The Now Moment Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 3 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: That's kind of where I am from reading the reviews. I don't see Andrew Luck or Peyton Manning in this draft. I'm not even sure I see Wentz or Goff. Same here. This class is all about potential. They all need massive improvements. That's why Allen could end up being one of the top ones taken. He has the highest potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Joshin' Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 15 minutes ago, Buffalo30 said: Same here. This class is all about potential. They all need massive improvements. That's why Allen could end up being one of the top ones taken. He has the highest potential. .....and with high potential comes high bust. When he busts he will drag a franchise down for a few years as they give him time to succeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProcessAccepted Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 7 hours ago, NastyNateSoldiers said: The time is overdue , the time is now . U guys know what I'm talking bout QB. There's 3 elite guys in this class Darnold, Mayfield & Rosen. We got to get one of these guys and we got to do whatever it takes . Next yrs draft is not looking good for QBs not at all there is no Mannings or Lucks in the horizon. There is no such thing as the perfect prospect at QB or any other positions for that matter. I can care less bout filling holes at DT or Wr in this upcoming draft as long as the biggest hole hasnt been filled at QB. We've gone down this route plenty of times and it hasn't gotten us to where we want to be. If the Bills brain trust feels like there's 3 franchise caliber QBs in this draft they need to get one. The Colts at 3 are the perfect team to make a deal with they have there franchise guy in place with Luck . They also have holes on there team and with no elite high caliber players at the top of the draft they will be open to moving down collecting pks and filling there roster. I got the deal for them if I'm the Bills. Offer our 2 firsts and add a player to the deal that fills the biggest hole on that team at LT Cordy Glenn. I believe the Colts will jump to the chance to add a franchise LT with 3yrs and 23mil left on his deal which is very cap friendly. Cordy and 2 firsts should get this deal done. Once we make this deal we are still left with our 2 2s and a 3 to fill holes immediately to help our team. This deal makes to much sense to me. I'm tired of us bypassing the biggest need in sports(QB) for Corners, DTs and Wrs . Just look at the AFC over these last 17yrs only 4 QBs have gone to the Superbowl, Brady, Peyton, Ben and Flacco. What's the common theme here u need a freaking QB... So please McBeane find a way to get us to the top and get one of these guys. What's worst that can happen we will be a Wr short on Sundays. The QB won't pan out? Like people say either go big or go home. No more excuses fill the mother of all holes QB . Franchise QBs make up for so much short comings on a team. They are the ultimate hole fillers i don't want to here about anything else come late April i want a freakin QB . McBeane the time is now! I'm trusting the McB team that ended the drought in their first year over than the strategy outlined in your rambling post. I get it, you're tired of the Bills not going all in on a big name QB prospect. You even reference Luck as a past example but ignore how he's injured because he doesn't have a line to protect him. Winning rosters are balanced. That's why 3 teams in the championship games this year had non-elite QBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NastyNateSoldiers Posted January 23, 2018 Author Share Posted January 23, 2018 40 minutes ago, Buffalo30 said: These are certainly elite QB prospects. Andrew Luck, Peyton Manning were elite QB prospects. These guys aren't even close to that. They all come with a big risk, every last one of them If your waiting for these types get ready to keep waiting because there's none on the horizon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Now Moment Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 minute ago, Dalton said: .....and with high potential comes high bust. When he busts he will drag a franchise down for a few years as they give him time to succeed. You could say that about any of the QBs in this class. That's my point. None of them are good enough right now to be considered elite prospects that can start right away and easily succeed. This class is all about potential. As for Allen, he could be great or he could be nothing. We shall see. Just now, NastyNateSoldiers said: If your waiting for these types get ready to keep waiting because there's none on the horizon. I'm not waiting for those types but I'm also not falsely listing the QBs in this class as elite prospects... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 39 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: If they see a guy that they really, truly feel is going to be that kind of guy, that guy who becomes a Pro Bowl type QB and is here for the next 15 years, then they should make a move and do what they need to in order to move up. And it will take a lot more than Glenn and our two first round picks to do so. Take a look at the moves for Wentz and Goff. As to being OK swinging and missing, you really think you'll be OK if the guy doesn't pan out? really? Or will you be on here demanding Beane be fired for giving away the store on a guy that was a bust? For me, I still say if you're going to spend money, spend it on a guy that you have some clue will be a good QB for you. Go get Cousins. My guess is that Darnold will not pan out because this past season shows his inaccuracy issues and he has questionable mechanics. Allen is similar. If I had to pick one it would be Rosen or Mayfield, and of those I'd take Mayfield. But I'd rather take a guy like the kid from western KY in the second and continue to build my roster, especially if I get Cousins. Good post and agree. If you think you see a top QB in the draft, do what it takes to get him. The GM's Butt will be indeed be in a sling if he sells out 4 1sts over the next 3 drafts, a couple of 2nds, Glenn, and White, and the guy turns out to be Bortles or Sanchez, but if you really think you see Luck or Stafford, Go For It. Of the various choices, my pick for the best risk/reward is go after Cousins and build the rest of the team through the draft and the 2nd tier FA/trade market. I tentatively think that these guys have the player e v a l skills to do that. My second choice is to stand pat (or moderate trade-up) and grab a prospect we like who is there for us, and also try for a modest upgrade in trade/FA (Alex Smith perhaps) and a 2nd tier FA. That doesn't sell the farm, and leaves us the "draft capital" to try again next year if the guy we take doesn't pan out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthNYfan Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 hour ago, ShadyBillsFan said: I don't follow college football. I can tell you I've seen many names of players listed as Elite Prospects. Many have failed on the NFL. Let me list a few names in no particular order Elite prospects: Tim Tebow, Johnny Manziel, Robert Griffin III, Danny Wuerffel, Matt Leinart, Rex Grossman, Vince Young, Akili Smith, JaMarcus Russell and Ryan Leaf I'll believe it when I see it. There are also many elite prospects who are elite There are many subpar prospects who wind up being elite The % of an elite prospect being elite is greater than that of one who isn't You can't get somebody elite without taking a risk though, even a FA is a risk I'm not advocating betting the farm though I'm just playing devil's advocate in a sense that it's not as cut and dry as you make it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 It scares me to think that we have all these draft picks and might waste some of them, packaging them and trading up for a QB who doesn't work out. In general, I really dislike trading up. And yet I want to find a good QB as much as anyone. And that leaves me conflicted. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NastyNateSoldiers Posted January 23, 2018 Author Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 minute ago, ProcessAccepted said: I'm trusting the McB team that ended the drought in their first year over than the strategy outlined in your rambling post. I get it, you're tired of the Bills not going all in on a big name QB prospect. You even reference Luck as a past example but ignore how he's injured because he doesn't have a line to protect him. Winning rosters are balanced. That's why 3 teams in the championship games this year had non-elite QBs. Alright keep scouting your Corners and DEs while other holes popping up on your team from yr to yr basis like a rotating door. All while other teams are finding there future QBs and Outpacing us to the finish line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corta765 Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 3 hours ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said: Just accept the fact that you got about a 50/50 shot at whomever you choose actually working out and becoming that elite guy. Moving up to to #3 likely means of the 3 guys you list we're getting Mayfield who of all of them is probably the most risky pick too. The only thing going for him is the NFL doesn't hand out suspensions for drinking too much, but that does often lead to things that do. If social media and the NFL with the attention it has everyday existed back when we had Kelly, Thomas, Reed, Bruce etc.. you wouldn't have wanted any of them. Mayfield made a mistake, seems to have picked himself up from it, and finished his season quite strong. IDK if he is a stud or not but the last thing I'm concerned about is his behavior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthNYfan Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 hour ago, Buffalo30 said: These are certainly elite QB prospects. Andrew Luck, Peyton Manning were elite QB prospects. These guys aren't even close to that. They all come with a big risk, every last one of them Revisionist history is a wonderful thing, isn't it? You're acting like Manning had no negatives on his profile. Yes Manning was an elite prospect, but his draft profile had many risks listed. Many thought he had reached his ceiling, which is why Manning vs Leaf was an actual discussion. Bill Walsh, who was well known to be a great talent evaluator, said he would pass on them both. Manning's draft profile: Peyton Manning: Manning is probably the most prepared QB to enter the NFL draft in several years.. He has had a storybook college career, and has been in a top level program with excellent coaching, and he has maturity and great intangibles to go along with his natural skills.. He should be able to pick up the mental aspects of the game early on the NFL level, and should play very quickly. He has great overall field vision. He is a fierce competitor, and all of his mechanics are very solid. He has good arm strength, but not necessarily a “gun” that you might expect from a QB at the top of the draft.. He has adequate mobility and good overall AA, although he is not a scrambler by nature. He has done an excellent job of getting the most out of his abilities, but he is not quite as natural a player as Leaf. One question that some NFL scouts have is the question “will he get any better?”. At times he gives the appearance of being a self-made player, and sometimes those types of players don’t always go on to great NFL careers. In Manning’s case, he may be a solid and productive NFL QB, but he may not have Hall of Fame type skills, but it certainly won’t be for lack of effort.. He has probably been the most scouted player in the draft in recent years, and because that NFL teams tend to look too much at potential flaws, instead of accepting him for what he is, a great college QB that is on his way to an outstanding NFL career. I'm not saying anybody in this draft is Manning. I'm saying that every prospect has warts. It's how those warts are managed, or how big they are, that makes the difference. Here is Leaf for comparison: Ryan Leaf: Leaf appears to be the hot QB in this draft, and he led WSU to a storybook season...He is a physically imposing QB with great size and strength....he is very sturdy and durable in the pocket, and is a surprisingly good athlete for his size...He has a strong arm and shows good touch, and can change up the speed on his passes...He has good feet, but is not really a scrambler. However, he can stand in and take the big hits....He is a very naturally gifted player, but could improve on his throwing mechanics, although it is not a major problem....There are no physical or athletic limitations to hold Leaf back from becoming a great NFL QB. However, there appears to be some minor nagging questions in the area of maturity and his mental approach to the game. He is perceived as not always an easy guy to work with, and he tends to beat to his own drummer...As good as he is, he can have some streaks on the field where he looks like he has forgotten everything he has been taught...There seems to be a nagging question here that something might be missing, but it may be hard to verbalize it...However, Leaf made all the right moves at the end of his season when he declared for the NFL draft...Unless he turns some teams off in individual interviews between now and the draft, he should have no problems....Nobody will question his physical abilities, and it is not outlandish to think that he could be the first pick of the draft, instead of Peyton Manning....There is a huge upside with Leaf, and it is conceivable that he could be one of the best young QB’s in the game in 2-3 years...His ability to play as physical as he does and take the hits that will obviously come, when playing for a team that obviously doesn’t have a very good OL, will help him get over the tough times as a team builds around him. His sounds a lot like Allen, but his faults were magnified because he was insane. I'm not sure Allen will be a stud, but I don't think he's as crazy as Leaf. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 Trading your franchise QB for a "franchise LT" (whatever that is)? Yeah, that's what smart teams do... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFunPolice Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 Colts or Browns would be the partners, preferably the Colts. Do it before the draft too. Lock yourself into the 3rd pick and you are guaranteed Rosen, Darnold, Allen, or Mayfield. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 hour ago, NastyNateSoldiers said: Dude your list looks awfully bad, Tebow was not elite prospect neither was Wuerffel as well as others on your list. That doesnt really matter either way because there's been busts at every position at every spot in the draft. There is no sure way of knowing if a guy is gonna pan out. We can sit there at 21,22 and take 2 busts then what. U can't look at the draft this way and if u do your in the wrong business if you're an NFL GM . These guys get paid to do there jobs and use every tool they have to make the best decision for there teams if they believe a guy has a chance to be a blue chip player theyre gonna take there chances According to the internets they were top prospects. Ask WEO and Doc about Matt Leinart. Man, did they have a long lived discussion about him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Boy Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Too hard to pronounce. Suggest "Culking" or perhaps "Corking" though that last sounds like fun I believe the correct term if “ Farging Cork Sulker” ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 hour ago, Buffalo30 said: These are certainly elite QB prospects. Andrew Luck, Peyton Manning were elite QB prospects. These guys aren't even close to that. They all come with a big risk, every last one of them I think you will find a lot of arguments about the merits of Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickelCity Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 It's always a gamble with QBs, honestly. The OP has the same top 3 qbs I do, and if we have the opportunity to grab one of them, I'd support a move up. I don't like giving up picks but with all that we have this is the year to do it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 1 hour ago, ndirish1978 said: Just a quick question: can time be overdue? Isn't time by nature, the measure of when something is due? Like that saying 'the hour is fast approaching'...like, faster than usual? Faster than one second per second? Sounds kinda spooky if you ask me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lfod Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 I don't need them to bring a vet QB in. I don't need them to blow all the draft picks to desperately grab at whatever is left. I'm not gonna live in that fantasy world of quick fixes. The Bills are building a team. They are building a culture. This isn't about one elite player, it's about every player working together as a team. Your all guilty of sleeping on Project Nate Peterman. You give up on a rookie who was thrown into an under performing offense with an OC that they fired. Your gonna hang them 5 picks over his head forever. Everybody is clamouring over some new shiny toys that your gonna turn your back on anyway. Your not ready to share in the growing pains of a rookie QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwai San Posted January 23, 2018 Share Posted January 23, 2018 3 hours ago, Putin said: Even though I agree 100% that a QB should be our # 1 priority , there’s anout a dozen teams who need a QB and are position better then us , and are probably thinking the same way ( do what ever it takes ) to get a QB , so 2 -1st and Glenn might not even be close to get to the # 3 spot , I am not so sure there is another team in this years draft that has 2 1st rounders.....surely that has to count for something......Glenn is a HUGH reach but who knows what they would say.....sadly until we get a QB all bets are off.......will be VERY interesting to see how they let TT go and what they do or do not get for him if anything. GO BILLS 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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