GunnerBill Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 I hate the best player available strategy. That assumes everyone knows who the best player is. They don't. It's an educated guess at best. I believe in the first 3 rounds you draft players at position of need you think capable of making it in the NFL and contributing right away. In the last 4 rounds you reach for some guys with ceilings who might grow into better players. Whenever possible trade down and accumulate more picks because it increases the odds you will hit on some of them. Pretty much the opposite of what the Bills do. For example, using that strategy you never take Kujo in the 2nd round because there are too many question marks. Ok leaving aside that I don't agree with your analysis of BPA anyway... I don't understand the logic leap that doing it your way you never end up with a Kujo? In fact I think there is a better than average chance you would end up with more. If, for example, you have a major need at offensive tackle and he is the best tackle you think is left then you end up with him anyway. I actually think Kujo was a reach for need and not a BPA last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSBill Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 Recently, the Bills (Whaley) have been terrible OL evaluators—see last year's picks. To answer this thread questions, FISHER was the logical choice. Moreover, consistent with my first sentence, i have no confidence that Miller will do well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 I really liked Maxx Williams. But the overreacting to draft picks is one of the silliest things you can do. No one knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 I really liked Maxx Williams. But the overreacting to draft picks is one of the silliest things you can do. No one knows. True. But the NFL draft is also one of the most fun, exciting, built-up day(s) of the year, and especially for serious football fans. So you have to react and overact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 I hate the best player available strategy. That assumes everyone knows who the best player is. They don't. It's an educated guess at best. I believe in the first 3 rounds you draft players at position of need you think capable of making it in the NFL and contributing right away. In the last 4 rounds you reach for some guys with ceilings who might grow into better players. Whenever possible trade down and accumulate more picks because it increases the odds you will hit on some of them. Pretty much the opposite of what the Bills do. For example, using that strategy you never take Kujo in the 2nd round because there are too many question marks. God this is such bs Pretty much agree with every word of this post. Well said. You would Jake fisher, Ali Marpet, Clive Walford .... Fisher is far from soft and is great pass blocker. Miller does NOT match up well with his little body against huge DTs Great another one.....yes Miller is such a smurf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 I really liked Maxx Williams. But the overreacting to draft picks is one of the silliest things you can do. No one knows. I have no problem with our selections. The organization took players the way their board stacked up. That's the right approach to take. As far as Max Williams if Ozzie Newsome took him in the second round then that is a major endorsement of him as a prospect. I believe that Ozzie is at the top or near the top of the GMs in the leauge and one of the best evaluators in the business. .His picks usually aren't dazzling so much as they are consistently good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 I have no problem with our selections. The organization took players the way their board stacked up. That's the right approach to take. As far as Max Williams if Ozzie Newsome took him in the second round then that is a major endorsement of him as a prospect. I believe that Ozzie is at the top or near the top of the GMs in the leauge and one of the best evaluators in the business. .His picks usually aren't dazzling so much as they are consistently good. He's the best. First three picks were Breshad Perriman, Maxx Williams, and then Carl Davis. That's one helluva draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 True. But the NFL draft is also one of the most fun, exciting, built-up day(s) of the year, and especially for serious football fans. So you have to react and overact. Very true. Overall, this whole draft was kinda of dud though. I have no problem with our selections. The organization took players the way their board stacked up. That's the right approach to take. As far as Max Williams if Ozzie Newsome took him in the second round then that is a major endorsement of him as a prospect. I believe that Ozzie is at the top or near the top of the GMs in the leauge and one of the best evaluators in the business. .His picks usually aren't dazzling so much as they are consistently good. Yeah, Newsome is the best. I think Maxx is going to be a stud there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 He's the best. First three picks were Breshad Perriman, Maxx Williams, and then Carl Davis. That's one helluva draft. His evaluations emphasize how a player plays in college over physical attributes. He would select a smaller and slower prospect who is very productive over a player who is more impressive physically but less instictive and pruductive on the field. Where he really shines is getting very good players in the lower half of the first round. I still remember when he traded back into the lower first round to select Flacco. That pick was a very important pick for the consistent success of his team. Because of where his draft board ranked Flacco he didn't take him with his first pick. But he maneuvered back into the lower part of the first round to take Flacco where he had him ranked. He has frequently stated that his approach to the draft is to be true to your board. Watching him make selections is like watching a maestro conducting an orchestra. He has a strategy and he follows it. He's at the top or near the top of his very challenging profession. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctk232 Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 OL. What I just don't understand is Whaley cited two reasons for Darby: 1. He was their BPA and 2. They needed to keep up with the division arms race. BPA is debatable here given who else was on the board at the time. Back and forth forever until the cows come home but I'm in personal disagreement with the Bills rankings of BPA at that point. But again what do I know. In terms of the arms race, the biggest additions to our divisional rivals have all been on the DLine. Suh to the Phins with wake and crew. Leo Williams to the Jets with Wilkerson and Richardson. Hell, even the pats took a DT in the 1st. I fail to see how a DB combats any of these major additions. To use this reasoning would be cause to pick Offensively and more specifically OL. I just don't understand... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 OL. What I just don't understand is Whaley cited two reasons for Darby: 1. He was their BPA and 2. They needed to keep up with the division arms race. BPA is debatable here given who else was on the board at the time. Back and forth forever until the cows come home but I'm in personal disagreement with the Bills rankings of BPA at that point. But again what do I know. In terms of the arms race, the biggest additions to our divisional rivals have all been on the DLine. Suh to the Phins with wake and crew. Leo Williams to the Jets with Wilkerson and Richardson. Hell, even the pats took a DT in the 1st. I fail to see how a DB combats any of these major additions. To use this reasoning would be cause to pick Offensively and more specifically OL. I just don't understand... Do you honestly believe a 2nd or 3rd pick is really going to be the difference against SUh? I know some folks hate to hear this, but they are going to give CK more than one year to prove himself. We also drafted a G in the 3rd. Can't do everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ctk232 Posted May 2, 2015 Share Posted May 2, 2015 Do you honestly believe a 2nd or 3rd pick is really going to be the difference against SUh? I know some folks hate to hear this, but they are going to give CK more than one year to prove himself. We also drafted a G in the 3rd. Can't do everything. Who knows? Most likely not. It's just in reference to Whaley's reasoning as to why. I believe we have our starting 5 whether we like it or not regardless of our picks. But I believe a guy like jake Fisher or AJ Cann would have made a greater contribution given the changing nature of our division. I don't hate going CB but I still question the reasoning and specific player. Circumstances could be worse though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent 91 Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 (edited) So if you had a wishing well you would have picked someone else? Well played sir! Just let Ron sign his name across your heart. Edited May 3, 2015 by Agent 91 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretzel logic Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Fisher is slide protection tackle.......roman is smash mouth. Im fine with the Bill's selecting Darby at 50th. Ryan sees the world class speed off cb blitz with Darby forcing AFC QBS to respect his speed and pro style coverage from FSU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjjr Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Darby...he has as high of a ceiling as any db in this draft, the athletic ability to run with any receiver in the league and fits what Rex is looking for in a corner. He'll take a year to develop and the plan will be for him to take over for mckelvin. The expectation should be he'll be an upgrade at that position in 2016 and play across from Gilmore for years to come. Love the pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finn Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Whaley's BPA strategy undervalues interior offensive linemen. Every year he rates guards lower than the rest of the league and as a result they pass on quality interior depth. My thoughts exactly. I don't understand why they feel they don't need quality people against the monsters at defensive tackle, even after seeing Colin Brown, Legursky, Richardson and Urbick struggle there. Our quarterbacks just aren't good enough to cover for them--it needs to be the other way around, in fact. So you have extraordinary receivers and running backs but an interior line that is likely to be overwhelmed--again. Whaley seems content with mediocrity at a position that is becoming increasingly critical in the game. Yes, Incognito might work out, and one of the young guys might develop. But he's not leaving WR or RB or the defense to chance, only the one position (other than qb) that has been given the Bills the most trouble for three years running. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Whaley's BPA strategy undervalues interior offensive linemen. Every year he rates guards lower than the rest of the league and as a result they pass on quality interior depth. From the Buddy Nix school of thought, and I think this will be his undoing. Meanwhile the rest of the NFL teams who value O line players make a run on them leaving Whaley holding his... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 (edited) Jake FisherIf they weren't going for a QB then Fisher seemed the obvious choice. Two big areas of need on this team. Two. Totally addressed with one 3rd round pick. Once again QB and OL play is going to hold this team back and waste a stellar defense and some very talented skill position players. If Whaley & Co. had swung and whiffed trying to address those needs, I could at least be confident that they'd continue to work toward fixing them. But it's like they still aren't a priority. WTF? Edited May 3, 2015 by BarleyNY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 From the Buddy Nix school of thought, and I think this will be his undoing. Meanwhile the rest of the NFL teams who value O line players make a run on them leaving Whaley holding his... Except that they drafted OL (a guard specifically) with 1 of their top 2 picks this year, and they drafted 3 OLmen last year...so that line of logic doesn't quite add up. I wanted an OL or DL guy at 50...at least they got a competitor at LG at 81. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peace Frog Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 (edited) Jake Fisher or Isla Fisher Edited May 3, 2015 by Peace Frog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Except that they drafted OL (a guard specifically) with 1 of their top 2 picks this year, and they drafted 3 OLmen last year...so that line of logic doesn't quite add up. I wanted an OL or DL guy at 50...at least they got a competitor at LG at 81. They value the position plenty - they just repeatedly mis-value it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 They value the position plenty - they just repeatedly mis-value it. I don't necessarily disagree with that. I do think that they got a good, safe player at OG with Miller, so that's a plus. We'll see what comes of Henderson, Richardson, and Kouandjio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 More like they value it, but misfire on filling it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 They value the position plenty - they just repeatedly mis-value it. If it makes you feel any better they are much worse at evaluating QBs than they are OL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Fisher is slide protection tackle.......roman is smash mouth. Im fine with the Bill's selecting Darby at 50th. Ryan sees the world class speed off cb blitz with Darby forcing AFC QBS to respect his speed and pro style coverage from FSU. Yea I don't see Fisher as a fit for what the Bills want to do either. I expected us to go O-Line, but I expected it to be AJ Cann at guard. In the end they wnet with Miller in the third... let's see how that plays out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superb Owl Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 If it makes you feel any better they are much worse at evaluating QBs than they are OL. Bwawawhahahaha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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