Kirby Jackson Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 How are you "sure" they are going to mess this up?"pretty" sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 They have a pretty good defense. Goff didn't play well but you put Sammy and Woods and Austin with Gurley and a coach that seems to know how to run an offense and they may not suck.anything is possible (cue Kevin Garnett) but the Rams have the worst ranked QB in the league and the worst winning percentage in football over the last ten years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 A few months back someone I know that has a connection with the organization said they were thinking of trading Sammy and McCoy. One downMaybe they can turn Shady into Thomas Rawls and a 2034 4th round pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
major Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Now that's funny Maybe they can turn Shady into Thomas Rawls and a 2034 4th round pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Â Yeah, I'm pretty sure that the Bills mess this up. My biggest fear is that they use a bunch of capital to move up and take the wrong guy at QB. Imagine dumping all of these guys and still downgrading at QB?!? If they get the QB right they'll be heading in the right direction. On this we agree to be sure. Â It is VERY early but it looks as if the top 3 qbs, barring injury, could be drafted in the top 10 picks, if not top 5. Greg Cossell was talking up the kid from Wyoming (Josh Allen?) and Rosen this morning and said Darnold could get much better. Â It looks to me that the Bills will win in the neighborhood of 4 games so they might have a chance to get one, if of course they want to go in that direction. It would not surprise me if they did not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriveFor1Outta5 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 "pretty" sure TT will never win a Super Bowl. Sammy and TT were never going to be hoisting a Lombardi Trophy together. We need a franchise QB. Now we have the required ammunition to make a move for one. There are no guarantees when drafting a rookie QB, but you have to give it a try. These moves give us the ability to draft a QB early in the first. There is no way you can be "sure" we will pick the wrong one. It is nothing more than your personal bias. We have a new regime, your personal bitterness doesn't mean they will fail. Kudos to the franchise for finally attempting to go all in at the position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Did this really happen or are we getting Punk'd? I think I blacked out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Did this really happen or are we getting Punk'd? I think I blacked out. It happened. But we signed Boldin so BB isn't throwing in the towel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
major Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 I guess Cleveland isn't the only team playing moneyball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 anything is possible (cue Kevin Garnett) but the Rams have the worst ranked QB in the league and the worst winning percentage in football over the last ten years. To give up on a number 1 overall pick qb who played with crap WRs after one year is pretty silly. Â It sounds crazy but I might rather have the Rams pieces on offense now. I really think Sammy swings things that much. It happened. But we signed Boldin so BB isn't throwing in the towel. I do feel better about that now. Boldin's 27 right? He is just entering his prime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 TT will never win a Super Bowl. Sammy and TT were never going to be hoisting a Lombardi Trophy together. We need a franchise QB. Now we have the required ammunition to make a move for one. There are no guarantees when drafting a rookie QB, but you have to give it a try. These moves give us the ability to draft a QB early in the first. There is no way you can be "sure" we will pick the wrong one. It is nothing more than your personal bias. We have a new regime, your personal bitterness doesn't mean they will fail. Kudos to the franchise for finally attempting to go all in at the position.That's all fine and good but if your plan was to get the franchise QB why sign Boldin? Why take back Matthews? Why bring back Tyrod and Kyle? Those moves are all for 2017. It's half-pregnant. I'm bitter because they traded a potential superstar for $.10 on the dollar. If you want to tank I can get on board with that but that clearly isn't the plan. You are still picking behind the Jets, 49ers and probably the Browns. You could be behind the Jags and Redskins as well. Those teams are all potentially taking QBs. Your draft capital is worthless if teams aren't going to move down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriveFor1Outta5 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 To give up on a number 1 overall pick qb who played with crap WRs after one year is pretty silly. Â It sounds crazy but I might rather have the Rams pieces on offense now. I really think Sammy swings things that much. Beane didn't "give up" on Sammy. You can't "give up" on someone that you never bought into. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Maybe they can turn Shady into Thomas Rawls and a 2034 4th round pick? Kindergarten teachers everywhere are talking about what a strong crop they are working with! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 That's all fine and good but if your plan was to get the franchise QB why sign Boldin? Why take back Matthews? Why bring back Tyrod and Kyle? Those moves are all for 2017. It's half-pregnant. I'm bitter because they traded a potential superstar for $.10 on the dollar. If you want to tank I can get on board with that but that clearly isn't the plan. You are still picking behind the Jets, 49ers and probably the Browns. You could be behind the Jags and Redskins as well. Those teams are all potentially taking QBs. Your draft capital is worthless if teams aren't going to move down. Such a good post. Their plan was half @ssed. Â My nightmare is we win enough games to pick like 5th and we can't move up so we settle for the 4th best qb in the draft aka The Losman. Beane didn't "give up" on Sammy. You can't "give up" on someone that you never bought into. I believe in Sammy's talent a lot more than Beane's and TBG's. Talent wins in this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Â Strange times we live in. Â undoubtedly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriveFor1Outta5 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 That's all fine and good but if your plan was to get the franchise QB why sign Boldin? Why take back Matthews? Why bring back Tyrod and Kyle? Those moves are all for 2017. It's half-pregnant. I'm bitter because they traded a potential superstar for $.10 on the dollar. If you want to tank I can get on board with that but that clearly isn't the plan. You are still picking behind the Jets, 49ers and probably the Browns. You could be behind the Jags and Redskins as well. Those teams are all potentially taking QBs. Your draft capital is worthless if teams aren't going to move down. I think they are trying to win games while collecting draft picks to trade up with. That is why we kept TT and signed Boldin. I'm now somewhat confused by what you attempting to say. You just stated that we will pick the wrong QB. Now you seem to be contradicting yourself by stating that we might not have a shot a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Maybe they can turn Shady into Thomas Rawls and a 2034 4th round pick? Â make it Lou Rawls and suddenly it becomes a no brainer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 That's all fine and good but if your plan was to get the franchise QB why sign Boldin? Why take back Matthews? Why bring back Tyrod and Kyle? Those moves are all for 2017. It's half-pregnant. I'm bitter because they traded a potential superstar for $.10 on the dollar. If you want to tank I can get on board with that but that clearly isn't the plan. You are still picking behind the Jets, 49ers and probably the Browns. You could be behind the Jags and Redskins as well. Those teams are all potentially taking QBs. Your draft capital is worthless if teams aren't going to move down. That's pretty much it. Â Getting the third best qb and the surrounding him with day two rookies seems like the worst case scenario... and exactly what we are angling towards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriveFor1Outta5 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 (edited) Such a good post. Their plan was half @ssed. Â My nightmare is we win enough games to pick like 5th and we can't move up so we settle for the 4th best qb in the draft aka The Losman. Â I believe in Sammy's talent a lot more than Beane's and TBG's. Talent wins in this league. QB's win in this league. Sammy's talent hasn't and wouldn't win us anything. That's pretty much it. Â Getting the third best qb and the surrounding him with day two rookies seems like the worst case scenario... and exactly what we are angling towards. Sometimes the "third best" QB in a deep draft turns out to be pretty good. Edited August 12, 2017 by DriveFor1Outta5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 QB's win in this league. Sammy's talent hasn't and wouldn't win us anything. so by this logic, Shady, Kyle, Richie, Dareus should all be traded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriveFor1Outta5 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 (edited) so by this logic, Shady, Kyle, Richie, Dareus should all be traded. It wouldn't upset me, but I think that the franchise may believe they have the picks needed to make a move. There is no need to trade everyone away in that case. I made a bit of a hyperbolic statement about QB's. Of course a team needs talent, but a lot ultimately depends on the QB. Recievers without a QB don't help teams win titles. Do you really believe the Pats success has that much to do with anyone other than Brady? Edited August 12, 2017 by DriveFor1Outta5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 QB's win in this league. Sammy's talent hasn't and wouldn't win us anything. Sometimes the "third best" QB in a deep draft turns out to be pretty good. Do you think it's a better scenario to just get the first pick? or alternatively surround that third best qb with some proven vet talent if we are not tanking? Â 3rd qb with day extra two rookies instead of a vet roster seems like the worst of the options there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 The wins didn't pile up with the crappy linemen either. The DBs helped the team more than those guys that I listed. Â Yeah, I'm pretty sure that the Bills mess this up. My biggest fear is that they use a bunch of capital to move up and take the wrong guy at QB. Imagine dumping all of these guys and still downgrading at QB?!? If they get the QB right they'll be heading in the right direction. Â So which is it? Â The team was going nowhere pre-trades. Â And you're saying they'll screw up the draft. Â Why do we even bother? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Â So which is it? Â The team was going nowhere pre-trades. Â And you're saying they'll screw up the draft. Â Why do we even bother? You could have had 2 1st round picks, picked a young qb, & given them 25 year old Sammy to throw to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 I think they are trying to win games while collecting draft picks to trade up with. That is why we kept TT and signed Boldin. I'm now somewhat confused by what you attempting to say. You just stated that we will pick the wrong QB. Now you seem to be contradicting yourself by stating that we might not have a shot a QB.No, I said, "I'm pretty sure the Bills will mess this up. My nightmare scenario is that the use the draft capital and take the wrong guy." Please don't take what I said out of context. If the Bills do win some games, say 6 or 7 they are staring at the 4th or 5th QB off the board. It is a loaded class for sure (especially if Darnold comes out) but the draft capital doesn't matter without a dance partner. The teams that are awful (SF & Jets) are taking QB. The Browns, Jags, Skins could all be bad an din the market for a QB. Why are you trying to win 6-8 games and pick behind those teams? That's not how you get a franchise QB. If you want to deal Tyrod and Shady I can at least see the direction.  So which is it?  The team was going nowhere pre-trades.  And you're saying they'll screw up the draft.  Why do we even bother? See the post above Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriveFor1Outta5 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Do you think it's a better scenario to just get the first pick? or alternatively surround that third best qb with some proven vet talent if we are not tanking? Â 3rd qb with day extra two rookies instead of a vet roster seems like the worst of the options there Why is not possible to believe that this QB class is deep enough for the "third best" QB to be a soild option? It's possible that the front office feels the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 (edited) Such a good post. Their plan was half @ssed. Â My nightmare is we win enough games to pick like 5th and we can't move up so we settle for the 4th best qb in the draft aka The Losman. Â I believe in Sammy's talent a lot more than Beane's and TBG's. Talent wins in this league. Â This was a 6-7 win team this year - tops. Â Not sure if we're the worst now - but getting closer. No, I said, "I'm pretty sure the Bills will mess this up. My nightmare scenario is that the use the draft capital and take the wrong guy." Please don't take what I said out of context. Â If the Bills do win some games, say 6 or 7 they are staring at the 4th or 5th QB off the board. It is a loaded class for sure (especially if Darnold comes out) but the draft capital doesn't matter without a dance partner. The teams that are awful (SF & Jets) are taking QB. The Browns, Jags, Skins could all be bad an din the market for a QB. Why are you trying to win 6-8 games and pick behind those teams? That's not how you get a franchise QB. If you want to deal Tyrod and Shady I can at least see the direction. See the post above see above Edited August 12, 2017 by inaugural balls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Scottlaw is on the ledge   Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 You could have had 2 1st round picks, picked a young qb, & given them 25 year old Sammy to throw to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Why is not possible to believe that this QB class is deep enough for the "third best" QB to be a soild option? It's possible that the front office feels the same. No offense but settling for the 3rd best anything is terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriveFor1Outta5 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 (edited) No, I said, "I'm pretty sure the Bills will mess this up. My nightmare scenario is that the use the draft capital and take the wrong guy." Please don't take what I said out of context. Â If the Bills do win some games, say 6 or 7 they are staring at the 4th or 5th QB off the board. It is a loaded class for sure (especially if Darnold comes out) but the draft capital doesn't matter without a dance partner. The teams that are awful (SF & Jets) are taking QB. The Browns, Jags, Skins could all be bad an din the market for a QB. Why are you trying to win 6-8 games and pick behind those teams? That's not how you get a franchise QB. If you want to deal Tyrod and Shady I can at least see the direction. See the post above I'm not talking anything out of context. I just disagree that you can be so sure a poor decision will be made. After all who says this is a six win team? Edited August 12, 2017 by DriveFor1Outta5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017  This was a 6-7 win team this year - tops.  Not sure if we're the worst now - but getting closer. see above  So we were a 6-7 win team that downgraded talent to try to be a 6-7 win team? The goal is either to load up and try to go to the playoffs or tear it down and try to pick first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 You could have had 2 1st round picks, picked a young qb, & given them 25 year old Sammy to throw to. Do you think Sammy would stay long term? Â Personally, I didn't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan4 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 (edited) It was impossible for the Bills to build a team without trading Watkins. Some of you are completely pathetic. That's not at all what I said or meant. Not even close. Not sure how you read everything I wrote and got that out of it. Â And I don't see trying to look at things rationally as pathetic. Whining and crying all over the message board on the other hand... Edited August 12, 2017 by BillsFan4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Â So we were a 6-7 win team that downgraded talent to try to be a 6-7 win team? The goal is either to load up and try to go to the playoffs or tear it down and try to pick first. i am perplexed by the signing of Boldin and not moving on from TT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriveFor1Outta5 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 No offense but settling for the 3rd best anything is terrible. That's a ridiculous statement. Ben Roethlisberger was the third QB picked in the 2004 draft. What a bum that guy has been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haslett_Stomp Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 (edited) Imagine how this board would have reacted to the trade that sent Greg Bell plus two first round picks and a second round pick for Biscuit. Edited August 12, 2017 by Haslett_Stomp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 I think they are trying to win games while collecting draft picks to trade up with. That is why we kept TT and signed Boldin. I'm now somewhat confused by what you attempting to say. You just stated that we will pick the wrong QB. Now you seem to be contradicting yourself by stating that we might not have a shot a QB. Kirby and everyone else here WANTS the Bills to draft a great qb. I don't think that there is a lot of reason to believe that they will. Â And if you think they be able to win a decent number of games AND draft a great quarterback, I will say that imo the odds of this happening are not good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Do you think Sammy would stay long term? Â Personally, I didn't think so. If they paid him and feed him the ball, like they should have been doing. He said that in camp. Â Either way, the GM should have asked him before he traded him. Props to Beane for being honest, but he admitted he didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stinky finger Posted August 12, 2017 Share Posted August 12, 2017 Â So we were a 6-7 win team that downgraded talent to try to be a 6-7 win team? The goal is either to load up and try to go to the playoffs or tear it down and try to pick first. Curious as to your opinion - would you be all in or would you prefer to tank in earnest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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