Eligible Receivers - 2pt Coleman Non-Catch

[saundena]

Can anybody explain why the Coleman 2-pt didn't count?  He clearly stepped out but I think they said on the broadcast that he was forced out and then questioned what he needed to do to make himself eligible again.  That was all that was said. 

 

Anybody know the answer to this?

[SoonerBillsFan]

The NFL retired ref guy said that I guess because its endzone he was ineligible?   That makes no sense, as he re established himself.  I guess in regards to the Endzone he can't be the first one to touch the ball after going out of the endzone and back in.  Its dumb either way.

[gonzo1105]

I think they deemed him not to be forced out of bounds and that he went out on his own 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

Complete screw job is probably the answer lol. All he has to do is walk back on the field and get both feet in if he’s forced out…nfl refs just completely botched the ‘he got forced out’ part of it and missed it.  Eagle eyes on seeing him step out though of course 😂

 

the announcers were likely thinking they didn’t know the rules because of how impossible the force out was to miss 

[saundena]

Agreed, I don't even know what establishing one's self in the normal sense means?  I suppose you have to have 2 feet in bounds and make a play on the ball or tackle the carrier?  

[fergie's ire]

Just now, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Complete screw job is probably the answer lol. All he has to do is walk back on the field and get both feet in if he’s forced out…nfl refs just completely botched the ‘he got forced out’ part of it and missed it.  Eagle eyes on seeing him step out though of course 😂

 

the announcers were likely thinking they didn’t know the rules because of how impossible the force out was to miss 

It didn't help that the official who announced it seemed confused and tripping over his words trying to explain.

[Ethan in Cleveland]

If you step out on your own you can't re-establish.  If you are pushed out then you can.  They must have determined he went out of bounds on his own.  He was contacted in the end-zone.  I guess it is a judgement call if he was pushed.  They either blew the call or determined he went out on his own.  Just a hunch but since he took at least three and maybe four steps OOB, I suspect they thought he went OOB on his own and wasn't making an immediate attempt to get back in the end-zone.  I have not seen a replay since last night but the contact seemed to be at about 6 yards deep in the end-zone suggesting he may have been able to stop.  

Not saying it was the correct call, just saying what they had to judge. 

Edited 5 hours ago by Ethan in Cleveland

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

3 minutes ago, saundena said:

Agreed, I don't even know what establishing one's self in the normal sense means?  I suppose you have to have 2 feet in bounds and make a play on the ball or tackle the carrier?  

It means just walking back in bounds basically lol I don’t think you can hop straight from out of bounds and catch the ball then land with two feet in but just walking back inbounds after being forced out should’ve been more than fine 

2 minutes ago, fergie's ire said:

It didn't help that the official who announced it seemed confused and tripping over his words trying to explain.

100% lol. There was some explanation of why the bills weren’t allowed to try again after committing an accepted penalty but they completely blew the force out explanation.  Goes to show you how absolutely terrible that call was 

Edited 5 hours ago by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Maine-iac]

Watched a McD interview and best I could tell they thought there was some QB in the pocket vs out of the pocket sway on how the call worked.  I'm not sure if that's right or wrong but he mentioned it.

[WeckMonster]

what I gather from the rule below is that once you’re out, no matter how you got there, you can’t catch it… no matter if you’ve re-established.
 

I don’t understand how it’s not an illegal contact penalty on the DB for shoving the WR out of bounds. Shouldn’t every DB do that in short fields?

 

 

ARTICLE 6. INELIGIBLE RECEIVERS.

All offensive players other than those identified in Article 5 above are ineligible to catch a legal or illegal forward pass thrown from behind the line of scrimmage, including:

(a) Players who are not on either end of their line or at least one yard behind it when the ball is snapped;

(b) Players who fail to notify the Referee of being eligible as required by Article 5;

(c) An eligible receiver who has been out of bounds prior to or during a pass, either by his own volition or by being legally forced out, even if he has reestablished himself inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands;

[Robert Paulson]

it was either 2 pts or illegal contact. how can you get pushed out of bounds like that without being contacted unless the DB was force sensitive. 

 

blown call by a team that was terrible at spotting the ball as well. they didn't seem to know any of the rules on how to do anything. 

[Steptide]

It should've counted. Refs were wrong. He was absolutely pushed out and came back in and re established himself. This is what frustrates me though, why can't/doesn't replay assist step in there and review it? Arnt all scoring plays reviewed? How could they see what we all saw and still uphold the call

[MPT]

 

1 hour ago, WeckMonster said:

what I gather from the rule below is that once you’re out, no matter how you got there, you can’t catch it… no matter if you’ve re-established.
 

I don’t understand how it’s not an illegal contact penalty on the DB for shoving the WR out of bounds. Shouldn’t every DB do that in short fields?

 

 

ARTICLE 6. INELIGIBLE RECEIVERS.

All offensive players other than those identified in Article 5 above are ineligible to catch a legal or illegal forward pass thrown from behind the line of scrimmage, including:

(a) Players who are not on either end of their line or at least one yard behind it when the ball is snapped;

(b) Players who fail to notify the Referee of being eligible as required by Article 5;

(c) An eligible receiver who has been out of bounds prior to or during a pass, either by his own volition or by being legally forced out, even if he has reestablished himself inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands;

 

This post is exactly right. No player is allowed to touch the ball after going out of bounds. There's no such thing as "re-establishing" for a player who is the first to touch the ball (only applies to players who don't touch the ball). However, the rule was not applied correctly since he was illegally pushed out of bounds.

 

If they're going to call illegal touching, they also have to call illegal contact as the reason he was out of bounds in the first place. But, if they actually called illegal contact then the illegal touching rule wouldn't apply since he was illegally forced out and the catch would have stood. 

 

So overall, a complete screw job from every angle of the rule. Pretty standard.

Edited 2 hours ago by MPT

[boyst]

He didn't try to turn inside is the only argument I can come up with. The defender extended his arms pushing him out, sure but Coleman should have tried to come in bounds. 

[ColoradoBills]

 

 

1 hour ago, Maine-iac said:

Watched a McD interview and best I could tell they thought there was some QB in the pocket vs out of the pocket sway on how the call worked.  I'm not sure if that's right or wrong but he mentioned it.

 

AI Overview

Yes, defensive players can contact receivers after a quarterback leaves the pocket because the "illegal contact" rule, which restricts contact beyond five yards, is waived in that situation. This means defensive backs can push, grab, and even tackle receivers downfield to disrupt the play, as long as they don't commit other fouls like a personal foul for excessive force or illegal holding. 

Key Points

Waiver of the Five-Yard Rule:

The rule that prohibits defenders from making contact with a receiver beyond five yards downfield is lifted once the quarterback leaves the pocket. 

[MPT]

2 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

If you step out on your own you can't re-establish.  If you are pushed out then you can. 

 

That's what I thought, but either the rule was changed at some point or I was wrong the whole time. As far as I can tell, that's only a rule through college. 

 

In the NFL rules, you can't touch it even if you re-establish yourself in bounds. 

 

The part they messed up is that this only applies if you go out of bounds on your own or are legally forced out (like if the Ravens defender had just stood in the way and Keon went out of bounds while going around him). But he was clearly pushed out so it should have been illegal contact or at least voided the illegal touching penalty.

[Bills!Win!]

I can’t wait for the new stadium. Nobody in the stadium had any idea what was going on. The sound system is awful.
 

We were halfway through the shout song and then the bills start going for 2. We all got excited that they successfully converted the 2 points and then the ref says something incoherently and then they wipe points off the board 

[DrDawkinstein]

It doesnt matter if he re-established himself when it comes to catching the ball. Once you step out for any reason, you cant catch it. Coleman must know this, and he must know where the boundary is and control his body better. Pushed or not.