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B-Man

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12 hours ago, B-Man said:

 

"This bill would cheapen the meaning of lynching by defining it so broadly as to include a minor bruise of abrasion."

 


Here's the transcript.
I seek to amend this legislation, not because I take it or I take lynching lightly, but because I take it seriously, and this legislation does not.
Lynching is a tool of terror that claimed the lives of nearly 5,000 Americans between 1881 and 1968. But this bill would cheapen the meaning of lynching by defining it so broadly as to include a minor bruise or abrasion. Our nation’s history of racial terrorism demands more seriousness from us than that....
It would be a disgrace for the Congress of the United States to declare that a bruise is lynching, that an abrasion is lynching, that any injury to the body, no matter how temporary, is on par with the atrocities done to people like Emmett Till, Raymond Gunn, and Sam Hose, who were killed for no reason, but because they were black. To do that would demean their memory and cheapen the historic and horrific legacy of lynching in our country.... 
We have had federal hate crime statutes for over 50 years, and it has been a federal hate crime to murder someone because of their race for over a decade. Additionally, murder is already a crime in 50 states. In fact, rather than consider a good-intentioned but symbolic bill, the Senate could immediately consider addressing qualified immunity and ending police militarization. We can and must do better....
 
 
At the link — the heated response from Senators Kamala Harris and Cory Booker. Harris accuses Paul of having "no reason... other than cruel and deliberate obstruction on a day of mourning." Booker praises Rand Paul — doesn't "question his heart" — but stresses what it "would mean for America" to pass the bill right now instead of getting hung up on "legalistic issues."
 
 
 
Typical Democrats.................let's pass it just so we can show we did "something"
 
 
 
 
 
 

Paul is a d-bag of the first order. That’s all that needs to be said 

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11 hours ago, Magox said:

I was talking about this with a friend.  The political class from the left thinks they can harness this into a voting block. They are wrong, many of these people are radically to the left and entering into the environment if you weren’t radicalized odds are you will be by the time this is over.   The left have a real dilemma, do they adopt many of their crazy initiatives and risk losing the suburban vote or do they just give lip service and throw a bone as they always have and risk low turnout?   I think they placate more so than they’d like.

 

The patients are running wild and have control of the asylum.   There is no satisfying these people.

 

 

 

11 hours ago, Magox said:

Like I said

 

The inmates aren’t running the asylum

 

 

 

Whitmer and Frey are despicable.

 

these people do not understand what they are asking for

https://twitter.com/MarkHiggie1/status/1269301655658512384

 

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7 minutes ago, Foxx said:

is she trying to pass a law that says bruising is lynching?

Yup, and she wants whites to go to jail if they look at Blacks wrong

4 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

I ask this as a serious question. What, in this bill, do you think is specifically needed?  

Let’s suppose it’s just symbolic, why oppose it? What symbolism is Paul showing by opposing something that supposedly does nothing? 

 

 

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I was hoping to come on here this morning to see that the discussions had progressed but apparently not so much. Seeing as how this is the Liberal Protest thread, can someone please list three tangible things that these protestors want? (Not slogans.....but actual changes.) I’ll try....

 

1. Justice and Peace (the officers have all been arrested and charged, and yet the protestors are still out there disrupting the peace?)

 

2. Defunding Police (replacing law enforcement with some sort of army of social workers?)

 

3. Anything else?

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12 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Let’s suppose it’s just symbolic, why oppose it? What symbolism is Paul showing by opposing something that supposedly does nothing? 

 

Because symbolic legislation is still legislation and has actual consequences. I am not a fan of enacting legislation, for any reason, symbolic or otherwise, that (1) recreates legislation that already exists as a means of putting motive at the center of the crime, or (2) that is vague or too broad. 

 

There are some aspects of this bill I could get behind as I am not sure if specific laws already exist. Much of it is too vague or unnecessary for me.

 

Edited by billsfan1959
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Just now, billsfan1959 said:

 

Because symbolic legislation is still legislation and has actual consequences. I am not a fan of enacting legislation, for any reason, symbolic or otherwise, that (1) recreates legislation that already exists that puts motive at the center of the crime, or (2) that is vague or too broad. 

 

There are some aspects of this bill I could get behind as I am not sure if specific laws already exist. Much of it is too vague or unnecessary for me.

I just totally support the bill. If the local governments don’t want to punish people I’d be happy a federal law is ready to be used to go after who ever does something so evil. It’s good to have tool in the tool box if needed 

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11 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I was hoping to come on here this morning to see that the discussions had progressed but apparently not so much. Seeing as how this is the Liberal Protest thread, can someone please list three tangible things that these protestors want? (Not slogans.....but actual changes.) I’ll try....

 

1. Justice and Peace (the officers have all been arrested and charged, and yet the protestors are still out there disrupting the peace?)

 

2. Defunding Police (replacing law enforcement with some sort of army of social workers?)

 

3. Anything else?

4. hell on Earth. because that is what they will get.

 

14 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Yup, and she wants whites to go to jail if they look at Blacks wrong...

 

 

did you just look at me sideways?

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3 minutes ago, Foxx said:

4. hell on Earth. because that is what they will get.

 

I appreciate the effort but like me, you couldn’t come up with #3. This protest has devolved into a daily group outing for the young, out of work, Bored to Death from Being Inside crowd. 

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....and MORE scum......27 year old "tough guy".......

 

Massachusetts Trump supporter, 82, ‘violently assaulted’ by motorist, 27, police say

By Dom Calicchio | Fox News

 

Nobody should be attacked for their political views, Charlie Chase says.

But according to authorities, that’s exactly what happened last week to the 82-year-old U.S. military veteran and supporter of President Trump.

 

The Fall River, Mass., man says he was holding a Trump sign and wearing a Trump hat when suddenly a motorist allegedly got out of his car and charged toward him.

 

“Give me the (expletive) sign!” the suspect said, according to police.

 

https://www.foxnews.com/us/massachusetts-trump-supporter-82-violently-assaulted-by-motorist-27-police-say

 

 

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1 minute ago, Tiberius said:

I just totally support the bill. If the local governments don’t want to punish people I’d be happy a federal law is ready to be used to go after who ever does something so evil. It’s good to have tool in the tool box if needed 

 

I can appreciate your position. However, there are already civil remedies and existing criminal laws that can address much of this. If there is something specific that is not already addressed or needs to be clarified/more specific, then I have no problem. 

 

It feels much like other hate crime legislation: Well intentioned; but, it really takes existing laws and recreates them in a way to put motive at the center of the guilt/innocence phase of the prosecution, rather than addressing it as an aggravating factor in sentencing

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18 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

I can appreciate your position. However, there are already civil remedies and existing criminal laws that can address much of this. If there is something specific that is not already addressed or needs to be clarified/more specific, then I have no problem. 

 

It feels much like other hate crime legislation: Well intentioned; but, it really takes existing laws and recreates them in a way to put motive at the center of the guilt/innocence phase of the prosecution, rather than addressing it as an aggravating factor in sentencing

Reminds me of the Equal Pay laws. There’s a poster in every break room in my office that says it’s the law that I have to pay people equally (which I do)....and yet we hear about supposed gender inequality right around election time, like clockwork!

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22 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

I can appreciate your position. However, there are already civil remedies and existing criminal laws that can address much of this. If there is something specific that is not already addressed or needs to be clarified/more specific, then I have no problem. 

 

It feels much like other hate crime legislation: Well intentioned; but, it really takes existing laws and recreates them in a way to put motive at the center of the guilt/innocence phase of the prosecution, rather than addressing it as an aggravating factor in sentencing

But it does allow for those denied justice at local level to have a higher law to look to. 

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18 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

I can appreciate your position. However, there are already civil remedies and existing criminal laws that can address much of this. If there is something specific that is not already addressed or needs to be clarified/more specific, then I have no problem. 

 

It feels much like other hate crime legislation: Well intentioned; but, it really takes existing laws and recreates them in a way to put motive at the center of the guilt/innocence phase of the prosecution, rather than addressing it as an aggravating factor in sentencing

 

 

..certainly agree...BUT...an impediment is the uphill battle prosecutors face is filing the EXACT and applicable charges, seating an objective jury pool, and then being faced with overturned convictions by a scrutinizing Appeals Court......the Judge assigned to a case is making quick decisions/rulings daily, whereas an Appeals Court (three or more) have ample time to sit and review the case, taking as much time as they deem necessary....what about the lawyers (COUGH) arrested in the NYC molotov cocktail incident who were released?......thankfully Appeals Court overruled and remanded them to jail......

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1 minute ago, Tiberius said:

But it does allow for those denied justice at local level to have a higher law to look to. 

 

I believe that already exists under federal civil rights laws. I do not mind federal criminal legislation that is necessary. So, I guess it depends on what specific denial of justice at the local level are we talking about? Or are we talking about legislation specifically designed to circumvent double jeopardy?

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5 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

I believe that already exists under federal civil rights laws. I do not mind federal criminal legislation that is necessary. So, I guess it depends on what specific denial of justice at the local level are we talking about? Or are we talking about legislation specifically designed to circumvent double jeopardy?

 

...as long as they are applied EQUALLY.....racism/civil rights are NOT just limited to skin color.....what about ETHNIC racism?....yes Hate Crimes legislation begins to address this.....isn't ETHNIC racism a worldwide pandemic?.....thousands of years in existence and NO end in sight.....hell we even have clowns in the US society who don't know the Civil War is over....geographic racism/hate crimes....."Yankees vs Confederates" still exist.....my retired neighbors (in their 70's) drove from Rochester NY to Myrtle Beach for a vacation.....because of NY plates, the "yankees" were confronted and threatened....are we really still THIS BAD?.....good Lord.......got any solutions??..........

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17 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

I believe that already exists under federal civil rights laws. I do not mind federal criminal legislation that is necessary. So, I guess it depends on what specific denial of justice at the local level are we talking about? Or are we talking about legislation specifically designed to circumvent double jeopardy?

No, it’s designed to circumvent “No Jeopardy” in case local officials refuse to act. 

18 minutes ago, Foxx said:

just in case their ego was bruised, amiright?

Local officials have a tremendous amount of power over peoples lives. 

 

Ever see Who Killed Garret Phillips? Great HBO documentary about a small NY town trying to convict a black guy for a murder there was no proof he did. Really crazy and the whole town (much like a lynching) wanted to get this black guy. 

 

 

 

 

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...shocking that Arkansas' pant suited feral hog weighs in with the solutions......Ms Irrelevant reveals that old losing wounds never heal......

 

Clinton calls Trump 'failure' in blistering interview, questions how anyone 'with a beating heart and a working mind' supports him

By Ronn Blitzer | Fox News

 

Former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton railed against President Trump and his response to George Floyd’s death in a new interview with the Los Angeles Times, saying his handling of the situation has been “inadequate” and that the president has been “such a failure across the board.”

In excerpts of the interview that were published Saturday, Clinton pulled no punches when it comes to the president or his supporters.

“It is a mystery why anybody with a beating heart and a working mind still supports him,” she said.

 

Clinton accused Trump of making everything “all about him” instead of addressing problems head on.

 

“If it’s about a terrible pandemic with an unprecedented virus, he tries to ignore it, tries to keep the attention on himself,” she said. “Then when it becomes impossible to do that, he tries to seize the moment and turn it into a daily rally, like he loves to do. And then when it becomes impossible to ignore, he tries to change the subject, he tries to withdraw from the spotlight so he can come up with some other diversion and distraction for the body politic and the press.”

 

Clinton then said that in the immediate aftermath of Floyd’s death after being pinned to the ground by Minneapolis police, Trump appeared to respond well, but then dropped the ball.

 

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/clinton-rips-failure-trump-questions-how-anyone-with-a-beating-heart-and-a-working-mind-supports-him-in-new-interview

 

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1 minute ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...as long as they are applied EQUALLY.....racism/civil rights are NOT just limited to skin color.....what about ETHNIC racism?....yes Hate Crimes legislation begins to address this.....isn't ETHNIC racism a worldwide pandemic?.....thousands of years in existence and NO end in sight.....hell we even have clowns in the US society who don't know the Civil War is over....geographic racism/hate crimes....."Yankees vs Confederates" still exist.....my retired neighbors (in their 70's) drove from Rochester NY to Myrtle Beach for a vacation.....because of NY plates, the "yankees" were confronted and threatened....are we really still THIS BAD?.....good Lord.......got any solutions??..........

 

I don't have any specific solution. I wish I did. I believe, as a society, we have made real progress in systemic biases and prejudices on different levels. It hasn't changed to the degree most of us would like; however, we are changing.

 

In addition, there will always be a small segment of society that just does bad things. It is fairly consistent and doesn't really change.Violent crime will always exist. There is a rate range it fluctuates between, but it is always there. However, we are making progress there as well. WHile it may seem worse to many, the rates of violent violent crime have been at some of their lowest numbers across the board.

 

We just keep trying, I guess...

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10 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

No, it’s designed to circumvent “No Jeopardy” in case local officials refuse to act. 

 

There are always going to be injustices in the prosecution, conviction, and sentencing of people in this country. It is a system run entirely by human beings. I am all in favor doing what we can in continually shaping laws and criminal procedures to eliminate those injustices.

 

I would prefer that, whatever we do, it not be so vague and broad that it invites more injustice in its application.

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10 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

I don't have any specific solution. I wish I did. I believe, as a society, we have made real progress in systemic biases and prejudices on different levels. It hasn't changed to the degree most of us would like; however, we are changing.

 

In addition, there will always be a small segment of society that just does bad things. It is fairly consistent and doesn't really change.Violent crime will always exist. There is a rate range it fluctuates between, but it is always there. However, we are making progress there as well. WHile it may seem worse to many, the rates of violent violent crime have been at some of their lowest numbers across the board.

 

We just keep trying, I guess...

 

...a VERY fair assessment....and yes there is NO magical or overnight "cure".....step back and look at the world......thousands and thousands of years exist relative to ethnic racism with NO end in sight......and we are purported to have the "magic wand"?.....seriously?......and the full court press in the US for socialism to level the playing field to punish achievers regardless of race, creed, color, ethnicity et al so the "gimme crowd", again REGARDLESS of race, creed, color, ethnicity et al want more for doing less or even nothing?......should we assume that with Phase 3, all of these protestors are going back to work (COUGH)??.......

Edited by OldTimeAFLGuy
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11 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

...shocking that Arkansas' pant suited feral hog weighs in with the solutions......Ms Irrelevant reveals that old losing wounds never heal......

 

Clinton calls Trump 'failure' in blistering interview, questions how anyone 'with a beating heart and a working mind' supports him

By Ronn Blitzer | Fox News

 

Former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton railed against President Trump and his response to George Floyd’s death in a new interview with the Los Angeles Times, saying his handling of the situation has been “inadequate” and that the president has been “such a failure across the board.”

In excerpts of the interview that were published Saturday, Clinton pulled no punches when it comes to the president or his supporters.

“It is a mystery why anybody with a beating heart and a working mind still supports him,” she said.

 

Clinton accused Trump of making everything “all about him” instead of addressing problems head on.

 

“If it’s about a terrible pandemic with an unprecedented virus, he tries to ignore it, tries to keep the attention on himself,” she said. “Then when it becomes impossible to do that, he tries to seize the moment and turn it into a daily rally, like he loves to do. And then when it becomes impossible to ignore, he tries to change the subject, he tries to withdraw from the spotlight so he can come up with some other diversion and distraction for the body politic and the press.”

 

Clinton then said that in the immediate aftermath of Floyd’s death after being pinned to the ground by Minneapolis police, Trump appeared to respond well, but then dropped the ball.

 

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/clinton-rips-failure-trump-questions-how-anyone-with-a-beating-heart-and-a-working-mind-supports-him-in-new-interview

 

 

This is great!  Deplorable v2

 

Bag on the President all you want.  He deserves it sometimes.  But when you start saying his supporters do not have working minds you piss people off.  Go Hillary go!! 

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Massachusetts Trump supporter, 82, ‘violently assaulted’ by motorist, 27, police say

by Dom Calicchio

 

Original Article

 

Nobody should be attacked for their political views, Charlie Chase says. But according to authorities, that’s exactly what happened last week to the 82-year-old U.S. military veteran and supporter of President Trump. The Fall River, Mass., man says he was holding a Trump sign and wearing a Trump hat when suddenly a motorist allegedly got out of his car and charged toward him.

 

 

 

 

DA declines to prosecute man arrested in St. Patrick’s Cathedral vandalism

by Dean Balsamini & Mary Kay Linge

 

Original Article

 

Turns out desecration is no crime in New York City. The Queens man arrested for scarring the landmarked façade of St. Patrick’s Cathedral during a George Floyd protest is now free—because the Manhattan District Attorney’s office declined to prosecute him. Yadir Avila Rosas, 26, was taken into custody at 5:30 a.m. Saturday, an NYPD spokeswoman told The Post.

 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, Chef Jim said:

 

This is great!  Deplorable v2

 

Bag on the President all you want.  He deserves it sometimes.  But when you start saying his supporters do not have working minds you piss people off.  Go Hillary go!! 

 

...agree bud....his bombastic (COUGH) style is something we've never seen out of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.....and I love how he has turned the "good ol boyz political fraternity" on its ugly head......exposure of graft , corruption, manipulation etc is something I never imagined ran THAT deep...BUT....there are times when I cringe at his tweets, etc and wish he would STFU......so it is his craving for attention?...OR.....is it his belief in country ala MAGA?......perhaps MAGA is a great ruse because he actually wanted the exorbitant presidential salary, 1600 Pennsylvania Ave digs, his own library and book deal(s).......

9 minutes ago, B-Man said:

Massachusetts Trump supporter, 82, ‘violently assaulted’ by motorist, 27, police say

by Dom Calicchio

 

Original Article

 

Nobody should be attacked for their political views, Charlie Chase says. But according to authorities, that’s exactly what happened last week to the 82-year-old U.S. military veteran and supporter of President Trump. The Fall River, Mass., man says he was holding a Trump sign and wearing a Trump hat when suddenly a motorist allegedly got out of his car and charged toward him.

 

 

 

 

DA declines to prosecute man arrested in St. Patrick’s Cathedral vandalism

by Dean Balsamini & Mary Kay Linge

 

Original Article

 

Turns out desecration is no crime in New York City. The Queens man arrested for scarring the landmarked façade of St. Patrick’s Cathedral during a George Floyd protest is now free—because the Manhattan District Attorney’s office declined to prosecute him. Yadir Avila Rosas, 26, was taken into custody at 5:30 a.m. Saturday, an NYPD spokeswoman told The Post.

 

 

 

 

...well it's a Catholic joint right?......Vance Jr shines............

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MICHAEL BARONE: As in the 1960s, violent rioting hurts the most disadvantaged.

 

 

 

 

3 protesters tracked officers to their homes, threw Molotov cocktails at police cars, authorities say.

 

 

 

 

BLACK LIVELIHOODS MATTER: Shop owners reveal financial and emotional struggles of being looted. 

 

“They tell me ‘Black Lives Matter.’ They’re lying . . . I’m black, look what you did to my store.”

 
 
 
 
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33 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

 

There are always going to be injustices in the prosecution, conviction, and sentencing of people in this country. It is a system run entirely by human beings. I am all in favor doing what we can in continually shaping laws and criminal procedures to eliminate those injustices.

 

I would prefer that, whatever we do, it not be so vague and broad that it invites more injustice in its application.

Local people have trouble dealing with issues that a higher level of government can look at more distantly and less I passionately. A great example of this Niagara Falls where it took the federal government coming in a dealing with organized crime that had crippled the local economy and the local police and courts were too scared or not powerful enough to stop. There was a 75% mark up in all construction projects, so no wonder the Canadian side looked so much better until the Feds came in. I remember one of the reporters getting attacked by a mobsters thug reporting on that, right in broad daylight. These local racist cliques are not at all that much different 

8 minutes ago, B-Man said:

 

MICHAEL BARONE: As in the 1960s, violent rioting hurts the most disadvantaged.

 

 

 

 

3 protesters tracked officers to their homes, threw Molotov cocktails at police cars, authorities say.

 

 

 

 

BLACK LIVELIHOODS MATTER: Shop owners reveal financial and emotional struggles of being looted. 

 

“They tell me ‘Black Lives Matter.’ They’re lying . . . I’m black, look what you did to my store.”

 
 
 
 

Vast majority of protests are peaceful, stop trying to make it seem different. 

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2 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Local people have trouble dealing with issues that a higher level of government can look at more distantly and less I passionately. A great example of this Niagara Falls where it took the federal government coming in a dealing with organized crime that had crippled the local economy and the local police and courts were too scared or not powerful enough to stop. There was a 75% mark up in all construction projects, so no wonder the Canadian side looked so much better until the Feds came in. I remember one of the reporters getting attacked by a mobsters thug reporting on that, right in broad daylight. These local racist cliques are not at all that much different 

Vast majority of protests are peaceful, stop trying to make it seem different. 

 

...blurred vision from under your rock?.....peaceful murders of cops?....292 NYC cops injured?......molotov cocktails, bricks strategically deployed for "convenience"?....and you crave legitimacy?.....sometimes ignorance should NOT be advertised.......

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