Johnny Manziel: "Too many red flags."

[NoSaint]

 

 

Yeah. But he really should zip it the !@#$ up and worry about how football will make the rest of his life a party.

 

understood, and dont disagree. just saying im not going to kill him every time he holds a beer as simply having a beer in hand isnt that big a deal. its the attitude and maturity that have to be the main concern and simply having a beer at a party without further issue isnt a big deal... though drinking at a rival schools fraternity party is in a small degree asking for trouble if he doesnt have good friends in the fraternity (no idea if he does or not).

[uncle flap]

Not sure how much of this is new knowledge, but it's a well-written article, and plenty of this was new to me:

 

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/9521439/heisman-winner-johnny-manziel-celebrity-derail-texas-aggies-season-espn-magazine

[papazoid]

the guy is a train wreck

[NoSaint]

Not sure how much of this is new knowledge, but it's a well-written article, and plenty of this was new to me:

 

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/9521439/heisman-winner-johnny-manziel-celebrity-derail-texas-aggies-season-espn-magazine

 

i think thats about what many of us suspected was going on behind the scenes. cant beat him up too badly about struggling under the pressure, he is a kid after all... but it definitely doesnt seem to come natural to him to be the star and like it or not it needs to quickly. beyond his physical question marks, i dont know how anyone can deny (especially after an article like that) that he has a lot of growing up to do REAL fast. if hes in an nfl OTA in 8 months and he starts breaking phones and tweeting nonsense... well... weve seen the things that people with those issues coupled with the stardom can do to themselves, and it would be a sad end to the story.

[NoSaint]

I know many are probably avoiding the thread but I will say its a really good article. Long, but for those looking for good journalism - it's worth your time. I'd be curious to hear some more takes based on being able to see more of the day to day of Johnny.

[tennesseeboy]

Lets see. He is a sophomore in college? About 19 or 20? Drinks a few more beers than he should and blows off a counseling gig at a summer camp? Gets rowdy at a fran part and is asked to leave? No charge of drug or steroid use? No allegations of sexual assault or rape? No physical altercations or waving a gun around? Sounds like a sophomore in college who is a little big for his britches. I'm not seeing anything that a little of the normal growing process isn't going to fix. He ought to listen a little more to momma, daddy and the preacher, and probably his coach and realize that with the trophy comes heightened scrutiny and judgment. Remember the rumors about Marino coming out of Pittsburgh scaring off a bunch of teams? This stuff is going to be blown up by the press and by NFL teams to lower his stock in the draft.Just be calm and carry on Johnny Boy...low profile and high performance carries the day.

[uncle flap]

Just be calm and carry on Johnny Boy

 

The thing about that is, he doesn't seem capable of doing so. Or at least he isn't willing.

 

I'm not saying he definitely can't or won't, but it's interesting to me that it's easy to dismiss his exploits as "just being a kid," and saying "I did boneheaded stuff when I was his age," while the vast majority of dozens of high profile college QBs are keeping their noses clean.

 

It's one thing to screw up once or twice and have that be a wake-up call. It's another to habitually act as if you don't have care in the world, and lack empathy or an appreciation for the broad scope of things that exist outside one's immediate surroundings at any given time.

 

I guess all I'm saying is that Manziel's pattern of behavior could be meaningless - but if I was in his camp, I' d find it troubling because if he hasn't been listening to his parents or coaches or other positive influences thus far, why would he start now?

 

I think he either doesn't "get it," as in understanding how his actions impact his image, or he doesn't care. Both of those make me think the light isn't going to suddenly come on for him.

Edited July 31, 2013 by uncle flap

[The Big Cat]

I know that my opinion on this matter is horribly compromised by my belief that Stevie Johnson is a bozo, but here goes:

 

The following arguments are complete bunk:

• Didn't you drink beer when you were 20?
  
• He's in college, college kids drink beer.
  
• Ah, leave him alone he deserves to have fun. You only get one shot at college.
  

 

Okay. When you're the first and only freshmen Heisman Trophy winner, you're not entitled to the same college experience I had. I would go so far as to say you shouldn't have the same college experience anyone has ever had, because you are not like anybody who ever went to college. Your life now and your life in the future will be unfathomably different than 99.9999% of the gen pop.

 

If you were in college to earn an accounting degree and you were staring down the barrel of a 35 year career as a CPA, then yes. By all means. GO SICK. Live it the !@#$ up. This is your shot.

 

But he's Johnny Football. If he's lucky, his career might total 15 years , but at the very least, he'll make in five years what 99.9999% of Americans won't make in a lifetime. Then he'll have the rest of his 20's, 30's and the rest of his LIFE to drink beer like an idiot. A lot of beer. Millions of dollars worth of beer. Forever. Until then, he needs to understand he's been blessed with great power, and it's time to assume great responsibility for his life.

 

If he can't grasp this, or if people are telling him this and he's not listening, he's an idiot.

[NoSaint]

it also has this cycle of him apparently hating the attention, but still attending the espys and sitting courtside, and tweeting.... obviously hes young and conflicted but.... its not a good spot for him, and its worrisome hearing things like his dad hating to go golfing with him because of his temper and that he regularly breaks his phone out of anger, and.... there seems to be an explosive factor in his personality - which happens, even to great people - but it seems like its going to be a real struggle to screw his head on straight with all that attention. i referenced similar in the other thread but this article did it a lot better with the idea of reconciling johnny football with johnathan manziel. while he seems to want to live it up, he also seems incredibly unhappy with all that comes with it. its not about drinking a beer in the slightest, though thats one way the struggles may show themselves.

Edited July 31, 2013 by NoSaint

[Malazan]

So his dad just came out and basically said his son is headed for a meltdown because of the pressure and he can't control his temper...I'm sure NFL teams will be excited about that.

[Gugny]

Too much, too fast. He's lucky he's still very young. He has time to turn things around, even if it means he stays in college a year longer than he intended. I hope it turns out well for him. He's just a kid.

[aristocrat]

His dad bought him a mercedes cause he thought his son would violate ncaa rules to get one? hmm.

[Mr. WEO]

I know that my opinion on this matter is horribly compromised by my belief that Stevie Johnson is a bozo, but here goes:

 

The following arguments are complete bunk:

• Didn't you drink beer when you were 20?
  
• He's in college, college kids drink beer.
  
• Ah, leave him alone he deserves to have fun. You only get one shot at college.
  

 

Okay. When you're the first and only freshmen Heisman Trophy winner, you're not entitled to the same college experience I had. I would go so far as to say you shouldn't have the same college experience anyone has ever had, because you are not like anybody who ever went to college. Your life now and your life in the future will be unfathomably different than 99.9999% of the gen pop.

 

If you were in college to earn an accounting degree and you were staring down the barrel of a 35 year career as a CPA, then yes. By all means. GO SICK. Live it the !@#$ up. This is your shot.

 

But he's Johnny Football. If he's lucky, his career might total 15 years , but at the very least, he'll make in five years what 99.9999% of Americans won't make in a lifetime. Then he'll have the rest of his 20's, 30's and the rest of his LIFE to drink beer like an idiot. A lot of beer. Millions of dollars worth of beer. Forever. Until then, he needs to understand he's been blessed with great power, and it's time to assume great responsibility for his life.

 

If he can't grasp this, or if people are telling him this and he's not listening, he's an idiot.

 

 

What repsonsibility?? To be a "Special Aggie" off the field? He owes thos podunks nothing but Ws on Saturdays. So far, he's delivered--in spades.

 

Relax gents. When he can no longer produce onthe field, football will spit him out. If you are still discussing how this "behavior" will affect his draft position next year, you are wasting your time. His draftability will depend "99.999%" on how he plays and comports himself on the field this year.

 

What this kid needs is a better parent than that sorry-ass excuse for a father he has. Would any of you make any of those comments to the press about your son?

[K-9]

Too much, too fast. He's lucky he's still very young. He has time to turn things around, even if it means he stays in college a year longer than he intended. I hope it turns out well for him. He's just a kid.

 

I think he should take a year off. Maybe do some volunteer work in some remote area. Get away from the fish bowl and re-establish (or establish in the first place, IDK), his values. He's flaming out at the moment.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Dragonborn10]

Too short... Too small... No arm strength. Not an NFL QB. Those are the red flags the rest is just non-sense.

 

I know that my opinion on this matter is horribly compromised by my belief that Stevie Johnson is a bozo, but here goes:

 

The following arguments are complete bunk:

• Didn't you drink beer when you were 20?
  
• He's in college, college kids drink beer.
  
• Ah, leave him alone he deserves to have fun. You only get one shot at college.
  

Okay. When you're the first and only freshmen Heisman Trophy winner, you're not entitled to the same college experience I had. I would go so far as to say you shouldn't have the same college experience anyone has ever had, because you are not like anybody who ever went to college. Your life now and your life in the future will be unfathomably different than 99.9999% of the gen pop.

 

If you were in college to earn an accounting degree and you were staring down the barrel of a 35 year career as a CPA, then yes. By all means. GO SICK. Live it the !@#$ up. This is your shot.

 

But he's Johnny Football. If he's lucky, his career might total 15 years , but at the very least, he'll make in five years what 99.9999% of Americans won't make in a lifetime. Then he'll have the rest of his 20's, 30's and the rest of his LIFE to drink beer like an idiot. A lot of beer. Millions of dollars worth of beer. Forever. Until then, he needs to understand he's been blessed with great power, and it's time to assume great responsibility for his life.

 

If he can't grasp this, or if people are telling him this and he's not listening, he's an idiot.

 

Vince Young will have made much more money than Manziel will ever see even if he is drafted in the first round because of the new CBA. I have no idea where he gets drafted but he probably grades out as 4th-6th round physical talents with top pick stats. Regardless he will make much less money than VY did and VY is broke. Now Manziel's family already has money and maybe he will manage his money better but so far his family hasn't amanged their son's activities that well.

[The Big Cat]

Too short... Too small... No arm strength. Not an NFL QB. Those are the red flags the rest is just non-sense.

 

 

 

Vince Young will have made much more money than Manziel will ever see even if he is drafted in the first round because of the new CBA. I have no idea where he gets drafted but he probably grades out as 4th-6th round physical talents with top pick stats. Regardless he will make much less money than VY did and VY is broke. Now Manziel's family already has money and maybe he will manage his money better but so far his family hasn't amanged their son's activities that well.

 

Assuming there's no Cheesecake Factory wherever he lands, then by the VY comparison, he's safe.

[C.Biscuit97]

Still say the real star of that team is their head coach. Anyone know how Case Keenum is doing these days?

 

I enjoy watching Johnny Football play. He has being coming across as rich douche but he still is young. Personally, I think he is more of a college star qb than a NFL one but we'll see. Also, it's important to see what his teammates think of him. Big Ben was a huge douche but his teammates love him.

[KD in CA]

His dad bought him a mercedes cause he thought his son would violate ncaa rules to get one? hmm.

 

Holy enabler Batman!

 

No wonder the kid is such a mess; the father seems like an even bigger idiot. It sounds like he's spending his life leeching off the grandfather who built the fortune.

[MDH]

The kid hasn't had to struggle for most of his life. He was the star player in high school and now college, he came from money and even today daddy buys him everything. Reading the article he drives a mercedes and gets flown all over the country to attend whatever event he wants to. When he does have to struggle a bit - like playing golf against his dad - he falls apart. He's falling apart in the public eye with every little thing he does wrong - then blames others. He doesn't know how to handle adversity other than to throw tantrums which leads me to believe he'll fail in the NFL. His physical gifts aren't such that he's going to come into the NFL and light it up immediately. He'll struggle. And with his personality make-up he'll fail because he doesn't know how to deal with it.

 

I feel for the kid, being under the kind of scrutiny he's under has to be unbearably difficult. But at the same time this is the life he's chosen. He thinks getting out of college station (or the "fish bowl" as he puts it) will end this scrutiny? Welcome to the NFL kid, ask Tebow how leaving Florida took him out of the fish bowl.

Edited July 31, 2013 by MDH

[26CornerBlitz]

Interesting take by Deadspin.

 

@Deadspin

Why ESPN's big Johnny Football story is a punch to the reader's balls: http://deadsp.in/JplEXGC

[NoSaint]

Interesting take by Deadspin.

 

@Deadspin

Why ESPN's big Johnny Football story is a punch to the reader's balls: http://deadsp.in/JplEXGC

 

for as obnoxious and sometimes hypocritical as deadspin can often be, sometimes they do great coverage of the media coverage.

 

i was ok with the reporter not taking a college athlete whos family seems to have welcomed him into their home fully to task... which i think deadspin is saying the reporter should have done at times (calling for a more explicit stance against his drinking instead of just giving hints for instance).

 

the story itself has so many anecdotes, and tidbits that could be teased out into longer discussions that its difficult to fully get into, but i think it was well done for the most part.

[26CornerBlitz]

‏@YahooSports

Johnny Manziel's dad: "It could come unraveled. And when it does, it's gonna be bad" @YahooForde on the ominous words http://yhoo.it/165p0Y1

[NoSaint]

‏@YahooSports

Johnny Manziel's dad: "It could come unraveled. And when it does, it's gonna be bad" @YahooForde on the ominous words http://yhoo.it/165p0Y1

 

hopefully it doesnt. it would be a shame if he went ryan leaf.... ill call it like i see it when a guys going the wrong path but i much prefer stories with happy endings.

 

either dads trying to scare him straight, or is coming unraveled himself. its a weird situation at this point.

[NDBUFFCUSEFAN]

hopefully it doesnt. it would be a shame if he went ryan leaf.... ill call it like i see it when a guys going the wrong path but i much prefer stories with happy endings.

 

either dads trying to scare him straight, or is coming unraveled himself. its a weird situation at this point.

 

After seeing JM play last year I had high hopes that he would continue to grow as a player. This offseason has been a disaster, his family and real friends need to get him under control before he implodes. At his age I don't know how I would have reacted to being famous but I can't say for certain that I would have handled it any better.

[KD in CA]

Interesting take by Deadspin.

 

@Deadspin

Why ESPN's big Johnny Football story is a punch to the reader's balls: http://deadsp.in/JplEXGC

 

That's a very good critique. He points some fingers that need pointing, most importantly at the self serving ESPN and the rest of the 'machine'. They'll just keep pumping the Johnny Football story so they'll be able to revel in it no matter if he triumphs or crashes and burns.

 

As Robert Duval said in The Natural, "whether you're a goat or a hero, tomorrow you're gonna make me a great story."

[BobChalmers]

Yep, kids drinking in college, who would have thunk it? good thing the Bills stayed away from that Alaonso character. Wait? Huh.

 

Way to miss the point completely. The issue isn't that he's drinking/partying etc.

 

The issue is that Manziel has demonstrated that he is an IMBECILE.

 

Only an imbecile would choose the Peyton Manning camp to party himself into a hangover.

 

Only an imbecile would brag about his partying all over Twitter.

 

Drinking isn't a disqualifier. STUPID is a disqualifier for a top NFL QB. And yes, combine that with his already lacking size/strength and there is no way this kid is a high pick a team wants to count on anymore.

[bills44]

.

 

The issue is that Manziel has demonstrated that he is an IMBECILE.

 

Johnny Football dun screwed up again....

[Tcali]

someone says Wilson has a cannon?? ...

[bills44]

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/blog/dennis-dodd/23015877/johnny-football-has-spit-on-all-the-help-texas-am-offered-him

Shortly after Johnny Manziel won the Heisman, Texas A&M AD Eric Hyman convened a Johnny Football summit in his office. Everyone who mattered was there -- Manziel's parents, compliance, coaches, marketing, SIDs, even the celebu-quarterback himself.

The tone from the head of the athletic department: Everything has changed. Here's how we're going to handle it.

The 62-year-old Hyman knows a little bit about handling hype. The man who hired game-changer Gary Patterson at TCU, inherited Steve Spurrier at South Carolina and was run over by two-time Heisman winner Archie Griffin as a North Carolina defender, was going to set the ground rules. Hyman went so far as to consult with Florida external relations guy Mike Hill, who helped oversee the Tim Tebow phenomena.

[NDBUFFCUSEFAN]

Good of the mods to send this topic to die instead of allowing discussion.