To all the Fire McDermott Posters, a follow up question..

[TheCockSportif]

Just now, Augie said:

 

The best candidates get to pick the best situations, or even sit out a year waiting for the right team and deal. Nobody wants to step into a bad management situation, it just makes the job too hard. The thought that we would consider a % of ownership shows how desperate we were. 

 

Any time you consider a new job, one question you need to ask is what happened to the last person in that position. Fire someone after a 14-4 season and I’d have to at least ask, is ownership reasonable? 

 

Totally agree with you.

 

But Dungy keeps coming to mind.  He turned around the... Bucs before failing to get the team to the next level.  Gruden won one, then Dungy won one for another underachieving team in the Colts.

 

Clearly both coaches took the gigs, and I wonder the questions that they asked.

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, Augie said:

 

They are a single team. They are the outlier. Keep that in mind. 

Yes, but there aren't a lot of examples of teams getting rid of coaches who have more wins than losses. Bengals post Lewis have been better also.

[DrDawkinstein]

6 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

They are a single team. They are the outlier. Keep that in mind. 

 

I think the difference through all of the Reid/Philly/KC stuff is: in Philly he never had a true star QB. And in KC, it was more of the same middling success with the likes of Alex Smith. It wasnt until Reid got Mahomes that he started winning big consistently. At least he's winning like he's supposed to.

 

But McD has a Mahomes. He isnt stuck with a McNabb/Smith. So not winning big consistently falls squarely on the coaching here imo.

 

Edited June 19, 2023 by DrDawkinstein

[Augie]

1 minute ago, TheCockSportif said:

 

Totally agree with you.

 

But Dungy keeps coming to mind.  He turned around the... Bucs before failing to get the team to the next level.  Gruden won one, then Dungy won one for another underachieving team in the Colts.

 

Clearly both coaches took the gigs, and I wonder the questions that they asked.

 

I lived in the Tampa market during those years. It’s interesting, and we’ll never know how it might have turned out, but I think Dungy would have won it with the Bucs. Gruden was just so lucky to fall into that spot (again because he was the top name and got to pick his spot) and won almost by default over his old team who hadn’t even bothered to change their calls. That is one of the most underrated boneheaded moves in the history of the NFL. There is video of John Lynch belly laughing on the sidelines saying something like “they haven’t changed a thing!! 😂”

[Buffalo_Stampede]

1 hour ago, PBF81 said:

 

OK, so same question to you that I asked Doc but haven't gotten an answer on yet; 

 

 

Suppose that it plays out that we go through the season again, make the playoffs whatever the circumstances, and lose either in the Wild-Card or Divisional Round by not playing our best and/or by losing to an inferior team.  

 

What are your thoughts then? 

 

 

If McDermott loses in the wildcard the seat gets warm. 

[newcam2012]

50 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

So McD would go collect SB rings somewhere else?   😋

 

Chip Kelly replaced Reid and had a record barely over .500. I do like how everyone likes to reference Reid and the Eagles. Philly has a top notch organization right now, but it doesn’t always turn into SB appearances. Sometimes you are the Browns. 

Or sometimes you are the Bills. Consistent playoff failures for years. 

[Augie]

1 minute ago, newcam2012 said:

Or sometimes you are the Bills. Consistent playoff failures for years. 

 

You want to make it sounds like I don’t want want to win a SB. I really do! I also realize that 31 teams are disappointed every year (some as early as October). McD is 4-5 in playoff games, and we all with that was better. I just won’t concede to the woe is us attitude. He gets AT LEAST this year, so beating it to death here at this point seems senseless to me. What can we do better? Realistic things to improve? That is more my focus, and quite frankly this is getting tiresome. 

 

We are not all supposed to see eye to eye on everything. That would be weird. 😋

[Einstein]

23 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Or sometimes you are the Bills. Consistent playoff failures for years. 

 

Bingo. I posted this before but I think it expands on exactly what you are saying the last page or two: 

 

For nearly twenty years, the objective was to achieve "playoff quality". Today, however, that status is a given. It is the baseline.  Reaching the playoffs is no longer a measure of distinction for a Bills coach. It is the bare minimum. With a top 3 QB in Josh Allen, playoffs have become an expectation.

 

In some instances, the coach who reinvigorates a franchise, lifting it from obscurity, is not the same coach who can guide a team to its pinnacle - a championship.

 

These are, after all, distinct skill sets. The former requires the ability to unify a franchise, to foster a new culture, and to motivate. Meanwhile, a championship coach needs tobe a brilliant strategist, adept at navigating the complexities of in-game decisions, and able to outwit the other sideline. These capabilities can coexist in one individual, but sometimes, they're embodied by two separate individuals.

 

I see McDermott as an exceptional 'team-flipper'. Just as a house flipper can transform a derelict property into a lucrative investment, McDermott possesses the instinctive ability to revitalize an NFL franchise and imbue it with respectability. However, we've observed that McDermott, despite his commendable skill as a team-flipper, hasn't displayed the same proficiency in the playoffs. In high-stakes situations, when absolute precision is demanded, and outsmarting the opposing team is crucial, he hasn't fully met the challenge. Is that going to suddenly change? I have my doubts.

 

 

 

 

[PBF81]

59 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

If McDermott loses in the wildcard the seat gets warm. 

 

Warm as in what, precisely?  How many seasons of doing that with the expiration date on Allen getting closer before a change is made?  

 

I don't have shred of confidence that after Allen's time we'll ever get closer.  

 

 

[newcam2012]

1 hour ago, Augie said:

 

You want to make it sounds like I don’t want want to win a SB. I really do! I also realize that 31 teams are disappointed every year (some as early as October). McD is 4-5 in playoff games, and we all with that was better. I just won’t concede to the woe is us attitude. He gets AT LEAST this year, so beating it to death here at this point seems senseless to me. What can we do better? Realistic things to improve? That is more my focus, and quite frankly this is getting tiresome. 

 

We are not all supposed to see eye to eye on everything. That would be weird. 😋

Yet you pound the drum for McD. Which is completely acceptable. It does come with validity.

 

However, you have to expect resistance to your viewpoint. There are several valid points to the contrary. 

 

At this point, no one can proclaim their position is correct without any level of accuracy. 

 

I get that the topic is getting tiresome. 

Edited June 19, 2023 by newcam2012

[Augie]

2 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Yet you pound the drum for McD. Which is completely acceptable. It does come with validity.

 

However, you have to expect resistance to your viewpoint. There are several valid points to the contrary. 

 

At this point, no one can proclaim their position is correct without any level of accuracy. 

 

I get that the topic is getting tiresome. 

 

And THERE is the disconnect! I do NOT pound the table for McD. He’s done enough to get at least one more year, so why are we doing this now? THAT is my thing. It’s just pointless.   🤷‍♂️

[newcam2012]

59 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

Bingo. I posted this before but I think it expands on exactly what you are saying the last page or two: 

 

For nearly twenty years, the objective was to achieve "playoff quality". Today, however, that status is a given. It is the baseline.  Reaching the playoffs is no longer a measure of distinction for a Bills coach. It is the bare minimum. With a top 3 QB in Josh Allen, playoffs have become an expectation.

 

In some instances, the coach who reinvigorates a franchise, lifting it from obscurity, is not the same coach who can guide a team to its pinnacle - a championship.

 

These are, after all, distinct skill sets. The former requires the ability to unify a franchise, to foster a new culture, and to motivate. Meanwhile, a championship coach needs tobe a brilliant strategist, adept at navigating the complexities of in-game decisions, and able to outwit the other sideline. These capabilities can coexist in one individual, but sometimes, they're embodied by two separate individuals.

 

I see McDermott as an exceptional 'team-flipper'. Just as a house flipper can transform a derelict property into a lucrative investment, McDermott possesses the instinctive ability to revitalize an NFL franchise and imbue it with respectability. However, we've observed that McDermott, despite his commendable skill as a team-flipper, hasn't displayed the same proficiency in the playoffs. In high-stakes situations, when absolute precision is demanded, and outsmarting the opposing team is crucial, he hasn't fully met the challenge. Is that going to suddenly change? I have my doubts.

 

 

 

 

Dang Einstein!   

 

Clear, concise, and to the point. This is a fantastic synopsis of how I see things. 

 

It's hard for me to disagree with any morsel of what you said. 

 

Well stated and I welcome your input. Just wish others wouldn't be so rude and unprofessional. I see you as a valuable poster that often gets rift due to your unpopular opinions which are largely based in facts. 

 

Home run here! 

[newcam2012]

15 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

And THERE is the disconnect! I do NOT pound the table for McD. He’s done enough to get at least one more year, so why are we doing this now? THAT is my thing. It’s just pointless.   🤷‍♂️

You state "he's done enough to earn another year." I get that and that's a fair statement. I suspect many echo this sentiment. No qualms with that.

 

However, I'd ask have you seen enough? What makes you think McD can be get the team over the hump? Can or could another coach do or done better? 

 

All questions that have beaten to a pulp. The real disconnect is many people feel McD has lost the opportunity via his multiple playoff failures with a Franchise QB. Many feel a solid offensive minded coach is the change that can get the Bills over the top. Or even a defensive guy like Lou Anarumo. 

 

Can you acknowledge those are valid and viable opinions? 

Edited June 19, 2023 by newcam2012

[Augie]

3 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

You state "he's done enough to earn another year." I get that and that's a fair statement. I suspect many echo this sentiment. No qualms with that.

 

However, I'd ask have you seen enough? What makes you think McD can be get the team over the hump? Can or could another coach do or done better? 

 

All questions that have beaten to a pulp. The real disconnect is many people feel McD has lost the opportunity via his multiple playoff failures with a Franchise QB. Many feel a solid offensive minded coach is the change that can get the Bills over the top. 

 

Can you acknowledge those are valid and viable opinions? 

 

Of course! I just disagree, right now. 

 

Could another coach do better is only one side of the coin. You know the other. We have a group, right now, built to win a certain way. We have some aging on defense, but we are now in a window. I don’t start over now. See if he can get it done with this group and this scheme.

 

A new coach wants to do his own thing, and far too often the players are not fits for what they want to do. Like when you move houses, the sofa (or OLineman) was fine in the last place, but now it doesn’t work. So we start over with new pieces. I think we are too close to start over….now. 

 

And times change, so we shall see. 

[Albany,n.y.]

4 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Yes, but there aren't a lot of examples of teams getting rid of coaches who have more wins than losses. Bengals post Lewis have been better also.

Joe Burrow is the reason.  A QB change to a franchise QB changes everything.  

[GoBills808]

9 minutes ago, Albany,n.y. said:

Joe Burrow is the reason.  A QB change to a franchise QB changes everything.  

Right...so how come they're going to back to back AFCCG and we aren't 

[Einstein]

3 hours ago, newcam2012 said:

Dang Einstein!   

 

Clear, concise, and to the point. This is a fantastic synopsis of how I see things. 

 

It's hard for me to disagree with any morsel of what you said. 

 

Well stated and I welcome your input. Just wish others wouldn't be so rude and unprofessional. I see you as a valuable poster that often gets rift due to your unpopular opinions which are largely based in facts. 

 

Home run here! 

 

Thank you sir. I appreciate the kind words.

[peterpan]

On 6/17/2023 at 10:29 PM, ChicagoRic said:

Who is your replacement?  Who will absolutely, positively, 100%, be that "better" choice you are clamoring for?

 

I keep on hearing "McDermott is the problem."

 

Who is the solution? Someone actually available to be hired. 

I wonder if Daboll would come back.  That’s who I’d like.  Belicheater stiffed the Jets in similar fashion 

[Nextmanup]

44 minutes ago, peterpan said:

I wonder if Daboll would come back.  That’s who I’d like.  Belicheater stiffed the Jets in similar fashion 

He's the HC of the NY Giants.  He's not coming back, unless he gets fired.

 

By the way, the best possible hire may very well be someone gainfully employed right now.  At the end of the year, maybe 8 of these guys will be fired...and who knows who might become available.

 

You can always go the bright up and coming OC route too....who that guy is, I have no idea...but there are people out there who do.

 

 

[Billsflyer12]

8 hours ago, Gregg said:

 

Look at Elway as an example. He didn't win a Super Bowl for the longest time (although he did get to and lose 3 of them) but the Broncos managed to build a team around him nearing the end of his career which allowed him to win 2 Super Bowls. The Bills have time to win with Allen, but I am not sure that McDermott will be the coach when they finally win a Super Bowl with him.

A better Bronco example, John Fox. 13-3, 13-3, 12-4, fired. Very next season Gary Kubrick got them across the finish line winning 2015 Super Bowl.

Edited June 20, 2023 by Billsflyer12