for what they do personally, dropping into those intermediate zones and asked to pick up crossers I think he might struggle. 

I hear that. He is definitely more 4-3 mike than 4-2-5 nickel backer. I think his projection is going to come down his combine workout. I remember Luke Keuchly originally had that 2-3 round projection and blew up the combine and that all changed. I see a similar fate for Campbell. I think he is way more athletic than people think. Does he get into the top ten? No but I think late 1 early two. 

[GunnerBill]

Can I add a sleeper name? Jalen Graham out of Purdue. Probably a day 3 pick could even go undrafted but converted safety with ball hawking ability who generally played as an outside backer in college and was used to rush the passer some but who I see as a best fit in the NFL at MLB in some of these deep drop tampa 2 type looks. Love his closing speed. He is like a missile fired out of a cannon when he closes on a ball carrier. 6'3, great range, you can leave him in man and be comfortable with it. He isn't necessarily a day 1 starter but he is a guy a team is gonna be really happy with down the road.

[MrEpsYtown]

I saw somewhere we met with Dee Winters at the senior bowl. Interesting guy from TCU. 
 

 

 

 

 

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I hear that. He is definitely more 4-3 mike than 4-2-5 nickel backer. I think his projection is going to come down his combine workout. I remember Luke Keuchly originally had that 2-3 round projection and blew up the combine and that all changed. I see a similar fate for Campbell. I think he is way more athletic than people think. Does he get into the top ten? No but I think late 1 early two. 

 

Hmm. It will be the agility drills that make or break his combine. When I put his tape on I like him coming downhill. I worry about him going sideline to sideline. I have a provisional late 2nd on him. But if this was 20 or 30 years ago he would be a 1st rounder. Because he hits, he tackles, he has great instincts, his run fits are on point. 

[MrEpsYtown]

9 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

Can I add a sleeper name? Jalen Graham out of Purdue. Probably a day 3 pick could even go undrafted but converted safety with ball hawking ability who generally played as an outside backer in college and was used to rush the passer some but who I see as a best fit in the NFL at MLB in some of these deep drop tampa 2 type looks. Love his closing speed. He is like a missile fired out of a cannon when he closes on a ball carrier. 6'3, great range, you can leave him in man and be comfortable with it. He isn't necessarily a day 1 starter but he is a guy a team is gonna be really happy with down the road.

I like it. Interesting dude.

 

 

 

[GunnerBill]

Just now, MrEpsYtown said:

I like it. Interesting dude.

 

 

 

 

Yea he was a Shrine Game invite as well. Was one of the players who flashed that week and in the game. 

[Richard Noggin]

24 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

Can I add a sleeper name? Jalen Graham out of Purdue. Probably a day 3 pick could even go undrafted but converted safety with ball hawking ability who generally played as an outside backer in college and was used to rush the passer some but who I see as a best fit in the NFL at MLB in some of these deep drop tampa 2 type looks. Love his closing speed. He is like a missile fired out of a cannon when he closes on a ball carrier. 6'3, great range, you can leave him in man and be comfortable with it. He isn't necessarily a day 1 starter but he is a guy a team is gonna be really happy with down the road.

 

14 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I like it. Interesting dude.

 

 

 

 

13 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea he was a Shrine Game invite as well. Was one of the players who flashed that week and in the game. 

 

Love this sequence, gents.

[John from Riverside]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Hmm. It will be the agility drills that make or break his combine. When I put his tape on I like him coming downhill. I worry about him going sideline to sideline. I have a provisional late 2nd on him. But if this was 20 or 30 years ago he would be a 1st rounder. Because he hits, he tackles, he has great instincts, his run fits are on point. 

If we do move on from Edmonds, or he leaves in free agency, I want a linebacker with good instincts. I want that over everything else.

[John from Riverside]

6 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

I thought we drafted his replacement in 2022 with Bernard.  A RD 3 pick

 

This draft record is really getting disturbing 

I’m wondering what the plans are for Baylon Spector who I thought should’ve gotten more of an opportunity as a back up linebacker for us before we went out and got klein

 

Now I think we should resign klien and bring along a rookie

[NoName]

I am going to get roasted for saying this but what about the braylon spector guy. Last year's 7th rounder.  He looked really good in preseason and seemed to know where to be.

[Chaos]

6 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

Can I add a sleeper name? Jalen Graham out of Purdue. Probably a day 3 pick could even go undrafted but converted safety with ball hawking ability who generally played as an outside backer in college and was used to rush the passer some but who I see as a best fit in the NFL at MLB in some of these deep drop tampa 2 type looks. Love his closing speed. He is like a missile fired out of a cannon when he closes on a ball carrier. 6'3, great range, you can leave him in man and be comfortable with it. He isn't necessarily a day 1 starter but he is a guy a team is gonna be really happy with down the road.

Your addition of Graham seems to fill out the consensus in this thread that there are lots ways to move on from Edmunds (on rookie contracts)

[The Jokeman]

Drew Sanders was compared to Edmunds in the NFL.com draft writeup. As he's got the same length and experience in a 4-2-5 defense. Yet like Edmunds has boom or bust potential. 

Edited February 18, 2023 by The Jokeman

[RG Murdock]

Has anyone EVER confronted Beane on the Bernard pick? I'd love to see his response. It's picks like Bernard, Basham, Epenesa, that have me doubting Beane's thinking when it comes to defensive line picks. Bernard even looks soft. If the Bills take a step back this year, it's mostly on Beane. His D-Line picks have been mostly atrocious. Even the Oliver pick, appears to be a bust considering where he was drafted, and the fact that the Bills are NOT going to keep him.      

[MrEpsYtown]

15 hours ago, Chaos said:

I love Jack Campbell.  Different type of player.  We need to to address offense in rounds 1 and 2.   He won't be around in round three. But he his an old school MLB.  might be wasted in the McDermott/Frazier full time prevent defense. 
 

 

That video shows him make some really good plays in zone coverage. Again, he’s not the athlete of Edmunds, but his instincts are just different. I love the way he dropped and got that pick off Stroud. I have yet to see Tremaine do something like that. 
 

I think he fits and plays the run better, but I do agree that he may be better off in another scheme. 

[MrEpsYtown]

13 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

Drew Sanders was compared to Edmunds in the NFL.com draft writeup. As he's hot the same length and experience in a 4-2-5 defense. Yet like Edmunds has boom or bust potential. 

Yeah I think Sanders is a bit of project who will take time and the kind of prospect this regime does not trust. I really like the player though. I am excited to watch him blow up the combine. 
 

Jack Campbell and Trenton Simpson, Noah Sewell as well, to me are step in, plug and play guys who can make all the calls and get everyone where they need to be. Sanders may end up being the best of them all, but he isn’t plug and play and these guys won’t trust him with the green dot. 

[bearcat]

https://www.drafttek.com/2023-NFL-Draft-Position-Rankings/Top-College-ILBs-2023-NFL-Draft.asp

[MrEpsYtown]

Noah Sewell

 

 

 

 

 

[BigdaddyinOrlando]

7 hours ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I hear that. He is definitely more 4-3 mike than 4-2-5 nickel backer. I think his projection is going to come down his combine workout. I remember Luke Keuchly originally had that 2-3 round projection and blew up the combine and that all changed. I see a similar fate for Campbell. I think he is way more athletic than people think. Does he get into the top ten? No but I think late 1 early two. 

Watched a lot of his games as the Mrs is from Iowa and all he did is make plays. Not sure how he translates to the NFL but kid is player for sure 

[MrEpsYtown]

8 minutes ago, bearcat said:

https://www.drafttek.com/2023-NFL-Draft-Position-Rankings/Top-College-ILBs-2023-NFL-Draft.asp

Based on that list, I fully expect Dillon Doyle to be a Bill, highly recommended by Dave Aranda. 🤷‍♂️
 

 

 

[GunnerBill]

52 minutes ago, Chaos said:

Your addition of Graham seems to fill out the consensus in this thread that there are lots ways to move on from Edmunds (on rookie contracts)

 

I think there are. And if he wants top of the market money that is the right move.

[Yantha]

16 hours ago, newcam2012 said:

You think 3rd round draft choice Bernard can get it done? 

I think it's a bit too hard to tell from a rookie season.  I thought the pick was a reach then....  but I remain hopeful he can become at least solid depth.

[Yantha]

16 hours ago, chongli said:

So people here want defense...again...with day one or day two picks? 

Depends on how the draft falls.  I'd be fine with defense but prefer O-line early and often.  I just don't think you pass on a quality linebacker, safety or corner if one slips down pretty far and it's a value pick.  

 

 

[Low Positive]

8 minutes ago, Yantha said:

I think it's a bit too hard to tell from a rookie season.  I thought the pick was a reach then....  but I remain hopeful he can become at least solid depth.

I made a post a few weeks ago where I dig through old mocks to see what the consensus was on Beane’s picks before the respective drafts. Bernard was the only one of the picks that have not planned out that was a reach. I mean, a lot of mocks had Cody Ford as a first rounder. Boogie too. 

[GunnerBill]

40 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

Noah Sewell

 

 

 

 

Again I am not massive on comps generally but this time of year when I watch guys I start seeing guys from other recent drafts. Noah Sewell is Nick Bolton IMO. The ceiling isn't super high but the floor is high and he is a pretty safe plug and play guy.

[gjv]

Compared to Running Back, O-Linemen, and Wide Receiver, Line Backers is not a position requiring an upgrade to make the Bills a better team.

[ProcessTruster]

Something in the 3rd or beyond.   I personally do not want to pay Edmunds.   Let him go.   Spend his $$ on the offense.  

Edited February 18, 2023 by ProcessTruster

[CookieG]

I like Jack Campbell but like protecting Josh more.  It depends on where he goes and who we've taken. 

 

I'll throw another name out there that hasn't been mentioned, (I don't think).

 

Daiyan Henley Washington St.

 

Quick, agile, strong, great instincts.  Voted the best LB in Senior Bowl practices this year.  6'1" 230lbs.

[HappyDays]

5 hours ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I think he fits and plays the run better, but I do agree that he may be better off in another scheme. 

 

It's time to change up our scheme anyways. We've done the same thing for six years with very little variation. That makes it way too easy for smart offensive coaches to take advantage. Last year we drafted a press man CB which was a nice variation that our coaches for some reason rused to utilize. If we draft a more traditional LB maybe that opens the door to call defensive plays that our opponents don't have six seasons worth of tape to dissect.

[HappyDays]

21 hours ago, Chaos said:

I love Jack Campbell.  Different type of player.  We need to to address offense in rounds 1 and 2.   He won't be around in round three. But he his an old school MLB.  might be wasted in the McDermott/Frazier full time prevent defense. 
 

 

 

First play of the video I see him do something I've never seen Edmunds do - track a tipped ball and intercept it, and even have the wherewithal to keep moving forward after catching it. He looks slow so you're correct that we would need to change up our scheme to fit him in. But instincts can make up for speed. And I love his physicality. This defense has been missing size and brutality. It's all finesse. You need a couple guys on defense that the opposing players are scared of. The more I think about it the more I would love him in round 2 if he's still there.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Kiko Alonzo?

[Chaos]

53 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

First play of the video I see him do something I've never seen Edmunds do - track a tipped ball and intercept it, and even have the wherewithal to keep moving forward after catching it. He looks slow so you're correct that we would need to change up our scheme to fit him in. But instincts can make up for speed. And I love his physicality. This defense has been missing size and brutality. It's all finesse. You need a couple guys on defense that the opposing players are scared of. The more I think about it the more I would love him in round 2 if he's still there.

My biggest fear is we commit huge dollars to Edmunds, effectively locking us into a defensive scheme, and DC, that seems to have been figured out by the good teams.  

[MrEpsYtown]

Germaine Pratt…he’s my #1 in free agency. PFF has him at 3 years 24 million. 

 

 

[MrEpsYtown]

Target 2: Drue Tranquill. PFF has him at 2 years 8.5 million.

 

nice breakdown from DJ:

 

 

[McBean]

22 hours ago, MrEpsYtown said:

Yeah he’s probably the first one off the board. Dude can play. He’s better than Nick Bolton. I have no issue grabbing him in the first. 

 

Dude. Absolute stud.

we use a 1st round draft pick on a defensive player this year, I’m out until McDermott is fired.

 

won’t waste my time anymore dealing with his bs

[Mr. WEO]

[Maine-iac]

I like Edmunds and I'm sure in their  minds they think there is no way we can play our defense without Edmunds but lets not forget we gave up roughly the same ppg in 2017 with Preston Brown at MLB and made the playoffs.

[1st&ten]

On 2/17/2023 at 5:17 PM, Chaos said:

Seems like there are several third round type players who can be suitable Edmunds replacements.  This assumes we are keeping Frazier and our scheme.  

These are two:
DeMarvion Overshown - former safety who grew up to be a linebacker

https://thedraftnetwork.com/sr-prospect/demarvion-overshown-9d45f5cd-68e2-4ed1-ba13-6c61db37b4b8/

 DeMarvion Overshown 🔥 FREAKISH LINEBACKER ᴴᴰ  WARNING EXPLICIT LYRICS

 

Drew Sanders - Projects all over the place from early second to late third

Best Linebacker in the Nation 💪 | Drew Sanders 2022 Arkansas Highlights 🐗 || HD
 

 

They both look pretty good but they are high light videos. I think Edmunds is pretty good but with our cap situation I don't think we can afford to resign him, we have too many other needs. Milano is 1-A and Edmunds is 1-B.

[MrEpsYtown]

I know this thread is about draft replacements, but I have another FA target: Cole Holcomb.

 

If Beandon Beane really wants to stick it to Washington, he should steal this guy who has kind of become their heart and soul. He is coming off season ending foot surgery. The Bills heavily scouted Cole in 2019 but unfortunately went with the upside play in Vosean Joseph. 
 

Holcomb is a very smart aggressive player. He is also fast and strong and a team captain. He would be a silky smooth fit having come from Ron Rivera’s system. Being a UNC grad, the braintrust here probably saw a lot of him back in the day during his college career.  He doesn’t have the upside of a Tremaine and won’t cost nearly as much but this is the kind of solid piece that can make upd for Tremaine’s loss in a lot of ways. 
 

 

I’d probably go: Tremaine, Pratt, Tranquill, Holcomb, draft pick in that order. 

[HappyDays]

2 hours ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I know this thread is about draft replacements, but I have another FA target: Cole Holcomb.

 

If Beandon Beane really wants to stick it to Washington, he should steal this guy who has kind of become their heart and soul. He is coming off season ending foot surgery. The Bills heavily scouted Cole in 2019 but unfortunately went with the upside play in Vosean Joseph. 
 

Holcomb is a very smart aggressive player. He is also fast and strong and a team captain. He would be a silky smooth fit having come from Ron Rivera’s system. Being a UNC grad, the braintrust here probably saw a lot of him back in the day during his college career.  He doesn’t have the upside of a Tremaine and won’t cost nearly as much but this is the kind of solid piece that can make upd for Tremaine’s loss in a lot of ways. 
 

 

I’d probably go: Tremaine, Pratt, Tranquill, Holcomb, draft pick in that order. 

 

I'm good on more small linebackers. Size wins in the NFL. It's a trait that Beane has not put enough stock in. I don't want us approaching the offseason with the mindset of just filling positions on defense. It's more about finding the type of player we are missing. Brutal, mean, imposing. Edmunds finally had a very good year but you wouldn't use any of those words to describe his play. Ditto for Milano. Terrel Bernard was supposedly a "heart and soul" guy at Baylor. I want muscle and sinew. It's why I have grown to love the idea of Jack Campell in the 2nd. You watch clips of him and nobody is moving him backwards, he is stopping runners dead in their tracks and even dragging them backwards in some cases. We don't have anyone on defense with that ability right now. Edmunds even when in the right position often gets taken for a ride by the ball carrier. It's part of our overall defensive mindset - "giving up 6 yards is okay." But it isn't okay. Giving up 0 yards is the goal. I'd like our player evaluation to start matching that reality.