YoloinOhio Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 The resignations were not voluntary The unexpected resignations earlier this month of two Pegula Sports and Entertainment executives followed an internal investigation into whether the two men sexually harassed female employees after a holiday party in December, according to four sources. Michael Gilbert, senior vice president of administration and general manager of HarborCenter, and Nik Fattey, vice president and director of hockey at HarborCenter, joined a group of about two dozen male and female PSE employees at Mulligan’s Brick Bar on Allen Street around midnight on Dec. 16, after the company holiday party inside the Marriott HarborCenter had ended, two of the sources said. At Brick Bar, Gilbert and Fattey focused their attention on two young women who work as servers at (716) Food & Sport, a PSE-owned bar and restaurant inside HarborCenter, the two sources said. Fattey, through his attorney, denied that he had sexually harassed or behaved inappropriately with any woman. Gilbert did not return two voice messages left on his cellphone. One of the women said Gilbert, 50, made sexually explicit and inappropriate remarks to her and repeatedly asked her to meet him in his hotel room at the Marriott. “I just said no, I have no interest. I would turn around and he would continue to talk to me,” the woman said. “I don’t know where he got to thinking that I would be interested. I have no idea why he thought he could do that.” The News contacted the woman when other sources said there was more behind the resignations than PSE initially revealed. The woman agreed to be interviewed on the condition that she not be identified by name in a story. The woman said she felt awkward trying to fend off Gilbert’s advances without angering him, because he ultimately wielded control over her job at the restaurant. “I think he was trying to use that power,” she said. The woman, who is 23, described the interaction as "creepy" and "gross." “He’s like twice my age,” she said. Another source who was in Brick Bar at the time confirmed substantial portions of the woman's account, although the source also acknowledged that she could not hear what Gilbert said to the woman. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 The Pegulas are setting a standard of conduct for people working within their enterprise. They are not allowing people in authority to abuse their status. This is not individual conduct isolated from their business. Whether it is in the workplace or outside of it there is a standard of behavior that is going to be applied. By taking action the Pegulas are making it clear to those involved (people at the top and bottom) in their company that certain behavior will not be tolerated. People who work for them are going to be held accountable for their conduct, especially as it relates to treating women. I give the Pegulas credit because they are not hesitant to apply the rules to people high up in the organization such as Brandon and the upper echelon employees in this story. The people at the top set the tone for the company. Their actions give their words meaning. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nextmanup Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 This group of people went to Brick Bar for an after-party??? That place was a dive filled with illegal kids when I last frequented it, admittedly about 25 years ago! Has it improved since? Seems like a strange choice for this crowd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 17, 2019 Author Share Posted January 17, 2019 I went to Brick Bar about 20 years ago. Thought it was definitely a college age (if that) bar at that time. Maybe it was the after after after party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 The old saw for many guys is ‘the drunker I get, the better they look’. I wonder how much of it is really ‘the drunker I get, the better looking I get’. After a late night office holiday party, the prudent executive calls a limo service and goes home. Not on a pub crawl as if they were in university. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guffalo Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 28 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: I went to Brick Bar about 20 years ago. Thought it was definitely a college age (if that) bar at that time. Maybe it was the after after after party. Maybe the 23 year olds went and the creepy execs followed them in hopes of getting a shot. All in all, very creepy. Kudos to the Pegulas' judgment and applying the standards across the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 it's a crazy ***** world when all that is required for your termination is an allegation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 8 minutes ago, Foxx said: it's a crazy ***** world when all that is required for your termination is an allegation. The company interviewed people who were involved and were at the scene. A decision was made according to the facts of the case. Due diligence and process were fully applied. Your complaint how this case was handled make little sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 1 minute ago, JohnC said: The company interviewed people who were involved and were at the scene. A decision was made according to the facts of the case. Due diligence and process were fully applied. Your complaint how this case was handled make little sense. and i quote, "HarborCenter execs resigned after alleged sexual harassment", end quote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said: I went to Brick Bar about 20 years ago. Thought it was definitely a college age (if that) bar at that time. Maybe it was the after after after party. Yup. When my buddies and I went in the early 90s the big joke was how much "elbow boob" you could get because the place was packed with coeds. To the point of the story, however -- kudos to the Pegulas for cleaning up this type of crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 14 minutes ago, Foxx said: and i quote, "HarborCenter execs resigned after alleged sexual harassment", end quote. I'm missing your point. This case was investigated by the personnel department that gets involved in these type of complaints. The dismissal was because of improper conduct as it related to interaction with a server. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 32 minutes ago, Foxx said: it's a crazy ***** world when all that is required for your termination is an allegation. Actually, what's crazy is a 50-year-old executive following 20-something-year-olds to a college bar. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 17, 2019 Author Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Foxx said: and i quote, "HarborCenter execs resigned after alleged sexual harassment", end quote. I didn’t paste the whole article but if you read it you will see the whole story In fact, the women didn’t report it because they thought it wouldn’t be taken seriously. Another co worker did who was there and saw it go down. Edited January 17, 2019 by YoloinOhio 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said: I didn’t paste the whole article but if you read it you will see the whole story i read the whole story. personnel departmental findings does not constitute a conviction within a court of law. it is not beyond the realm of possibility that in today's 'environment' just the mere 'allegation' of impropriety would be enough to make a 'personnel department finding' that would suggest the dismissal to avoid any 'appearances' of condoning said behavior. if they were found guilty, the headline should not state that the allegation is alleged. it is so because of legal ramifications. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 41 minutes ago, Foxx said: and i quote, "HarborCenter execs resigned after alleged sexual harassment", end quote. The word "alleged" refers to the lack of a conviction in court. I doesn't mean the allegations weren't investigated by PSE. 24 minutes ago, JohnC said: I'm missing your point. This case was investigated by the personnel department that gets involved in these type of complaints. The dismissal was because of improper conduct as it related to interaction with a server. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: The word "alleged" refers to the lack of a conviction in court. I doesn't mean the allegations weren't investigated by PSE. carry on then. nothing to see here. Edited January 17, 2019 by Foxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 12 minutes ago, Foxx said: i read the whole story. personnel departmental findings does not constitute a conviction within a court of law. it is not beyond the realm of possibility that in today's 'environment' just the mere 'allegation' of impropriety would be enough to make a 'personnel department finding' that would suggest the dismissal to avoid any 'appearances' of condoning said behavior. if they were found guilty, the headline should not state that the allegation is alleged. it is so because of legal ramifications. Companies are not courts of law. They can fire you for cause. In this case they determined there was cause. Fortunately for the two guys fired, harassment cases rarely reach prosecution. 2 minutes ago, Foxx said: carry on then. nothing to see here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 1 minute ago, PromoTheRobot said: Companies are not courts of law. They can fire you for cause. In this case they determined there was cause. Fortunately for the two guys fired, harassment cases rarely reach prosecution. what... your just going to quote and reply with the same thing that was said in different words? alrighty then..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Just now, Foxx said: what... your just going to quote and reply with the same thing that was said in different words? alrighty then..... I wanted to include your comment with the post I already made because it was relevent. That's why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 1 minute ago, PromoTheRobot said: I wanted to include your comment with the post I already made because it was relevent. That's why. right. so you are just going to quote me and say the exact same thing with different words, gotcha. thanks for playing, run along now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 8 minutes ago, Foxx said: right. so you are just going to quote me and say the exact same thing with different words, gotcha. thanks for playing, run along now. No, I was pointing out that "guilty until proven innocent" does not apply in employment settings. You can be terminated at will. The use of "alleged" in the paper is due to the fact these two were not convicted in a court of law (not that harrassment is ever really prosecuted.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Just now, PromoTheRobot said: No, I was pointing out that "guilty until proven innocent" does not apply in employment settings. You can be terminated at will. The use of "alleged" in the paper is due to the fact these two were not convicted in a court of law (not that harrassment is ever really prosecuted.) oye. might i suggest you go back and reread my post(s). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Well, the moral of the story, and it comes in handy in all of life, is.............DON’T BE A JERK! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) Removed. I inadvertently posted drivel. Edited January 17, 2019 by Ridgewaycynic2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
\GoBillsInDallas/ Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said: After a late night office holiday party, the prudent executive calls a limo service and goes home. It always amazes me to see the # of "executives" out there who have no idea on how to "act" as an executive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 17, 2019 Author Share Posted January 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Foxx said: i read the whole story. personnel departmental findings does not constitute a conviction within a court of law. it is not beyond the realm of possibility that in today's 'environment' just the mere 'allegation' of impropriety would be enough to make a 'personnel department finding' that would suggest the dismissal to avoid any 'appearances' of condoning said behavior. if they were found guilty, the headline should not state that the allegation is alleged. it is so because of legal ramifications. I’m not sure what you are saying then. They were fired because the company determined there was cause. They obviously don’t need to be convicted for something in a court of law to be fired for something like this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaoulDuke79 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) No wonder fewer and fewer companies are having holiday parties. Edited January 17, 2019 by RaoulDuke79 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) 27 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: I’m not sure what you are saying then. They were fired because the company determined there was cause. They obviously don’t need to be convicted for something in a court of law to be fired for something like this i'm saying that they are not necessarily guilty of the alleged allegations. in today's, 'environment', with all the SJW bull#### that is permeating society, just the mere allegation may have been enough to find a 'cause'. people are so afraid of being or appearing to be politically incorrect that they are afraid of any appearance of items such as these. so much so that they would rather get rid of the problem than have to defend it. not to mention that what may have been innocent yesterday, may not be viewed that way today. i'm not saying they (accused) did or didn't do what they were accused of, i have no idea. i just know that in a different day and time (not so long ago) the threshold of believable guilt was probably a lot higher than it currently is today. 27 minutes ago, RaoulDuke79 said: No wonder fewer and fewer companies are having holiday parties. right? Edited January 17, 2019 by Foxx 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Foxx said: oye. might i suggest you go back and reread my post(s). Oh I was getting you point, that all it takes is an allegation to get fired. But we don't know how much was based on an allegation and how much was corroborated by witnesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 46 minutes ago, \GoBillsInDallas/ said: It always amazes me to see the # of "executives" out there who have no idea on how to "act" as an executive. I wonder how he would respond if his daughter/wife came home and told him that someone acted like he did at her job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Foxx said: and i quote, "HarborCenter execs resigned after alleged sexual harassment", end quote. They resigned. Your other post said terminated. There is a difference. Edited January 17, 2019 by 4merper4mer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 5 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said: They resigned. Your other post said terminated. There is a difference. were they offered resignation or did they resign of their own volition? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 “You can’t fire me! I quit!” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said: They resigned. They're forced to resign before it gets uglier. Save some face, you know? It's hard for some dudes to get any action. Especially dudes who put a priority on their career over physical fitness. They don't realize how disgusting they are, especially after drinking too much. Women put up with so much gross *****. I was recently out with 3 other friends and we started getting aggressively hit on by a drunk older gay dude. It was funny at first and then turned ugly real fast. Afterwards, we we're like "this is what it's like for women every night..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Just now, Foxx said: were they offered resignation or did they resign of their own volition? I would have thought you looked that up before you said they were terminated. If you did nothing and someone told you resign or be fired wouldn't you fight back? Although I agree the SJW stuff is out of control, I also dislike the offshoot of it which is "just claim it is all SJW stuff even if you go around harassing 23 year old women that work in your organization". How about we just go with the truth? Nothing, including the actions of the participants indicates the id SJW stuff so why just conclude that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 3 hours ago, YoloinOhio said: I went to Brick Bar about 20 years ago. Thought it was definitely a college age (if that) bar at that time. Maybe it was the after after after party. ...hmmm...sounds like PSE had multiple "Directors of Internal Affairs".......sounds like Kim is still "draining the asamp"........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 6 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said: I would have thought you looked that up before you said they were terminated. If you did nothing and someone told you resign or be fired wouldn't you fight back? Although I agree the SJW stuff is out of control, I also dislike the offshoot of it which is "just claim it is all SJW stuff even if you go around harassing 23 year old women that work in your organization". How about we just go with the truth? Nothing, including the actions of the participants indicates the id SJW stuff so why just conclude that? are you aware of the terms of their dismissal? might they have gotten a parachute if they resigned? i don't know to be honest but i can think of a myriad of reasons to not fight it. they did, through their attorney, deny the allegations, from day one. from the article, Fattey, "... developed a "spotless reputation" in his 14 years in the hockey community...". sexual predators do not suddenly emerge over night, they tend to have other episodes in their past that may possibly portend such actions. a "spotless reputation" does not seem to suggest that. again, i have no idea whether they are guilty or not. i don't like to see a man's reputation besmirched nor his life destroyed because of a false allegation. i only hope that justice was served here. that everyone is ready to jump on the guilty bandwagon is troubling in this day and age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 17, 2019 Author Share Posted January 17, 2019 20 minutes ago, Foxx said: were they offered resignation or did they resign of their own volition? I assume they were forced to resign. Similar to Russ. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeF Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Augie said: Well, the moral of the story, and it comes in handy in all of life, is.............DON’T BE A JERK! Act your age, not your wanker size????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 6 minutes ago, Foxx said: sexual predators do not suddenly emerge over night That's exactly what they do! It's how they getchya. Sneaky bastards. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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