Looks like the call to squib may not have made it to Bass

[Livinginthepast]

2 minutes ago, Billl said:

This is the correct answer.  
 

With :13 seconds left and a 3 point lead, you really just want to avoid a catastrophe.  Here’s what we know to be true…

 

Kansas City has fast players.  Byron Pringle has returned multiple kickoffs for TDs.  Tyreek Hill in the 2 playoff games against the Bills has a 71 yard catch and run on a short pass, a 64 yard TD catch and run on a short pass, and a 45 yard punt return while Mecole Hardman had a 50 yard run and an ankle breaking 26 yard TD run.  These are facts.  
 

So the question the coaches have to ask themselves is who do they want on the field defending those guys?  Do they want it to be a bunch of special teams guys who are fringe roster players, or do they want their starting defense?  It’s 100% reasonable to decide that they want to trust their big money players and that kicking it through the end zone checks the “avoid a catastrophe” box.

 

If they’d squibbed it and an up-man fell on it at the 40, that would have been a disaster.  If they’d pooched it and Hardman, Hill, or Pringle had housed it, that would have been a bigger disaster.  The narrative would have been “just kick it through the end zone instead of trying to burn 2 seconds”.  Instead, people are blaming the special teams for not getting cute and burning 3 seconds off the clock.  Seriously, if your mentality is that the defense can defend for 10 seconds but not 13 seconds then you do be on an NFL sideline.

 

The special teams did their job.  They put the defense on the field with a 99% chance to win.

Ok , good points but why doesnt McD just say that and own it?

[TheyCallMeAndy]

Did a fan post this exact thing yesterday siting an inside source?

[SWATeam]

1 minute ago, Billl said:

This is the correct answer.  
 

With :13 seconds left and a 3 point lead, you really just want to avoid a catastrophe.  Here’s what we know to be true…

 

Kansas City has fast players.  Byron Pringle has returned multiple kickoffs for TDs.  Tyreek Hill in the 2 playoff games against the Bills has a 71 yard catch and run on a short pass, a 64 yard TD catch and run on a short pass, and a 45 yard punt return while Mecole Hardman had a 50 yard run and an ankle breaking 26 yard TD run.  These are facts.  
 

So the question the coaches have to ask themselves is who do they want on the field defending those guys?  Do they want it to be a bunch of special teams guys who are fringe roster players, or do they want their starting defense?  It’s 100% reasonable to decide that they want to trust their big money players and that kicking it through the end zone checks the “avoid a catastrophe” box.

 

If they’d squibbed it and an up-man fell on it at the 40, that would have been a disaster.  If they’d pooched it and Hardman, Hill, or Pringle had housed it, that would have been a bigger disaster.  The narrative would have been “just kick it through the end zone instead of trying to burn 2 seconds”.  Instead, people are blaming the special teams for not getting cute and burning 3 seconds off the clock.  Seriously, if your mentality is that the defense can defend for 10 seconds but not 13 seconds then you do be on an NFL sideline.

 

The special teams did their job.  They put the defense on the field with a 99% chance to win.

This is all fear based.

 

Play to win, not not to lose.

 

It's a clear coaching failure.  No need to be aggressive on D and risk the big play.  But what is the point of using four defensive lineman?  A complete waste of bodies.  Pat could not hold the ball anyways so a pass rush is moot.  Take the linemen off and bring DB's in, then you have numbers to jam at the line and protect deep.  It's not complicated.  Instead, we basically conceded the tie...pathetic.

[Niagara Dude]

3 minutes ago, Billl said:

This is the correct answer.  
 

With :13 seconds left and a 3 point lead, you really just want to avoid a catastrophe.  Here’s what we know to be true…

 

Kansas City has fast players.  Byron Pringle has returned multiple kickoffs for TDs.  Tyreek Hill in the 2 playoff games against the Bills has a 71 yard catch and run on a short pass, a 64 yard TD catch and run on a short pass, and a 45 yard punt return while Mecole Hardman had a 50 yard run and an ankle breaking 26 yard TD run.  These are facts.  
 

So the question the coaches have to ask themselves is who do they want on the field defending those guys?  Do they want it to be a bunch of special teams guys who are fringe roster players, or do they want their starting defense?  It’s 100% reasonable to decide that they want to trust their big money players and that kicking it through the end zone checks the “avoid a catastrophe” box.

 

If they’d squibbed it and an up-man fell on it at the 40, that would have been a disaster.  If they’d pooched it and Hardman, Hill, or Pringle had housed it, that would have been a bigger disaster.  The narrative would have been “just kick it through the end zone instead of trying to burn 2 seconds”.  Instead, people are blaming the special teams for not getting cute and burning 3 seconds off the clock.  Seriously, if your mentality is that the defense can defend for 10 seconds but not 13 seconds then you do be on an NFL sideline.

 

The special teams did their job.  They put the defense on the field with a 99% chance to win.

I personally think they threw Bass under the bus too deflect from the brutal coaching decision made on next two plays.  No excuses on those two passes and I don't think it was the players, Sean and Leslie Frazier screwed up on strategy 

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, SWATeam said:

If this is true he has to take the fall.  Unacceptable.

Why does some need to take the fall?  It doesn’t change the outcome.  
 

Our ST unit was one of the best in the NFL this year, so why do you want to weaken it for some sort of personal gratification over a miscommunication?

[Reed83HOF]

13 minutes ago, st pete gogolak said:

Yeah, agree and I know that it's not their job to satisfy the curiousness of the fanbase but I'm genuinely curious now as to what the hell happened.  Was the intent to kick it deep or was something else called and it wasn't conveyed to Bass or was it conveyed to Bass and Bass screwed up?  To me, it's looking like one in the middle.

It's not going to satisfy the curiosity of the fan base, look at everyone on here saying fire Sean, fire beane fire frazier etc...

 

Some kids spray painted mckelvins lawn after his fumble

 

[Billl]

1 minute ago, SWATeam said:

This is all fear based.

 

Play to win, not not to lose.

 

It's a clear coaching failure.  No need to be aggressive on D and risk the big play.  But what is the point of using four defensive lineman?  A complete waste of bodies.  Pat could not hold the ball anyways so a pass rush is moot.  Take the linemen off and bring DB's in, then you have numbers to jam at the line and protect deep.  It's not complicated.  Instead, we basically conceded the tie...pathetic.

That’s probably what they should have done (assuming Hill wouldn’t have cooked them on a deep ball).  It has nothing to do with special teams, though.

[TheFunPolice]

The average kickoff return (that gets 15-20 yards) burns 6-7 seconds of clock. 

 

Squib or pooch inside the 20 and KC likely returns it to the 30 (ish) and burns 6 seconds (we'll go low end).

 

Now, instead of 1st and 10 from the 25 with 13 seconds, it's 1st and 10 from the 30 with 7 seconds. 

 

Game's over, even with the defense we played. There's not enough time for 2 plays and a FG. 

[BuffaloRebound]

7 minutes ago, Billl said:

This is the correct answer.  
 

With :13 seconds left and a 3 point lead, you really just want to avoid a catastrophe.  Here’s what we know to be true…

 

Kansas City has fast players.  Byron Pringle has returned multiple kickoffs for TDs.  Tyreek Hill in the 2 playoff games against the Bills has a 71 yard catch and run on a short pass, a 64 yard TD catch and run on a short pass, and a 45 yard punt return while Mecole Hardman had a 50 yard run and an ankle breaking 26 yard TD run.  These are facts.  
 

So the question the coaches have to ask themselves is who do they want on the field defending those guys?  Do they want it to be a bunch of special teams guys who are fringe roster players, or do they want their starting defense?  It’s 100% reasonable to decide that they want to trust their big money players and that kicking it through the end zone checks the “avoid a catastrophe” box.

 

If they’d squibbed it and an up-man fell on it at the 40, that would have been a disaster.  If they’d pooched it and Hardman, Hill, or Pringle had housed it, that would have been a bigger disaster.  The narrative would have been “just kick it through the end zone instead of trying to burn 2 seconds”.  Instead, people are blaming the special teams for not getting cute and burning 3 seconds off the clock.  Seriously, if your mentality is that the defense can defend for 10 seconds but not 13 seconds then you do be on an NFL sideline.

 

The special teams did their job.  They put the defense on the field with a 99% chance to win.

Not against Mahomes and that offense.  Somebody posted that the only kicks returned for TD’s were brought out of the end zone or goal line.  The short high kick to the 10-15 was the right call.  If Hill was back there, I could live with them kicking it out of end zone.  He inexplicably wasn’t.  That’s the difference between good situational coaches and scared ones.  

[MrEpsYtown]

Ok, so to preface, I love McDermott. I think he does a good job, and he has taken this team out of the abyss. That said, this is his fault. 

 

A few points...so i am a high school football coach, and have been since 2007. As an assistant for many years, I was in charge the offensive and defensive lines, and special teams and relaying calls to our kicker. The head coach I worked with was a bit of a control freak and never let the assistants make their own calls. There were so many times, when I begged and pleaded him to tell me what he wanted...squib, deep, onside, rugby punt etc etc. And there were many times when he would completely ignore me and then be upset with the call that was made on the field. He wasn't ignoring on purpose...he was so enamored and distracted by what we are going to do on offense and defense and what play he was going to call next, that he just did not let special teams enter his mind. Now I am a head coach and I do not call plays. I let my trusted assistants call and send in play calls so that I can pay attention to the flow of the game and make critical decisions and manage the clock. 

 

Now I get it, its high school so obviously very different. But I think McDermott was so caught up in what defense they were going to play, that he allowed this mistake to happen. In my mind he should allow Frazier to make the calls and have his special teams coordinator trained in a way so that he knows that coach wants a squib in that situation. It's about communication and preparation and making sure your guys know what you want in situational football. 

 

I think the moral of the story is that Coach McDermott has to stop thinking like a defensive coordinator and think like a head coach. I do believe he will learn from this. This situational stuff is what the Belichick's of the world excel in, but it takes time to get there. Andy Reid was the absolute worst at situational football. Now he is one of the best.. Every situation is always covered and so there are no surprises and confusion in the moment. Heath Farwell should not be axed over this, unless he ignored a directive from coach McDermott. No one should be fired. Everyone simply needs to get better. 

[TheFunPolice]

Plus, you would expect, and you saw, that KC told their players to GET DOWN and not waste clock. 

 

A TD was never in the cards. Coaches were beating it in their heads: GO DOWN when you catch the ball and call timeout. 

I believe something went wrong on the kickoff, because the D we played was PERFECT for KC having 6-7 seconds of game clock to go 40 yards. 

 

Once the touchback happened we just stayed with the same D were were going to use anyway. 

[Coach Tuesday]

The Denver Broncos are about to sell for close to $4 billion dollars.

 

With that kind of brand value at stake you simply cannot have glorified gym teachers screwing up basic game strategy decisions like this - it is 0% acceptable.

Edited January 26, 2022 by Coach Tuesday

[SWATeam]

7 minutes ago, Billl said:

That’s probably what they should have done (assuming Hill wouldn’t have cooked them on a deep ball).  It has nothing to do with special teams, though.

There are, amazingly, multiple errors including kicking a touchback.

[Matt_In_NH]

1 hour ago, Steptide said:

If true, that's legit terrible. The ONE guy who needs to know didn't know 

Not that it changes much but if true it was super critical all 11 NEED to know

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, Reed83HOF said:

Not sure it is fireable, that is on mcd to error proof that process. It's unfortunate, but it is a gap in your process. The coaching staff will fix it and put countermeasures in place to prevent it from happening again. Aside from Haack (and this kick), the unit was good all season.

 

I think you're forgetting a few things.

Like the  blocked punt for 7 points in the Steelers game (which we lost by 7); that was NOT on Haack.

 

[Livinginthepast]

1 minute ago, TheFunPolice said:

The average kickoff return (that gets 15-20 yards) burns 6-7 seconds of clock. 

 

Squib or pooch inside the 20 and KC likely returns it to the 30 (ish) and burns 6 seconds (we'll go low end).

 

Now, instead of 1st and 10 from the 25 with 13 seconds, it's 1st and 10 from the 30 with 7 seconds. 

 

Game's over, even with the defense we played. There's not enough time for 2 plays and a FG. 

KC would have had a huge conundrum on the kickoff if we had squibbed it or popped it up. 

 

1. If they fall on it right away to avoid clock burning, they are stuck between the goal line and the 25, way worse field position for Mahomes and co to do anything.

 

2. If they return it, the seconds burn off. So they would have had to do Home run throwback play or something special. or get the hell out of bounds and that would have left 7 seconds likely on the clock

 

Instead of forcing them into these two bad scenarios. The Bills removed any stress by kicking through the end zone. Then they gift wrapped the game by playing the stupidest possible defensive strategy on two plays in a row. Amateur hour coaching at its finest!

[Hapless Bills Fan]

6 minutes ago, TheFunPolice said:

Plus, you would expect, and you saw, that KC told their players to GET DOWN and not waste clock. 

 

A TD was never in the cards. Coaches were beating it in their heads: GO DOWN when you catch the ball and call timeout. 

I believe something went wrong on the kickoff, because the D we played was PERFECT for KC having 6-7 seconds of game clock to go 40 yards. 

 

Once the touchback happened we just stayed with the same D were were going to use anyway. 

 

That's a mistake, if so, especially since we used time-outs.  We had time to re-consider.

[TheFunPolice]

Just now, Livinginthepast said:

KC would have had a huge conundrum on the kickoff if we had squibbed it or popped it up. 

 

1. If they fall on it right away to avoid clock burning, they are stuck between the goal line and the 25, way worse field position for Mahomes and co to do anything.

 

2. If they return it, the seconds burn off. So they would have had to do Home run throwback play or something special. or get the hell out of bounds and that would have left 7 seconds likely on the clock

 

Instead of forcing them into these two bad scenarios. The Bills removed any stress by kicking through the end zone. Then they gift wrapped the game by playing the stupidest possible defensive strategy on two plays in a row. Amateur hour coaching at its finest!

 

Exactly!

 

You have to at LEAST put pressure on the other team to make a decision in a split second, emotional moment!

 

Instead we just let them take an easy touchback and play catch with their WR and TE. 

[SWATeam]

9 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Why does some need to take the fall?  It doesn’t change the outcome.  
 

Our ST unit was one of the best in the NFL this year, so why do you want to weaken it for some sort of personal gratification over a miscommunication?

This is the big leagues and there are consequences.  You want to preach accountability, it's not just for the players.

 

I'm not assuming this report is correct but, if so, it's not some simple miscommunication to learn from.  It's an inexcusable failure.

[TheFunPolice]

Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

That's a mistake, if so, especially since we used time-outs.  We had time to re-consider.

 

I think McD figured that it was the perfect defense to follow a squib/pooch, but it would also work with 13 seconds, albeit not as ideal. 

 

It was the perfect defense to stop 1 play, but not 2.