Webster Guy Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 Chad Pennington is an analyst now, he's surprisingly insightful. Reminds me of how Aikman surprised me as an analyst because i always thought both those guys were dolts. Anyway, Chad said from the NFL combine the other day it takes three years to get it in the NFL as a quarterback. There are exceptions of course, but as far as understanding today's NFL and being able to do well he thinks you need to have that much time. He also said there are several qb's whose accuracy has improved significantly after their rookie season. He said accuracy is developed by throwing to the same receivers over and over, that WR's all have different tendencies, speeds, etc. Even on screen plays and short passes, he said he missed Leon Washington on every screen pass for the first 2 months because he was so quick getting in the flat, and if I remember Pennington was pretty accurate. It got me to thinking that maybe EJ needs one more year with consistent receivers, a solid Oline, coaching and ground game. He's won a bunch of games in this league without those things, I'd like to see what he does with them. One other interesting thing Pennington said was that they need to start having a full defense on the field at the NFL combine when these quarterbacks throw. (that's why he was there, soley to evaluate qb's). He said a lot of passes the draftees threw weren't hitting the magic number of 8 feet above the ground when they crossed the line of scrimmage, and that's simply not realistic. With a full defense out there, it would be easier to evaluate. His analogy was that lots of NFL kickers can boot a kickoff out of the endzone 75 yards away, but on a field goal try, with a wall of defenders in front of them, it's a whole different thing because they need to elevate the ball earlier in the kick. QB throws follow that same logic. For what it's worth, he said Mariota has an excellent touch on the ball and was impressed with the kid in all phases of the combine. Obviously if the Jets take him he will be the enemy, but I'd love to see him go to an NFC team and do well, he's a great kid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solomon Grundy Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 Chad Pennington is an analyst now, he's surprisingly insightful. Reminds me of how Aikman surprised me as an analyst because i always thought both those guys were dolts. Anyway, Chad said from the NFL combine the other day it takes three years to get it in the NFL as a quarterback. There are exceptions of course, but as far as understanding today's NFL and being able to do well he thinks you need to have that much time. He also said there are several qb's whose accuracy has improved significantly after their rookie season. He said accuracy is developed by throwing to the same receivers over and over, that WR's all have different tendencies, speeds, etc. Even on screen plays and short passes, he said he missed Leon Washington on every screen pass for the first 2 months because he was so quick getting in the flat, and if I remember Pennington was pretty accurate. It got me to thinking that maybe EJ needs one more year with consistent receivers, a solid Oline, coaching and ground game. He's won a bunch of games in this league without those things, I'd like to see what he does with them. One other interesting thing Pennington said was that they need to start having a full defense on the field at the NFL combine when these quarterbacks throw. (that's why he was there, soley to evaluate qb's). He said a lot of passes the draftees threw weren't hitting the magic number of 8 feet above the ground when they crossed the line of scrimmage, and that's simply not realistic. With a full defense out there, it would be easier to evaluate. His analogy was that lots of NFL kickers can boot a kickoff out of the endzone 75 yards away, but on a field goal try, with a wall of defenders in front of them, it's a whole different thing because they need to elevate the ball earlier in the kick. QB throws follow that same logic. For what it's worth, he said Mariota has an excellent touch on the ball and was impressed with the kid in all phases of the combine. Obviously if the Jets take him he will be the enemy, but I'd love to see him go to an NFC team and do well, he's a great kid. So Chad Pennington said it takes 3 years to develop? Pennington said you CAN improve accuracy? Thanks for posting this!! You just opened a hornets nest!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 EJ should get this year because a) I think Marrone and Hackett were ruining him (and suck in general), b) he's still young and cheap, and c) there are no other real choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 Chad Pennington is an analyst now, he's surprisingly insightful. Reminds me of how Aikman surprised me as an analyst because i always thought both those guys were dolts. I like you was pleasantly surprised with how well Aikman transitioned from the field to the booth. His timing with his booth partner is excellent, he is succinct and his observations are insightful. He can be critical about a play but say it in a non-harsh way that is more illuminating and less personal. As it stands he is one of the best in the booth and is trusted to handle the most prominent games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gonzo1105 Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 E.J. Manuel has been the same player that he has always been since his Freshman year at Florida State. He'll make a play or two that will make you pop but his constant inaccuracy and slow decision making is an absolute killer. He has not progressed in this area very much at all since he was a highly touted freshmen. He will never improve in this area. People can point to his college stats all they want but I actually watched the guy for 4 years in college and he, with his average play, cost Florida State a legitimate shot at the 2012 National Championship. I shook my head when Buffalo drafted him cause I knew on day one this guy wasn't going to be anything more than a backup QB in the league. Its not gonna happen and I think the Bills brass has realized this as well which is why at this point a journeyman NFL guy is a better option. Great kid not a great QB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 Chad Pennington is an analyst now, he's surprisingly insightful. Reminds me of how Aikman surprised me as an analyst because i always thought both those guys were dolts. Anyway, Chad said from the NFL combine the other day it takes three years to get it in the NFL as a quarterback. There are exceptions of course, but as far as understanding today's NFL and being able to do well he thinks you need to have that much time. He also said there are several qb's whose accuracy has improved significantly after their rookie season. He said accuracy is developed by throwing to the same receivers over and over, that WR's all have different tendencies, speeds, etc. Even on screen plays and short passes, he said he missed Leon Washington on every screen pass for the first 2 months because he was so quick getting in the flat, and if I remember Pennington was pretty accurate. It got me to thinking that maybe EJ needs one more year with consistent receivers, a solid Oline, coaching and ground game. He's won a bunch of games in this league without those things, I'd like to see what he does with them. EJ's won a bunch of games? He's a career 6-8 in the NFL. The point isn't that it takes 3 years. I think that's elementary to feel comfortable with the speed, defenses, schemes. It's to show improvement from year 1 to year 2 to year 3. Right now, I'm not sure what EJ did better in those first 4 games than during his rookie season. The accuracy didn't improve, despite working with Woods, Chandler and the backs in a 2nd season. It's convenient to blame it all on Marrone and company (who were bad) because they departed. But at some point it's on EJ to demonstrate he can be a good NFL QB and justify being a mid-first round pick. I didn't see much improvement during 2014 prior to being benched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 please read every other EJ threads. EJ was a rookie thrown in to a fast paced professional O even a seasoned QB has struggles with. SEE the Eagles!!! 2nd year 3rd QB? Why was EJ really benched after week 4? Performance or in deference to a seasoned 50% QB named Orton??? WRT to Chad Pennington Those than can do, those that can't teach or analyze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garranimal Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 Chad Pennington is an analyst now, he's surprisingly insightful. Reminds me of how Aikman surprised me as an analyst because i always thought both those guys were dolts. Anyway, Chad said from the NFL combine the other day it takes three years to get it in the NFL as a quarterback. There are exceptions of course, but as far as understanding today's NFL and being able to do well he thinks you need to have that much time. He also said there are several qb's whose accuracy has improved significantly after their rookie season. He said accuracy is developed by throwing to the same receivers over and over, that WR's all have different tendencies, speeds, etc. Even on screen plays and short passes, he said he missed Leon Washington on every screen pass for the first 2 months because he was so quick getting in the flat, and if I remember Pennington was pretty accurate. It got me to thinking that maybe EJ needs one more year with consistent receivers, a solid Oline, coaching and ground game. He's won a bunch of games in this league without those things, I'd like to see what he does with them. One other interesting thing Pennington said was that they need to start having a full defense on the field at the NFL combine when these quarterbacks throw. (that's why he was there, soley to evaluate qb's). He said a lot of passes the draftees threw weren't hitting the magic number of 8 feet above the ground when they crossed the line of scrimmage, and that's simply not realistic. With a full defense out there, it would be easier to evaluate. His analogy was that lots of NFL kickers can boot a kickoff out of the endzone 75 yards away, but on a field goal try, with a wall of defenders in front of them, it's a whole different thing because they need to elevate the ball earlier in the kick. QB throws follow that same logic. For what it's worth, he said Mariota has an excellent touch on the ball and was impressed with the kid in all phases of the combine. Obviously if the Jets take him he will be the enemy, but I'd love to see him go to an NFC team and do well, he's a great kid. Cool, bring back Tebow! He had more playoff wins in his second season than the Bills in the last 20 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 Not sure why you would be surprised that Chad Pennington would be a good analyst, he was arguably the smartest QB of his time. In fact, he's the only example in the last 20 years or so who was a pretty good QB who had a rag arm, and it was because he was so very smart. And that is football smart, not book smart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 EJ's won a bunch of games? He's a career 6-8 in the NFL. The point isn't that it takes 3 years. I think that's elementary to feel comfortable with the speed, defenses, schemes. It's to show improvement from year 1 to year 2 to year 3. Right now, I'm not sure what EJ did better in those first 4 games than during his rookie season. The accuracy didn't improve, despite working with Woods, Chandler and the backs in a 2nd season. It's convenient to blame it all on Marrone and company (who were bad) because they departed. But at some point it's on EJ to demonstrate he can be a good NFL QB and justify being a mid-first round pick. I didn't see much improvement during 2014 prior to being benched. It's a pretty small sample to work with, and I'm one of the ones who believes the way in which EJ was coached by Marrone, in particular, led to what we saw on the field. I think EJ deserves another shot at earning the starting job. Not be handed it, but earn it against whoever they bring in. It's too soon to give up on the guy. Even last year he led a 4th quarter comeback and OT win on the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPS Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 So Chad Pennington said it takes 3 years to develop? Pennington said you CAN improve accuracy? Thanks for posting this!! You just opened a hornets nest!! It's not really improving accuracy, his comment reflects the fact that lack of timing and familiarity with your receivers comes across as poor accuracy. EJ has the most comfort level with Woods, and my casual empiricism says that stats probably show a greater level of accuracy with Woods than any other receiver on the Bills. That said, EJ may or may not be an accurate passer, but CP is right that it takes time to develop the chemistry. I hope he gets a chance to prove himself, but I doubt it will happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 It's a pretty small sample to work with, and I'm one of the ones who believes the way in which EJ was coached by Marrone, in particular, led to what we saw on the field. I think EJ deserves another shot at earning the starting job. Not be handed it, but earn it against whoever they bring in. It's too soon to give up on the guy. Even last year he led a 4th quarter comeback and OT win on the road. Sure it's a small sample size and everyone can agree the offensive coaching and OL play weren't good last year. The issue remains, there's more patience from pro-team fans than pro coaching staffs, regardless of who they are. Fair or not, they don't have time to wait for a guy to get-it. Either the QB shows signs of improvement or they have to move on. At the end of last year I saw more from guys like Bridgewater and Carr in their rookie seasons than I did from EJ at the beginning of his 2nd NFL season. And I'm still not clear. What did EJ do better in year 2 than he did in year 1? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 EJ should get this year because a) I think Marrone and Hackett were ruining him (and suck in general), b) he's still young and cheap, and c) there are no other real choices. Exactly how I feel, especially the last part. It's a pretty small sample to work with, and I'm one of the ones who believes the way in which EJ was coached by Marrone, in particular, led to what we saw on the field. I think EJ deserves another shot at earning the starting job. Not be handed it, but earn it against whoever they bring in. It's too soon to give up on the guy. Even last year he led a 4th quarter comeback and OT win on the road. EJ has always impressed me more when he's playing "fast", 2 minute drills, 4th quarter/OT, etc... he seems to play more aggressive, moves around a bit, and is more natural. I'm not an expert, but I always got the impression for a good part of the game he was overthinking what his coaches were drilling in to him, but when forced to "just play" he did well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 EJ has always impressed me more when he's playing "fast", 2 minute drills, 4th quarter/OT, etc... he seems to play more aggressive, moves around a bit, and is more natural. I'm not an expert, but I always got the impression for a good part of the game he was overthinking what his coaches were drilling in to him, but when forced to "just play" he did well. I think that's why after he got benched he said he was just going to go out and sling it the next time he got a chance. Kind of a I'm done overthinking this process statement Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 Not sure why you would be surprised that Chad Pennington would be a good analyst, he was arguably the smartest QB of his time. In fact, he's the only example in the last 20 years or so who was a pretty good QB who had a rag arm, and it was because he was so very smart. And that is football smart, not book smart. I believe CP was also book smart. Exactly how I feel, especially the last part. EJ has always impressed me more when he's playing "fast", 2 minute drills, 4th quarter/OT, etc... he seems to play more aggressive, moves around a bit, and is more natural. I'm not an expert, but I always got the impression for a good part of the game he was overthinking what his coaches were drilling in to him, but when forced to "just play" he did well. Yeah, seems like when he just lets it go he plays better. When he has too much time, he starts over-thinking things. And as Thurman said, he was being told at least 3 different things by at least 3 different coaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webster Guy Posted March 3, 2015 Author Share Posted March 3, 2015 Not sure why you would be surprised that Chad Pennington would be a good analyst, he was arguably the smartest QB of his time. In fact, he's the only example in the last 20 years or so who was a pretty good QB who had a rag arm, and it was because he was so very smart. And that is football smart, not book smart. I never heard the guy speak in my life until 2 weeks ago. def a sharp dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 Sure it's a small sample size and everyone can agree the offensive coaching and OL play weren't good last year. The issue remains, there's more patience from pro-team fans than pro coaching staffs, regardless of who they are. Fair or not, they don't have time to wait for a guy to get-it. Either the QB shows signs of improvement or they have to move on. At the end of last year I saw more from guys like Bridgewater and Carr in their rookie seasons than I did from EJ at the beginning of his 2nd NFL season. And I'm still not clear. What did EJ do better in year 2 than he did in year 1? Well, he didn't get hurt. My real point, though, is that EJ didn't really have a full "year 1" -- he missed a lot of preseason and only played in 10 games. He has still played in fewer than an entire season's worth. And the coaching stunk. If he doesn't show improvement in training camp and preseason with a new staff and almost an entire season of watching from the sidelines, then I begin to agree that it's time to move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 please read every other EJ threads. EJ was a rookie thrown in to a fast paced professional O even a seasoned QB has struggles with. SEE the Eagles!!! 2nd year 3rd QB? Why was EJ really benched after week 4? Performance or in deference to a seasoned 50% QB named Orton??? WRT to Chad Pennington Those than can do, those that can't teach or analyze EJ has light years to travel before he approaches Pennington's level of function. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Protocal69 Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 Sure it's a small sample size and everyone can agree the offensive coaching and OL play weren't good last year. The issue remains, there's more patience from pro-team fans than pro coaching staffs, regardless of who they are. Fair or not, they don't have time to wait for a guy to get-it. Either the QB shows signs of improvement or they have to move on. At the end of last year I saw more from guys like Bridgewater and Carr in their rookie seasons than I did from EJ at the beginning of his 2nd NFL season. And I'm still not clear. What did EJ do better in year 2 than he did in year 1? WIn% before he got benched Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tintonfallsbillsfan Posted March 3, 2015 Share Posted March 3, 2015 one of the most accurate qb's ever . Extremely under appreciated qb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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