Coach Tuesday Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Moves like like this. Watkins, keeping schlubs like Eric wood, trading for McCoy, and really just doing all we can to be mediocre makes me care less and less about this stupid team. They make dumb football decisions. Indeed they do. They're one of the worst-run mega-businesses in the United States. It takes a staggering amount of ineptitude to miss out on the playoffs for two decades, given the rules favoring parity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lv-Bills Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 (edited) Pretty much everything you've said here is wrong, and the stats that completely contradict these assertions have been posted in this very thread. But alas, Emotion > Facts You can throw as many stats out there as you would like. It's not wrong. This guy.....on film......ran away from contact in the running game on many occasions last year. Liability. He's not physical at all. He's a terrible tackler. Unless you have a computer, tablet, or smartphone that can assess those things that can't be measured by stats, film doesn't lie. As for coverage. It's not a mistake that he, on a ton of occasions, seemed to always be in the middle of some mix up in communication of some sort. Matter of fact, according to him, and his jocksniffing defenders, things were never his fault. While some of that is true, and the truth is probably somewhere in the middle, he wasn't good last year. Period. When you have a player that is elite, you don't have nearly the Media, pundits, coaches, analysts or fans that question this much of a guys ability like people do Gilmore. You debate whether or not he's the best. Not whether or not he's even worth a crap. Edited March 9, 2017 by Lv-Bills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 I need to get better about ignoring them...I have a very real issue with needing to establish accuracy as part of some ill-conceived idea that--once accuracy and facts are established--an intelligent discussion can occur. Um, have you seen 2017? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWATeam Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 I need to get better about ignoring them...I have a very real issue with needing to establish accuracy as part of some ill-conceived idea that--once accuracy and facts are established--an intelligent discussion can occur. Your work is appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 If Sammy can stay healthyand Gilmore can stay healthy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 I haven't gone over the responses to this, but I am guessing that there are 20 or so excuses for that play. Gilmore is a talented player who put forth a lackluster effort last season. Will he play better in NE? Probably. Hogan did. In any case it's clear (imo) that he didn't want to be here. His situation reminds me a bit of the circumstances under which we lost Clements, who I actually preferred over Gilmore. I wish him luck but let's just say it won't take me that long to get over his departure. What lack of effort? He was clearly expecting safety help on that play. I know you'll chalk it up to excuses, but here is what Gilmore said afterward:'"Busted coverage," said Gilmore, who was spotted yelling at safety Jonathan Meeks following the play.' http://bigstory.ap.org/article/08ca3d01812f4e41aa440bfa169dd5eb/demoralization-sets-bills-after-41-25-loss-pats Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Yup. It's frustrating to see so many ill-informed, emotional takes. Why? Because they disagree with you? Have you ever been wrong about a player? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 I need to get better about ignoring them...I have a very real issue with needing to establish accuracy as part of some ill-conceived idea that--once accuracy and facts are established--an intelligent discussion can occur. this is the year of alternate facts, #feelings and snowflakes. So much special here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonCents Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 This is not intended to be mean... You live in an alternate reality...form is his problem, not willingness. The guy has laid out both Gronk and Tyler Eifert in the past. Pay attention to what happens on the field and not a preconceived narrative. I don't think I'm going out on a limb when I say with the change of atmosphere he just signed into he will quickly figuere the small things out. The chance to win for a guy who was fed up with losing is a hell of a motivator. I still don't see a long term plan in place that shows Whaley and company know what they are doing. A press release saying they moved on from paying Gilmore before the season started? Before Rex bungled the HC job? Oh strange, those same decision makers told us how perfect he was for Rex. Meanwhile they allot cap money to another FB and a niche back. The guy they decided to negotiate with is Lorax? An aging career special teamer who shined one year in a screwball scheme?! I hope the approach isn't just to sign hardworking guys instead of signing talented guys and making them work hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bomb Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Lmao, and bills fans didn't want the kid back... Nope, not for 14m a season, no way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 What lack of effort? He was clearly expecting safety help on that play. I know you'll chalk it up to excuses, but here is what Gilmore said afterward:'"Busted coverage," said Gilmore, who was spotted yelling at safety Jonathan Meeks following the play.' [/size]http://bigstory.ap.org/article/08ca3d01812f4e41aa440bfa169dd5eb/demoralization-sets-bills-after-41-25-loss-patsHis lack of effort last season was more than that 1 play that you so readily excuse. Other people agree; you do not. What makes your takes all knowing and beyond dispute? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 You can throw as many stats out there as you would like. It's not wrong. This guy.....on film......ran away from contact in the running game on many occasions last year. Liability. He's not physical at all. He's a terrible tackler. Unless you have a computer, tablet, or smartphone that can assess those things that can't be measured by stats, film doesn't lie. As for coverage. It's not a mistake that he, on a ton of occasions, seemed to always be in the middle of some mix up in communication of some sort. Matter of fact, according to him, and his jocksniffing defenders, things were never his fault. While some of that is true, and the truth is probably somewhere in the middle, he wasn't good last year. Period. When you have a player that is elite, you don't have nearly the Media, pundits, coaches, analysts or fans that question this much of a guys ability like people do Gilmore. You debate whether or not he's the best. Not whether or not he's even worth a crap. "Always" as in, what, twice that you can remember in 2017? Your questioning his willingness to be physical is absolutely hilarious considering he separated his shoulder in 2016 diving shoulder-first into a RB. Also, this: And this: And this: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-videos/0ap2000000219168/Stephon-Gilmore-breaks-up-long-pass-to-Gronkowski And...well...sometimes it's just easier to say you're wrong. Because, well, you're wrong. Um, have you seen 2017? Like I said, it's ill-advised on my part. Your work is appreciated Nice to know...thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Why? Because they disagree with you? Have you ever been wrong about a player? Thank you this needed to said! Your work is appreciated he's my hero Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 (edited) Why? Because they disagree with you? Have you ever been wrong about a player? I have been wrong plenty. I thought Trent Edwards was the answer. But I based my view on what I saw, what he measured out at, and more importantly my projection of what I thought he could do. Obviously, I was completely wrong, but my view was centered around what i thought his future progression would be. Smarter fans than me (Alphadawg) had much better eyes than I did. At any rate, I like to think that I don't argue based on one-time anecdotes and emotion but rather on a stronger evidentiary basis. And it is frustrating to see tons of ill-informed, emotional takes that ignore the evidence that is in front of one's face (if one takes the time to dig a little bit). The punchline here is that the greatest DB coach of all time just paid this guy a ton of cash. I'll take his opinion any day. Edited March 9, 2017 by dave mcbride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lv-Bills Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 (edited) "Always" as in, what, twice that you can remember in 2017? Your questioning his willingness to be physical is absolutely hilarious considering he separated his shoulder in 2016 diving shoulder-first into a RB. Also, this: And this: And this: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-videos/0ap2000000219168/Stephon-Gilmore-breaks-up-long-pass-to-Gronkowski And...well...sometimes it's just easier to say you're wrong. Because, well, you're wrong. Like I said, it's ill-advised on my part. Nice to know...thanks OK, so do you want me to go watch all 16 games from last year, and post the 50 times or so I know that Gilmore ran from contact, didn't fight off blocks to even attempt to hold an edge, or gave less than 100% effort. Because there are many. So, while videos are cute and all, there are good and bad videos for almost every player in the league. Hell, Mario Williams even exerted maximum effort here and there, that probably ended up on YouTube. Maybe I could point out that for how great Randy Moss' career was, I can probably produce 25 videos of him loafing or not trying. The video point isn't impressive, because there as many that shows he was bad. Neither was Gilmore last year. That being said, if he is as good as some people think he is, he picked the one absolute place where he can thrive. Great move going to NE for him. He wasn't his best here, that's for sure. Edited March 9, 2017 by Lv-Bills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 What lack of effort? He was clearly expecting safety help on that play. I know you'll chalk it up to excuses, but here is what Gilmore said afterward:'"Busted coverage," said Gilmore, who was spotted yelling at safety Jonathan Meeks following the play.' [/size]http://bigstory.ap.org/article/08ca3d01812f4e41aa440bfa169dd5eb/demoralization-sets-bills-after-41-25-loss-pats Busted coverage is a good reason to give up on the play and call out your teamates before the play is even over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 OK, so do you want me to go watch all 16 games from last year, and post the 50 times or so I know that Gilmore ran from contact, didn't off blocks to even attempt to hold an edge, or gave less than 100% effort. Because there are many. So, while videos are cute and all, there are good and bad videos for almost every player in the league. Hell, Mario Williams even exerted maximum effort here and there, that probably ended up on YouTube. Maybe I could point out that for how great Randy Moss' career was, I can probably produce 25 videos of him loafing or not trying. The video isn't impressive. Neither was Gilmore last year. Agreed! Give me A.J. Bouye over this guy any day! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonCents Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Agreed! Give me A.J. Bouye over this guy any day! Hey that's my guy!! Step off!!! But yea I agree, he is going to be a star. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 I have been wrong plenty. I thought Trent Edwards was the answer. But I based my view on what I saw, what he measured out at, and more importantly my projection of what I thought he could do. Obviously, I was completely wrong, but my view was centered around what i thought his future progression would be. Smarter fans than me (Alphadawg) had much better eyes than I did. At any rate, I like to think that I don't argue based on one-time anecdotes and emotion but rather on a stronger evidentiary basis. And it is frustrating to see tons of ill-informed, emotional takes that ignore the evidence that is in front of one's face (if one takes the time to dig a little bit). The punchline here is that the greatest DB coach of all time just paid this guy a ton of cash. I'll take his opinion any day. Sure, Gilmore has talent and BB has 60 million in cap space, plus Brady. Make no mistake, I respect you as a poster but you are usually not so dismissive to those who disagree with your takes, and I have been reading your posts for many, many years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 (edited) His lack of effort last season was more than that 1 play that you so readily excuse. Other people agree; you do not. What makes your takes all knowing and beyond dispute? I am disputing things, as are others here, so obviously what I say isn't "beyond dispute." That's their right, and my right. I simply disagree with them (and, apparently, with you). That's what a freaking message board is for. Edited March 9, 2017 by dave mcbride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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