GunnerBill Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 SEA has zero championships an no S-bowl rings if they wait for RW to develop behind Matt Flynn... WAS doesn't make the playoffs last season if Shanny doesn't double down on QB's in '12... The lesson? -If you havent got a franchise guy, you should ALWAYs be looking for a QB... That is, if you're serious about rings... There should be absolutely no question whether of not your QB can get you to the playoffs... If there is, his potential replacement should be on your bench. Correct, although Flynn isn't quite a fair comparison because he was also new to Seattle that year. If the Bills took say, Dak Prescott, in the 3rd you would not expect him to outplay Tyrod in camp because Tyrod would have the advantage of a year in the system and a comfort level with his teammates. So whilst I agree with your general premise that if you think a guy who can be a starting Quarterback in the NFL is there when you value him then you pick him.... but Wilson had a better chance of beating out the vet than most mid-round guys in that situation have (and Flynn sucked in that pre-season by the way - Wilson was good but Flynn lost that job as much as Wilson won it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 Correct, although Flynn isn't quite a fair comparison because he was also new to Seattle that year. If the Bills took say, Dak Prescott, in the 3rd you would not expect him to outplay Tyrod in camp because Tyrod would have the advantage of a year in the system and a comfort level with his teammates. So whilst I agree with your general premise that if you think a guy who can be a starting Quarterback in the NFL is there when you value him then you pick him.... but Wilson had a better chance of beating out the vet than most mid-round guys in that situation have (and Flynn sucked in that pre-season by the way - Wilson was good but Flynn lost that job as much as Wilson won it). Even better! -If you suck, you should get exposed.... If you have another gear we've not seen, you'll need to whip it out in order to fend off a talented rival.. Either way, the TEAM wins. If my mind's not made up about a QB, the LAST thing I want is for him to be comfortable in his mediocrity... I want him worried... That'll show me more of what I need to know in order to make the call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solomon Grundy Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 I actually dont mind Dac Prescott.....but my question is.....are we looking for a starter? We are probably about to pay TT 20 million a year.......why would we be looking for a starter? We need someone that can come in and win maybe 3 games a year. Sorry John, but I'm not paying TT "franchise QB" money. We jumped the shark once with Fitzpatrick. Like I said earlier in my post, Kevin Hogan is "probably" the one QB in this year's draft that can win in the NFL with the compliment of weapons already acquired on this roster. He has a TE in Clay. A dynamic receiver in Watkins. A returning starting five offensive line and let's not forget about Shady. Shady is every bit the dynamic player McCaffrey was at Stanford last season. Let TT play out the year while Hogan works on that quirky delivery. Not worried much about Hogan cerebrally, just his throwing motion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 (edited) Well, the real question is "were you happy with his development prior to "the hit"? The pro's and con's have already been discussed ad nauseam, I'm just curious to see which people here are on which side. It's either "he was developing into a QB good enough to lead the Bills to the promised land, with the right cast around him", or "he wasn't good enough, even before he had his brain scrambled". I thought he was developing nicely....to be quite honest Sorry John, but I'm not paying TT "franchise QB" money. We jumped the shark once with Fitzpatrick. Like I said earlier in my post, Kevin Hogan is "probably" the one QB in this year's draft that can win in the NFL with the compliment of weapons already acquired on this roster. He has a TE in Clay. A dynamic receiver in Watkins. A returning starting five offensive line and let's not forget about Shady. Shady is every bit the dynamic player McCaffrey was at Stanford last season. Let TT play out the year while Hogan works on that quirky delivery. Not worried much about Hogan cerebrally, just his throwing motion. Sky, You are most welcome to your opinion....I dont agree with it. You cannot keep keep hitting the reset button at QB at hope for any kind of success......and that does not mean that I dont subscribe to the "draft a QB every year philosophy"....I do actually. We have not had the quality of a QB like TT in some time.....he does everything that a franshise QB is asked to do talent wise and even started to show ability to throw over the middle of the field towards the end of the year which people claimed he cannot do. Is he a top 5 NFL QB.....no I dont think he is.....but I think it is also a fallacy to try to keep hitting the reset buttom trying to find that golden fleece.....teams out there wish they just had a STARTING caliber NFL QB. He is gonna get that contract barring injury....and this isnt a fitzpatrick situation either....the bills are being patient to make sure they DONT do the Ryan Fitzy thing...... but I believe Tyrod is the guy Edit: And honestly I dont see a problem with drafting Hogan either....I think he is complimentery piece to our team puzzle. Edited March 27, 2016 by John from Hemet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 (edited) I thought he was developing nicely....to be quite honest I thought his ceiling was the second coming of Jay Fiedler, at best. (Actually, Fiedler was way better). Anyone else out there like Trentative, "pre-scrambled"? Edited March 27, 2016 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaNole3 Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 HAHA! Even after he was benched in college for EJ too He wasn't benched for EJ. He injured his shoulder making a tackle and was out for the bowl game. EJ then started the bowl game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DallasMac Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 I thought his ceiling was the second coming of Jay Fiedler, at best. (Actually, Fiedler was way better). Anyone else out there like Trentative, "pre-scrambled"? Trent had one of his best games the week after against San Diego. "The Hit" had nothing to do with Trent's failure. He couldn't throw the deep ball consistently and I don't think he ever had a game where he threw for over 300 yds. He just wasn't any good. Had nothing to do with Adrian Wilson. Can we please stop pretending he was good before the concussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokestradamus Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 People who loved Tom Savage and Sean Mannion also love Kevin Hogan. The guy has a winning complexion for some in the draft media. I don't draft Kevin Hogan at all. He's a dagger through the heart in the red zone, he's inaccurate as a passer. I've not seen this reinvented throwing motion yet so I can't comment if he's shortened it up by much. There's also no telling if he's going to revert back to old habits under pressure. Kevin Hogan is a guy I pick up as a UDFA. He's my QB3 (or PS QB depending on roster composition). He's a smart guy, he's routinely made checks/audibles at the LOS and that's a testament to his film room preparation. I'd rather have him as a coach than a player. He has a place in the NFL, it just isn't on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 I thought his ceiling was the second coming of Jay Fiedler, at best. (Actually, Fiedler was way better). Anyone else out there like Trentative, "pre-scrambled"? His ceiling was something like Alex Smith. He lacks Smith's luck (coaching, opportunities) and toughness. You're being overly critical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 His ceiling was something like Alex Smith. He lacks Smith's luck (coaching, opportunities) and toughness. You're being overly critical. Where? Edwards had a 4 game winning streak against some crappy teams...Jay Fielder had three 10+ winning seasons. I watched Trent Edwards, and he was no Jay Fiedler. And Alex Smith isn't taking anyone to the Promised Land. He can't advance in the playoffs. After he was with the Bills, where he had Chan Gailey (who actually squeezed some wins out of Fitzlacksit), Edwards had a chance with Andy Ried. Everywhere he went, he failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 just say no Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turftoe Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 To me, Hogan is way more Trent Edwards than Andrew Luck. I'm bumming that there is no way to get Wentz without giving up the farm. The guy who kind of intrigues me that no one is talking about is AJ Mccarron. If anything, would be a good backup for 2 cheap years. Maybe if Cincy calls to move up on draft day, McCarron could be part of the deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 To me, Hogan is way more Trent Edwards than Andrew Luck. I'm bumming that there is no way to get Wentz without giving up the farm. The guy who kind of intrigues me that no one is talking about is AJ Mccarron. If anything, would be a good backup for 2 cheap years. Maybe if Cincy calls to move up on draft day, McCarron could be part of the deal. I like McCarron, why would Cincy trade up to 19 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turftoe Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 I like McCarron, why would Cincy trade up to 19 Maybe if a top WR drops.Treadwell maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 Something tells me that the Bills will draft him in the 3rd round this year. Whaley said that he is the most NFL ready QB in the draft and he fits the offensive system. I see him as a poor mans Andrew Luck and I have a real good feeling about Him. I like Tyrod, but I don't know if he has enough to get us to the promise land. I think Hogan will be special. I think he was recruited to Sanford when Roman/Harbaugh were there so it makes sense to connect them. Yet if we take him the 3rd is a bit early he might be there with our second 4th Rounder which be a better spot. I could also see us taking a chance on Hackenberg because of his PSU ties and Polian once talked about us maybe going after him too early in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simpleman Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 I’m not saying Trent was a future Tom Brady before the hit, but his ceiling still appeared higher than a top 20 QB (which he was). In his almost full year before the injury he had a higher Quarterback rating than Brett Favre, Joe Flacco & Ben Roethlisberger and was only .3 below Tony Romo. Does that sound like someone who didn’t have potential and had an obvious low ceiling? He did not work out, but he had potential and his ceiling did not appear as close as it turned out to be. I brought this up because more than one on this board has slammed Hogan by comparing him to Trent because of his background and how he was described by the scouts. I would not take Hogan as a low round draft choice, and would definitely take Prescott or Hackenburg before Hogan. But as a later round pick I would take a chance on Hogan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 Maybe if a top WR drops.Treadwell maybe? Cincy do not trade up in 1st rounds. They always sit and let the board come to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilton Bills Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 I definitely would draft Kevin Hogan in the 3rd or 4th round. Quality individual and a very pro ready qb. Could be the best qb we could have since Jim Kelly. Regardless, all the speculation is a waste of time until something becomes fruition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turftoe Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Cincy do not trade up in 1st rounds. They always sit and let the board come to them. Maybe this year is different. They have an interest. http://www.cincyjungle.com/visits-workouts/2016/3/17/11254972/bengals-set-to-meet-with-ole-miss-wide-receiver-laquon-treadwell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Maybe if a top WR drops.Treadwell maybe? Agreed....this is not THAT far fetched. They lost WR's in the offseason and might target Treadwell... We need a QB to cultivate for the future You could trade down and target a guy like Butler DT/DE int he first....go Sua Cravens in the second.....and have picked up a QB without drafting one to be the number 3 in 2016 then number 2 in 2017. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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