Best Player Available Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 There's only one problem with all of this: Nix doesn't control RW's money, Jeff Littmann does . And it's been proven time and again that BN talks out of his backside, so trusting him to talk about how they're going to spend is doubly ridiculous. The team has their back against the wall, especially with season ticket sales falling from 55k in 2009 to 37.5k in 2011. This is not the year, it's a make or break one for this franchise. Promising hope and hyping this team isn't cutting it anymore and most fans have finally figured it out. ^^^ This is closer too what takes place on OBD. No doubt they will sign some one with star appeal, because they have zero bona fide stars on the team (exception FJ) to sell season tickets.In the least a TO type signing to help Brandon out. Resigning SJ13 and a reliable other receiver would sell tickets to the newest Air-Gailey show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffaloed in Pa Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 I`d rather go hard after a pass rusher. Go Hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 The pic was his account getting hacked, otherwise we'd have heard about him getting called to Sir Roger's office. As for the car ride, I guess they could be mad about him refusing to say that Lynch was the one driving the car, but not much else. A) you don't get called in for a nude photo. It's just dumb. I mention it as he's often revered as a great family man on here. B) if the team was aware he was rolling with marshawn through that and possibly other nights, it could make then hesitate before signing over the house C) I wasn't talking about reasons he's been in trouble but instead red flags that maybe he's not as classy/innocent off the field as he's portrayed. I don't know who the real Stevie is. I hear one version here, but for a guy in the spotlight for about 18months at most, he has some volume of flags. Even if you counted the blown off events and such as another tiny blip. He also has a lot of positive things, but I was just offering a couple counterpoints to what you brought up. Maybe as much as he says he's ready to be a leader, the team doesn't feel good handing him cash and declaring him a leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBeck/cuba Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 If the Bills sign either SJ or VJ the other won't be signed. It's one or the other. As to whom they prefer, there's a legit case to be made for both. Personally, I hope they re-sign Stevie. GO BILLS!!! I disagree. We could easily sign both. The Bills will need to make a splash at one position in FA to sell some tickets (and improve as a team) WR is the best place to do that. The real problem could be keeping both happy and would Stevie be willing to accept a #2 spot. I personally would go after a Manningham or Meachom and try to sign a big time DB like Finneagan. Draft pass rushers and a deep threat wr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 A) you don't get called in for a nude photo. It's just dumb. I mention it as he's often revered as a great family man on here. B) if the team was aware he was rolling with marshawn through that and possibly other nights, it could make then hesitate before signing over the house C) I wasn't talking about reasons he's been in trouble but instead red flags that maybe he's not as classy/innocent off the field as he's portrayed. I don't know who the real Stevie is. I hear one version here, but for a guy in the spotlight for about 18months at most, he has some volume of flags. Even if you counted the blown off events and such as another tiny blip. He also has a lot of positive things, but I was just offering a couple counterpoints to what you brought up. Maybe as much as he says he's ready to be a leader, the team doesn't feel good handing him cash and declaring him a leader. Fair enough. But is Vincent Jackson a leader, or more of one than Stevie? If neither are, who would be the ideal FA WR for the Bills? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turftoe Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 We already have a CJ on the team now all we need is a BJ and chill out and let Buddy do what he came here to do... B.J. Coleman, QB Tennessee-Chattanooga Mid round pick..mark it down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in San Diego Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Merrriman would have some influence with VJ. He would be an excellent addition if we can still afford to make the other upgrades needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Fair enough. But is Vincent Jackson a leader, or more of one than Stevie? If neither are, who would be the ideal FA WR for the Bills? I will shout colston every time I'm asked. I think he's a perfect fit. Huge, good hands, and a positive influence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobChalmers Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 There's only one problem with all of this: Nix doesn't control RW's money, Jeff Littmann does . And it's been proven time and again that BN talks out of his backside, so trusting him to talk about how they're going to spend is doubly ridiculous. Example??? The team has their back against the wall, especially with season ticket sales falling from 55k in 2009 to 37.5k in 2011. This is not the year, it's a make or break one for this franchise. Promising hope and hyping this team isn't cutting it anymore and most fans have finally figured it out. You're making my point. Buddy Nix was saying essentially the same thing - THIS is the year. Again - in years past they HAVE spent the money in those years when they thought they were on the verge. This is another of those years. My estimate is that it's not quite $20M to sign Stevie and a VJ or similar - more like $16M, and yes, I think they intend to do exactly that. Whether they can do that AND improve the pass rush with other than draft picks is a fair question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreReed83 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 First WR in Bills history to record back to back 1000 yd receiving seasons and you guys are still not considering him a number 1 WR? Lay down the crack pipe yall. He's been our best WR since Reed. He's even put up similar numbers as Jackson in his last 2 complete seasons. And Jackson played with a better QB. Yet Jackson is a number 1 and Stevie's not? You guys make me laugh. HA !!!!!! AND YES I'M BACK !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 The Bills are Interested in Vincent Jackson, I'm interested in Freida Pinto I think we have about an equal shot. After we sign VJ you will be doing good for yourself . I have no clue why people stick to this attitude ignoring all evidence. Nix was very explicit - he intends to resign Stevie AND bring in another top WR. A "Calvin Johnson-type" who's "open when he's covered". He specifically said if they lose Stevie they will add TWO WR's. Guys - if he wasn't serious about spending the cash on FA's this year, he wouldn't have said all that at the press conference. It does him no good to get fans' hopes up for a few months just to let them down before the ticket sales start in earnest. Look at the history of the team - HONESTLY. Every so often when they think they are close, Ralph spends the money. Remember the year of Dockery@$7M/Walker@$5M/etc.? Nix was spelling it out last month - they believe THIS is one of those years, and they intend to bring in the players THIS YEAR to get to the playoffs. If they don't, they are open to serious criticism because he said point-blank they were going to do it. :worthy: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) I will shout colston every time I'm asked. I think he's a perfect fit. Huge, good hands, and a positive influence. I'd say Dwayne Bowe, and he'd be a more realistic get. Slightly younger than Colston and Jackson, played under Gailey, and played in KC, which is a lot more like Buffalo than NO or SD. Edited February 12, 2012 by Doc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thoner7 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 I can see it now. Buddy is thinking he will sign CJax and let Stevie walk. He will bring in V Jax throw our best offer at him, and he'll sign somewhere else. Then Buddy will call Stevie who just signed with another team (likely in our division) and the Bills will have cut off thir own nose in spite of their face once again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astrobot Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 moving from Whale's vagina to Buffalo for a guy who likes to party.....it's gonna take a lot of dough. and an Applebee's gift card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/02/12/remaining-2011-cap-space-by-team/ This might help us this year, should we actually have an interest in spending in FA (unlikely, but a guy can dream, can't he?)..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/02/12/remaining-2011-cap-space-by-team/ This might help us this year, should we actually have an interest in spending in FA (unlikely, but a guy can dream, can't he?)..... Thanks. Its going to be interesting to see which teams carry over and how much. There are so many ways for teams to massage the cap its nuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) Thanks. Its going to be interesting to see which teams carry over and how much. There are so many ways for teams to massage the cap its nuts. I think next year is when it gets truly interesting because that's when the 89% floor for every team kicks in. If you carry over say $20m in cap space then you've just increased your minimum as well. GO BILLS!!! Edited February 12, 2012 by K-9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/02/12/remaining-2011-cap-space-by-team/ This might help us this year, should we actually have an interest in spending in FA (unlikely, but a guy can dream, can't he?)..... The cap # is the biggest ? for me. Can anyone who understands how the cap works answer this; COULD the Bills, (provided we could get the guys to sign for these amts) do the following and stay under the cap: Sign SJ at $8 mil/yr Sign VJJ at $10 mil/yr Sign M Williams at $15 mil/yr Sign Chandler at $4 mil/yr Sign Bell at $5 mil/yr Extend FJ at $5 mil/yr Sign our draft picks Is this even possible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 I think next year is when it gets truly interesting because that's when the 89% floor for every team kicks in. If you carry over say $20m in cap space then you've just increased your minimum as well. GO BILLS!!! for sure. Bills wont carry over though will they? I hope they do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 The cap # is the biggest ? for me. Can anyone who understands how the cap works answer this; COULD the Bills, (provided we could get the guys to sign for these amts) do the following and stay under the cap: Sign SJ at $8 mil/yr Sign VJJ at $10 mil/yr Sign M Williams at $15 mil/yr Sign Chandler at $4 mil/yr Sign Bell at $5 mil/yr Extend FJ at $5 mil/yr Sign our draft picks Is this even possible? Depends on structures and signing bonuses etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 The cap # is the biggest ? for me. Can anyone who understands how the cap works answer this; COULD the Bills, (provided we could get the guys to sign for these amts) do the following and stay under the cap: Sign SJ at $8 mil/yr Sign VJJ at $10 mil/yr Sign M Williams at $15 mil/yr Sign Chandler at $4 mil/yr Sign Bell at $5 mil/yr Extend FJ at $5 mil/yr Sign our draft picks Is this even possible? Let me put it this way.. its possible. But the Bills cant because they are in a cash to cap system (like most other teams). If they were willing to say "to hell with it" then technically they could. It would get tricky in a couple years because theyd constantly be trying to circumvent the salary cap. Sorry if that sounded confusing but i dont want my stalker to show up on this thread and try to twist what im trying to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 The cap # is the biggest ? for me. Can anyone who understands how the cap works answer this; COULD the Bills, (provided we could get the guys to sign for these amts) do the following and stay under the cap: Sign SJ at $8 mil/yr Sign VJJ at $10 mil/yr Sign M Williams at $15 mil/yr Sign Chandler at $4 mil/yr Sign Bell at $5 mil/yr Extend FJ at $5 mil/yr Sign our draft picks Is this even possible? Yes, for teams that are creative w/ the cap and string out bonuses throughout the life of the contract. For the Bills, who have a cash to the cap policy and don't string out bonuses, no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) Yes, for teams that are creative w/ the cap and string out bonuses throughout the life of the contract. For the Bills, who have a cash to the cap policy and don't string out bonuses, no. Amortizing signing bonuses counts as creative? On the flip side we don't have dollars from all our signing bonuses in previous years taking up space today Edited February 12, 2012 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Amortizing signing bonuses counts as creative? On the flip side we don't have dollars from all our signing bonuses in previous years taking up space today It's ironic to me that the entire NFL will no longer be able to use amortized bonus amounts as part of the 89% mandate set to kick in in 2013. The entire league must be at that number in "actual cash" spent or the NFL pays the difference to the players. The NFL will be 89% cash-to-cap. The Bills, Steelers, Packers, Chiefs, and many others were ahead of their time apparently. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Yes, for teams that are creative w/ the cap and string out bonuses throughout the life of the contract. For the Bills, who have a cash to the cap policy and don't string out bonuses, no. Remember how well that worked when John Butler was in charge in the mid to late '90s? As stated by many here, there is a large number teams that use this system. It prevents teams from having dead money and paying millions to players cut years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) Amortizing signing bonuses counts as creative? On the flip side we don't have dollars from all our signing bonuses in previous years taking up space today I never said signing bonuses. There's a multitude of other bonuses that go into a contract that can be smartly/creatively spaced out throughout the life of the contract. The Bills choose not to do this whether it's the right or wrong approach. Edited February 12, 2012 by stony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 I never said signing bonuses. There's a multitude of other bonuses that go into a contract that can be smartly/creatively spaced out throughout the life of the contract. The Bills choose not to do this. How do you know this? Most players have other bonuses built in to their contracts for awards, yards gained...etc. It's the signing bonus that matters most in regards to the salary cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I never said signing bonuses. There's a multitude of other bonuses that go into a contract that can be smartly/creatively spaced out throughout the life of the contract. The Bills choose not to do this whether it's the right or wrong approach. Actually signing bonuses are the only ones that apply to this discussion to my knowledge. The bills use roster bonuses so they hit in one year instead of spread trough the first 5 as a signing bonus will. The bills use all other types that I know of. Do you have any examples of what you are talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I'm highly suspect of any rumor where a big name free agent comes to Buffalo. This is the place for players to go when they have little to no other choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Actually signing bonuses are the only ones that apply to this discussion to my knowledge. The bills use roster bonuses so they hit in one year instead of spread trough the first 5 as a signing bonus will. The bills use all other types that I know of. Do you have any examples of what you are talking about? Specifically, no. I'm going off an interview I listened to when Jerry Sullivan (go figure) was lamenting the lack of skills the Bill's bean counters display when it comes to negotiating contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Specifically, no. I'm going off an interview I listened to when Jerry Sullivan (go figure) was lamenting the lack of skills the Bill's bean counters display when it comes to negotiating contracts. I think there may have been a misstep in what he said, or possibly a misunderstanding on what you heard. I don't mean that to sound bad from my end, but I don't think what you are implying actually exists. Other than signing bonuses, the is no other bonus that effects cash to cap differently than the rest. The bigger thing with those "creative contracts" is having a player that really wants to be with the team and in turn accepts less desirable structures from their end. Im sure the bean counters would love to turn the tables but right now free agents have the power in our negotiations as we aren't a prime destination. Simply put - players aren't taking less to come to buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Would incentives be considered a type of bonus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Would incentives be considered a type of bonus? It really wouldn't effect the discussion at hand, beyond a player is less likely to take them to come here. We use them though, and they count in the year earned just like any bonus other than signing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loserlovers Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 First WR in Bills history to record back to back 1000 yd receiving seasons and you guys are still not considering him a number 1 WR? Lay down the crack pipe yall. He's been our best WR since Reed. He's even put up similar numbers as Jackson in his last 2 complete seasons. And Jackson played with a better QB. Yet Jackson is a number 1 and Stevie's not? You guys make me laugh. HA !!!!!! AND YES I'M BACK !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! best since reed????? jeeesh i guess you missed about 7 years and a guy named moulds, i dont get why we annoint a guy as great and a number 1, just because hes the best "we" have. Stevie isnt better than any of the three guys in NY. He isnt better than about 30 other WR's but now hes better than an all-time great??? i guess if u just read one stat he is. How bout lost game do to big drops and idiot penalties? is that a stat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I disagree. We could easily sign both. The Bills will need to make a splash at one position in FA to sell some tickets (and improve as a team) WR is the best place to do that. The real problem could be keeping both happy and would Stevie be willing to accept a #2 spot. I personally would go after a Manningham or Meachom and try to sign a big time DB like Finneagan. Draft pass rushers and a deep threat wr. And who will be your LT ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12Kachy Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 The Bills are interested in any Charger (Nix) and Georgia Tech (Gailey) player. Jackson is likely SJ replacement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinMassare Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 The Bills are interested in any Charger (Nix) and Georgia Tech (Gailey) player. Jackson is likely SJ replacement. Yes. Very true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobChalmers Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 And who will be your LT ? The best/healthiest of the following: Hairston, plus maybe Bell, plus one guy they get when they think they see value in rounds 2-4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I would like to see VJ here as well, but feel we need to get Defensive help before we spend big on a WR...that doesn't mean I don't think we need to add a veteran WR, but pony up the dollars to a DE AND OLB, then add a WR based upon whatever your Cash-to-Cap budget allows, because there are other good WRs available that won't command the type of money VJax or Bowe will and can substantially add to our offense, Garcon for one and I know he's been mentioned before so that's nothing new, just stating he's an example of how the Offensive need can be addressed without breaking the bank before we get the Defensive needs addressed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobChalmers Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 The Bills are interested in any Charger (Nix) and Georgia Tech (Gailey) player. Jackson is likely SJ replacement. OMG PEOPLE. Nix was explicit about this - he's trying to re-sign SJ AND bring in a 2nd big WR. He explicitly was asked what if they lose SJ, and he explicitly said "THEN WE NEED TO ADD TWO." He'd have to have been straight-up lying to plan what you suggest, and regardless of what you think of his character - THERE IS NO VALUE TO HIM LYING NOW and then being called out and disappointing the fan base BEFORE the ticket sales period. It's pretty obvious they want to resign Stevie and add a guy like VJ - maybe they can't pull it off (although there are a lot of good FA WR's out there so I think they can) - but it's clearly their plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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