Is there an NFL team with a weaker WR group than the Bills?

[Buffalo Boy]

Arguing that Josh shouldn’t have a #1 wide receiver or ,at the very least one who can stretch the field and separate , and mocking fans who think it might be a good idea?

 

I swear McBeane has taken to wearing a certain color of makeup the way they have so many of you glamorized 

[Pete]

5 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Well you have an interesting concept of “productive”.  
 

Cooper - 20 Rec, 297 yards (2.5 rec per game)

 

Hollins - 31 Rec, 378 yards (1.8 rec per game while leading the Bills in most snaps played at receiver)

That’s a loose definition you have of “2 productive receivers” we lost.  

 

So everyone is panicking because we lost 2 WR’s whose COMBINED production was 4.3 rec per game and under 60 yards?  

And we replaced them with a guy that is not only capable of producing their same or better COMBINED production, but also brings a lot more value and potential downfield than Mack or the Ghost or Cooper did last year, which was a bigger need than anything.  

So I don’t think the concern of losing those two and adding Palmer is the lopsided loss you think it is.  

 

You are forgetting the 9TDs.  Mack and Amari made many huge plays and big TDs in playoffs and season.  Keion and Dalton didn't show up for playoffs.  

 

Mack played more snaps then any other WR.  James Cook and Josh were primary beneficiarys of Macks tenacious blocking skills. And Mack is a special teams Ace.  Someone is going to have to fill all those snaps at WR and 4 phase special teamer.

 

As Beane stated, the Bills offense scored more then 7 points a game when Amari was in the lineup.  There is more to football than 20 rec, 297 yards, its a little more complex than that simple methodology.

 

October 15 we sign Amari after being embarrassed by the Ravens, Texans, and Jets.  Our offense couldnt do anything. No WRs were getting open.  Beane is desperate for talent at WR, and trades for Cooper.  October 30 the Bills offense sets record with 8 straight games of 30 points or more.  That was the Amari Cooper effect.  And we have failed in replacing Mack and Amari, whom I believe you are severely underestimating

 

 

[BillytheKid]

21 minutes ago, Gregg said:

 

If they had a halfway decent defense, they would have probably made the playoffs and gone far. Burrow had an amazing year last season, but the Bengals defense was a joke. It seemed like they gave up more points per game than an NBA team.

If the Bills had a halfway decent defense they would have won the Super Bowl last year. 
 

Bills scored more than the Bengals on offense without two stud wide receivers. 

[Pete]

14 minutes ago, ddaryl said:

 

 

Watch the Bills defense in that game. They over pursued and fell prey to many cut backs. In fact the Giants out rushed the Bills. 

That game is still painful for me to watch.  That Bills team was awesome.  They had zero business losing

[harmonkillebrew]

46 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Well you have an interesting concept of “productive”.  
 

Cooper - 20 Rec, 297 yards (2.5 rec per game)

 

Hollins - 31 Rec, 378 yards (1.8 rec per game while leading the Bills in most snaps played at receiver)

That’s a loose definition you have of “2 productive receivers” we lost.  

 

So everyone is panicking because we lost 2 WR’s whose COMBINED production was 4.3 rec per game and under 60 yards?  

And we replaced them with a guy that is not only capable of producing their same or better COMBINED production, but also brings a lot more value and potential downfield than Mack or the Ghost or Cooper did last y

So I don’t think the concern of losing those two and adding Palmer is the lopsided loss you think it is.  

 

"Productive" in Bills terms. Hollins had most snaps and most receiving TDs. Amari was the mid-season impact maker, supposedly.  They were also our only outside WRs, besides Keon. We needed upgrades really, but all we got is Palmer, who couldn't crack the Chargers' top 2, after Keenan Allen and Mike Williams left, getting beat out by a rookie and Quentin "dropsies" Johnston.  It was the kind of lukewarm approach to WR that has been Beane the last few years. 

 

Josh carries this team week in and out. And it's fine for most of the season, but come playoffs we don't have the difference makers to contribute and get us over the top. Against KC, I saw a D that couldn't stop anything, but I also saw an Offense that had the ball with a chance to win and couldn't make a play. 

 

We needed to address both this offseason, but Beane has ignored the Offense. 

[Luka]

I don't know about the weakest wide receiver group but the Bills definitely have the whiniest fan base. 

[DJB]

We need a true #1 it’s as simple as that and I will continue pound the table

for Beane to acquire or draft one . 
 

Im tired of WR3 types like Palmer being brought in and wasting resources for mid level guys

 

I wanted Brian Thomas last year . We need to get a stud at the draft 

[starrymessenger]

The WR room is not bad, but I have to think it's incomplete. No doubt a legit outside threat could open up the playbook for the passing game, assuming Brady is up for it. Lacking that ability can lead to predictability making opposing DC's jobs a lot easier. if we had a guy like Brian Thomas the Bills offence would be # 1 in the league, possibly amongst the most productive Os historically. So I can understand why some people are disappointed with the draft. 
Of course this year's WR class was not last year's class. There was no Brian Thomas in 2025. 
By far the Bill's most pressing demands were on the defensive side of the ball (although it is worth mentioning that two later round offensive linemen are likely to make the team). In looking at Beane's draft I see very promising players in positions of urgent need who were great value where they were taken and good fits for what the Bills like and want to do. 
I think Beane had a great draft both strategically and in terms of execution value-wise. If he winds up hitting on three or four of these picks on defence this will be the Bills best draft since 2018.

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, Pete said:

You are forgetting the 9TDs.  Mack and Amari made many huge plays and big TDs in playoffs and season.  Keion and Dalton didn't show up for playoffs.  

 

Mack played more snaps then any other WR.  James Cook and Josh were primary beneficiarys of Macks tenacious blocking skills. And Mack is a special teams Ace.  Someone is going to have to fill all those snaps at WR and 4 phase special teamer.

 

As Beane stated, the Bills offense scored more then 7 points a game when Amari was in the lineup.  There is more to football than 20 rec, 297 yards, its a little more complex than that simple methodology.

 

October 15 we sign Amari after being embarrassed by the Ravens, Texans, and Jets.  Our offense couldnt do anything. No WRs were getting open.  Beane is desperate for talent at WR, and trades for Cooper.  October 30 the Bills offense sets record with 8 straight games of 30 points or more.  That was the Amari Cooper effect.  And we have failed in replacing Mack and Amari, whom I believe you are severely underestimating

 

 

 

The only simple (and incorrect) mythology going on here is that you think the Bills lose the production when Mack and Cooper leave, as if no other Bills could have scored those TD's last year or this upcoming year.  Its like Cook...if he left, we aren't "losing" his TD's, guys like Allen, Davis, and whoever we replaced Cook with would pick up the slack.  

 

This notion is so flawed I can't believe you keep repeating it.  

Edited 9 hours ago by Alphadawg7

[oldmanfan]

The entire issue with this thread, the second one started by the same guy about the same topic, and multiple other posts over the past several days is that we should have taken a WR on day 3, and that Beane doesn’t give Josh weapons.  But let’s examine these.

 

The fact is we did draft a WR in this draft on day 3.  Then the assumption made by naysayers are two fold: 1. a WR drafted in let’s say round 5 has to be better than a guy in round 7, and 2.  a WR drafted say in round 5 has to have more value than the guy drafted instead of the hypothetical WR.  

 

Taking #1, I would imagine round 5 picks have a fractionally better chance to hit than round 7, but not by much.  The Benfords of tound 6, or the famous Brady in round 6, are very much the exception.  So if this Prather kid or one on the FAs we picked up surprises then it’s to me about as likely as a day 5 guy.  I wonder if Prather got picked in round 5 if we even have this conversation.

 

Taking #2, especially in later rounds from my understanding NFL folks are looking at their board for value, and asking if a guy at one position that grades lower than another guy should still be drafters to fit a perceived need.  So let’s look at rounds 4-7.  We had need in the defensive backfield and interior D line.  That was known going into the draft.  So in round 4 you have Walker available and some of the WRs folks are talking about, and that the Bills talked to.  And then discussions ensue like is this guy at WR going to contribute more?  Play special teams?  Coach Brady, does he offer more than what we have on the roster currently?  And so on.  And then decisions are made.  In later rounds we took two guys that play CB, one of which projects to safety.  Why?  Again because they represented more potential value at that point over at the available WR.  Right now we’ll likely have Hairston and Benford start, but we have to have competition for the backup roles, and have to account for getting ready to replace Taron at the nickel CB spot.  Looking at DB vs. WR we simply need more guys to compete at DB right now given how well the offense did and what was seen on D last season.

 

Lost in all this is Brady’s offensive philosophy.  He wants balance between run and pass game.  He wants Josh to distribute to open guys, whether it be WR, TE, or RB.  Would I love to see us get a guy like a Jefferson or a Chase?  Of course.  Who wouldn’t?   But one of the drawbacks of being so good is you are not in draft position to get a guy like that.  And while you could trade for a guy like we did with Cooper, Cooper I don’t think was that huge a difference last year.  Could have gotten Metcalf but then would that have limited what could have been done to help the D in draft day?  The truth is that Beane has done a lot to help Josh; building a really good O line, drafting guys like Cook, Kincaid, Coleman, Knox; bringing in guys over the years like Diggs, Beasley, Brown, Cooper, and so on.  Some guys worked out really well, some aged out, and some it is still too early or through effects of injury to assess impact.

 

As fans we can just think linearly.  Beane doesn’t have that luxury.  He plays chess while we can play checkers.  So when he says people B word too much about WR, he’s right if you look at offensive output last year.  And if he decides to trade for a guy like say Pickens, it’s not admitting he failed.  It’s his attempt to constantly look to improve the roster.  And last Saturday it was by adding to positions other than WR when it came time to make most of the picks.

 

 

[PayDaBill$]

On 4/27/2025 at 7:52 AM, Pete said:

Why did we lose to Ravens?  
 

Why do we see the most man to man in the NFL?  And that’s with Josh ***** Allen.

 

Dont you agree separation was a major issue last season?

 

What did we do to fix it?

Don’t you get sick of Josh getting pummeled after 6 seconds and no one can get open?

Let’s not let fact get in the way of an old tired argument;

 

In 2024, the Buffalo Bills' passing offense ranked 9th out of 32 teams in the NFL with an average of 227.9 passing yards per game. Oh and 2nd in points.  They were top 10 in pass rush and points.

 

The Bills offense wasn’t the problem!

 

 

 

Edited 8 hours ago by PayDaBill$

[Rocky Landing]

1 hour ago, Buffalo Boy said:

Arguing that Josh shouldn’t have a #1 wide receiver or ,at the very least one who can stretch the field and separate , and mocking fans who think it might be a good idea?

 

I swear McBeane has taken to wearing a certain color of makeup the way they have so many of you glamorized 

Just for reference: Who has argued any of these things?

[Goin Breakdown]

I wonder who the Beotch was in the front office or coaching staff was that suggested to talk to Moore. 
Wonder why McD was beotching about needing vertical speed a few months ago. 
Who were the beotches that brought in speedy receivers for their pre draft visits?

Who were the beotches that brought in cooper last year, Cole Beasley and brown a couple years back when were were in need mid season because the WR group we were running with wasn't working?

We follow this team. We follow the ques that the coaches give us. Excuuuuuuuuse us for for Beotching about WR when clearly our staff sees the same needs as we do. 
No one ever said to sell The farm and get one. The simple question is this "why does it seem that this team does not value WR the same as other teams"

Josh is MVP without good WR?  Isn't that part of the reasoning he WAS MVP? Because he did what he did with less around him?  The answer is RIGHT THERE. Josh had less around him. We were arguing the whole time that Lamar had more talent than Josh and now that our GM calls the media (and Fans,in a way) a beotch, we all start singing a different song and turning on each other?

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

I look at it like curtis samuel will play a bigger role in 2025.  If palmer is able to stay on the field more, samuel is probably gone next year and they can look at bringing in another player if they want to keep getting younger.  Something about this draft didn't seem right with regards to the WRs, and I'm just not sure they were looking there with the first 3 picks.  

[Alphadawg7]

On 4/27/2025 at 4:52 AM, Pete said:

Why did we lose to Ravens?  

 

You mean week 4?  You know the Ravens lost to the Raiders in week 2 right and also lost to the Browns in week 8?  So week 4 isn't very relevant now is it.  Teams lose games, its why only 2 teams in NFL history ever went undefeaed in the regular season, and one was when they played far the less games, and the other had the greatest offense in NFL history at that time and got shut down by defense in the SB and lost to Eli Manning.  

 

But who finished with the higher seed and won the divisional round to advance to the AFCCG?  HINT:  Not the Ravens.

 

On 4/27/2025 at 4:52 AM, Pete said:

Why do we see the most man to man in the NFL?  And that’s with Josh ***** Allen.

 

Dont you agree separation was a major issue last season?

 

What did we do to fix it?

Don’t you get sick of Josh getting pummeled after 6 seconds and no one can get open?

 

What I get sick of is people grossly over exaggerating and flat out making up things to support your hysteria.  I can't imagine what its like to have so much angst over something the Bills are the best in the NFL at, not just last year, but over the past 5 seasons - scoring points - most in the NFL.  

 

You are literally polluting the board with hysteria in regards to:

• 16th best offense in NFL history
• #1 offense in Bills history
• Highest scoring team in the AFC regular season
• Highest scoring team in the AFC postseason
• NFL record for most games won by 20+ points
• 8 straight games of 30+ points
• NFL MVP led offense
• Most points scored in the NFL over the past 5 years
• Fewest turnovers of Allens career and arguably his most efficient and best season
• And season ended losing by 3 and allowing 32 points to a team who did not break 30 in any other game that season, including the postseason.  
  • And not to mention - Refs flipped the score by 11, if not 15 points in mid 4th quarter by not once, but TWICE, stealing a first down from the Bills on the same set of downs.  Kincaid had the first by a half yard on 2nd down, they marked it short after the first ref declared first down.  4th down, Josh again gets the first, but wasn't given to us.  That resulted in us having a 1 point lead to going down 7 when KC drove the field on a turnover of downs and converted a 2 point conversion.  So instead of going up 4 (we were already in FG range and would have a first down to keep driving towards endzone) or possibly 8 (or 9 if they went for 2), we went down 7.  That is a 11-15 point swing in the 4th in a game we lost by 3.  Otherwise, we very well could have advanced to the SB already last year.

But hey...might as well start 100 threads about your WR rants because it makes "so much sense" and is clearly why the Bills havent gotten by the Chiefs and has nothing to do with defense or the fact the Chiefs average 35 PPG in their wins against us in the playoffs and 3 of those times went on to lose the next game averaging 17 PPG (less than half what they score on us).  

 

But hey...I know facts aren't your friend...so do carry on with it all be about the WR  

 

What is worse about this is that all your rants are about how we didn't take a day 3 WR (which we did) in a weak WR class, meaning, the odds of that person stepping in and being the WR you clamor for are already pretty low.  

Edited 7 hours ago by Alphadawg7

[Alphadawg7]

17 minutes ago, Goin Breakdown said:

I wonder who the Beotch was in the front office or coaching staff was that suggested to talk to Moore. 
Wonder why McD was beotching about needing vertical speed a few months ago. 
Who were the beotches that brought in speedy receivers for their pre draft visits?

Who were the beotches that brought in cooper last year, Cole Beasley and brown a couple years back when were were in need mid season because the WR group we were running with wasn't working?

We follow this team. We follow the ques that the coaches give us. Excuuuuuuuuse us for for Beotching about WR when clearly our staff sees the same needs as we do. 
No one ever said to sell The farm and get one. The simple question is this "why does it seem that this team does not value WR the same as other teams"

Josh is MVP without good WR?  Isn't that part of the reasoning he WAS MVP? Because he did what he did with less around him?  The answer is RIGHT THERE. Josh had less around him. We were arguing the whole time that Lamar had more talent than Josh and now that our GM calls the media (and Fans,in a way) a beotch, we all start singing a different song and turning on each other?

 

Because you seem to care more about "how" we score and "who" scores rather than if we score.  Scoreboards don't decipher between length of receiving TD or was it a rushing TD and deduct points when they aren't some big play to a WR.  

 

Points are points.  We are the best in the NFL at scoring points.  To whine about how or who is scoring points is like being rich and b****ing about how you made the money.  

 

Meanwhile:  Burrow - Chase - Higgins didn't make the playoffs...again.  Hill and Waddle have helped Miami do what?  They missed the playoffs last year and best they have ever done is be the 6th seed and one and done in the postseason.  

 

I will take perennial SB contender and most points scored in the NFL 100% of the time over the fantasy football teams Bengals and Miami tried to build and didn't work.  

Edited 7 hours ago by Alphadawg7

[Goin Breakdown]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Because you seem to care more about "how" we score and "who" scores rather than if we score.  Scoreboards don't decipher between length of receiving TD or was it a rushing TD and deduct points when they aren't some big play to a WR.  

 

Points are points.  We are the best in the NFL at scoring points.  To whine about how or who is scoring points is like being rich and b****ing about how you made the money.  

 

Meanwhile:  Burrow - Chase - Higgins didn't make the playoffs...again.  Hill and Waddle have helped Miami do what?  They missed the playoffs last year and best they have ever done is be the 6th seed and one and done in the postseason.  

 

I will take perennial SB contender and most points scored in the NFL 100% of the time over the fantasy football teams Bengals and Miami tried to build and didn't work.  

This is kind of what I'm talking about. I've never said who I personally would like to score. I'm proud of all

our guys and how they performed last year. It was awesome to watch. But I can also have the opinion that if Josh had a receiver that can separate, he would be able to possibly be even more successful. I think it is perfectly fine to be on both sides here. This isn't a simple 1+1=2 b/w kind of situation. 
I understand draft order

I understand the money

I understand availability has a say

I understand not everyone is a pro owl or all pro

I understand our defense stunk. 
(a question for another day is how well they did in the playoffs when they didn't stink) 

I understand the historical markers the Bills make and consistently make. 

I get all that and yet, I can also wonder what it be like to have a little more skill at that position. 
It's all really simple if we just listen and hear what others are actually saying rather than lumping people into categories and sides. 
I would guess that not even half of the people commenting on what Beane said never actually listened to the WGR show that morning to understand the context of the 2 and a half hours leading up to Beane's comments. The guys in the show, for the most part liked the draft and what the team did. Beane reacted to 1 comment made and now everyone is taking sides. I won't do it but I will see both sides and agree with both sides in what each of them had to say. None of them were entirely wrong. 
I respect that you actually see stats and are knowledgeable about the team, so none of why I'm saying is directed at you. I dig this conversation a lot. I just don't think it's fair to lump everyone as one side or another, unless of course they are taking a hard stance then yeah go for it lol. I just think respectful conversation and debate is healthy and good. 

Edited 6 hours ago by Goin Breakdown

[nosejob]

4 hours ago, Pete said:

You are forgetting the 9TDs.  Mack and Amari made many huge plays and big TDs in playoffs and season.  Keion and Dalton didn't show up for playoffs.  

 

Mack played more snaps then any other WR.  James Cook and Josh were primary beneficiarys of Macks tenacious blocking skills. And Mack is a special teams Ace.  Someone is going to have to fill all those snaps at WR and 4 phase special teamer.

 

As Beane stated, the Bills offense scored more then 7 points a game when Amari was in the lineup.  There is more to football than 20 rec, 297 yards, its a little more complex than that simple methodology.

 

October 15 we sign Amari after being embarrassed by the Ravens, Texans, and Jets.  Our offense couldnt do anything. No WRs were getting open.  Beane is desperate for talent at WR, and trades for Cooper.  October 30 the Bills offense sets record with 8 straight games of 30 points or more.  That was the Amari Cooper effect.  And we have failed in replacing Mack and Amari, whom I believe you are severely underestimating

 

 

Show ain't over til the fat lady sings. 6/1... I wouldn't be against signing Cooper and I think if they use what's in the cupboard...ie...Shavers they'll be fine.

[Pete]

42 minutes ago, nosejob said:

Show ain't over til the fat lady sings. 6/1... I wouldn't be against signing Cooper and I think if they use what's in the cupboard...ie...Shavers they'll be fine.

I like Shavers.  It makes sense that it could be Shavers.  The 5th WR must play special teams- Shavers could take Mack’s role. 

[JGMcD2]

4 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

The only simple (and incorrect) mythology going on here is that you think the Bills lose the production when Mack and Cooper leave, as if no other Bills could have scored those TD's last year or this upcoming year.  Its like Cook...if he left, we aren't "losing" his TD's, guys like Allen, Davis, and whoever we replaced Cook with would pick up the slack.  

 

This notion is so flawed I can't believe you keep repeating it.  

They’re not going back to the 2021 version of the offense where Josh Allen threw the ball 646 times. It’ll probably land somewhere between the 480 attempts from last season and the 560 range of the two years before that.

 

There are about 92 targets to replace with the departures of Mack Hollins, Amari Cooper, Marquez Valdes-Scantling, and Quintin Morris. Even if you bump that number up to 170 (gets you to the 160 ATT from Allen), Josh Palmer likely takes up half of that on his own. That leaves around 85 targets to spread among Shakir, Samuel, Coleman, and Kincaid - all of whom missed time last year and are in line for increased target share. And that’s before factoring in whoever ends up as TE3, plus Ty Johnson, James Cook, and the rest of the backfield. Those targets won’t sit around unused for long.

Edited 5 hours ago by JGMcD2