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Inigo Montoya

Beane free agent WR signings

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The Odell Beckham trade by the Browns got all the publicity and love this off season.  The Cole Beasley and John Brown signings were also ran signings that flew completely under the radar.  Look at the contracts and stats of those three players twelve weeks into the season with the Bills heading towards the playoffs and the Browns all but eliminated from the post season.

 

Odell Beckham Jr  compensation; 

2019   $17,000,000

2020   $14,250,000

2021   $15,750,000

2022   $15,000,000

2023   $ 15,000,000

OBJ 2019 production through 12 games;

57 catches

805 yards

2 TDs

 

Cole Beasley compensation;

2019   $11,400,000

2020   $5,600,000

2021   $5,900,000

2022   $6,100,000

Beasley 2019 production through 12 games;

55 catches

635 yards

5 TDs

 

John Brown compensation;

2019   $10,700,000

2020   $8,150,000

2021   $8,150,000

John Brown 2019  production through 12 games;

61 catches

882 yards

5 TDs

 

OBJ has the big name and the pedigree and there is no mistaking his elite receiving skills, but I think Beane and McDermott have it right when it comes to team building.  It's not about collecting a bunch of talented individual players, it's about bringing together a group of players who are willing to play team football.  I think the 2019 Bills are greater than the sum of their parts and teams like the Browns and the Cowboys simply are not.  Look how far this Buffalo Bills franchise has come in the last two years.  It's getting hard to argue against the position that Beane and McDermott are a top 5 GM/Coach combo in the league right now.

 

Edited by Inigo Montoya
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There are several chapters yet to be written about Beane and McDermott and this season alone neither proves or disproves their competence at team building.  Early signs are encouraging though.

 

Still, teams do not win without elite talent in the NFL and the HC and GM need better offensive talent for the long haul, particularly at WR because Buffalo has no depth there after Brown and Beasley.  Speaking of those two,  Brown turns 30 in April and Beasley will be 31 that month so they need talent there.  The point is that coaches or GMs who eschew star players so as to have an easier way with building their culture are doing themselves a disservice. 

 

OBJ is a #1 receiver in a league with few of them.  He's on a team with internal strife at every level and his production cannot be isolated down himself alone.  He's a far better receiver that what one season's stats say and just because he hasn't lived up to the hype of that move doesn't mean he won't.  

 

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I think most of the experts would agree that the McBean combo has been great. Can't argue against it the results speak for themselves. We're 9-3 going on a 2nd playoff birth in 3 years ... yes, that's the Bills we're talking about lol. 

 

Only thing left to do is see where the ceiling is and how long they can sustain success. 

Edited by dayman
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14 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

The Odell Beckham trade by the Browns got all the publicity and love this off season.  The Cole Beasley and John Brown signings were also ran signings that flew completely under the radar.  Lets take a look at the three players twelve weeks into the season with the Bills heading towards the playoffs and the Browns all but eliminated from the post season.

 

Odell Beckham Jr  compensation; 

2019   $17,000,000

2020   $14,250,000

2021   $15,750,000

2022   $15,000,000

2023   $ 15,000,000

OBJ 2019 production through 12 games;

57 catches

805 yards

2 TDs

 

Cole Beasley compensation;

2019   $11,400,000

2020   $5,600,000

2021   $5,900,000

2022   $6,100,000

Beasley 2019 production through 12 games;

55 catches

635 yards

5 TDs

 

John Brown compensation;

2019   $10,700,000

2020   $8,150,000

2021   $8,150,000

John Brown 2019  production through 12 games;

61 catches

882 yards

5 TDs

 

OBJ has the big name and the pedigree and there is no mistaking his elite receiving skills, but I think Beane and McDermott have it right when it comes to team building.  It's not about collecting a bunch of talented individual players, it's about bringing together a group of players who are willing to play team football.  I think the 2019 Bills are greater than the sum of their parts and teams like the Browns and the Cowboys simply are not.  Look how far this Buffalo Bills franchise has come in the last two years.  I think Beane and McDermott are a top 5 GM/Coach combo in the league right now.

 

I agree! And I love how Beane  has structured the contracts with more Paid out in the first year. I think his goal is if his signing doesn’t pan out he has no intention of taking huge dead cap hits. 

Edited by loveorhatembillsfan4life
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17 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

The Odell Beckham trade by the Browns got all the publicity and love this off season.  The Cole Beasley and John Brown signings were also ran signings that flew completely under the radar.  Lets take a look at the three players twelve weeks into the season with the Bills heading towards the playoffs and the Browns all but eliminated from the post season.

 

Odell Beckham Jr  compensation; 

2019   $17,000,000

2020   $14,250,000

2021   $15,750,000

2022   $15,000,000

2023   $ 15,000,000

OBJ 2019 production through 12 games;

57 catches

805 yards

2 TDs

 

Cole Beasley compensation;

2019   $11,400,000

2020   $5,600,000

2021   $5,900,000

2022   $6,100,000

Beasley 2019 production through 12 games;

55 catches

635 yards

5 TDs

 

John Brown compensation;

2019   $10,700,000

2020   $8,150,000

2021   $8,150,000

John Brown 2019  production through 12 games;

61 catches

882 yards

5 TDs

 

OBJ has the big name and the pedigree and there is no mistaking his elite receiving skills, but I think Beane and McDermott have it right when it comes to team building.  It's not about collecting a bunch of talented individual players, it's about bringing together a group of players who are willing to play team football.  I think the 2019 Bills are greater than the sum of their parts and teams like the Browns and the Cowboys simply are not.  Look how far this Buffalo Bills franchise has come in the last two years.  It's getting hard to argue against the position that Beane and McDermott are a top 5 GM/Coach combo in the league right now.

 

Those numbers may be a tad misleading, Beasley and Brown have a better quarterback throwing them the ball.

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11 minutes ago, BillsVet said:

There are several chapters yet to be written about Beane and McDermott and this season alone neither proves or disproves their competence at team building.  Early signs are encouraging though.

 

Still, teams do not win without elite talent in the NFL and the HC and GM need better offensive talent for the long haul, particularly at WR because Buffalo has no depth there after Brown and Beasley.  Speaking of those two,  Brown turns 30 in April and Beasley will be 31 that month so they need talent there.  The point is that coaches or GMs who eschew star players so as to have an easier way with building their culture are doing themselves a disservice. 

 

OBJ is a #1 receiver in a league with few of them.  He's on a team with internal strife at every level and his production cannot be isolated down himself alone.  He's a far better receiver that what one season's stats say and just because he hasn't lived up to the hype of that move doesn't mean he won't.  

 

 

All fair points BillsVet.  I'm not here to argue that OBJ isn't a more talented receiver. 

 

My larger point is about how you build a competitive team. I don't know if you do need a bunch of elite players to win a championship.  I think there is also something to be said for building a roster top to bottom with solid, team oriented players.  I'd argue that the only elite talent on the Patriots is their head coach and Stephon Gilmore, but they are still winning.  I think Brady is more of a game manager right now.

 

Brown and Beasley are both on team friendly deals as well so if their play declines Beane and Co. can move on without hamstringing the franchise going forward.  I think next year we will only be a piece or two away from contending for a Super Bowl.  We have $90mm in cap space to go out and find those pieces and I trust Beane to find them.  I don't think there will be as much hesitation from free agents to come to Buffalo either after this season.

 

Edited by Inigo Montoya
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Another good outside receiver will really open up the offense more.  Was hoping Foster was going to be that guy but it’s not looking like it.  

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16 minutes ago, BillsVet said:

There are several chapters yet to be written about Beane and McDermott and this season alone neither proves or disproves their competence at team building.  Early signs are encouraging though.

 

Still, teams do not win without elite talent in the NFL and the HC and GM need better offensive talent for the long haul, particularly at WR because Buffalo has no depth there after Brown and Beasley.  Speaking of those two,  Brown turns 30 in April and Beasley will be 31 that month so they need talent there.  The point is that coaches or GMs who eschew star players so as to have an easier way with building their culture are doing themselves a disservice. 

 

OBJ is a #1 receiver in a league with few of them.  He's on a team with internal strife at every level and his production cannot be isolated down himself alone.  He's a far better receiver that what one season's stats say and just because he hasn't lived up to the hype of that move doesn't mean he won't.  

 


You can take the OBJ’s of the world. He is part of what you describe as Cleveland’s “internal strife at every level”.

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I don’t think OBJ would of fit in to the culture McDermott and Beane want. 
OBJ looks to draw attention to himself, the Bills players look to praise each other. 

Edited by atlbillsfan1975
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47 minutes ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

Another good outside receiver will really open up the offense more.  Was hoping Foster was going to be that guy but it’s not looking like it.  

You are right about a getting a 2nd good outside receiver, it will help the entire offense/team. Really wish Foster would reappear so to speak. 

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I would certainly rather spend 25 million on 4 WR who are good but not elite then spend 30 on 2 elite recievers and need to be cheap after that. Your 4th reciever needs to be able to make plays because almost any single reciever can removed from a game plan.

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1 hour ago, dayman said:

 We're 9-3 going on a 2nd playoff birth in 3 years

Please don't do that!

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1 hour ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

I don’t think OBJ would of fit in to the culture McDermott and Beane want. 
OBJ looks to draw attention to himself, the Bills players look to praise each other. 

Sometimes guys like that can fit in. You can only have so many of them before it changes the locker room though. The Browns have several paired with a few knuckleheads and a coach that doesn’t have control of the team. I’d imagine there are a few teams that OBJ would STFU on and just play. 

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1 hour ago, twist_to_open said:

Those numbers may be a tad misleading, Beasley and Brown have a better quarterback throwing them the ball.

 

He is also taking away throws by running including for TDs but you do not hear any complaints from wide receivers that he is hurting their stats.

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The Browns didn’t just give up money/cap space. They had to trade for OBJ. Makes it even worse. They gave up 1st and 3rd round picks and Peppers.

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1 hour ago, Inigo Montoya said:

All fair points BillsVet.  I'm not here to argue that OBJ isn't a more talented receiver. 

 

My larger point is about how you build a competitive team. I don't know if you do need a bunch of elite players to win a championship.  I think there is also something to be said for building a roster top to bottom with solid, team oriented players.  I'd argue that the only elite talent on the Patriots is their head coach and Stephon Gilmore, but they are still winning.  I think Brady is more of a game manager right now.

 

Brown and Beasley are both on team friendly deals as well so if their play declines Beane and Co. can move on without hamstringing the franchise going forward.  I think next year we will only be a piece or two away from contending for a Super Bowl.  We have $90mm in cap space to go out and find those pieces and I trust Beane to find them.  I don't think there will be as much hesitation from free agents to come to Buffalo either after this season.

 

Both the Brown and Beasley deals are at their market value and I wouldn't consider them team-friendly or, for lack of a better term, unfriendly.  

 

I'm concerned with McD's overall personnel decision strategy, as evidenced by their move to take Cody Ford over D.K. Metcalf.  If you've got a chance to get a skill type who can demand defensive attention, that's more important than plodding interior OL types like Ford.  You can find those guys later or in UFA on team friendly contracts.  You don't find top skill types there.    

 

1 hour ago, Binghamton Beast said:

You can take the OBJ’s of the world. He is part of what you describe as Cleveland’s “internal strife at every level”.

 

Not quite.  He is a guy who plays in any system, but has been used as a decoy in many respects by a HC who is not up to par for the NFL.  There aren't many learned Bills fans who would say no to OBJ because he makes plays.  

 

Sometimes HC's have to learn how to manage personalities and not avoid them.  High performing people in any environment make the difference and in a results oriented environment they can be the difference between winning and losing. 

 

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16 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said:

Odell pretty much sucks this season. 

as an OBJ fantasy owner I can say he doesn't pretty much suck, he DOES suck  

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8 minutes ago, WMDman said:

as an OBJ fantasy owner I can say he doesn't pretty much suck, he DOES suck  

 

Of course. He wanted to go to a contender but Jiants sold him to whoever gave the best offer.

So he will try under performing for a while hoping to be traded/cut all the time denying it is performance which is in issue.

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1 hour ago, BillsVet said:

 

Both the Brown and Beasley deals are at their market value and I wouldn't consider them team-friendly or, for lack of a better term, unfriendly.  

 

I'm concerned with McD's overall personnel decision strategy, as evidenced by their move to take Cody Ford over D.K. Metcalf.  If you've got a chance to get a skill type who can demand defensive attention, that's more important than plodding interior OL types like Ford.  You can find those guys later or in UFA on team friendly contracts.  You don't find top skill types there.    

 

 

Not quite.  He is a guy who plays in any system, but has been used as a decoy in many respects by a HC who is not up to par for the NFL.  There aren't many learned Bills fans who would say no to OBJ because he makes plays.  

 

Sometimes HC's have to learn how to manage personalities and not avoid them.  High performing people in any environment make the difference and in a results oriented environment they can be the difference between winning and losing. 

 

You build from the trenches, on both sides of the ball.  Don't sleep on Cody, he's coming along.

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3 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:

The Odell Beckham trade by the Browns got all the publicity and love this off season.  The Cole Beasley and John Brown signings were also ran signings that flew completely under the radar.  Look at the contracts and stats of those three players twelve weeks into the season with the Bills heading towards the playoffs and the Browns all but eliminated from the post season.

 

Odell Beckham Jr  compensation; 

2019   $17,000,000

2020   $14,250,000

2021   $15,750,000

2022   $15,000,000

2023   $ 15,000,000

OBJ 2019 production through 12 games;

57 catches

805 yards

2 TDs

 

Cole Beasley compensation;

2019   $11,400,000

2020   $5,600,000

2021   $5,900,000

2022   $6,100,000

Beasley 2019 production through 12 games;

55 catches

635 yards

5 TDs

 

John Brown compensation;

2019   $10,700,000

2020   $8,150,000

2021   $8,150,000

John Brown 2019  production through 12 games;

61 catches

882 yards

5 TDs

 

OBJ has the big name and the pedigree and there is no mistaking his elite receiving skills, but I think Beane and McDermott have it right when it comes to team building.  It's not about collecting a bunch of talented individual players, it's about bringing together a group of players who are willing to play team football.  I think the 2019 Bills are greater than the sum of their parts and teams like the Browns and the Cowboys simply are not.  Look how far this Buffalo Bills franchise has come in the last two years.  It's getting hard to argue against the position that Beane and McDermott are a top 5 GM/Coach combo in the league right now.

 


They’ve played well. The browns have not. I don’t think that means there’s some large truth about lunch pails vs stars. You find great talent and point them towards common goals. 

 

bills fans often come across desperate to have a team that plays good, even if not great, on a modest budget with blue collar guys.

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I agree with your overall point, but don't think it's close to fair to evaluate the Beckham signing by his stats this year.

 

Receiver stats are greatly affected by the QB and how well he's playing, and even the OL and how well they're protecting the QB. Beckham will be sensational again if he's in the right position, and I think he will be.

 

But yeah, in free agency picking the low- to mid-range guys while building the core of your team through the draft does seem to be the strategy the teams that sustain excellence consistently use.

 

 

 

Oh, and I agree with BillsVet above, the Brown and Beasley deals weren't team-friendly. They got what they could get. They got market value and weren't cheap.

 

 

Oh, and Brady's no game manager. Not even close. Thank goodness he's no longer elite but he's still probably top seven or so but is dealing with an offense that doesn't have a Gronk or anyone but Edelman. And while he's always been terrific enough to overcome that, he's just really really good now and can't overcome the problems.

Edited by Thurman#1

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