Frazier: "(Brown and Ragland) will be part of our best 11"

[Dopey]

I'm not surprised. Brown was a decent football player in the 4-3. No one, outside of the corners, was more hindered by Rex. I expect Preston Brown to return to a solid starter.

 

Damn, Mark. Hyperbole much? I enjoy your posts, but this reeks of a vendetta. 1st off, NO ONE playing in the NFL for 3+ years is terrible. They're the finest football players on the planet. What makes or breaks teams fortune has more to do with schemes and locker room. I don't argue that PB looked lost a lot of the time the past 2 seasons, but I put that firmly on the scheme which did not match his strengths. A few of those terrible plays you reference certainly appeared to hi-lite PB's diving missed tackle, but I saw them as him racing over to the ball carrier from a position he shouldn't have had to come from and his diving attempt was born out of desperation because NO ONE else was around the ball carrier for another 15-20 yrds. As fans, we have no choice but to accept the words of the coaching staffs and Leslie is firmly in Brown's corner -for the time being.

The whole d looked lost the last 2 years. PB will have a comeback season, as will the rest of the d. Now, if Ragland beats him for the starting spot, that's fine. We now have a decent backup.

[thebandit27]

 

 

Used in coverage "quite a bit" is a real exaggeration. I remember seeing a story after the 2015 season when all the DLs complained about it showing that each DL had averaged a bit over a play a game in coverage. This was a change-up, not something they were doing all the time.

 

But I agree that Dareus just hasn't been a force the past couple of years.

Twice in the entirety of the 2015 season did Dareus drop into coverage

[nucci]

Preston Brown is terrible. Period. End of story. It is not Rex Ryan's fault the guy cannot tackle anyone without being pushed ahead 2-3 yards, needing help, or risk the guy breaking the arm tackle for huge games (see Dolphins games). It is not Rex Ryan's fault that the guy over pursued his assigned hole over and over and over again leading to huge gains. It is not Rex Ryan's fault the guy simply cannot shed a block and make a play. Stop blaming Rex Ryan for all of our terrible players performance. Some of guys are just terrible.

 

Now, Ragland was a tackling machine at Alabama and in the limited time he was on the field last summer. That is something to get excited about, not Preston Brown.

Not really

[Dopey]

Twice in the entirety of the 2015 season did Dareus drop into coverage

Didn't do much research, but this article claims in the KC game alone, Marcell dropped into coverage 2x. Each one resulted in a TD pass.

 

"On both of Alex Smith's touchdown passes during the Bills' 30-22 loss to the Kansas City Chiefs on Sunday, it appeared star defensive tackle Marcell Dareus was dropping back into coverage." By Matthew Fairburn | mfairburn@newyorkupstate.com

http://www.syracuse.com/buffalo-bills/index.ssf/2015/12/bills_rex_ryan_explains_marcell_dareus_dropping_into_coverage_on_chiefs_td_passe.html

 

Again, I didn't do much research but I'm gonna guess he dropped into coverage more than 2x. I'm not saying he dropped into coverage "quite a bit", but if you are correct, he dropped both times in the same game. Seems strange to me.

Edited July 10, 2017 by Dopey

[Coach Tuesday]

Twice in the entirety of the 2015 season did Dareus drop into coverage

 

Are you counting zone blitzes or not?

[Royale with Cheese]

Didn't do much research, but this article claims in the KC game alone, Marcell dropped into coverage 2x. Each one resulted in a TD pass.

 

"On both of Alex Smith's touchdown passes during the Bills' 30-22 loss to the Kansas City Chiefs on Sunday, it appeared star defensive tackle Marcell Dareus was dropping back into coverage." By Matthew Fairburn | mfairburn@newyorkupstate.com

http://www.syracuse.com/buffalo-bills/index.ssf/2015/12/bills_rex_ryan_explains_marcell_dareus_dropping_into_coverage_on_chiefs_td_passe.html

 

Again, I didn't do much research but I'm gonna guess he dropped into coverage more than 2x. I'm not saying he dropped into coverage "quite a bit", but if you are correct, he dropped both times in the same game. Seems strange to me.

I did read that in 2015, Mario dropped something around 36 times in coverage. I don't know about Dareus though but would assume they would be in the same ballpark.

[Drunken Pygmy Goat]

I'm not sure how you absolve Rex when the team was 9th DVOA in 2014, 15th in 2015, and 28th in 2016 with virtually the same guys? No one is saying Brown is great but he's not terrible. Rex (and Rob) made guys worse with their scheme and lack of communication. We will see this year just how bad they were.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the defense was 2nd in DVOA in 2014... further proving your theory.

[Alphadawg7]

Interesting quote from our DC in article by CB on who will be the starting LB's. Always figured whoever loses at MLB will split time with Alexander at SAM.

 

I always felt Preston Brown was a decent LB, and seems like fans have written off how good Reggie Ragland can be in any scheme. With Hodges in the mix, this should be a fun summer.

 

Im confused, was this ever in question? I mean I thought it was pretty clear our 3 LBs are Lonzo, Brown, and Ragland.

[thebandit27]

 

Are you counting zone blitzes or not?

Going off of E Turner numbers:

 

http://www.cover1.net/2016/02/20161212015-bills-defensive-study-defensive-line/

[Alphadawg7]

PS: Our D last year was substantially worse than many tend to believe. Lots of people point to the season end numbers to make a case we were average, not terrible. But what is GROSSLY overlooked is the week 4 FLUKE. Our numbers were heavily skewed by a week 4 shutout of a Pats team missing Brady and Jimmy that started a rookie QB with a hurt throwing hand. Plus no Gronk really, as he only played a few decoy snaps.

 

If you look at the other 15 games, we were 26th in the NFL in points allowed.

 

If you think about what the Pats WOULD have scored had Brady played (he dropped 41 on us a few weeks later), then we more than likely drop to 28th in the NFL had Brady played week 4.

 

We were one of the 5 worst defenses in the NFL last year, so lots of reasons to expect a significant bounce back with the better coaching and scheme, Dareus not missing half the season, Rags and Shaq healthy, and the new additions. If we can get back to even around 15th in the NFL, that could be enough to get us in the playoffs. We lost 6 of our 8 games under TT last year by 6 points or less. With even a modest improvement to our D, it could potentially flip several those into wins assuming our Offensive scoring doesn't completely fall off with the new coaches.

[wilcoam]

Im confused, was this ever in question? I mean I thought it was pretty clear our 3 LBs are Lonzo, Brown, and Ragland.

 

Actually, us fans feel/think Lonzo and Brown may be liabilities vs the run and that's why they went out and brought in Hodges, who got a terrific PFF LB rating last season, just a bit below Zack Brown, and specifically vs the run, rated 12th best in the NFL, right after, sic, Bradham

 

Based on last years stats, Hodges and Lonzo, are the best 3 down LB's, and one of Brown and Ragland, will begin as a backup, though Frazier seems to contradict what alot of us are thinking, lol

 

Considering we should be in nickel/dime 65% of the time, and only 2 LB's will see the field, I see a rotation of sorts, Ragland and Hodges being the primary LB's on run downs, both come out for Lonzo and Brown on passing downs, that works, and now having brought Hodges in, re-upped Lonzo, and depending upon if Ragland is the real deal, our LB's situation is not as dire as it once looked, might turn out to be a strength, however no one really knows until the guys hit the field, let alone, who is starting, etc, its all a transitional year

 

jc

Edited July 10, 2017 by wilcoam

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Didn't do much research, but this article claims in the KC game alone, Marcell dropped into coverage 2x. Each one resulted in a TD pass.

 

"On both of Alex Smith's touchdown passes during the Bills' 30-22 loss to the Kansas City Chiefs on Sunday, it appeared star defensive tackle Marcell Dareus was dropping back into coverage." By Matthew Fairburn | mfairburn@newyorkupstate.com

http://www.syracuse.com/buffalo-bills/index.ssf/2015/12/bills_rex_ryan_explains_marcell_dareus_dropping_into_coverage_on_chiefs_td_passe.html

 

Again, I didn't do much research but I'm gonna guess he dropped into coverage more than 2x. I'm not saying he dropped into coverage "quite a bit", but if you are correct, he dropped both times in the same game. Seems strange to me.

And it was clearly two times too many. Dropping a 300+ pound Incredibly talented passrushing pocket collapsing Tackle into shallow middle zone coverage isn't trickery...

 

But look, Browns deal is simple. He was very good in Jim Schwartz's scheme. He was rarely asked to move sideline to sideline and was primarily a clean up shed and tackle run stuffer in the middle or shallow zone MLB. He capitalized on the front four wreaking havoc and funneling stuff to the middle.

 

 

In Rex's scheme he had to play sideline to sideline and man up on RB and TE, and occasionally, unforgivablably even on slot WRs. It's not him. I'm not sure Ragland would have thrived either. Really you needed ray Lewis or a reasonable facsimile to make it all work- and we know there aren't a bunch of Ray Lewis's walking around.

 

If they come back to that sort of defense we saw do pretty well under Jim, provided they can replace marios edge setting presence from 2014, which was exceptional, I think he'll be just fine.

Edited July 10, 2017 by Over 28 years of fanhood

[wilcoam]

Excellent points on how Preston excelled in 2014, note Schwartz moved the insider Spikes outside where he equally excelled

Which brings us to the million dollar question

We have 3 MLB's in Ragland, Brown, and Hodges

So who moves outside and can they be successful there, because as you pointed out its likely not gonna be a fit for Preston

 

jc

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Excellent points on how Preston excelled in 2014, note Schwartz moved the insider Spikes outside where he equally excelled

Which brings us to the million dollar question

We have 3 MLB's in Ragland, Brown, and Hodges

So who moves outside and can they be successful there, because as you pointed out its likely not gonna be a fit for Preston

 

jc

I believe Hodges is the smaller and faster of the three. Has been successful in coverage.

 

I'm unclear on what Frazier will want his Linebackers to do. Going with Schwartz scheme for a minute, I can see Brown in the middle, Ragland penciling into the spot Bradham occupied and can't for the life of me remember who the third regular lb was. It's possible it was spikes at MLB and brown/Bradham- in that case brown Ragland hodges may work just fine. (Assuming rags can play)

[Bill from NYC]

 

 

Used in coverage "quite a bit" is a real exaggeration. I remember seeing a story after the 2015 season when all the DLs complained about it showing that each DL had averaged a bit over a play a game in coverage. This was a change-up, not something they were doing all the time.

 

But I agree that Dareus just hasn't been a force the past couple of years.

When linemen are held back from penetrating they are very often guarding for screens, in addition to playing the run.

 

Remember Big Sam Adams? People looked at his size and thought of him as a nose. He was not. Dareus reminds me of Adams.

 

When a strong, penetrating DT like Marcel is in coverage, or even standing around scrimmage jumping up and down, a very talented player is being wasted. I hope it doesn't take long to erase Rex from the memory of the players and the fans, including this one.

[ChanOverChin]

We really only have four LBs who can be counted on........Ragland, P. Brown, Alexander, and Hodges. Frazier will find a way to play the best of the four according to down and distance.

 

Alexander may be out of position at LB, but he sure seems to be able to adapt well quickly. He played LB in the pro Bowl recently and voted Pro Bowl MVP.

 

I happen to think that Ragland is going to be the best of the four. By the end of the fourth preseason game that will be quite evident. You can bet that Ragland will be starting, whether at MLB or OLB.

 

Brown is accustomed to being the defensive play caller. That means that the coaches trust him considerably. He played quite well in Schwartz's 4-3 defense as the MLB calling out the defensive alignments. I think the Bills may lean on him to be their MLB for awhile until Ragland gets his feet wet.

In the meantime, Ragland will likely play OLB because he's too damn good to not have on the field.

 

Hodges is a bona fide NFL starting LB. He definitely looks the part. He will play OLB for the Bills and likely spell Ragland and Alexander.

 

Alexander will be expected to be a third down pass rushing specialist as well as play on ST. He'll be playing OLB because he too is too damn good to not have on the field.

[#34fan]

I doubt even Frazier can undo two years of Ryan Ruination in four weeks....

 

I'm actually more worried about this defense than I was with last year's...

Edited July 10, 2017 by #34fan

[Dr. K]

I expect Brown to look much better now that he won't have to play in Rex's defense, for which he was not suited. Look at the player he was in his rookie year.

[John from Riverside]

When linemen are held back from penetrating they are very often guarding for screens, in addition to playing the run.

 

Remember Big Sam Adams? People looked at his size and thought of him as a nose. He was not. Dareus reminds me of Adams.

 

When a strong, penetrating DT like Marcel is in coverage, or even standing around scrimmage jumping up and down, a very talented player is being wasted. I hope it doesn't take long to erase Rex from the memory of the players and the fans, including this one.

The problem I have with Marcel and RR's defense is him playing the "nose" tieing up blockers

 

Your just wasting his talent

[Mark80]

 

Damn, Mark. Hyperbole much? I enjoy your posts, but this reeks of a vendetta. 1st off, NO ONE playing in the NFL for 3+ years is terrible. They're the finest football players on the planet. What makes or breaks teams fortune has more to do with schemes and locker room. I don't argue that PB looked lost a lot of the time the past 2 seasons, but I put that firmly on the scheme which did not match his strengths. A few of those terrible plays you reference certainly appeared to hi-lite PB's diving missed tackle, but I saw them as him racing over to the ball carrier from a position he shouldn't have had to come from and his diving attempt was born out of desperation because NO ONE else was around the ball carrier for another 15-20 yrds. As fans, we have no choice but to accept the words of the coaching staffs and Leslie is firmly in Brown's corner -for the time being.

 

Ha, yes, I do have it out for Preston. I will not deny that. There are fundamental things a MLB has to do in my mind. First and foremost is tackle well. I can say with a high degree of certainty that more times than not when I saw a play (and I'm talking up the middle more so than the outside) that a guy got dragged for yards on a tackle, or attempted an arm tackle that was run through, or went to the wrong hole leaving a gaping hole where he should have been, Preston Brown seemed to be the man at fault. So, after noticing this, I tried to watch him solely on a number of plays during games. What I saw then was Preston eaten up by blockers with no shedding ability at all.

 

Now, can some of it be Rex's fault? Maybe he was assigned the wrong holes to attack, I don't know. But a MLB who can't get off blocks and who can't tackle, well, that's not a coaching problem IMO, that's a player problem. Add to that the complete dysfunction on the communication side of things, which is also usually a MLB job. I attribute that aspect more to Rex and the coaching staff though, but other MLBs have done fine with these coaches, even excelled with Lewis and Harris.

 

Terrible may be an exaggeration as I'm sure he would be a good depth guy to have. But if we end up depending on him to be our run stopping, team leader on defense, well, I think we are in trouble then.