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Injuries NOT an excuse. Bills tied for 5th fewest man games lost to injury thru Week 11


Big Turk
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Injuries are an excuse like it was for Baltimore last year.  Saying injuries aren't an excuse is basically saying the back ups are equally as effective as the starters.

 

A regular rate of injuries to starters, if you're a good team, shouldn't faze you too much.  But when you have this:

- Von Miller (Indefinitely)

- Jordan Poyer (4 games)

- Micah Hyde (15 games)

- Tre White (10 games)

- Kair Elam (2 games)

- Christian Benford (3 games + additional 4 games for IR)

- Jordan Phillips (3 games)

- Tim Settle (2 games)

- Ed Oliver (4 games)

- Greg Rosseau  (3 games)

- Tremaine Edmunds (3 games)

- Matt Milano (1 game)

 

Everyone of these players except Milano missed multiple games or will miss multiple games.  That's 4 All Pro's on defense that we have missed multiple games at the same time.  That's many key contributing starters who aren't All Pro's. 

Not only that, but the back ups have gotten hurt and we've had to use 3rd and 4th stringers.

We have had every single starter injured except Taron Johnson and DaQuan.  That's unreal.

 

If the Cowboys were missing Parsons, Diggs, Lawrence, Kearse, Vander Esch, Anthony Brown and Armstrong all around the same time and for multiple games...would they be as good?  

Edited by Royale with Cheese
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You can't discount the quality of players injured.  The Bills aren't losing "unimportant" players.  Every All-Pro besides Diggs has missed a game or are dealing with an injury affecting their performance.  It's not like they're missing special team players.  These positions are literally the most important positions in football....LT, CB, FS, SS, DE.  These matter

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6 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Injuries are an excuse like it was for Baltimore last year.  Saying injuries aren't an excuse is basically saying the back ups are equally as effective as the starters.

 

A regular rate of injuries to starters, if you're a good team, shouldn't faze you too much.  But when you have this:

- Von Miller (Indefinitely)

- Jordan Poyer (4 games)

- Micah Hyde (15 games)

- Tre White (10 games)

- Kair Elam (2 games)

- Christian Benford (3 games + additional 4 games for IR)

- Jordan Phillips (3 games)

- Tim Settle (2 games)

- Ed Oliver (4 games)

- Greg Rosseau  (3 games)

- Tremaine Edmunds (3 games)

- Matt Milano (1 game)

 

Everyone of these players except Milano missed multiple games or will miss multiple games.  That's 4 All Pro's on defense that we have missed multiple games at the same time.  That's many key contributing starters who aren't All Pro's. 

Not only that, but the back ups have gotten hurt and we've had to use 3rd and 4th stringers.

We have had every single starter injured except Taron Johnson.  That's unreal.

 

If the Cowboys were missing Parsons, Diggs, Lawrence, Kearse, Vander Esch, Anthony Brown and Armstrong all around the same time and for multiple games...would they be as good?  


Bingo.  What’s crazy to me is how obvious this is and yet people unrealistically arguing against it.  

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25 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Injuries are an excuse like it was for Baltimore last year.  Saying injuries aren't an excuse is basically saying the back ups are equally as effective as the starters.

 

A regular rate of injuries to starters, if you're a good team, shouldn't faze you too much.  But when you have this:

- Von Miller (Indefinitely)

- Jordan Poyer (4 games)

- Micah Hyde (15 games)

- Tre White (10 games)

- Kair Elam (2 games)

- Christian Benford (3 games + additional 4 games for IR)

- Jordan Phillips (3 games)

- Tim Settle (2 games)

- Ed Oliver (4 games)

- Greg Rosseau  (3 games)

- Tremaine Edmunds (3 games)

- Matt Milano (1 game)

 

Everyone of these players except Milano missed multiple games or will miss multiple games.  That's 4 All Pro's on defense that we have missed multiple games at the same time.  That's many key contributing starters who aren't All Pro's. 

Not only that, but the back ups have gotten hurt and we've had to use 3rd and 4th stringers.

We have had every single starter injured except Taron Johnson and DaQuan.  That's unreal.

 

If the Cowboys were missing Parsons, Diggs, Lawrence, Kearse, Vander Esch, Anthony Brown and Armstrong all around the same time and for multiple games...would they be as good?  

Yea… they’ve made huge investments defensively and as you mentioned those defensive pieces have been banged up all year… couple that with an offense that’s has had it’s share of problems due to lack luster personnel upfront and out wide and Allen struggling with TOs and this is what you get…. They are gutting out some wins, but if they want any shot in the playoffs they need to get everyone healthy defensively. 
 

Good news is it looks like Rousseau and Edmunds will be back this week, more snaps for Tre and a healthier Elam(although he’s had his struggles too).

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11 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

Yea… they’ve made huge investments defensively and as you mentioned those defensive pieces have been banged up all year… couple that with an offense that’s has had it’s share of problems due to lack luster personnel upfront and out wide and Allen struggling with TOs and this is what you get…. They are gutting out some wins, but if they want any shot in the playoffs they need to get everyone healthy defensively. 
 

Good news is it looks like Rousseau and Edmunds will be back this week, more snaps for Tre and a healthier Elam(although he’s had his struggles too).

 

I am 100% on a firm stance with #2 WR being our main priority in the offseason.

Gabe Davis is a #3 at best.  He's a guy you want to make the big play down the field but not to rely on consistently throughout a game.

 

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1. As others have pointed out in this thread, not all injuries are created equal. The Bills have lost key players, star players, etc, which count the same as an injured third string linebacker in this data.

2. As others have pointed out in this thread, the Bills are 8-3. "Excuses" for what, exactly? Being tied for the division lead and one game out of the AFC 1-seed?

This post has big "Big Turk Energy".

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52 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Injuries are an excuse like it was for Baltimore last year.  Saying injuries aren't an excuse is basically saying the back ups are equally as effective as the starters.

 

A regular rate of injuries to starters, if you're a good team, shouldn't faze you too much.  But when you have this:

- Von Miller (Indefinitely)

- Jordan Poyer (4 games)

- Micah Hyde (15 games)

- Tre White (10 games)

- Kair Elam (2 games)

- Christian Benford (3 games + additional 4 games for IR)

- Jordan Phillips (3 games)

- Tim Settle (2 games)

- Ed Oliver (4 games)

- Greg Rosseau  (3 games)

- Tremaine Edmunds (3 games)

- Matt Milano (1 game)

 

Everyone of these players except Milano missed multiple games or will miss multiple games.  That's 4 All Pro's on defense that we have missed multiple games at the same time.  That's many key contributing starters who aren't All Pro's. 

Not only that, but the back ups have gotten hurt and we've had to use 3rd and 4th stringers.

We have had every single starter injured except Taron Johnson and DaQuan.  That's unreal.

 

If the Cowboys were missing Parsons, Diggs, Lawrence, Kearse, Vander Esch, Anthony Brown and Armstrong all around the same time and for multiple games...would they be as good?  

Thank you.... the troubling thing is, you had to waste your time typing this all out because people are having a really hard time grasping the difference between cumulative injuries vs quality of players injured.

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2 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

Thank you.... the troubling thing is, you had to waste your time typing this all out because people are having a really hard time grasping the difference between cumulative injuries vs quality of players injured.

 

We have 3 players on our secondary that have either made All Pro or 2nd Team All Pro.  All of them have missed significant time.

Poyer is the only one that has really played this year and he's missed 4 games himself.  That's 75% of one unit, your strongest unit depleted.

 

Would the Legion of Boom be great if Sherman, Kam Chancellor and Earl Thomas missed most of the year?

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25 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

I am 100% on a firm stance with #2 WR being our main priority in the offseason.

Gabe Davis is a #3 at best.  He's a guy you want to make the big play down the field but not to rely on consistently throughout a game.

 

 

I can't at this moment in time see an argument for our first-round pick not being a WR UNLESS it is a Left Tackle. Dawkins has been okay, but not his best and I still say as he approaches his 30s the natural position for him is left guard. If they get a chance to draft a franchise left tackle they should consider it. The thing is those guys go early and you have a much better chance of drafting a guy who can be a #1 receiver (even if initially the #2 to Diggs) at the end of round 1. 

Edited by GunnerBill
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3 minutes ago, DapperCam said:

Can you imagine the Miami game if we weren’t missing so many starters in the secondary? We had someone named Ingram I’ve never heard of before playing boundary corner against Tyreek Hill and Waddle, lol!

 

In the second half after Benford got injured....Cam Lewis and Ja'Marcus Ingram were our starting CB's.

Not to mention Hamlin and Johnson were our starting Safety's.  


This secondary went up against one of the best WR tandem in the league.

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6 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

We have 3 players on our secondary that have either made All Pro or 2nd Team All Pro.  All of them have missed significant time.

Poyer is the only one that has really played this year and he's missed 4 games himself.  That's 75% of one unit, your strongest unit depleted.

 

Would the Legion of Boom be great if Sherman, Kam Chancellor and Earl Thomas missed most of the year?

ya man. i'm with you. these arent just role players going down. Its been players directly responsible for the winning thats been done the last 3 years. We're talking about MULTIPLE all pro players. its huge, man.

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2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I can't at this moment in time see an argument for our first-round pick not being a WR UNLESS it is a Left Tackle. Dawkins has been okay, but not his best and I still say as he approaches his 30s the natural position for him is left guard. If they get a chance to draft a franchise left tackle they should consider it. The thing is those guys go early and you have a much better chance of drafting a guy who can be a #1 receiver (even if initially the #2 to Diggs) at the end of round 1. 

 

I think LT could be something they look at closer to Dawkins reaching his upper 20's.

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1 minute ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

In the second half after Benford got injured....Cam Lewis and Ja'Marcus Ingram were our starting CB's.

Not to mention Hamlin and Johnson were our starting Safety's.  


This secondary went up against one of the best WR tandem in the league.

Defense played admirably that day. i think maybe that early in the season, frazier and mcdermott still had a scheming upperhand. But now The warts are on plenty of tape for everyone to see and we havnt had the talent out there to cover it up.

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1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Injuries are an excuse like it was for Baltimore last year.  Saying injuries aren't an excuse is basically saying the back ups are equally as effective as the starters.

 

A regular rate of injuries to starters, if you're a good team, shouldn't faze you too much.  But when you have this:

- Von Miller (Indefinitely)

- Jordan Poyer (4 games)

- Micah Hyde (15 games)

- Tre White (10 games)

- Kair Elam (2 games)

- Christian Benford (3 games + additional 4 games for IR)

- Jordan Phillips (3 games)

- Tim Settle (2 games)

- Ed Oliver (4 games)

- Greg Rosseau  (3 games)

- Tremaine Edmunds (3 games)

- Matt Milano (1 game)

 

Everyone of these players except Milano missed multiple games or will miss multiple games.  That's 4 All Pro's on defense that we have missed multiple games at the same time.  That's many key contributing starters who aren't All Pro's. 

Not only that, but the back ups have gotten hurt and we've had to use 3rd and 4th stringers.

We have had every single starter injured except Taron Johnson and DaQuan.  That's unreal.

 

If the Cowboys were missing Parsons, Diggs, Lawrence, Kearse, Vander Esch, Anthony Brown and Armstrong all around the same time and for multiple games...would they be as good?  

Dane Jackson wants to know why he was left off this list 😅 He missed the Dolphins game with the neck injury.

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1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Injuries are an excuse like it was for Baltimore last year.  Saying injuries aren't an excuse is basically saying the back ups are equally as effective as the starters.

 

A regular rate of injuries to starters, if you're a good team, shouldn't faze you too much.  But when you have this:

- Von Miller (Indefinitely)

- Jordan Poyer (4 games)

- Micah Hyde (15 games)

- Tre White (10 games)

- Kair Elam (2 games)

- Christian Benford (3 games + additional 4 games for IR)

- Jordan Phillips (3 games)

- Tim Settle (2 games)

- Ed Oliver (4 games)

- Greg Rosseau  (3 games)

- Tremaine Edmunds (3 games)

- Matt Milano (1 game)

 

Everyone of these players except Milano missed multiple games or will miss multiple games.  That's 4 All Pro's on defense that we have missed multiple games at the same time.  That's many key contributing starters who aren't All Pro's. 

Not only that, but the back ups have gotten hurt and we've had to use 3rd and 4th stringers.

We have had every single starter injured except Taron Johnson and DaQuan.  That's unreal.

 

If the Cowboys were missing Parsons, Diggs, Lawrence, Kearse, Vander Esch, Anthony Brown and Armstrong all around the same time and for multiple games...would they be as good?  

 

The Ravens last year and 49ers in 2020 were teams that were decimated with season ending injuries to key players so that's a bit different IMO.

 

But looking at the Bills, sure we've have some key injuries to important players but so far the only one of note lost for an extensive period of time was Hyde in week 2. If Miller is gone for the year that would certainly be another major blow.

 

Also the Cowboys have missed some of those players in question this year and have been just fine also sitting at 8-3. The Bengals are another team that has been hit hard with injuries since the beginning of the year and are 7-2 after and 0-2 start.

 

At the end of the day every team is effected differently but I stand with the original premise of this thread that if the Bills fail to live up to expectations (which is anything short of of a SB appearance) injuries won't be a valid excuse unless a bunch of other key guys land on season ending IR the coming weeks.

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Am I the only one that can read the graph?

 

The Bills circle on the graph is significantly larger than the other teams around them in A) the standings and B) number of games missed. The fact that their circle is the same size as teams with significantly more injuries says exactly what everyone is saying...quality, not quantity, is the issue.

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43 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

We have 3 players on our secondary that have either made All Pro or 2nd Team All Pro.  All of them have missed significant time.

Poyer is the only one that has really played this year and he's missed 4 games himself.  That's 75% of one unit, your strongest unit depleted.

 

Would the Legion of Boom be great if Sherman, Kam Chancellor and Earl Thomas missed most of the year?

Poyer missed the Miami L and Jets L and Vikings L.  
 

In 2 of the losses (Miami and Minny), his replacement was torched for a game changing play that he likely would’ve prevented.  

Milano missing the jets game broke our defense.  Bernard got destroyed.  
 

the quality of players missed = everything 

 

I’d venture to say that if Milano and Poyer hadn’t missed any games, we’d be undefeated.

 

that said…..our offense needs to fix itself or we won’t win the SB

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